228 replies to this topic

[Khobai]

Quote

My Kraken is going to have 4 gauss rifles and 8 machineguns. Lolwut heat scaling ?

I doubt theyll add the Kraken. They seem to be staying away from the mechs with weird hardpoints...

The Daishi is a sure thing though and the Daishi-B will be able to have 3 Gauss Rifles.

[Joseph Mallan]

PanchoTortilla, on 14 August 2013 - 06:23 PM, said:

If it were up to me I'd just go with what the official CBT Tech Manual says: heavy lasers have a pre-firing charge up delay.

But that idea is too simple and too canon. PGI will come up with some bizarre system where lasers in your arms shoot behind you, head lasers shoot sideways, and torso lasers fire curved beams every other Thursday.

IIRC fluff said they caused interference in the cockpit... Yeah that would be more PGIs style.

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 06:39 PM, said:

I doubt theyll add the Kraken. They seem to be staying away from the mechs with weird hardpoints...

The Daishi is a sure thing though and the Daishi-B will be able to have 3 Gauss Rifles.

By Lore a Dire Wolf of any make could. Omnis could swap any weapon the pilot wanted.

[Khobai]

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By Lore a Dire Wolf of any make could. Omnis could swap any weapon the pilot wanted.

Yes but in MWO I doubt omnimechs will have that kindve freedom. My guess is youll get 1-2 "omnislots" which can be used for any type of weapon. That would still allow for different variants to be different, but also give omnimechs an advantage in flexibility.

[FupDup]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 August 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

By Lore a Dire Wolf of any make could. Omnis could swap any weapon the pilot wanted.

By lore PGI ignored lore and made Battlemechs into mock-Omnis in that they swap out stuff really fast and easily. In fact, our current BMs are actually superior to lore Omnis because lore Omnis aren't allowed to switch out engines/armor/internals/etc outside of custom refits that turn them into standard Battlemechs.

[ghos t in the shel l]

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

That's why the boating nerf to dual AC/20 was completely uncalled for because it was the only reason the AC/20 was even worth considering.

Simply wait half a second, or set 2 AC20 on chain fire to one group and fire away, no need to worry about heat pentalty, you can still take dual AC20, just like I still take 4 PPC.

[MischiefSC]

Love of god. The solution is the silliest thing in the world to fix.

PPC/ERPPC heat was reduced because prior to HSR they were incredibly inaccurate. They also had a slower projectile speed. So in order to compensate for their lack of accuracy they had a 4pt heat reduction for ERPPCs and a 2pt heat reduction for PPCs and a projectile speed buff of 60% - from1200 to 2,000.

Now they are accurate. Undo the buffs they got to compensate for the lack of accurate hit detection.

Heat for PPCs - 10pts/shot. Heat for ERPPCs - 15/shot. Put speed down to 1600 or so.

Gauss should have a minimum range, ERPPCs don't. This makes snipers still effective - high pinpoint damage at great range but energy weapons (without ammo limits and lower weight) are painfully hot and gauss are heavy and have a minimum range - not viable for brawling.

Boom. Balanced, and balanced wonderfully. Much like an LRM boat is balanced - it's got a nieche that it fills and fills well but is nearly helpless at point blank. The issue right now absolutely is that a PPC/ERPPC/Gauss build is just as good at brawling as it is at long range - A little warm but not too bad and you've got gauss to brawl with while your heat from your PPCs recycles down.

This never was an issue to fix. Ghost heat is a bad idea IMO. Just balance the weapons.

[NineTails]

RENZOKUKEN, on 14 August 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

Explain to me exactly, what is the problem with Gauss and PPC? You are saying it is a problem, but explain it please. In what way is it a problem? It is a simple build that can be taken on many different mechs and is by no means the best build in the game or something that would be considered unbalanced. Actually, it is underpowered because of the hit registration bug. So, you are calling a weapon loadout that is underpowered somehow a problem? What is the problem, please because you are just making random statements without any reasons as to why they are a problem.

Wait, what? Gauss + x2 PPC is underpowered?

[ghos t in the shel l]

MischiefSC, on 14 August 2013 - 06:49 PM, said:

Now they are accurate. Undo the buffs they got to compensate for the lack of accurate hit detection.

They may be accurate, but that does not mean that they damage when hitting. This is still an issue, once this issue is resolved PPC will be where they need to be.

NineTails, on 14 August 2013 - 06:52 PM, said:

Wait, what? Gauss + x2 PPC is underpowered?

Yes, because of the hit registration bug. 50% of PPC shots do no damage when hitting, 90% of the time with red crosshairs. Gauss also has this issue to a certain degree.

[NineTails]

PanchoTortilla, on 14 August 2013 - 06:10 PM, said:

Meh. Give me 12 heavy medium lasers any day.

If you're going for the 1 shot overheat and die strategy at least make it count. 120 pt alpha FTW.

The ghost heat from that many mediums will probably shut you down and then kill you. They broke my HBK-4P and my heart at the same time.

[ghos t in the shel l]

NineTails, on 14 August 2013 - 06:55 PM, said:

The ghost heat from that many mediums will probably shut you down and then kill you. They broke my HBK-4P and my heart at the same time.

unless you fired 6 lasers and then waited half a second and fired 6 more, or simply put two groups on chain fire with 6 each and fire both simultaneously. Then it is impossible to ever get "ghost heat"

[Lootee]

NineTails, on 14 August 2013 - 06:55 PM, said:

The ghost heat from that many mediums will probably shut you down and then kill you. They broke my HBK-4P and my heart at the same time.

Oh most definitely but if you can hold your aim on a torso or leg the other guy is either: dead, about to die, or messed up for the rest of the match.

Ultimate troll build, and they might not even get a chance to retaliate against you if your mech goes super nova. Put a ton of MG ammo in your head to make sure.

Edited by PanchoTortilla, 14 August 2013 - 07:02 PM.

[RANDALLFLAGG]

Bhael Fire, on 14 August 2013 - 07:44 AM, said:

There's nothing wrong with PPCs.

I really wish people would stop throwing tantrums over them. The fact is, if you don't want to get hit by them, don't stand out in the open like a tard. Learn to use cover.

In fact, the only thing wrong with weapons right now is HSR and the fact that some weapons are still useless (flamers, streaks, and NARCs) or need a little love (AC/5, AC/10, and LB 10-X).

***agreed there are some weapons in the game that are useless....but the point some of us are trying to make is that if a weapon was USELESS it would not be in production...no single weapon should have such high advantage. I happen to be an electrical engineer, and for what its worth, a 4 second recharge time on a weapon spewing that much energy would literally shred or vaporize the capacitor bank serving it. If something gets hot, it has to be bigger to dissipate the heat quicker. I know this is a make believe weapon, a make believe world, but when devs have to apply all this make believe "technology" to some sort of rule base to make a game playable and enjoyable for the MASSES...things like this get overlooked sometimes. I think the TT game had it right, was it a one or two turn recharge? I can't remember, but surely....4 seconds? c'mon. Increase the recharge time...please...pretty please...even two more seconds would make a difference....I know I'm a long way from being even efficient at the PPC...but do I want to play a game where a single weapon platform is so dominant that EVERYONE uses the same thing? The mech lab and the countless possibilities are what make MW so appealing to me, maybe to most others....so don't lock us in to using the same weapon which is too light, too precise, too powerful, and has no ammo limit....[what about a capacitor bank that if shot too often, wears out and disables the weapon, or DESTROYS the weapon if over-utilized?] just an idea....my 3c OTHERWISE THIS GAME IS GOING TO BE ANOTHER MW4 JUMP SNIPE ASSAULT CLASS FEST....NOTHING MORE!

Edited by RANDALLFLAGG, 14 August 2013 - 07:12 PM.

[Joseph Mallan]

FupDup, on 14 August 2013 - 06:44 PM, said:

By lore PGI ignored lore and made Battlemechs into mock-Omnis in that they swap out stuff really fast and easily. In fact, our current BMs are actually superior to lore Omnis because lore Omnis aren't allowed to switch out engines/armor/internals/etc outside of custom refits that turn them into standard Battlemechs.

By Lore no they did not. What separates a Mech from an Omni Mech is the time it takes to make the changes. And if you don't think I'm right. Where did Samuel "Shorty" Snede's Rifle/Phoenix...thing

[FupDup]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 August 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

By Lore no they did not. What separates a Mech from an Omni Mech is the time it takes to make the changes. And if you don't think I'm right. Where did Samuel "Shorty" Snede's Rifle/Phoenix...thing

Yeah, and our current Battlemechs make the changes instantly.

[Bhael Fire]

RANDALLFLAGG, on 14 August 2013 - 07:04 PM, said:

I know I'm a long way from being even efficient at the PPC...but do I want to play a game where a single weapon platform is so dominant that EVERYONE uses the same thing?

I don't often use PPCs because they are not effective for my playstyle; I prefer face-humping the enemy to death, and/or tearing them apart with loads of dakka and pew-pew at mid-range.

Furthermore, I can't remember the last time I was killed by a PPC directly...at least not in a while. I see builds with them at range and I do the sensible thing; take cover.

So, as far as I'm concerned, PPCs are just fine.

[Joseph Mallan]

FupDup, on 14 August 2013 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yeah, and our current Battlemechs make the changes instantly.

Do They? How long is the trip In system from the Jump Point? Or for that matter TO the Jump point. Or how many Jumps (each Jump is a week of recharge before jumping again) to get to the planet we plan to assault?Between the time we get out of the last drop till we click Launch could be months before we reach the target.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 14 August 2013 - 07:42 PM.

[FupDup]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 August 2013 - 07:40 PM, said:

Do They? How long is the trip In system from the Jump Point? Or for that matter TO the Jump point. Or how many Jumps (each Jump is a week of recharge before jumping again) to get to the planet we plan to assault?Between the time we get out of the last drop till we click Launch could be months before we reach the target.

The time it takes to travel around isn't in the same category as the time it takes to replace a Medium Laser with a Large Laser or something.

[Khobai]

Quote

Simply wait half a second, or set 2 AC20 on chain fire to one group and fire away, no need to worry about heat pentalty, you can still take dual AC20, just like I still take 4 PPC.

Yeah i could do that or I could just use 4 ppcs and wait half a second. And its better.

[Joseph Mallan]

FupDup, on 14 August 2013 - 07:51 PM, said:

The time it takes to travel around isn't in the same category as the time it takes to replace a Medium Laser with a Large Laser or something.

16 hours. It takes 16 hours to make that change. (IIRC) It take at least 3 days to get from the jump point to the planet.

On an Omni Mech it takes less than one hour.

I stand corrected. According to the BattleTech Master Rules Replacing a weapon or piece of equipment takes a Base of 120 Minutes...


Replacing a destroyed section is 240 Minutes (4 Hours).

Replacing a blown off Limb? 180 Minutes (3 Hours)

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 14 August 2013 - 08:31 PM.

[Volume]

MrZakalwe, on 14 August 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

I'm not so sure

Novacat with 4 CERPPCs if you recall?- it did amazing damage at any range with a projectile speed that broke the speed of sounds, didn't get nearly as hot as you'd think and had a crap load of coolent if it did.

One of the curses of customisation is that it's much harder to balance and we have a lot of it in MWO (and that is a good thing but more difficult for the devs) I also have far more fun on MWO lately than i did on MWLL (and I had more fun on MWLL than I did on any previous MW game ). Ghost heat and reliably getting a HUD really improved this game.

I'm constantly annoyed by how slow PGI are but they are finally starting to get there!

Let me break this down for you:

MWO does not have any combined-arms. Aerospace fighters with half-decent pilots could always destroy a Novacat with 4 CERPPCs...Easily.