138 replies to this topic

[Forscythe]

Merrik Stryfe, on 07 June 2012 - 04:24 PM, said:

OHGODYES

"ALL SYSTEMS ARE COMPLETELY NOMINAL! FANTASTIC!"

I approve this message.

[Melissia]

Feminism has a bad reputation in some places, but meh, it's kinda undeserved, just like gamers have an undeserved reputation for being douchebags to everyone.

I remember being called "feminazi" because I said that if there was an option to play as a female soldier in certain modern shooters I'd be more inclined to buy them. Or being told I deserved to be raped because I happened to use a female avatar in a game and beat them in a match The amount of childish hate that gets spewed out is mind-boggling at times.

[Beazle]

As i Mechanist i appreciate that you have portrayed Mechs as being fully compatible with all genders, races, and creeds.

Too often Mechs are portrayed as limited death machines capable of being piloted by only a select few.

Mechs should ALWAYS be portrayed as UNlimited death machines.

[Waladil]

Melissia, on 07 June 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

Feminism has a bad reputation in some places, but meh, it's kinda undeserved, just like gamers have an undeserved reputation for being douchebags to everyone.

I remember being called "feminazi" because I said that if there was an option to play as a female soldier in certain modern shooters I'd be more inclined to buy them. Or being told I deserved to be raped because I happened to use a female avatar in a game and beat them in a match The amount of childish hate that gets spewed out is mind-boggling at times.

That **** you're mentioning is pretty evil. But there are some hilariously stupid feminists out there. (I refer you to the "scholarly" article "Woman the gatherer" by Sally Slocum.)

Why can't people just be equal and happy about it?

[Melissia]

Waladil, on 07 June 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

Why can't people just be equal and happy about it?

That IS feminism-- equal rights.


But at the moment, we AREN'T equal in terms of rights or treatment. >90% of games require you to play as a male avatar. Most games have no female developers at all. Outside the gaming industry, women are underpaid (female professors of the same level of seniority make 11% less than male professors, and that's hardly the only example), underrepresented (the number of countries where women are represented equally in the seats of power can be represented with one hand that ha half the fingers cut off), and almost universally, humanity has a culture that favors masculinity over femininity (East Asian countrys' (especially China and India) problems with sex-selective abortions resulting in female foetuses being aborted more than male ones, for example. China has 118.08 males for every 100 females, a nearly 20% difference).

So... the struggle, as it were, is still on-going.

[Waladil]

Melissia, on 07 June 2012 - 04:57 PM, said:

That IS feminism-- equal rights.


But at the moment, we AREN'T equal in terms of rights or treatment. >90% of games require you to play as a male avatar. Most games have no female developers at all. Outside the gaming industry, women are underpaid (female professors of the same level of seniority make 11% less than male professors, and that's hardly the only example), underrepresented (the number of countries where women are represented equally in the seats of power can be represented with one hand that ha half the fingers cut off), and almost universally, humanity has a culture that favors masculinity over femininity (East Asian countrys' (especially China and India) problems with sex-selective abortions resulting in female foetuses being aborted more than male ones, for example. China has 118.08 males for every 100 females, a nearly 20% difference).

So... the struggle, as it were, is still on-going.

I'm not arguing against you! Did you read the article I referred you to? In it, Mrs. Slocum (Possibly Dr. Slocum, I'm not sure on her credentials) basically says "Women are more important than men and women invented art and fed the family and raised the children in the past and we can be sure I'm right because men are dumb." I've read her paper and there's a mysterious lack of... y'know, evidence or anything to support her claims.

I WANT there to be equality. I DON'T discriminate on gender (or anything else for that matter). And yet, for some reason, I've got certain people jumping down my throat telling me my gender is filled with bad people and that I'm apparently ignorant and uneducated for not being aware that sexism is still a thing.

And that's all I'm saying on this. I'm not gonna get into a flame war or an internet argument right now, I've got better stuff to do*.


*Anything else.

[Joanna Conners]

Jeremiah Mint, on 07 June 2012 - 04:18 PM, said:

Why is that silly? I don't play female characters. Period.(no pun intended) I simply cannot relate to a female. I can't imagine how a female counterpart might react in the same situation as a male and so, I don't play them.

And that's a reasonable response. The one I said was "silly" was not.

[Alymbic]

Melissia, on 07 June 2012 - 04:57 PM, said:

That IS feminism-- equal rights.

Depends how objective your being I guess.

I get what your saying, but coming from Australia I have to say a lot of that sort of treatment is minimised. I'm not saying it doesnt exist, but it's at the very least not as readily apparent, for better or for worse. Unfortunetly, we just have to live with seeing that sort of thing in the world, and there is little we can do to help East Asian countries doing what they do. You make a strong arguement, but at the moment the best we can do to combat anti-feminist sentiment at present is to Alpha Strike anyone who makes... callous remarks when the game is released.

And as for sexism in gaming, I'm from a rural farmer background. I prefer to see real women in games and books rather then some of the (cough) anime style girls. Thats what I've always liked about BattleTech, the fact that normally the authors are unbiased towards males and females, and in a few cases (thinking of Natasha Kerensky here) completely outclass there peers.

[Melissia]

Waladil, on 07 June 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

I'm not arguing against you! Did you read the article I referred you to?

I really don't see how it's relevant. There's extremists on all sides.

Waladil, on 07 June 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

And yet, for some reason, I've got certain people jumping down my throat telling me my gender is filled with bad people and that I'm apparently ignorant and uneducated for not being aware that sexism is still a thing.

And yet, for some reason, I've got certain people jumping down my throat telling me to get back in the kitchen and that I'm a bad woman and sinner for getting a degree in Chemistry and trying to work for a living.

Neither one is that pleasant, but at the moment, the certain people I referred to are the ones that have actual influence and power in our society, where the ones you referred to are embittered fringe groups of a long-running civil rights movement.

Edited by Melissia, 07 June 2012 - 05:25 PM.

[JP Josh]

PANZERBUNNY, on 07 June 2012 - 11:39 AM, said:

Female mechwarriors spend too much time in the Engineering bay and not on the battlefield...they also take at LEAST 3 times longer reloading and outfitting their rides.

Lets not even get into the Neuro helmet messing up their hair. A nightmare for the CO to listen to that all over the COMS.

you obvisly havnt met my girlfirend fits helga role perfectly she does.

[AdamantVallation]

Melissia, on 07 June 2012 - 04:57 PM, said:

... >90% of games require you to play as a male avatar ...11% less than male professors, and that's hardly the only example) ... with one hand that ha half the fingers cut off), .... China has 118.08 males for every 100 females, a nearly 20% difference).

Did you know that 87% of statistics are made up on the spot?

[Alymbic]

I'm I the only one to see a "warning, critical overload imminent" flash across the screen? There is little we can do at present with regards to this, the best we can do is to a) work together over time to overcome this or b. selectively nuke countries and parliamentary buildings et al. Now, I have to admit I'm rather taken to the second option but the first will probably be the best in the long run.

Ladies and Gentlemen, let’s not start a flame war when we don’t need another one

Edited for spelling

Edited by Alymbic, 07 June 2012 - 05:37 PM.

[Renan Ruivo]

Tyra, on 07 June 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

Awkward? Only if you misrepresent yourself.

As a writer, I have to write women as part of what I write. I HAVE to be as realistic as possible, for it to be believable.

I'm also a roleplayer. I typically write women, because I view roleplay as interactive fiction.

I'm making a joke here, and you are not helping


Still ... As a writer, you wouldn't cast a MAN for the role of a FEMALE character, would you?

[Melissia]

I don't see any one starting a flame war yet?

AdamantVallation, on 07 June 2012 - 05:25 PM, said:

Did you know that 87% of statistics are made up on the spot?

The only statistic I made up from whole cloth there was the ninety percent of games require you to play a male statistic.

I'm fairly certain that one is higher, actually. The rest of it was statistics found through actual research. The 118.08 males per 100 females in China is from China's own census, for example.

[Joanna Conners]

Renan Ruivo, on 07 June 2012 - 05:30 PM, said:

I'm making a joke here, and you are not helping


Still ... As a writer, you wouldn't cast a MAN for the role of a FEMALE character, would you?

Depends on the script.

Role-playing is not screen acting. It's written and imaginative immersion.

[Melissia]

Renan Ruivo, on 07 June 2012 - 05:30 PM, said:

Still ... As a writer, you wouldn't cast a MAN for the role of a FEMALE character, would you?

Well, some writers do this, for the sake of comedy usually unfortunately. Very few writers actually deal seriously and fairly with "stay at home dads", for example.

[Joanna Conners]

Alymbic, on 07 June 2012 - 05:29 PM, said:

I'm I the only one to see a "warning, critical overload imminent" flash across the screen? There is little we can do at present with regards to this, the best we can do is to a) work together over time to overcome this or b. selectively nuke countries and parliamentary buildings. Now, I have to admit I'm rather taken to the second option but the first will probably be the best in the long run.

Ladies and Gentlemen, let’s not start a flame war when we don’t need another one

Edited for spelling

Interesting that you want to assign blame toward governments. I would've said the biggest problem is culture and religion.

[Alymbic]

Demona, on 07 June 2012 - 05:32 PM, said:

Interesting that you want to assign blame toward governments. I would've said the biggest problem is culture and religion.

Its a bad example, I know, but I hope you get my point, but I was more gearing that assurtion towards governments such as in China One Child Policy and similiar.

Edited by Alymbic, 07 June 2012 - 05:38 PM.

[KeeperVS]

Joanna from The Legend of the Jade Phoenix trilogy is my favorite female character in Battletech.

[Melissia]

Culture, especially.

Look at the example I gave of women professors-- this gap applies even in private schools, because despite colleges having a reputation for being "liberal", in truth, they're very conservative organizations as they're highly resistant to change. We've been trying to get rid of Tenure for years, as well (it's a very wasteful and inefficient system), but that's also been heavily resisted.

As for religion... I don't really want to get too far in to that, but a lot of the misogynistic things in the bible were not actually in the original text, but were added in later (same with most of the homophobic parts-- the "Sin of Sodom" was actually inhospitality, and had nothing to do with homosexuality until Emperor Justinian's reign where he used the change to attack his political opponents-- and the witchcraft related parts which the KJV added in).

So the religion topic is extremely nuanced and I don't really feel like getting that deeply in it...