152 replies to this topic

[Yokaiko]

teh booty is very sore with this one.

[ArmageddonKnight]

As much as i agree wiht the OP, i dont see a 3rd game type coming along any time soon.

PGI has already stated they will be splitting each of the current game types in two possibly 3 for when 3rd person mode is released. (1st person only, 3rd person only, mixed)
That will increase wait times to find groups, if they add a 3rd death match or king of the hill mode, that will increase wait times even further.

Personaly i think they shouldnt bother with 3rd person mode, they should instead just add more game types. So instead of 2 game types and up to 6 queues for 1st, 3rd, mixed person modes. I would rather have 4 different game types.

Asault ( 2 teams of 12)
Conquest ( 2 teams of 12)
King of the Hill with possible respawns/redrops so its not another death match type game (2 teams of 12)
3 Way death match (3 teams of 8)

Edited by ArmageddonKnight, 24 April 2013 - 11:11 AM.

[xterix]

how hard is this, if you wanna play a 'whack each other senseless' game, gather others of the same ilk and sync drop together as a 8man.

[qki]

No, OP. First - you are not running a "fast" mech - anything below 97 km/h is moderate speed at best.

And it's not killing you use it for - otherwise you'd get back and kill the capper. What you want, is a mindless game of whack a mole, where you just walko over to one spot on the map, and shoot the enemy as they appear.

Heavens forbid you'd actually have to look for the enemy, or try to counter his strategy. You want the enemy to do what you expect him to do, and when he doesn't, you come over here and cry for the devs to make him.

So far, however, PGI seems all in favour of diversity, and the more ways there are to achieve the objective, the better. So just gear up, and prepare. It's not like capturing the base is a random, hidden unknown.

[Lazor Sharp]

I am with Homeless Bill,
I only pug in MWO, and don't do premade's so far.......that may change soon......
4 out of 5 pug teams i play with, don't ever think about defending the base, and when i do go back in a heavy, i die quick
because all the enemy heavy's show up, and none of my team are even close enough to help, it gets old.... In game Voip for your current Pug team would be great, typing in chat while some one is pounding on you is death........and the Premades will use TS anyway.....
I LOVE the Game, Hate the Cap Mode
JUST GIVE US MIND LESS WACK THE DAMN MOLE...... this is what we want to play some times......
not always, when i feel like playing cap the crap, i will play that mode.......

Although i don't think that TDM is so mindless as you think, there are some strategy involved, I have played MWL, etc.. alone in open servers, and on teams in Team Speak, and know how that works, this the kind of play we want...... Some of You may not like it, and that is fine, but there are enough of us that do like TDM to make it a viable Mode....!!!!!!! SO, What's so damn hard about adding a new mode to make a LARGE portion of your player base happy....?

I would bet that nearly ALL the newbie PUGs will play TDM, vs cap the crap, till they get use to playing, and then they will start playing the other modes, and learn how to defend the base.

I would also like to see King of the Hill, and McRugby Modes, this would give enough verity to keep PPL interested and not bored to death of one mode or another........ Like it is, PPL are Leaving in droves, bored senseless, till something changes.......

[DeaconW]

Ahasver, on 24 April 2013 - 04:51 AM, said:

Help me out, I do not understand the discussion (maybe because of my english).

There are two Bases and two ways to win. Eather by killing the other team or by capturing the other Base.

I do not see where the concept leads to problems with the whole game of MWO and I never had the feeling
the game mode was responsible whenever the other Team captured our Base.

Why would the game mode be a problem? Is this not a matter of tactics and countertactics?




Apart from this, King of the Hill would be a nice option, but would lead to even more Assault Mechs and less movement, less
game play and more mindless shooting. I would play it every now and then but with Airstrikes and Artillery ... well probably it will be boring after a while.

Don't feel bad, your reading comprehension is fine. It's the QQers that aren't making sense. Instead of asking for a new game mode, such as KOTH, they want to change the current ones. AOC said it best, their attitude is "capping bad, team work bad, just want shoot robits and get mad when they no stand still." There is a strong contingent that really want to dumb down MWO into a COD or GOW clone...

[Homeless Bill]

qki, on 24 April 2013 - 11:25 AM, said:

No, OP. First - you are not running a "fast" mech - anything below 97 km/h is moderate speed at best.

And it's not killing you use it for - otherwise you'd get back and kill the capper. What you want, is a mindless game of whack a mole, where you just walko over to one spot on the map, and shoot the enemy as they appear.

I apologize. You're clearly the authority on arbitrary numbers here.

Get back and kill the capper? That's how you think it works? Cute. What really happens is the minute I return to base, the Raven runs off, and I've left my team down a man and had zero fun in the process. When there's actually something I can kill on base, I'll head back.

You arrogant ******** need to stop telling me what mode I want. I'm looking for a mode based entirely around combat. Games would be far more dynamic, my rate of capture idea encourages tactics that don't just rush straight for the capture, and even if it did end up being similar every round, that's no different than what we have now in Assault. At least mine has a few different locations to fight over instead of the near-identical way most Assault matches play out.

Let's say I don't even take issue with your description of the mode I want. If enough people want that mindless mode, why can't we have it? Why do you and people like you deserve two modes to **** around in, while the TDM crowd gets the Raven reach-around?

DeaconW, on 24 April 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

Instead of asking for a new game mode, such as KOTH, they want to change the current ones. AOC said it best, their attitude is "capping bad, team work bad, just want shoot robits and get mad when they no stand still." There is a strong contingent that really want to dumb down MWO into a COD or GOW clone...

Already changed my OP to reflect that I don't care whether it's new or changed. I just think it's incredibly unfair that you wise and intelligent "tactics" people get two modes, while the boors among us have no place to shoot stuff without any other worries.

The arrogance just grates on me. I'm not for dumbing the game down. I'm not for getting rid of tactics. I'm for diversity - I'm for adding a mode of pure killing that (as many polls have shown) a lot of people want. Don't want to play that gametype? Then don't; play the run-around game that you find so entertaining. But don't force your arbitrary playstyle on everyone else.

[Lazor Sharp]

Bill, Well Said....

WE DON'T WANT DUMB DOWN VERSIONS OF MODES we have now, We Want a NEW mode, TDM that fits our idea of fun, not your idea of what is the OP of this game......!!!!!!!

"Let's say I don't even take issue with your description of the mode I want. If enough people want that mindless mode, why can't we have it? Why do you and people like you deserve two modes to **** around in, while the TDM crowd gets the Raven reach-around?"

"The arrogance just grates on me. I'm not for dumbing the game down. I'm not for getting rid of tactics. I'm for diversity - I'm for adding a mode of pure killing that (as many polls have shown) a lot of people want. Don't want to play that gametype? Then don't; play the run-around game that you find so entertaining. But don't force your arbitrary playstyle on everyone else."

Edited by Lazor Sharp, 24 April 2013 - 02:34 PM.

[qki]

Call me lod fashioned, but anything below 6/9/0 doesn't get to call itself fast. And whatever fancy words you use - that's exactly what you're asking for - even if you keep denying to everyone, yourself included.

You want a game mode, where the only way to win is destroying enemy mechs. Because that means the enemy will HAVE TO seek combat, instead of employing strategy. A side effect is robbing light mechs of their greatest weapon (the situation you described, when you get back, and the raven runs off, or completes the cap if you don't get back. And contrary to what some people say, and believe, it is not an unsolvable riddle).


Did you consider the simple fact, that once 'mechs start hitting the dirt, it is very difficult (and rare) for that team to get back in the fight? Without objectives like base capping, the first team to lose a mech or two, is essentially doomed to lose, because the other team just turtles up, getting further and further ahead with every kill, and gaining superior firepower every time. Guess you didn't think of that Mr. "I know better than all the devs, and can rebalance the entire game in my head in 10 minutes".

[Fabe]

I don't know about any one else but I think what would help with speed capping is some base defences. Have a few turrets placed around the base maybe even a some tanks that rush out to attack when the enemy gets to close. Also having a freindly on the base should stop the cap so you'll always need to have at least one more capper then defender. And finally have the cap meter refresh if the capper leaves the point.

Edited by Fabe, 24 April 2013 - 03:25 PM.

[Lazor Sharp]

Once again, played a drop, and never got to fire a shot....... we capped and won, I got 20 points, Woopie.... Cap Warrior Deluxe...... What a joke...... What a waste of time............

Edited by Lazor Sharp, 24 April 2013 - 05:46 PM.

[qki]

Fabe, on 24 April 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

I don't know about any one else but I think what would help with speed capping is some base defences. Have a few turrets placed around the base maybe even a some tanks that rush out to attack when the enemy gets to close. Also having a freindly on the base should stop the cap so you'll always need to have at least one more capper then defender. And finally have the cap meter refresh if the capper leaves the point.

You are not thinking at all - that's the problem. Defences would all but destroy any lights attempting to cap, effectively nullifying a whole tactic that is based on entering the cap zone to force a reaction, or as a means of turning the tide.

[Homeless Bill]

qki, on 24 April 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

Call me lod fashioned, but anything below 6/9/0 doesn't get to call itself fast.

Because that means the enemy will HAVE TO seek combat, instead of employing strategy. A side effect is robbing light mechs of their greatest weapon.

Did you consider the simple fact, that once 'mechs start hitting the dirt, it is very difficult (and rare) for that team to get back in the fight? Without objectives like base capping, the first team to lose a mech or two, is essentially doomed to lose, because the other team just turtles up, getting further and further ahead with every kill, and gaining superior firepower every time. Guess you didn't think of that Mr. "I know better than all the devs, and can rebalance the entire game in my head in 10 minutes".

Most assaults can barely break 60; I go 85, so I consider myself fast. My point was this: I'm not begging for slow targets for my even slower brawler like DeaconW suggested.

The most baffling point you keep re-iterating is that people will abandon tactics in favor of combat. How does that even make sense? How many battles don't involve strategy and positioning? What I'd consider greatest military engagements in history weren't often slog-fests - they were all about superior positioning. I'm personally a flanking action kind of guy. There's nothing like rolling up on the back of a sniper squad with a wolf pack.

Your narrow definition of "tactics" is just one simple, repetitive move to draw a couple enemies away from the fight. It's predictable, it's un-fun for most people involved, and there's nothing interesting about it. It's a single tactic that can ruin most other fun ones.

Wanted to take the long flaking road on Alpine? Too bad; you need to defend your base. How about using the lights to rush enemy snipers so the main force can get close? Nope - they need to make sure the enemy lights don't slip behind. Want to battle it out in a different part of the map? You're probably doing it wrong, and you should get closer to one of the bases to be of use.

And the big one: you refuse to answer my point that Assault pretty much always plays out the same every time, and I suspect that's because you know I'm right. 90+% of the PUG matches end up in the same locations having the same fights. You criticize my mode's lack of diversity, when the current implementation of Assault is clearly worse in that regard. Again, at least mine would switch the center of the fight between a few different areas. And don't start talking about how crazy different it is that some matches boil down to capture and others don't; lights aside, the rest of us end up trotting to the middle of the map and slowly closing on each other. It's the same ****, every time (honestly, it's why I play Conquest more often than not).

You say that I take away a light's greatest weapon by taking away capturing. I hope that all decent light pilots take offense to that. I know several gentlemen who absolutely tear **** up in a light.

Speed is a light's greatest weapon - and that isn't just useful for getting inside a square. Whenever I run a light, I'm constantly nipping at their back lines, making sure their snipers and LRM boats are distracted and irritated. Hell, brawling in a light is one of the funnest things in the game. Just because you play lights like a coward doesn't mean everyone likes to play them that way.

I'll admit that the farther you're down, the harder it is to win. Kind of most things in life? That's the whole point. It means getting matches over with quickly instead of the last guy realizing his team is losing, wasting three minutes of everyone's time, and then bestowing the win on the undeserving team. Again, I admit it's a perfectly valid tactic to capture. But at the end of the day, it's often (not always, but often) winning like a ***** - it's winning when by every other metric, you lost. I take two issues with your analysis of how things play out:
1. Being out-gunned is usually the most fun I have in this game. The last Catapult on your team finish off the last six enemies, Koreanese taking out the last four in his Jenner, that headshot on a fresh Atlas that turns the tables - those are the moments I live for. I still remember the 5v8 faceroll I was involved in back in December; good stories come from epic moments - all Assault does is encourage players to avoid those in favor of safety. Hey, why don't you tell me about that one time you stood in that one box and it was super ******* awesome? (I'll admit I do have one reeeally good capture story, but otherwise it's all really boring)
2. It's no different in the current implementation of Assault - once you're getting rolled, it's all over. Assault just lets the team that got their ***** kicked feel like winners.

My final point (and if this isn't addressed, I'm done arguing): Why not? Why can't we simpletons have a mode like we want, but you get two where you can do what you want? What would it hurt to add this mode to the game? You clearly won't be playing it, so why do you care? Why do you want people like me in your objective gametypes? Is your way of playing more correct than mine? I just fail to understand why people like you feel the need to force your playstyle on everyone else.

[Fabe]

qki, on 24 April 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

You are not thinking at all - that's the problem. Defences would all but destroy any lights attempting to cap, effectively nullifying a whole tactic that is based on entering the cap zone to force a reaction, or as a means of turning the tide.

Not if the defenses are balanced right,Lights would still be able to decoy cap.They'll just have to take care of some stationary turrets first.

[Lazor Sharp]

Once again Bill, well said.........

[hercules1981]

qki, on 24 April 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

You are not thinking at all - that's the problem. Defences would all but destroy any lights attempting to cap, effectively nullifying a whole tactic that is based on entering the cap zone to force a reaction, or as a means of turning the tide.

Oh no so what will u do when they do put up turrets at the base guess u will have to find something else to do besides cap, fight mayb, cause they already have spoke about base defence it's gonna be in the game.

[qki]

I'll have no shortage of things to do. Problem is - capping IS A TACTIC. Siply smearing the base with Unions, and Overlords to buttrape any 'mech that comes close without 6 friends is just stupid.

Part of the Light 'mech usefulness in the game comes from their ability to harass, not just shoot the enemy.

And stop being a scrub and pretending like there is only skill in "fighting". Play by the rules of the game, instead of making up your own, imaginary rules. And for some reason, it always comes down to the notion that "skill" is only found in the ability to press a lot of buttons quickly, and anyone who seeks to remove as much variables from combat as possible is reviled as a "no-skill cheeser".

[Homeless Bill]

qki, on 25 April 2013 - 02:40 AM, said:

Part of the Light 'mech usefulness in the game comes from their ability to harass, not just shoot the enemy.

And stop being a scrub and pretending like there is only skill in "fighting". Play by the rules of the game, instead of making up your own, imaginary rules. And for some reason, it always comes down to the notion that "skill" is only found in the ability to press a lot of buttons quickly, and anyone who seeks to remove as much variables from combat as possible is reviled as a "no-skill cheeser".

I agree with you 100% that lights aren't just there to shoot the enemy - or even primarily. What I'm saying is that they're still far from obsolete in a strictly combat / scouting role.

You need to stop pretending everyone likes to play like you. There are many different skillsets in this game and none of them are less valuable than the others. Calling you a coward was really only done to match your snarkiness =P Personally, I'm extremely thankful when I get a good scout on my team that calls out positions and movements.

I'm not calling you a cheesemonster for capturing; you're playing the game to win, and you're doing so efficiently. I'm just asking for a mode where people like me can get away from people like you - one where the only variables are strategic positioning and fighting prowess.

You want objectives, and we want death to all robots. Again, I'm that guy you hate because he throws away the guaranteed win in favor of the thrill of combat. Why the hell do you want me playing in your mode?

Since you are completely unable supply a reason that we shouldn't get a mode like this, I'm going to call this a win.

[qki]

And you'd be better off pushing for trials of grievance.

Also, my previous comment was aimed at Hercules1981

Edited by qki, 25 April 2013 - 04:55 AM.

[hercules1981]

qki, on 25 April 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

And you'd be better off pushing for trials of grievance.

Also, my previous comment was aimed at Hercules1981

Don't be calling me a scrub I never said there was skill in only fighting what so ever and u know it. If I wanted to button mash I'd go play mortal kombat ok. I love all the tactics involved in this game even capping but I will say that I'm not a fan of people that make it 1st thing on there list to cap. If u played more defensive with your light instead of just capping straight out I think us bigs would have less to say about all the CAPWARRIOR crap every1 says. Scout a bit find the enemy and come back to the bigs, cover there back. Make sure no light is gonna shoot them in the back. If some1 caps your base go deal with it let the bigs advance then u take care of the mechs capping your base it's all out to Cap there's at that point. At least if a light caps yours and he runs off u can chase him down any thing else but another light or cicada or a cent D and he runs off and gets to do it again.
So again I'm not really sure what the deal is with people actually name Callin around on these forums. I'm not a scrub at this game whatsoever ever man and if u really want to be seen as an Internet thug that's your problem. It's real easy to talk**** when u don't c some1 in front of u.
Oh and when missiles come back to being useful again u could tag for your team as well.

Edited by hercules1981, 25 April 2013 - 05:52 AM.