981 replies to this topic

[Just wanna play]

Adalas, on 03 April 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

'Cause I don't know how to optimise it more and this is why i'm asking here if someone can help me understand how to better undertand how to do so?

oh ok, first off, when you have .5 or more tonnage left over you should look and see if you can get a bigger engine, if you have less then .5, or there isn't an engine you can get, you could always look into putting on more armor, bigger engine can hold more heat sinks, up to the first 10 of them in an engine are double heat sinks so if you have that upgrade equipped, it is generally recommended to put in an engine that is at least 250 to get the most cooling for your critical space

btw it is generally considered smart to put ammo in the legs so it doesn't get shot, which would cause it to explode and dmg you, and also put heat sinks in the torso so you keep them if an arm gets blown off

anyone else have some recommendations for him?

[Adalas]

Just wanna play, on 03 April 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

well, imo you don't need 2 tons of ammo for the ams since they got nerfed to the point where they aren't that dangerous, but with out changing amount of ammo and such, here is my updated version:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...751c1c2d4374c87
you could consider removing some ams ammo, or taking the ams out completely for bigger engine and/or maybe an srm6

what do you think about Artemis? removing one ton of ammo from the ams would let you equip it, makes the srm 4s spread tighter

How the heck did you added 2 tons to the mech without adding anything :Doesnotcompute:
Btw, does the artemis changes anything with the critical slots/ tonnage or does it only change the price of the missilles you pay for? Speed isn't that much of a concern for this buldup, so a bigger engine isn't really what i'm searching for, though a smr6 could be useful. Fact is, the ams kinda saved my life a dozen of times.

[Just wanna play]

Adalas, on 03 April 2013 - 01:24 PM, said:

How the heck did you added 2 tons to the mech without adding anything :Doesnotcompute:
Btw, does the artemis changes anything with the critical slots/ tonnage or does it only change the price of the missilles you pay for? Speed isn't that much of a concern for this buldup, so a bigger engine isn't really what i'm searching for, though a smr6 could be useful. Fact is, the ams kinda saved my life a dozen of times.

the bigger engine adds another double heat sink over the 240 you put in, you should at least get a 250 engine, and the bigger engine is what added the 2 tons lol Artemis adds one crit slot and ton to each launcher you have

have you ever used up more then 1000 rounds of your ams? if not, put that tonnage some where else

nvm about artemis, you would also have another ton and crit slot added to the lrm, and that would require some compromises

[Adalas]

Just wanna play, on 03 April 2013 - 01:48 PM, said:

have you ever used up more then 1000 rounds of your ams? if not, put that tonnage some where else

Yes, XD
alot of times, at first I fell on so many lrm boats, it wasn't funny how quickly I died when I was too slow to realise going in the open alone in MWO meant my doom unlike in mechwarrior 2: mercenaries where I could just run and gun

I'll see if I can get the artemis without removing any of my weapons/heatsinks, if not, i'll just add a bigger engine like you said. can't hurt me to be faster i believe... Thanks

Edited by Adalas, 03 April 2013 - 02:10 PM.

[Wrenchfarm]

Skadi, on 02 April 2013 - 07:00 PM, said:

Have at it: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...309a6eef3e58c9f (Please note, im aware SRM6's are abominably bad atm, and the artemis is intended for the extra range and tighter spread, play along with them as im hoping they will be buffed soon in terms of dmg.)

Looks pretty good!

I am concerned about that extra 1/2 ton you're carrying. Normally I'm the first guy to bring more ammo than you need, but I think 125 rounds for a single UAC5 might be pushing it. Here is what I'd do.

I'd drop one ton of UAC5 ammo, shave a 1/2 ton armour off the legs, and squeeze in an extra jump jet. I also swapped the ammo locations, putting the SRM ammo in the head and legs and sliding that one extra UAC ammo pack to the cannon arm. My thinking is you're likely to use the UAC5 at a range and deplete those 25 shots before you get in combat than the SRMs which you will only use at close range where you are more likely to take some hits yourself. Placing loose ton of UAC5 ammo in the cannon arm not only makes it more likely to be used, but if it does happen to get breached, it goes along with the gun it was used with, so you don't lose a ton of SRM ammo while you lose your cannon like you have now.

I think that is the most optimization I can squeeze out of this build. I kind of like it. Wish it had more heatsinks though, I'm not sure how much you'll be able to use those LLAS. Bring coolant.

[Skadi]

Wrenchfarm, on 03 April 2013 - 02:23 PM, said:

Looks pretty good!

I am concerned about that extra 1/2 ton you're carrying. Normally I'm the first guy to bring more ammo than you need, but I think 125 rounds for a single UAC5 might be pushing it. Here is what I'd do.

I'd drop one ton of UAC5 ammo, shave a 1/2 ton armour off the legs, and squeeze in an extra jump jet. I also swapped the ammo locations, putting the SRM ammo in the head and legs and sliding that one extra UAC ammo pack to the cannon arm. My thinking is you're likely to use the UAC5 at a range and deplete those 25 shots before you get in combat than the SRMs which you will only use at close range where you are more likely to take some hits yourself. Placing loose ton of UAC5 ammo in the cannon arm not only makes it more likely to be used, but if it does happen to get breached, it goes along with the gun it was used with, so you don't lose a ton of SRM ammo while you lose your cannon like you have now.

I think that is the most optimization I can squeeze out of this build. I kind of like it. Wish it had more heatsinks though, I'm not sure how much you'll be able to use those LLAS. Bring coolant.

Oh yeah coolant is a must for almost all highlander builds atm that are good... the only reason I brought so much ammo for my UAC5 is because I tend to use it... ALOT, and as it sits its kind of useless due to the SRM damage though, working on another variant that has 2ml and 1ll and a gauss... will post later.

Edited by Skadi, 03 April 2013 - 03:01 PM.

[Skadi]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c1198299618ec4d New build, I left ammo out for reasons of letting the user add the ammounts he wants.

[Wrenchfarm]

Adalas, on 03 April 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

Hey guys, wondered what you thought about that AWS-8V buildup.
It's my first mech btw. Been playing with it since I started playing the game and trying to optimise it ever since.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...35ffab2682b5c0d

Hey Adalas! I'm gonna try and help you with your build. I'll be honest, right now it isn't great, you've made some rookie errors. But it's cool! We were all new once and MWO is a game that does not explain itself well.

First thing, take the ammo out of the center torso. This is a must on every mech. You're mech dies when it's engine, head, or both legs are destroyed. Out of all of them, the most common way to go is engine destruction. Ammo stored in your mech can be detonated internally when hit by enemy fire (once your armour is gone). If that ammo goes up in your chest, it will kill you. It is WAY safer to stash the ammo in the legs, head (risky, but cockpit hits are rare), and in dire straights, the arms or side torso (with a CASE unit hopefully). You'll see yourself living longer just by that alone.

Second, move your chest armour up. Maybe you've already done that, but if you haven't, take armour out of the back center and sides and move it facing forward. You get hit to the front more than the back, and the super wide Awesome needs all the protection it can get.

All engines come with heat sinks in them to a max of 10. DHS in the engine function at a true 2x rate rather than the 1.4 rate of the big blocky ones you place in crit slots. A 250 engine comes with the full 10 true double heat sinks, so you always want a 250 if you can do it. Also, the more speed the better, this is universal. People are running tricked out builds with great aim these days, you can't just rely on armour. You need to be able to get into cover and twist around fast to spread out damage (the bigger the engine, the faster the twist.)

Large pulse lasers are of debatable worth. I think they look amazing, but often I find the range and lower heat/tonnage of regular LLAS much better than the tiny bit of damage and "wubwubwub" sound effect of the pulses.

You also need to think about what kind of battle you want to fight. Looking at your build, I think you are going for a generalized mech that can fight at all ranges. That is a noble goal, but sad to say fighting in MWO works best when you specialize. Thats why short range builds that boat SRMs like the Splatcat, or long range builds that boat Guass and PPCs like the PhractTart are so powerful. Your current build is all over the place with a long range PPC and LRM15 pack, mid range pulses, and one SRM4 you can probably live without at close range. Not only does it not specialize in anything, but it is also a lot of weapon groups to keep track of. Even for a generalist build, you can do some things to simplify that down.

So I'm going to suggest a few builds for different ranges.
LRM Support

This build uses a pair of LRM15s, TAG, and two large lasers. It isn't super optimized, but it is simple. You'll notice I junked BAP and lost a ton of AMS ammo. BAP is nice on some builds, but not necessary, and you simply don't need 2 tons of AMS ammo. It just isn't good enough to warrant the tonnage.

This build will let you rain LRMs down while toasting mechs with your LLAS at a comfortable mid-range distance. Don't sit back and just sling missiles at a huge range, try to stay behind your front line brawlers at a comfortable 400m-600m and use your LRMs on targets you have a clear TAG focus on that you can also hit with the lasers. This is a solid support build, but you need to be careful to not be the first guy in a fight.

(note that LRMs are pretty weak right now, but I expect them to be buffed to proper damage levels soon - they have always come back from nerfs in the past).
Direct Fire Support with SRM Backup

Three PPCs are nothing to sneeze at. This particular build runs a bit hotter than some other Awesome PPC boats, but you get a nice close range punch of 3xSRM4s. Again, make sure you are behind the thickest fighting and sling PPC juice until the enemy starts to cry. If they get close, you have a SRM surprise waiting for them.

Coolant would be a definite asset to help with emergency situations. You might notice I cut the leg armour pretty deep. It is severe, but I can count the number of times I've been legged in an Awesome on one thumb. Nobody shoots for the Awesome's legs given its huge torso.
Obvious Brawling Build

I don't like to brawl in my Awesomes, but maybe you do. If you're so inclined, this is the obvious build to do it. Just remember that 3 LLAS are nothing to sneeze at in their own right. The SRMs are the money maker, but don't rush in too quick when you could use the LLAS to soften them up.

Personally, I don't think Awesome make good brawlers because they are so big and even with a 300 engine they are not very fast. Atlas and Stalkers make better close range mechs with the Atlai's ballistic mounts and the Stalkers abundant hardpoints and weird body shape. But that doesn't mean you can't do it in an Awesome, in fact some forum goers have been quite successful doing it.

Mixed Range/Brawling build

This weird build tries to cover all the bases. An ERPPC on the arm lets you slam mechs out to 1000m with direct damage. The 3xMLAS and 3xSRM6+Artemis mean you just do more and more damage as mechs get closer.

I've had good luck running a bracketed fire build on my ASW-9M recently (ERPPC, LLAS, MLAS) and the trick is to be disciplined about your fire. Stop using the ERPPC once the enemy is in range of the MLAS and SRMs. You'll overheat trying to use all the weapons at once, so try to break it down to ERPPC at ranges 450m+, MLAS between 250-450m, and MLAS+SRMs at 250m and below.

Two things bug me about this set up - you leave tonnage on the table, and it runs hot. You could swap the MLAS for MPLAS to use up the tonnage, but that won't do you any favours with the heat.

Anyway, those are my suggestions! You'll notice a common theme is sticking in a max engine and trying to find weapons that compliment each other. Try to keep yourself to no more than 3 weapons (TAG doesn't count) so you don't have to move all over the mouse and keyboard while fighting.

If you can't afford the 300 STD engine, I recommend going with a ranged build where movement hopefully won't be as important. You can use the extra tonnage on ammo and sinks. Make sure to get at least a 250 STD to make the most out of your DHS upgrade (remember, you can sell your 240 engine to help afford the 250). You could always make a damn near stationary LRM boat.

[Adalas]

@Wrenchfarm

Thanks alot for the detailed opinion, i'm gonna look if I can learn from those builds!
Though I don't really like to specialise myself too much, and frankly, I have no problem keeping track of many weapons. I have the talent to get myself stuck all the time in different situations where if i'm too specialised I just die. I like the mixed/ranged brawling and at some extend and the lrm support, but I bought the 8V to be able to snipe and side the battlefield, assisting people from not too far and not being dependents froms others for short periods of time if i get in the wrong place or if i'm assaulted by lightweights. Getting all ppc is just meh, all lrm too and i'm not very fond of simple lasers since I still have the bad tendency to just wiggle the mouse around and do less damage because of the stream instead of focusing like bullets, so pulse lasers helps me alot for now, until I stop wiggling the laser.

Gotta try double LRMing and use that erppc for once.

Edited by Adalas, 03 April 2013 - 05:30 PM.

[Lazycat]

Hi all

I'm pretty new to the game and after looking over this thread and some of the builds I tried to improve my own CPLT-K2 build

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0f637a9bfb87d16

I spent all my Cadet bonus money on this so far so I can't really afford a XL engine or anything. Can you suggest cheap changes for now (say < 3M) and perhaps a loadout for when I have more money?

Also I have a few questions:
Will I lose functionality in battle if my no-armor arms get destroyed since they contain dynamic armor and structure parts?

What is the best use of CASE? Is it better to lump all your ammo in with it or what?
What is the best distribution of ammo, all in one part or spread out?

Many thanks for your help!

[Just wanna play]

Lazycat, on 03 April 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Hi all

I'm pretty new to the game and after looking over this thread and some of the builds I tried to improve my own CPLT-K2 build

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0f637a9bfb87d16

I spent all my Cadet bonus money on this so far so I can't really afford a XL engine or anything. Can you suggest cheap changes for now (say < 3M) and perhaps a loadout for when I have more money?

Also I have a few questions:
Will I lose functionality in battle if my no-armor arms get destroyed since they contain dynamic armor and structure parts?

What is the best use of CASE? Is it better to lump all your ammo in with it or what?
What is the best distribution of ammo, all in one part or spread out?

Many thanks for your help!

if you loss an arm, all that happens is you don't get to use what ever components where on that arm, such as weapons and ammo, imo don't use case, it is recommended to put ammo in the legs, then head, then arm, never in the torso, you dont want ammo in a limb that will take a lot of shots to destroy since each shot has a chance to hit the ammo

btw, guass ammo doesn't explode, only the rifle does,, so you can put it in any limb you want, i recommend putting it near stuff you don't want getting hit, like the rifle it self

here ya go, you will spend some money, but not as much as you would on an xl engine
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5fe1a5a352420a4

idk if case helps contain the dmg from a guass rifle exploding, you might want to consider altering my design and putting one in the right torso

[Drollzy]

cdrolly, on 01 April 2013 - 09:39 AM, said:

wow looks liek you've taken over this thread Just wanna play???

No offense intended but I was looking for advice from the OP's Protector and Gid's maybe you should start your own thread as I am finding it cumbersome flicking through yours looking for the OP's advice.

[Lazycat]

Just wanna play, on 03 April 2013 - 09:37 PM, said:

if you loss an arm, all that happens is you don't get to use what ever components where on that arm, such as weapons and ammo, imo don't use case, it is recommended to put ammo in the legs, then head, then arm, never in the torso, you dont want ammo in a limb that will take a lot of shots to destroy since each shot has a chance to hit the ammo

btw, guass ammo doesn't explode, only the rifle does,, so you can put it in any limb you want, i recommend putting it near stuff you don't want getting hit, like the rifle it self

here ya go, you will spend some money, but not as much as you would on an xl engine
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5fe1a5a352420a4

idk if case helps contain the dmg from a guass rifle exploding, you might want to consider altering my design and putting one in the right torso

Thanks Just Wanna Play, that's just the sort of thing I was after.

[Gidonihah]

Pkunk, on 03 April 2013 - 03:30 AM, said:

I usually use 4 weapon groups most of the time. I guess it depends on your key mapping. I use left shift for group 3 and space for group 4. I use groups 1,2 and 3 for different weapon types and group 4 for alpha.

Alpha doesnt really count as its own weapon group frankly.. Its mostly a convenience thing between simply pressing all the weapon group buttons at the same time. Their actually is a Alpha hotkey, so you dont need to bind it at all with normal weapon groups. (though I heavily recommend moving it to a useful spot on the keyboard, shift is my favorite spot)

By no more than 3 weapon groups we mean stuff like
Group1: 2Large Lasers
Group2: 2Medium Lasers
Group3: 1Srm6
Group4: Gauss

Its just a mess to control. My personal opinion though, is that its completely fine to have a 4th weapon group if that weapon is tertiary like LRM, aka a weapon you never use in the midst of combat that doesnt actually need to be aimed.

Adalas, on 03 April 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

Hey guys, wondered what you thought about that AWS-8V buildup.
It's my first mech btw. Been playing with it since I started playing the game and trying to optimise it ever since.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...35ffab2682b5c0d

Well a good amount of advice has already been given. So Ill just chime in with a few things that may or may not have already been said.

First: Large Pulse lasers are often worse than Large lasers, the extra heat really kills the Pulse, not to mention damage falloff from range penalties.
Second: LRMs paired with PPcs and Large Lasers will be rather lackluster, basically your LRMs are producing heat at the ranges that you should be using that PPC for.

Third: A single Srm4 is rather lonely

Recomendations for weapon loadout: Consolidate one way or the other, 3 Large Pulse Lasers backed up by Lrms, 3 Largelasers backed up by SRMs, 3 PPCs backed by SRMs. Or 1PPc 2large with SRMs for a spread.

Other things: BAP isnt that great here, 1 LRM-15 doesnt make BAP worth it, and BAP gets shut down hard by ECM anyways.
I personally always recommend removing AMS, but we need to increase the speed of your mech to make that advisable.
Tag is also a bit superflous, you only have 1 LRM-15, you are spending more tonnage on the support weapons for the LRM than you are spending on ammo for it!

So shake and bake, add in a Medium laser for my own sick amusement (I love head lasers)
and AWS-8V

Now if you really wanna use those LRms lets go the other direction.
Adding in more LRMs removing Pulses and SRMs, adding in 2 Mediums for emergency close range support, and upping the engine. Position of the PPC is debatable.

AWS-8V

Now for a Midling design, I dont really like Jack of All trade designs, but you can optimize anything!
Still removing Tag and Bap for being useless.

Your basic design made Faster and more heat efficient.
AWS-8V

Same thing with Large Lasers instead of Pulse (More speed, more Srms, cooler)
AWS-8V

Lazycat, on 03 April 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Hi all

I'm pretty new to the game and after looking over this thread and some of the builds I tried to improve my own CPLT-K2 build

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0f637a9bfb87d16

I spent all my Cadet bonus money on this so far so I can't really afford a XL engine or anything. Can you suggest cheap changes for now (say < 3M) and perhaps a loadout for when I have more money?

Also I have a few questions:
Will I lose functionality in battle if my no-armor arms get destroyed since they contain dynamic armor and structure parts?

What is the best use of CASE? Is it better to lump all your ammo in with it or what?
What is the best distribution of ammo, all in one part or spread out?

Many thanks for your help!

In General

Losing Dynamic Armor doesnt matter, basically free slots.
Case.. just avoid using Case for now, its use is more fringe than you may realize, stick ammo in head/legs/arms is almost always better (with a few exceptions of course)
Ammo distribution is personal opinion.

Your K2
Stick Gauss ammo with the Gauss Rifle, the Gauss ammo will sometime absorb hits meant for the Rifle, increasing its lengevity slightly.
Immediate Change
CPLT-K2

DHS is directly superior to SHS in this build but its costly and frankly this is a low heat build to begin with.

Your K2 should probally work towards Gaussapult Status, losing the Ac2 for anouther Gauss Rifle. Dont really know the best K2 Gaussapult build atm, since Heavies arent my forte, but their should be a few builds floating around.

Regardless your K2 will benefit tremendously from having Duo balistics of the same weapon. Even Duo Ac10s will see an improvement.

The main Duo builds:
Two Gauss (Can use an XL engine)
Duo Ac20 (Can't)
Duo UltraAc5 (Can, and has the most tonnage for backups)

An example of a Ultra build (Though again K2s arent my area of expertise, thats Protections job)
CPLT-K2

Also Low cost Gauss build
CPLT-K2
Problem is.. that build is really only usable if you are really really skilled... dumb 4 tons of ammo with no backup weapons.

High Cost Gauss build
CPLT-K2
Backup weapons are lovely lovely things, their are many varients of the Gaussapult, and again I dont really run them, so best to shop around before you build one. You may even want a Jaegermech instead of a catapult.

Edited by Gidonihah, 04 April 2013 - 02:29 AM.

[Gidonihah]

Im gonna ignore Skadi's highlander build... cause thats just cruel, showing me a build I have no idea if its good or not because its the first assault mech with JJs.

[Gidonihah]

Xumed, on 03 April 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

Here is a fun build for a YEN-LO-WANG

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4e584b02e8b43c4

Its Fast, Good Cooling and great DPS...

Can it be better?

YEN-LO-WANG
Loses some Cooling, gains some speed, but most importantly upps the ammo.

Xumed, on 02 April 2013 - 07:36 AM, said:

How about this Jenner? JR7-D

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e863c5475bddacd

Sadly this build exists in a vaguely competitive version
See Lights should ALWAYS run a XL engine. And that build with a XL engine turns into this
JR7-D
Which used to be a premier Light Build before ECM Ravens came along, still strong whenever you dont have ECM stopping you.

Edited by Gidonihah, 04 April 2013 - 02:23 AM.

[Lazycat]

Thanks Gidonihah,

Quote

In General

Losing Dynamic Armor doesnt matter, basically free slots.
Case.. just avoid using Case for now, its use is more fringe than you may realize, stick ammo in head/legs/arms is almost always better (with a few exceptions of course)

Good news!

Quote

Your K2
Stick Gauss ammo with the Gauss Rifle, the Gauss ammo will sometime absorb hits meant for the Rifle, increasing its lengevity slightly.

Cheers

Quote

DHS is directly superior to SHS in this build but its costly and frankly this is a low heat build to begin with.

Your K2 should probally work towards Gaussapult Status, losing the Ac2 for anouther Gauss Rifle. Dont really know the best K2 Gaussapult build atm, since Heavies arent my forte, but their should be a few builds floating around.

Regardless your K2 will benefit tremendously from having Duo balistics of the same weapon. Even Duo Ac10s will see an improvement.

DHS is a little expensive with not too much gain for me right now, bt I'll get to it.

I like the look of the dual ultra AC5's, I'll give that a go.

The different timings of the AC2 and the Gauss does take a bit of getting used to but I don't mind it, I sort of use the AC2 fire as a tracer bullet for the Gauss so I can tell if I should fire.

I don't think I'd be good for dual Gauss, with a 4s cooldown I'd get too frustrated when i miss!

Thanks for the help

[Wrenchfarm]

Xumed, on 03 April 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

Here is a fun build for a YEN-LO-WANG

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4e584b02e8b43c4

Its Fast, Good Cooling and great DPS...

Can it be better?

Woah! What's with all the sinks? The YLW doesn't need any extras when you're only running the AC20 and 2xMLAS. You'll stay plenty cool unless you decide to fight in a volcano. Also, if you really want the sinks, take them out of the shield arm that you will be intentionally taking fire with and move them into the side torsos. No reason to lose them early.

I'd recommend you strip out the sinks, upgrade to 4 tons of AC20 round giving you a mighty 28 rounds, pump it up to an XL300 and add AMS. Check out the build.

Of course, I personally run my YLW with a 250STD engine, Endo, Ferro, AC20+4 tons of ammo, and 2xMLAS. A Cent with a STD engine can be a tough one to put down.

[Mordynak]

I ran with a HBK-4H With Ballistic for a while but i found i could barely hit anything with the LB10X.

So i switched out for a HBK-4H with nothing but lasers.

It has a higher firepower and better range. Still wonder if there is anyway i can improve it. Any suggestions?

[Just wanna play]

Mordynak, on 04 April 2013 - 07:05 AM, said:

I ran with a HBK-4H With Ballistic for a while but i found i could barely hit anything with the LB10X.

So i switched out for a HBK-4H with nothing but lasers.

It has a higher firepower and better range. Still wonder if there is anyway i can improve it. Any suggestions?

um, its has room for ferro, which means a bigger engine....

got in a bigger engine and put ams ammo in legs so it doesn't become useless if you loss your left arm

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7ddd4dad987e666