1217 replies to this topic

[DeaconW]

MonkeyCheese, on 04 June 2013 - 09:57 PM, said:

Just because one condition or reaction dose not apply to certain people it doesn't mean it is a lie, how hard is it to believe that this is seriously a problem for people?

Is it so hard to believe that some people are so dishonest and narcissistic that they will feign this problem to try and get their poptart meta game back?

[StealthAssassin]

Eugenics, on 04 June 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

< Master Spider pilot. Now all my spiders are no fun.

I too am a master spider pilot, or like to think so at least. I even run a spider with no armor, and 2 ER PPC's sometimes. My accuracy has gone from 60% which is reasonable to maybe 40% it feels like, perhaps less?

If lights get nerfed much more, many of us will quit, and you will be left with asssault/heavy warrior online.

DeaconW, on 04 June 2013 - 10:17 PM, said:

Is it so hard to believe that some people are so dishonest and narcissistic that they will feign this problem to try and get their poptart meta game back?

I only played highlanders yesterday before the patch, and today. I have no interest in them. I can say that although it is certainly more difficult to aim with them, they are much less affected than lights.

Edited by StealthAssassin, 04 June 2013 - 10:22 PM.

[Inhibition]

DeaconW, on 04 June 2013 - 09:25 PM, said:

Nice try...but you fell off the ledge when you implied the current poptart meta was "creative"...



How appropriate that someone named "MonkeyCheese" supports the cheese builds...

Is an A1 catapult firing unguided SRM's and jump jetting called sniping/poptarting? I did mention that the only mech of mine I really use with jump jets is a catapult? Too much hostility and distrust in this thread.

As a catapult user I get cored by poptarters, but I didn't care, I used my brain to maneuver around jumping snipers and
use close range combat to my advantage. My A1 catapult build is now...useless.

Is brawling with srm's and jump jetting to increase my versatility as an opponent called poptarting? This jump jet shaking now forces ME to spread my SRM damage over an enemy mech by random (no skill involved). I use Jump jets in brawling to spread enemy damage all over my mech, allowing me to live longer. Spreading damage over my catapult is useful especially because without jumpjets (low combat versatility), the arms/"ears" of a catapult get shot off way too often, striping all my weapons. With an srm nerf, and now a jump jet nerf, my build and style of play is practically no longer an effective = stunting variability and creativity in personalized combat styles.

This is why I am disappointed with the developers.

[StandingCow]

Vectoron, on 04 June 2013 - 06:34 PM, said:

Something I have yet to understand is...

If you get motion sick easily.... Why are you playing a piloting/mecha game? Why? I think its utterly obvious that the meta jocks are a little sore about this, and are looking for excuses to make it change.

Seriously though, if you do suffer from motion sickness.... dont play Pilot Simulators. The goal of this game (to my understanding) was not ever to be a game like call of duty, or halo, or any of those. Your piloting a 3 story mass of anger, the slightest jerk or twist should be making you vomit if thats the case.

Further more, I pilot a CTF-3d. This change was needed, and hasnt hindered my ability or mobility. It has introduced real skill back into the game as well. Sorry for the rude awakening to those who thought they were tough stuff in their poptart snipers.




Edit: forgot to say "Cry some more!"

Most simulators don't make me sick, but some FPS games do. Some things that every game should do that helps with motion sickness is FOV... 90 and above really helps out. Also, studdering/jumpiness can cause it to happen from my experience.

LOTS of people get motion sick, so telling people that do, to not play the game isn't an answer, in fact, it's not helpful whatsoever (makes you look like an ***). If we can help MWO devs implement this feature, without affecting the millions that suffer from motion sickness, good.

I don't think lights should really have much of any cockpit shake, maybe just a slight vibration.

Edited by StandingCow, 04 June 2013 - 10:24 PM.

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

In couple of other topics I implied that had they nerfed Jenner pilots more than poptarts. Was one on one with user Kunae a while ago and he is very skilled with the JJ and jenner use. Beat me down in a situation where normally the Jenner would be dead (might be something to do with ballistics netcode also). But the point is I saw the skill one on one and I respect that alot. I do not want to see those good light pilots go away... I still feel that one should adapt to current state of game (like many of us adapted to poptarts) but unnecessary gimping of lights is not acceptable..

I hope the reduction of shake will make things better for light pilots and those who suffer from nausea.

[DLFReporter]

Screenshake could be toned down a bit, but the crosshair-shake and the deviation can stay.

[Dashwood Fox]

DeaconW, on 04 June 2013 - 09:49 PM, said:

...but I drive lights as well and so far, it really doesn't both me in my jenner.

It bugs me quite a bit in mine. As I light pilot I rely on my ability to concentrate my minimal firepower (relative to other weight classes) on one part of a Mech at a time. Sure you can still hit a Mech but your damage is more spread and focusing fire on a specific part of a Mech is pretty much impossible now while in the air. That is a significant nerf on the Jenner's brawling ability. Lights are hard enough to aim with while moving fast over uneven terrain, using JJ's was actually a way of stabilizing your Mech's movement to get a more concentrated shot. Now you get the opposite.

I really despised alpha strike poptarts (alpha strike builds in general) but now that the Jenner isn't as fun to run I'm probably going to lose interest in this game unless the shake is reduced in Lights. Even the mediums could use a reduction. The BJ-1 and BJ-3 have become pretty inferior to the other mediums as a result. I was really enjoying them but now I'm probably going to sell them.

Unrelated: Or they need to at least throw some bigger engines in the RVN-2X and RVN-4X to make them more effective scouts. That would keep me around.

IV Amen, on 04 June 2013 - 10:22 PM, said:

In couple of other topics I implied that had they nerfed Jenner pilots more than poptarts. Was one on one with user Kunae a while ago and he is very skilled with the JJ and jenner use. Beat me down in a situation where normally the Jenner would be dead (might be something to do with ballistics netcode also). But the point is I saw the skill one on one and I respect that alot. I do not want to see those good light pilots go away... I still feel that one should adapt to current state of game (like many of us adapted to poptarts) but unnecessary gimping of lights is not acceptable..

^This 1000 times.

[Corvus Antaka]

Glad jumpsniping is dead. not glad that lights got the shaft, already was hard to jumpshoot with them. Even worse, jumpjets are garbage once more, continue to be "Wall climbing jets" more than "jumpjets" and are no-where near ready for collisions or DFA with current jumpjet design. Until jumpjets are revamped they will continue to be relegated to 1 JJ to get around faster, or max JJ to do the "drop and jumpsnipe"

Also, the entire experience of jumpjetting now sucks. the motion sickness / randomness is god-aweful, and despite the fact that I myself am not a big jumpsnipe player at all, I find the entire game less fun whenever I take a jumpjet capable mech - it makes me not want to play. And that is not cool. all the skill is removed by this vibration, shots are totally random. considering the "no cone of fire stance" i find this jumpjet implementation goes directly against that, and as such creates a confusing situation.

suggestions below as to what could be done to improve the experience.

Edited by Colonel Pada Vinson, 04 June 2013 - 10:51 PM.

[Modo44]

The Jenner should not have a brawling ability. Like every other light 'mech, it can hit and run, or stay and die. Running circles around anything but assaults was just silly.

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

Modo44, on 04 June 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

The Jenner should not have a brawling ability. Like every other light 'mech, it can hit and run, or stay and die. Running circles around anything but assaults was just silly.

You obviously have not met good light pilots... They do not circle strafe at all. You can not predict their next move while constantly taking hits from their ML wether they are in air or ground or behind cover!

[Deathlike]

I had a better post hidden here:
http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2418362

Quote

It's longer than you think. If you were the one suffering, you would be whining too. There's already been discussions about HUD colors for the colorblind... why don't you see that as an issue? Many who are complaining about the motion is complaining about the shots being affected (it'll frustrate them for sure, but that's a different discussion).

It's almost like people having allergies, with peanuts for example. Many food products are required to list them on the label. You are also REQUIRED BY LAW to inform waiters/food providers that a person may have that problem. Failure to understand the ramifications of said change is not good for player retention (having it cause physical illness should not occur in the first place).

If people complaining about motion sickness relative to the reticule moment, that can change.. usually other games simply "expand" the reticule to show inaccurate or the "cone of fire" we've come to know and love/hate.

The screen shaking however is more distracting, and people disable that feature in games for obvious reasons... not just for competitive play, but for health. It's not strictly for just pro-gamers.

[Modo44]

IV Amen, on 04 June 2013 - 10:36 PM, said:

You obviously have not met good light pilots... They do not circle strafe at all. You can not predict their next move while constantly taking hits from their ML wether they are in air or ground or behind cover!

That was kind of my point. A good light pilot will not whine about not being able to "brawl".

[DeaconW]

Dashwood Fox, on 04 June 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

. That is a significant nerf on the Jenner's brawling ability.

Well there's your problem right there...you think lights are supposed to brawl...

[Alik Kerensky]

Not prone to motion sickness myself so I find this change just annoying more than having any physical aliment. It reminds me of the excessive cockpit shake from dual AC/2 builds on the K2 awhile back or the A1 Streak Cats before ECM. To me it's kind of a step back in playability as it doesn't seem to add anything useful as I still jump around erradically taking pot shots at everyone in my Jenner.

From My 1st match after patch.


My 3D did okay too, but then again I use its jump jets to change direction and never really cared about being a slow falling airborne target i.e. pop-tart.

My biggest complaint is that the motion is out of synch with the direction of movement... since we don't have directional thrust other than up then down from a straight line this toilet swirling reticle motion instead of a more up/down vibration is quite frankly stupid IMHO. If you want to see jump jet like stuff in real life recommend watching some of the NASA videos on YouTube... particularly the cabin videos with external view too... see how direction and thrust affect how they shake.

Edited by Alik Kerensky, 06 June 2013 - 08:09 AM.

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

Modo44, on 04 June 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

That was kind of my point. A good light pilot will not whine about not being able to "brawl".

K. Missed your point totally and still not getting it. This has to do with jumpjets and cockpit shake how?

[MonkeyCheese]

Dashwood Fox, on 04 June 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

It bugs me quite a bit in mine. As I light pilot I rely on my ability to concentrate my minimal firepower (relative to other weight classes) on one part of a Mech at a time.

Exactly that, remove this new feature for light mechs, my spider only does 19 damage with laser weaponry and dont tell me that poptart lights will then rule cus ppc lights will just get eaten by the other lights with lasers/ssrms/srms.

[Modo44]

Ditto on maybe disabling screen shaking in favor of reticule shaking. I too get motion sickness from excessive screen randomness.

IV Amen, on 04 June 2013 - 10:47 PM, said:

K. Missed your point totally and still not getting it. This has to do with jumpjets and cockpit shake how?

The shaking makes it harder to simply run around other 'mechs while blowing smoke (tapping the jj key) and firing -- without moving in and out of actual cover.

[Scandinavian Jawbreaker]

Modo44, on 04 June 2013 - 10:58 PM, said:

The shaking makes it harder to simply run around other 'mechs while blowing smoke (tapping the jj key) and firing -- without moving in and out of actual cover.

Ok. I get it now. And I disagree with you.

[VXJaeger]

Never been keen on poptarting, but this shaking nerf went bit too far. Combined screen- and reticuleshake causes physical illness after few matches, even when I use JJs only for ease of traveling.
And my Spidey became POS 'cause I cannot anymore shoot accurately from air, biggest funfactor in whole mech got ruined.

Heavy poptarts were the problem, not Jenners, Ravens or Spideys. Limit the shaking effect to heavier class JJs.
I guessed weeks ago that this FU will happen, but hoped for the best.

[Distemper]

Why change three things when changing any one of these would have likely been enough?

After playing last night the jump jet changes left me with eye strain and feeling quite ill. This took me by surprise as I have never suffered from any kind of motion sickness in a game before.

You chose to fix jump jets by drastically changing three separate things - Screen shake, Cross hair shake and Weapon fire spread – when in reality changing any one of these would have likely been enough. What’s wrong with making single/smaller changes instead of taking a heavy handed approach? I’m getting flashbacks to the last patch where LRMs were over boosted, once again that was several significant changes all at once rather than a more common sense approach of tweak – monitor –tweak – monitor etc.

It’s all very clever for customer service reps to say smart things like ‘don’t press space then’ but the simple fact is a big change has been consciously made to the game that has caused this. A change has been made that will affect peoples ability to enjoy the game. This will further narrow the audience and, as a big fan of the game to date, I can only see this as a bad thing.