981 replies to this topic

[Delchev]

FireSlade, on 29 April 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

Looks really good I'm impressed that you managed to fit all that and keep it close to your original. My only gripe is the LRM10 and not because you used it but because the 10 and 20 don't match up with the 5 and 15 in terms of weight and slots. 1 LRM15 with artemis weighs 8 tons while the 10+5 weighs an extra ton more. My understanding in separating the 15 into a 10+5 is that you want to chain fire them creating a stream of missiles which makes a ton of sense when you apply the impulse of the weapons. You're going to really love the twin UAC5s, I use them in my Ilya Muromets with twin LL and usually score 400-600 damage per match with it. Once you get the pause down to keep them from jamming you're set and when you get up close the double tap feature will allow you to burst anywhere from 20 and up and every time it fires that's another 10 damage. Last match with it I managed to core a awesome in just a few seconds without them jamming. Good luck with your design and let me know how it fairs my plan for the HGN-733C was to keep the AC20 and med lasers for close range and use two LRM15s for long range.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b357894b3e3e40b

1. Artemis takes two slots, which you lack to get endo-steel which saves a lot of tons.
2. With standard engine you can put LRM to torso, which has more tubes.
3. Distribute ammo around to decrease probability of all ammo exploding at once.

With some magic you can achieve same build, but with STD300 instead of XL300, which is quite more survivable.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...6926861d13e63af

Of course you can use freed up tons for XL325 and medium pulse lasers instead (or a large laser, strip some armor):
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8d909e2220b8fe8
Spread ammo as well, I didn't bother.

[FireSlade]

I thought about doing those changes to it but with my play style and experience with Heavy Metal I found that the XL doesn't really decrease my survivability and I feel the artemis is worth the slight loss in speed and 2 points in damage. My CPLT-C1 with twin ALRM15s out damages my CPLT-C4 with the standard LRM20s. The ammo spreading I have mixed feelings with since it offers more opportunities for an explosion at the same time as reducing them I hate putting ammo in the legs on a JJ mech since everyone shoots the legs and I've been killed more by an ammo explosion in the legs running an XL engine than one in the torso since when the ammo goes the engine isn't far behind anyways.

[ZeProme]

FireSlade, on 29 April 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

Looks really good I'm impressed that you managed to fit all that and keep it close to your original. My only gripe is the LRM10 and not because you used it but because the 10 and 20 don't match up with the 5 and 15 in terms of weight and slots. 1 LRM15 with artemis weighs 8 tons while the 10+5 weighs an extra ton more. My understanding in separating the 15 into a 10+5 is that you want to chain fire them creating a stream of missiles which makes a ton of sense when you apply the impulse of the weapons. You're going to really love the twin UAC5s, I use them in my Ilya Muromets with twin LL and usually score 400-600 damage per match with it. Once you get the pause down to keep them from jamming you're set and when you get up close the double tap feature will allow you to burst anywhere from 20 and up and every time it fires that's another 10 damage. Last match with it I managed to core a awesome in just a few seconds without them jamming. Good luck with your design and let me know how it fairs my plan for the HGN-733C was to keep the AC20 and med lasers for close range and use two LRM15s for long range.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b357894b3e3e40b

I didn't know that with artemis, each missile hardpoints has an extra ton. Thing is, I wanted to save weight. My experience back with my CN9-A taught me that replacing LRM 10 with 2 LRM 5s can save 1 ton which is huge for a medium mech.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...370b697e80a7081

That or also that I have better chance of enduring less damage to a single weapon. Say if I lose the LRM 15, I don't have any more LRMs. But with LRM 5 and LRM 10, if I lose either one I still have one that still gives me the capability to LRM.

That or swap the 2 LRMs for a LRM 15 and get another LRM Ammo in.

Decisions decisions.

Delchev, on 29 April 2013 - 02:03 PM, said:

Be the man and get the maximum engine. You will not regret. Remove ams, remove case (and spread ammo around to distribute the risk of damage), remove 1 heat sink and some armor, remove artemis, exchange LRM10 to LRM5 and get that max engine.

3 points lower damage will not make a difference. 10 km/h (20%!) will make a huge difference.
Like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...234263f10c1f18f

And actually, if I were you I would either use 3xLRM5, or 3xSRM4. Same weight, different purpose. Having some of both is just a distraction and not a benefit.
Example:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...1336f2b5cc30564

I prefer a good blend of offense ability. Experience has taught me that often times, higher speed can get me into more trouble.

Besides, with Speed Tweak, it should solve most of my mobility problems.

Thanks though!

[FireSlade]

ZeProme, on 29 April 2013 - 05:52 PM, said:

I didn't know that with artemis, each missile hardpoints has an extra ton. Thing is, I wanted to save weight. My experience back with my CN9-A taught me that replacing LRM 10 with 2 LRM 5s can save 1 ton which is huge for a medium mech.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...370b697e80a7081

That or also that I have better chance of enduring less damage to a single weapon. Say if I lose the LRM 15, I don't have any more LRMs. But with LRM 5 and LRM 10, if I lose either one I still have one that still gives me the capability to LRM.

That or swap the 2 LRMs for a LRM 15 and get another LRM Ammo in.

Decisions decisions.



I prefer a good blend of offense ability. Experience has taught me that often times, higher speed can get me into more trouble.

Besides, with Speed Tweak, it should solve most of my mobility problems.

Thanks though!

Yea the LRM5s are a tad of a odd ball and they offer better ROF, heat, and weight until you add artemis then they lose the weight bonus. The LRM15s offer similarities to the 5s but still 3 5s weigh less. The big downside to LRM5s is the hardpoints. If there was a 8 missile HP CPLT-C4 then the 8 5s would out dps 2 20s (8.64dps vs 5.9dps). If you stay with the single LRM you'll have 36 salvos that you can unleash (378 damage / 2.47dps). The two LRMs will net you 24 salvos (252 damage but with a higher dps / 2.95dps). Only a small amount for an increase and as you said "decisions". Personally I'd go for more ammo so that you can hang back longer dealing damage and when you run out you'll still have most of your armor (hopefully) and they're going to be hurting at the 200meter mark since your LRM, Lasers, and UACs are going to rip them a new one.

[Just wanna play]

FireSlade, on 29 April 2013 - 06:22 PM, said:

Yea the LRM5s are a tad of a odd ball and they offer better ROF, heat, and weight until you add artemis then they lose the weight bonus. The LRM15s offer similarities to the 5s but still 3 5s weigh less. The big downside to LRM5s is the hardpoints. If there was a 8 missile HP CPLT-C4 then the 8 5s would out dps 2 20s (8.64dps vs 5.9dps). If you stay with the single LRM you'll have 36 salvos that you can unleash (378 damage / 2.47dps). The two LRMs will net you 24 salvos (252 damage but with a higher dps / 2.95dps). Only a small amount for an increase and as you said "decisions". Personally I'd go for more ammo so that you can hang back longer dealing damage and when you run out you'll still have most of your armor (hopefully) and they're going to be hurting at the 200meter mark since your LRM, Lasers, and UACs are going to rip them a new one.

not to but in or anything but wouldn't the lrm5s offer a tighter group of lrm fire??

or less lrms being wasted off target or hitting a limb that doesn't really need to be damaged

[FireSlade]

Never really thought about it but you could be right. I tend to stick to the Heavy and Assault (the Highlanders being my only Assault) classes so I tend to not use a LRM5 due to AMS being able to knock them out of the sky and when you send 30 missiles downrange it is hard to see their grouping (2 LRM15s vs 6 LRM5s).

[Akuma]

My CN9-D

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a046a40c1f8d871

Opinions? I've been a Battletech tabletop player for 20+ years but recently picked this game up. I am interested in playing competitively but I know having an efficient build is critical. Played with different combinations of AC5, UAC5, LB10X, mlas/mplas, XL325, XL315, this is about the tightest I can tweak it. No additional space, seems like it will run cool, doesn't have a ton of firepower but then I'm not engaging the main battle lines - I try to skirmish, pick off stragglers, or go for base caps and then I'm up against light mechs that I can usually kill or drive off. AC5 and UAC5 didn't really seem to do as much damage as I liked, LB10X sounded good but I was unsure of how much damage I was actually doing (plus its not a pinpoint weapon). I am concerned the gauss won't be as effective up close as the LB10X, cause I don't really snipe and I tend to get into close up circle fights.

Edited by Akuma, 29 April 2013 - 09:01 PM.

[Art3mis1337]

Akuma, on 29 April 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

My CN9-D

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a046a40c1f8d871

Opinions? I've been a Battletech tabletop player for 20+ years but recently picked this game up. I am interested in playing competitively but I know having an efficient build is critical. Played with different combinations of AC5, UAC5, LB10X, mlas/mplas, XL325, XL315, this is about the tightest I can tweak it. No additional space, seems like it will run cool, doesn't have a ton of firepower but then I'm not engaging the main battle lines - I try to skirmish, pick off stragglers, or go for base caps and then I'm up against light mechs that I can usually kill or drive off. AC5 and UAC5 didn't really seem to do as much damage as I liked, LB10X sounded good but I was unsure of how much damage I was actually doing (plus its not a pinpoint weapon). I am concerned the gauss won't be as effective up close as the LB10X, cause I don't really snipe and I tend to get into close up circle fights.

I'm going to step in here and throw this out;

For one you can free up almost a ton dumping armor on the left arm if you are willing, then drop a bit off the legs and you can do something as follows... Then on the right I personally would go from a Gauss to an AC10... imo, it's a very underrated weapon and for no good reason... On most builds AC20s are better, but you lack that option, and it frees up tons to upgrade your MLs to MPLs...

I personally think it's easier to do reliable damage at close range with the AC10 and MPLs... I might just suck with gauss, but they just seem to 'not' excel at close range... Then I'm just a fan of MPLs, but you could go back to normals for restoring your armor / adding more ammo.

Here's what I come up with... It may not be the greatest build ever, but it's probably what I would run... http://mwo.smurfy-ne...195e4f182e78a9a

It's worth a shot... I'm not exactly an expert, but I've been building mechs since closed beta, so I've had some experience .. though I will admit my experience with Cents are lacking a bit, and I've never been a fan of the D model anyway

hope i helped
~smallchange.

P.S. forgot to mention, to get slots had to go from ferro to standard armor...

Edited by smallchange, 29 April 2013 - 09:54 PM.

[Delchev]

ZeProme, on 29 April 2013 - 05:52 PM, said:

I prefer a good blend of offense ability. Experience has taught me that often times, higher speed can get me into more trouble.

Besides, with Speed Tweak, it should solve most of my mobility problems.

Thanks though!

You can still have artemis and XL325 at the same time (although buying that specifically is expensive pleasure, but it is optimization thread!).
You have to give up one ton of ammo and one jump jet though. i think it is not critical, as you don't really have poptarting weapons like gauss or PPC. And for LRM's and AC20 two jump jets should be sufficient.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c364fb9b3a39340

Just another option I understand that many people will have XL300 from other mechs and are not willing to buy XL325 specifically.

[FireSlade]

Akuma, on 29 April 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

My CN9-D
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a046a40c1f8d871
Opinions? I've been a Battletech tabletop player for 20+ years but recently picked this game up. I am interested in playing competitively but I know having an efficient build is critical. Played with different combinations of AC5, UAC5, LB10X, mlas/mplas, XL325, XL315, this is about the tightest I can tweak it. No additional space, seems like it will run cool, doesn't have a ton of firepower but then I'm not engaging the main battle lines - I try to skirmish, pick off stragglers, or go for base caps and then I'm up against light mechs that I can usually kill or drive off. AC5 and UAC5 didn't really seem to do as much damage as I liked, LB10X sounded good but I was unsure of how much damage I was actually doing (plus its not a pinpoint weapon). I am concerned the gauss won't be as effective up close as the LB10X, cause I don't really snipe and I tend to get into close up circle fights.

Nice design there, Akuma. My thing and it is because of the limited amount of tons available for weapons are the lack of ammo. My HGN-HM runs 3 tons of ammo for the Gauss and during the length of a battle, I will run out before it is over. You could get that extra ammo by doing what smallchange mentioned by dumping the left arm’s armor but to me that defeats the whole purpose of having a shield arm that can soak up 30 points in damage. I also agreed with smallchange on replacing the Gauss Rifle with an AC10 and using the weight save to go with the standard armor and some more ammo. At this point we’d start to disagree since he mentioned replacing the MLs with MPLs. What I dislike about the MPLs is that they’re twice the weight, less range (180opt and 360max VS 270opt and 540max), and are less heat efficient for only 1 point in damage and .25 seconds faster to put out the damage. By just replacing the Gauss with the AC10 and putting 4 tons of AC10, you max potential damage output (minus the missiles and lasers) goes from 300 to 600 with a higher DPS. In addition, you lose the 3hp Gauss Rifle that when destroyed does 20damage to the remaining structure when it explodes (the ammo will not explode). That way there is less risk when you get close and the AC10 has a respectable max range of 1350 and is only 100MPS slower. So here is what the AC10 build could look like:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3a6dbcf3488e832
I wish you luck on the battlefield.

[giganova]

Can anything be done to optimize this Atlas AS7-D? Thanks in advance!

[eadipus]

Akuma, on 29 April 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

My CN9-D

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a046a40c1f8d871

Opinions? I've been a Battletech tabletop player for 20+ years but recently picked this game up. I am interested in playing competitively but I know having an efficient build is critical. Played with different combinations of AC5, UAC5, LB10X, mlas/mplas, XL325, XL315, this is about the tightest I can tweak it. No additional space, seems like it will run cool, doesn't have a ton of firepower but then I'm not engaging the main battle lines - I try to skirmish, pick off stragglers, or go for base caps and then I'm up against light mechs that I can usually kill or drive off. AC5 and UAC5 didn't really seem to do as much damage as I liked, LB10X sounded good but I was unsure of how much damage I was actually doing (plus its not a pinpoint weapon). I am concerned the gauss won't be as effective up close as the LB10X, cause I don't really snipe and I tend to get into close up circle fights.

if you're not set on using a ballistic weapon in the arm I've had a lot of fun with SRM6's + ML/MPL on both the Centurion and the Catapult. The arms are left armoured as they are huge and will take a lot of damage, if I lose my arms in a match I know I've been torso twisting properly and since they're empty its no loss at all. Even with both side toros missing you can still put the hurt on people with the CT lasers. I haven't used this build personally, you might want to swap a ton of SRM ammo or some armour for an engine heatsink if its running too hot

edit: link would probably help http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a1ab6d0f5109fac

Edited by eadipus, 30 April 2013 - 04:43 AM.

[FireSlade]

giganova, on 30 April 2013 - 04:19 AM, said:

Can anything be done to optimize this Atlas AS7-D? Thanks in advance!

The only things I can think of to make the design better is to get it to run cooler. At 26% cooling efficiency you’re going to be running close to shutdown a lot especially on the desert maps. I know that PPCs are the FOTM and you may not want to give them up so I would at least run the standard PPCs which will bring you to 31% efficiency and the 90 meter minimum will not matter since you have plenty of backup. If you do not mind losing the “sniper” +2dmg aspect you could swap over to a pair of LL which will bring cooling even further into the 42% range and boost your armor. The only other thing that I can think of is the armor load out. I don’t have much time in Atlas’s so I don’t know the hit boxes on them but in my Highlanders in a straight up brawl with an Atlas I win every time since I have more armor in my front than an Atlas does. Since the whole point for a big mech is to be able to soak up damage since they are aiming for the broadside of a barn I tend to want to have as much armor upfront as possible while keeping enough on my backside for surprise moments and lights. I would run a 52/32 : 90/34 : 52/32 (RT : CT : LT). It is up to you really and your playstyle really to pick the armor setup but if you can spread that damage around with that type of setup then they would have to do 194 damage to even expose your internals and because you are running a standard engine you will be even harder to kill.

Here is what I would run:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...19cb0ac79a4552c
Otherwise, I would keep your current design and just swap the ERs for reg. PPCs

Good luck o/

[arghmace]

About that 4 AC5 CTF-4X build: Why have the improved versions moved ammo from CT to head? I really don't see the point. It is entirely possible that someone will right at the start of the battle strip your cockpit armor and then blow the ammo even though there would be a bit of internal structure left in the head. On the other hand if you put it to CT, you have lots more armor to protect it and the engine soaks the crits so the ammo won't even be hit most likely unlike in the head. For sure in the longer run ammo in CT is bad but you should be able to shoot it out very fast so no problem there.

[giganova]

Thanks, FireSlade. I've thought about using LLs in the arms for a while, just never got around to trying it. It's meant to be a brawler, so I rarely use the ERPPCs for sniping. I'll give the new pewpews a try and see what happens!

[Vinrus]

arghmace, on 30 April 2013 - 06:06 AM, said:

About that 4 AC5 CTF-4X build: Why have the improved versions moved ammo from CT to head? I really don't see the point. It is entirely possible that someone will right at the start of the battle strip your cockpit armor and then blow the ammo even though there would be a bit of internal structure left in the head. On the other hand if you put it to CT, you have lots more armor to protect it and the engine soaks the crits so the ammo won't even be hit most likely unlike in the head. For sure in the longer run ammo in CT is bad but you should be able to shoot it out very fast so no problem there.

Anything's a gamble I suppose. Yes, it's possible I die immediately to a lucky alpha-strike head shot, but more often than not, those first 30 rounds get used pretty quick (basically 7 1/2 volleys). From what I gather, the stuff in the head gets used first, so my window of vulnerability isn't that long.

[GreyPaws]

ILYA cookie cutter

Standard issue UAC5 ML ILYA... was thinking maybe going 300xl for more ammo.. but then i would have to put it into the arms... and.. i dunno how i feel about that

[arghmace]

Vinrus, on 30 April 2013 - 09:30 AM, said:

Anything's a gamble I suppose. Yes, it's possible I die immediately to a lucky alpha-strike head shot, but more often than not, those first 30 rounds get used pretty quick (basically 7 1/2 volleys). From what I gather, the stuff in the head gets used first, so my window of vulnerability isn't that long.

But if you don't have ammo in the head, then it gets first used from center torso, so the window is just the same.

[Draxist]

was messing around in a match with my 4P, which looks something like this.

I know it runs hot, and its very much a boat, but I was wondering if any of the vets had any suggestions.

I like the build for the punch and flexibility it gives, and the first round out with it I nailed two kills and an assist, making me very pleased.

[arghmace]

Draxist, on 01 May 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

was messing around in a match with my 4P, which looks something like this.

I know it runs hot, and its very much a boat, but I was wondering if any of the vets had any suggestions.

I like the build for the punch and flexibility it gives, and the first round out with it I nailed two kills and an assist, making me very pleased.

You were missing 2 armor points from center torso so I took one point off each leg and put them to CT back. Feel free to move them to front, if you like that more. But most importantly I moved 2 heat sinks from left torso to both arms. That way when your arms lose their armor, the heat sinks will soak in criticals making your arm weapons less likely to be knocked off before you lose the arm completely.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...36de9893e891952