52 replies to this topic

[Shuyen]

MourningZero, on 16 April 2013 - 07:21 AM, said:

2 large lasers, ecm, dhs, endo, ferro, done. I leave off the JJs, since the predictability on landing tends to get more parts blown off than the flight time ever helps.

With an XL engine, too, I assume? That's the sticking point for me. I just started a D build for fun. Getting it to ECM, endo and ferro was easy enough. But the 4.5 (or is it 4.8?) million c-bills for the XL engine? Yeah. Not so easy when you can't afford to dish out real world money to play the game.

Right now I have an ECM, 1 ML, 1 Pulse ML and a TAG on mine, with Endo and Ferro upgrades. The TAG is an experiment to see if it's actually useful anymore or not. My thought was to sneak behind enemy lines with ECM and TAG the LRM boats/assaults without them knowing it. I haven't played enough matches to know if it's viable or not, but it's fun to play around some.

[Durant Carlyle]

MourningZero, on 16 April 2013 - 07:21 AM, said:

I leave off the JJs, since the predictability on landing tends to get more parts blown off than the flight time ever helps.

You WHAT!?!?!? Heretic!!!

A Spider without jump jets isn't a Spider ... it's Generic 30 Ton BattleMech #25.

And if you're getting stuff blown off on landing, you're doing something wrong. I have never had anything blown off when landing, and I've been piloting Spiders since day one. One easy way to avoid fire when landing is to always land facing a different direction than you were flying, and have that W key pressed flat so you're quickly up to speed.

Please don't mention your jet-less Spider ever again. It's a sin against Battletech, and we don't want to encourage such sacrilege especially when newbies might be listening.

[Phoenix Gray]

Asheron Storm, on 15 April 2013 - 10:50 AM, said:

Hey folks, I'm wondering if anyone has come up with some decent builds for the spider that they may like to share. As for me, I've finished using the V, which I had decked out with 2 medium pulse lasers, an xl engine, and extra armor. Sadly, my D is pretty much the same as the V, but replaces some Jump with the ECM. Both of those are okay, but nothing to write home about. The variant that's really bothering me is the K. I've tried a medium laser and 4 machine guns. I've even worked things out so I could try an AC/2 (as my only weapon), and another build with an AC/5. Both AC builds can actually get more damage per match than I had with the machine guns, but I haven't won a match since making that trade. I could really use some assistance so I can tolerate my K until I don't need it anymore.

Here:http://tinyurl.com/d495sb9

LL for firepower and range, and a bunch of speed and jump jets.

[Shuyen]

Durant Carlyle, on 16 April 2013 - 09:05 PM, said:

You WHAT!?!?!? Heretic!!!

A Spider without jump jets isn't a Spider ... it's Generic 30 Ton BattleMech #25.

And if you're getting stuff blown off on landing, you're doing something wrong. I have never had anything blown off when landing, and I've been piloting Spiders since day one. One easy way to avoid fire when landing is to always land facing a different direction than you were flying, and have that W key pressed flat so you're quickly up to speed.

Please don't mention your jet-less Spider ever again. It's a sin against Battletech, and we don't want to encourage such sacrilege especially when newbies might be listening.

Well, I will admit that, in an effort to find some space, I did reduce my SDR-D's JJ's by 1 ton. I needed the space for the ECM. Without it (ECM), I honestly think the D is completely useless on the battlefield.

On a side note, the jury is still out for me and the TAG. I take great pains to announce to my team pre-battle that I have ECM & TAG, and plan on painting the enemy from the rear. I even call out on team chat which mech I am painting with the TAG. My hope is that they'll eventually be aware enough to take advantage of this. As of yet, I don't think anybody really has.

Even if it isn't effective, it is super fun the sneak behind enemy lines, sit on a hill, and TAG'ing enemy lurkers from behind. I've literally sat there painting an enemy AWS with the TAG for almost a full minute. One battle I was behind their lines, TAG'ing for a full 5 minutes. I could have done it longer, except that we were winning and their remaining mechs charged forward to engage my team. So I charged said AWS from behind and started melting through his rear armor.

Which was hilarious. I dead stopped behind him and got off 4 full salvos before he made the realization that he was taking damage. The same happened to a HBK on a different map. He was on a building on the ice planet. I just sat there, 300m away, and took off his leg with 5 salvos (ML & MPL). Only after his leg came off did he realize that he was being shot from behind. Weird!

Which makes me think that I *may* ditch the TAG and the MPL, get 2 ML's (for 3 ML total) and an extra HS, and keep doing the sneak, squat, and hit from behind tactic. So many lights just charge into enemy formations, eventually losing their ECM coverage or getting blown to Hell. It's kinda cool to make your way to the rear, find a good spot that's sheltered, and pot shot. Once seen, I've moved to a different spot, waited 15-30 seconds for the enemy to get distracted, and done it again.

Well, that's my report from a newb SDR-D pilot with no money viewpoint, at least.

[stjobe]

Shuyen, on 17 April 2013 - 08:56 AM, said:

The same happened to a HBK on a different map. He was on a building on the ice planet. I just sat there, 300m away, and took off his leg with 5 salvos (ML & MPL).

I enjoyed reading your experiences, so allow me to share a bit of mine; the ML has an effective range of 270m, and the MPL has only 180m effective range - meaning you didn't do full damage from either weapon. With that in mind, I believe you're misremembering either the distance or the number of salvos it took to leg the HBK - they normally have about 40-50 armour on their legs, and 26 Internal Structure per leg - all of which has to be chewed through before the leg is gone.

So I guess the moral of the story is: Know your weapon ranges! It's almost as important as knowing the range, damage, and cooldown times of the enemy's weapons.

[Shuyen]

stjobe, on 17 April 2013 - 10:28 AM, said:

I enjoyed reading your experiences, so allow me to share a bit of mine; the ML has an effective range of 270m, and the MPL has only 180m effective range - meaning you didn't do full damage from either weapon. With that in mind, I believe you're misremembering either the distance or the number of salvos it took to leg the HBK - they normally have about 40-50 armour on their legs, and 26 Internal Structure per leg - all of which has to be chewed through before the leg is gone.

So I guess the moral of the story is: Know your weapon ranges! It's almost as important as knowing the range, damage, and cooldown times of the enemy's weapons.

I may have been closer, I dunno, but that's a good point. I tried to be close but not too close. I just remember sitting there, TAG'ing away, and noticing we were already down 3-1 on mechs. "OK, I'll start shooting", I think. "An HBK, silhouetted perfectly! Shoot and run!"

PEW! PEW!

"Holy cr*p. He isn't even turning to look at me. OK."

PEW! PEW!

"Seriously?!?!"

PEW! PEW!

"OK, this is getting silly. Dude, I am shooting you!"

PEW! PEW!

"WTF?"

Etc, etc...leg pop. At that point in time, there were only 2-3 of us left and I got noticed so I just ran around like a lunatic, dodging and weaving and shooting (PEW! PEW!) until I was the last one left and, yeah, I died.

The whole thing amused me greatly. I just wish there was an energy weapon placed somewhere in between the ML (1 ton, 270m range) and the LL (5t, 450m range). Even if I set aside the ML and MPL, that's only 3t of room for another weapon. To get 5t of free space, I'd have to ditch the extra 1t of armor I've added and the TAG or the ECM. :/

Edited by Shuyen, 17 April 2013 - 11:04 AM.

[stjobe]

Shuyen, on 17 April 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

The whole thing amused me greatly.

Yeah, some people are oblivious to anything - I *like* those people. When they're on the other team, that is...

Shuyen, on 17 April 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

I just wish there was an energy weapon placed somewhere in between the ML (1 ton, 270m range) and the LL (5t, 450m range). Even if I set aside the ML and MPL, that's only 3t of room for another weapon. To get 5t of free space, I'd have to ditch the extra 1t of armor I've added and the TAG or the ECM. :/

Here's how I fit an ERLL and 2xML into my SDR-5D. If you want to keep the TAG, just swap one of the MLs out. If you want to, you can also switch places on the CT ML and put the ERLL there so you don't lose it if your arm gets blown off - although if that happens I'm usually only seconds away from the spectator seat anyway, and I like the extra mobility of an arm mount.

[Shuyen]

stjobe, on 17 April 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Here's how I fit an ERLL and 2xML into my SDR-5D. If you want to keep the TAG, just swap one of the MLs out. If you want to, you can also switch places on the CT ML and put the ERLL there so you don't lose it if your arm gets blown off - although if that happens I'm usually only seconds away from the spectator seat anyway, and I like the extra mobility of an arm mount.

Yeah, I have to play (and play and play) and save up the dinero for the XL engine. That's the only way I am going to be able to mount up something with a bit more range and 'oomph!'. For now, I've got Endo, Ferro, Standard HS, 2xML, TAG, ECM, and 1.5t of additional armor over stock config. In an other, um, $4 meeeelllllllliiiiioooon credits I'll be able to get the XL engine.

[scruffy416]

There's a pretty good thread here on Spiders. My older loadouts are included in one of the posts, but I've updated them based on recommendations the thread (I've moved armour from the front of the mech to the back, and re-positioned the ML on the 5D.)

MourningZero, on 16 April 2013 - 07:21 AM, said:

I leave off the JJs, since the predictability on landing tends to get more parts blown off than the flight time ever helps.

For the jump/landing thing, I've been working on feathering the JJ's on landing to try to be at as-close-to-zero vertical velocity when I land. I'm not sure if it's just me imagining the effect or what, but it feels like I land without the complete stop. Needs more experimenting and really, I need someone in another Mech to watch to see if it's happening or not.

The other solution to the JJ landing is of course, DON'T LAND WHERE ENEMY MECHS CAN STILL SEE YOU!. Ideally when you jump, you should be jumping into cover. Even a small dip in the landscape can count (eg. the craters in Tourmaline, the hillocks around the crater on Caustic, etc.) because you'll only need the cover for as long as it takes to get back up to speed.

If you've ground out enough XP and C-Bills, I recommend the Target Info Gathering module too... equip, and you'll know just that little bit quicker where to shoot - hopefully for a Component Destruction or even a Kill. For 'fresh' Assault Mechs, I'll usually try a leg first - if the armour seems to strip away well on the first shot, odds are good the pilot skimped on Leg armour (eg. CTF pilots in ammo-based builds!) and you leg them to death. If the Leg armour looks good, I go for rear CT.

In any SDR build you put together, be prepared for a LONG grind... but oh the fun you'll have

[Kommisar]

My lightest mech is a Jager. I have mastered the Atlas, Awesome, Stalker, Cataphract and Jager so far. The fastest I travel is around 76 kph.

So, I'm looking at my next mech purchase and, while the Highlander is tempting for my assault specialist idiom, I like change. I have been thinking about getting a light. The conventional wisdom is to get a Raven 3L and win-button my way to glory. (Side note, my months in the big mechs has flavored my view of lights). But, I also have 2 mastered Awesomes and 1 Jager without running dual AC/20s... so, I'm not very conventional.

The jump jets are draw for me here. I have a 3D Cataphract, but I've never done the pop-tart thing.

Should I move on, stick with my assaults, go the path of wisdom and pick up the 3L or go nutso and buy a spider?

[Shuyen]

Kommisar, on 17 April 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

My lightest mech is a Jager. I have mastered the Atlas, Awesome, Stalker, Cataphract and Jager so far. The fastest I travel is around 76 kph.

So, I'm looking at my next mech purchase and, while the Highlander is tempting for my assault specialist idiom, I like change. I have been thinking about getting a light. The conventional wisdom is to get a Raven 3L and win-button my way to glory. (Side note, my months in the big mechs has flavored my view of lights). But, I also have 2 mastered Awesomes and 1 Jager without running dual AC/20s... so, I'm not very conventional.

The jump jets are draw for me here. I have a 3D Cataphract, but I've never done the pop-tart thing.

Should I move on, stick with my assaults, go the path of wisdom and pick up the 3L or go nutso and buy a spider?

Go nutso.

Get the SDR-5D for the ECM first. Like I said earlier in this thread someplace, it's a really neat changeup from heavier mechs. You have adopt a completely different playing style from even other light classes, like the Raven.

[Durant Carlyle]

Kommisar, on 17 April 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

My lightest mech is a Jager. I have mastered the Atlas, Awesome, Stalker, Cataphract and Jager so far. The fastest I travel is around 76 kph.

So, I'm looking at my next mech purchase and, while the Highlander is tempting for my assault specialist idiom, I like change. I have been thinking about getting a light. The conventional wisdom is to get a Raven 3L and win-button my way to glory. (Side note, my months in the big mechs has flavored my view of lights). But, I also have 2 mastered Awesomes and 1 Jager without running dual AC/20s... so, I'm not very conventional.

The jump jets are draw for me here. I have a 3D Cataphract, but I've never done the pop-tart thing.

Should I move on, stick with my assaults, go the path of wisdom and pick up the 3L or go nutso and buy a spider?

Shuyen, on 17 April 2013 - 02:22 PM, said:

Go nutso.

Get the SDR-5D for the ECM first. Like I said earlier in this thread someplace, it's a really neat changeup from heavier mechs. You have adopt a completely different playing style from even other light classes, like the Raven.

I also heartily recommend the Spider. I have Mastered all three variants. They may not get lots of kills, but they ARE fun. I almost feel like a traitor saying this, but the Spider has at least tied the Jenner for my favorite 'Mech in this game.

I have more wins than losses with all three Spider variants, and only the 5K has a K/D ratio less than 1.0 (currently 0.55, up from a low of 0.30).

[Delchev]

stjobe, on 17 April 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Yeah, some people are oblivious to anything - I *like* those people. When they're on the other team, that is...


Here's how I fit an ERLL and 2xML into my SDR-5D. If you want to keep the TAG, just swap one of the MLs out. If you want to, you can also switch places on the CT ML and put the ERLL there so you don't lose it if your arm gets blown off - although if that happens I'm usually only seconds away from the spectator seat anyway, and I like the extra mobility of an arm mount.

Man, just add in ferro-fibrous and you will have so much more armor! I would even remove 1 more JJ to have good armor.

[stjobe]

Delchev, on 17 April 2013 - 11:56 PM, said:

Man, just add in ferro-fibrous and you will have so much more armor! I would even remove 1 more JJ to have good armor.

0.48 tons isn't all that much of a difference, but sure. I guess the legs could use 8 more points of armour. Good call.

[Kommisar]

Well, I went nutso.

I am now the proud owner of a Spider 5D. Tricked her out with DHS, endo, and an XL255 and have been playing around with a few different loadouts. I started with a 2xMPL, 1xML and seven jumpjets. Had a lot of fun with that; though I am still getting the hang of jumping.

Ended the night with an ERPPC build with only 3 JJ. Less jump, but I liked the single shot, high damage capability. Worked well for me at high speeds. I was even able to tear into some other light mechs. Interestingly enough, after months of being the target of light mechs actually helped me quite a bit. I knew what tore me to pieces and I knew what mistakes I always look for from a light mech. I just did my best to focus on the former and avoid the later.

[Kamelkaze]

I play my spidey 5D with 2 ER Large Laser.

Love it!

[Milt]

i run two 5d builds, 1erppc,2ml,ecm,jj and 3mpl,ecm,bap,jj both with a 255xl. the ppc build is the most fun but the 3mpl gets me bigger scores.

[scruffy416]

Kamelkaze, on 18 April 2013 - 04:42 AM, said:

I play my spidey 5D with 2 ER Large Laser.

Love it!

Wow, 2 ERLL? Care to share the loadout? I couldn't manage two without a lot of sacrifices I didn't want to make.

[Shuyen]

I spent some time this morning playing the 5D w/TAG & ECM. On the Forest Colony there is a ledge on the hill the tunnel goes through. I jumped up and perched on that, TAG'ing enemy mechs with impunity (including some that were literally right below me) for 3/4 of the game. We didn't win (it was close), but I did get a nice XP TAG bonus, so at least I know it works.

It still just amazes me how much these little Spiders can blend into the background with ECM. They just literally don't see you at all! I can imagine with a ERLL or a ERPPC how effective a stealth sniper this thing could be.

[stjobe]

scruffy416, on 18 April 2013 - 08:29 AM, said:

Wow, 2 ERLL? Care to share the loadout? I couldn't manage two without a lot of sacrifices I didn't want to make.

Here's one way of doing it: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c9919709ab427c1
No JJs.