267 replies to this topic

[Lazy Eye]

Relevant to the discussion (long):

Dealing with Commercial Realities (or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love #saveMWO)

[Mordynak]

Kraven Kor, on 23 August 2013 - 01:09 PM, said:

Insult us all you wish.

We just want the game they sold us last year, and we want to ensure they understand that they cannot sell us one thing and give us another.

You are welcome to disagree.

First of all, King Cobra didnt insult you.

You say you want the game they sold you last year?

Ok heres whats a little daft about that. The game is and always has been a free to play game. Which will always be subject to change. You decided to pay into that, you should have thought about it a bit harder first.

Also, the game last year was super buggy... Yes the game is far from perfect. But i don't think a group like this which appears to bash the developers constantly is going to help anything. Constantly saying no no no your doing this wrong is helping noone.

Imagine being a developer yourself and constantly being told your {Scrap} at your job. You would want to give up. However if you were told "Hey, maybe you should try this instead..." You would be more willing to try whatever from another angle.

I think you people just need to settle down and stop being so quick to judge ALL THE TIME. I'm sure whatever it is youre all complaining about will come eventually. Stop being so damn negative all the time and get a ******** life.

There are other games you could try in the meantime. Or maybe you could go for a walk. Whatever, just calm down.

(I'm not insulting you, these are just opinions.)

[Deathz Jester]

RG Notch, on 22 August 2013 - 06:59 PM, said:

Did anyone try to get any news of this latest debacle on some outside sites? Anything with some larger audience, seems like last time forums went up in flames they doused it with "reorganization", too little time before launch to do something like that. Maybe if they get embarrassed again in the gaming press they might listen. I know I dream.

Well i dont know if it counts but here The Penny Arcade Report : "The hardcore Mechwarrior Online community is in open revolt"

It also links a article from The Mittani : "MWO A Failure to Communicate"

[Kraven Kor]

Mordynak, on 26 August 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

First of all, King Cobra didnt insult you.

You say you want the game they sold you last year?

Ok heres whats a little daft about that. The game is and always has been a free to play game. Which will always be subject to change. You decided to pay into that, you should have thought about it a bit harder first.

Also, the game last year was super buggy... Yes the game is far from perfect. But i don't think a group like this which appears to bash the developers constantly is going to help anything. Constantly saying no no no your doing this wrong is helping noone.

Imagine being a developer yourself and constantly being told your {Scrap} at your job. You would want to give up. However if you were told "Hey, maybe you should try this instead..." You would be more willing to try whatever from another angle.

I think you people just need to settle down and stop being so quick to judge ALL THE TIME. I'm sure whatever it is youre all complaining about will come eventually. Stop being so damn negative all the time and get a ******** life.

There are other games you could try in the meantime. Or maybe you could go for a walk. Whatever, just calm down.

(I'm not insulting you, these are just opinions.)

Look over my posting history and you will see how I / we tried exactly that.

We have tried reasoned debate, we have tried helpful suggestions, and I for one have always been as polite as possible. We tried voting with our wallets (under the premise "if I spend money, maybe my opinions will have more weight" true or not.) We have tried AtD feedback, feedback forum threads, emails, etc.

What we have received for our efforts is a constant and growing deviation from the initial sales pitches that got us to buy Founders Packs. And 3PV, Coolant, and other topics were all brought up in numerous early FAQ's and Dev Blogs and forum posts and the information we got in reply from PGI seemed to tell us they had heard us and were trying to not repeat the "mistakes of MW:4" as many of us saw it.

I won't say that the lack of 3PV and Coolant Flushes were the SOLE reason I bought my Founder's pack, but seeing the Devs talk about MW:4 issues with apparently a plan to avoid those problems was a large part of why I chose to do the pre-order.

You cannot crowd-fund a game (even if not bound by Kickstarter rules...) and then not give those who funded the game the game you had actually advertised to get them to fund the game.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

I know this developer can make anything and everything our hearts desire come true... there's one really big thing standing in the way (for me)
TIME.
I'm extremely picky.. if it were up to me: Menus would've worked intuitively, if you put a large laser on top of a small laser in your arm on your build then the large laser would remain the top firing weapon. If you put a module into slot #1 it would remain and be written in slot #1... if you put on a BAP before you equip CASE or ECM the BAP would be the first thing added to the list and so on. If you wanted a 'mech in your bay to stand next to another w/ a similar profile you could do so, why? because it looks good and feels better. When you equip missile systems your missile tube count would immediately be appropriate to what you've selected. A much more user friendly voice chat would be there, including automated voice commands that report what you see at the touch of a button. Weight balancing would be of utmost importance. If their were 'mechs that had hit detection issues purchasers would be reimbursed and it would be removed until it could be fixed. If there's a useless 3 ton piece of equipment (command console) sold on a highly sought after variant we'd remove it immediately and the same can be said for CASE + XL engine or even that damned advanced zoom module.

I understand every piece of come back you could possibly throw at what I've said so if you wanted to tell me to have patience and reasons why they can't just make things happen the way I would have them, well have at it.

I've learned a huge lesson in spending as much as I have (willingly) on this game beta. What can I say, I've been spoiled by quality and I'm not saying they haven't done a good job or that the future of this game couldn't contain everything I desire and more.. I'm saying that stuff isn't here yet, it takes time and that's not what I want to hear..
It's been a struggle for me this past few months, to play and be excited about playing. If there were one thing I'd really hope PGI would do would be to stop... go back... and repair what's already in front of the players faces. Like that'll ever happen anywhere from 1 - 2 years from now.


Fading fast. There's my rant, don't look too much into it

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 26 August 2013 - 09:33 AM.

[RG Notch]

Kraven Kor, on 26 August 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

You cannot crowd-fund a game (even if not bound by Kickstarter rules...) and then not give those who funded the game the game you had actually advertised to get them to fund the game.

Actually, PGI continues to prove you can, you just get this type of reaction and they already "reorganized" the forums once. Now they have to lurch towards launch with an unhappy player base and forums "in open revolt".

[Kraven Kor]

RG Notch, on 26 August 2013 - 09:34 AM, said:

Actually, PGI continues to prove you can, you just get this type of reaction and they already "reorganized" the forums once. Now they have to lurch towards launch with an unhappy player base and forums "in open revolt".

Well, I am doing everything in my power to change that in this industry.

For instance, I will never buy an EA product again until they stop treating their employees like beasts of burden, and stop releasing half-finished, buggy games with crappy always-on DRM.

[KingCobra]

Kraven Kor, on 26 August 2013 - 10:16 AM, said:

Well, I am doing everything in my power to change that in this industry.

For instance, I will never buy an EA product again until they stop treating their employees like beasts of burden, and stop releasing half-finished, buggy games with crappy always-on DRM.

Sir you cannot change the way the game industry works its in a period of low quality beta games for huge profits like my granddaddy said (Money talks and bbullshitt walks).So as long as players pay to play these low quality low content beta games the game company's will keep making them. PGI/IGP are not a stupid group and in many ways they have provided a good game. MWO is just not the AAA MechWarrior games of the past with time it might become something great like what I have posted about many times and made many topics about in 2 years along with many other 20+ year TT/BT/MechWarrior/MechAssault/mecha fans. Even contacting them directly did not change MWO so a forum group has no impact on there decisions. Good luck on your venture Kor.

Edited by KingCobra, 26 August 2013 - 10:47 AM.

[Sybreed]

RG Notch, on 26 August 2013 - 09:34 AM, said:

Actually, PGI continues to prove you can, you just get this type of reaction and they already "reorganized" the forums once. Now they have to lurch towards launch with an unhappy player base and forums "in open revolt".

it's kind of sad that I feel like we were just good to give them a nice injection of money, then they could just discard us as they please.

Eh, I hope this game will take ideas from other F2P like War Thunder. First, their menu UI is a thousand times better than our current one. Second, they had the balls to include an "arcade mode" and a "realistic mode" where you only play in 1st person and using a joystick increases your chance of success.

Still, I think the biggest issue for me right now is that they can't launch MWO without UI 2.0. If it's not ready, don't launch it. MWO will be the laughing stock of the f2p market if they launch with UI 1.0.

[Kraven Kor]

KingCobra, on 26 August 2013 - 10:46 AM, said:

Sir you cannot change the way the game industry works its in a period of low quality beta games for huge profits like my granddaddy said (Money talks and bbullshitt walks).So as long as players pay to play these low quality low content beta games the game company's will keep making them. PGI/IGP are not a stupid group and in many ways they have provided a good game. MWO is just not the AAA MechWarrior games of the past with time it might become something great like what I have posted about many times and made many topics about in 2 years along with many other 20+ year TT/BT/MechWarrior/MechAssault/mecha fans. Even contacting them directly did not change MWO so a forum group has no impact on there decisions. Good luck on your venture Kor.

My money has ceased walking into either EA or PGI's coffers, until they have learned from their mistakes.

I sincerely hope enough others do the same to enact some positive change. I remain completely hopeless in regards to this ever happening, seeing as by and large the world just becomes more of a steaming pile of **** laid upon us by our corporate overlords, but I digress.

[Deathz Jester]

Sybreed, on 26 August 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

it's kind of sad that I feel like we were just good to give them a nice injection of money, then they could just discard us as they please.

Eh, I hope this game will take ideas from other F2P like War Thunder. First, their menu UI is a thousand times better than our current one. Second, they had the balls to include an "arcade mode" and a "realistic mode" where you only play in 1st person and using a joystick increases your chance of success.

Still, I think the biggest issue for me right now is that they can't launch MWO without UI 2.0. If it's not ready, don't launch it. MWO will be the laughing stock of the f2p market if they launch with UI 1.0.

Well lets not forget Gaijin Entertainment launched Warthunder on Steam and partnered with Sony to launch on the PS4. oh, and they listen to their playerbase, albeit they have to translate everything since their native language is not english.

[Heffay]

Iron Harlequin, on 26 August 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

Well lets not forget Gaijin Entertainment launched Warthunder on Steam and partnered with Sony to launch on the PS4. oh, and they listen to their playerbase, albeit they have to translate everything since their native language is not english.

War Thunder, eh? Aren't they the company that had one of their developers change code/stats that other developers were working on so that his favorite nation's planes were better than the others?

[jozkhan]

I see World of Tanks has also just announced they are going on the Xbox or already are on the Xbox free to play for gold members

[Protection]

jozkhan, on 26 August 2013 - 02:03 PM, said:

I see World of Tanks has also just announced they are going on the Xbox or already are on the Xbox free to play for gold members

Quote

they are going on the Xbox or already are on the Xbox free to play

Holy **** balls. That explains everything.

Mechwarrior: Online isn't for PC. It's for Xbox One arcade!

[Squid von Torgar]

Guys, I just listened to SaveMWO 3 and yet again I agree with your sentiments. However one option you have not considered is the forums. You claim (I signed) to represent thousands of players. If that is true get each one of those players to post in the 3PV feedback and apology thread. Make it a thousand pages. Do it now, unit commanders just ask your members to make a simple post such as "I hate 3PV and want a separate queue and wont buy any MC until that happens"

Thats how to show your numbers in a quick and instant way that is easy to undertake.

We know they do monitor the forums, use that as you method of communication. Show your numbers via posts. Because at the moment the thread has devolved into the same old voices going around in circles.

Edited by Squid von Torgar, 26 August 2013 - 03:02 PM.

[Heffay]

Squid von Torgar, on 26 August 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

Guys, I just listened to SaveMWO 3 and yet again I agree with your sentiments. However one option you have not considered is the forums. You claim (I signed) to represent thousands of players. If that is true get each one of those players to post in the 3PV feedback and apology thread. Make it a thousand pages. Do it now, unit commanders just ask your members to make a simple post such as "I hate 3PV and want a separate queue and wont buy any MC until that happens"

Thats how to show your numbers in a quick and instant way that is easy to undertake.

We know they do monitor the forums, use that as you method of communication. Show your numbers via posts. Because at the moment the thread has devolved into the same old voices going around in circles.

I think it's better for them to not do that. I'm pretty sure they won't get thousands of posts.

[Mordynak]

Kraven Kor, on 26 August 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

Look over my posting history and you will see how I / we tried exactly that.

We have tried reasoned debate, we have tried helpful suggestions, and I for one have always been as polite as possible. We tried voting with our wallets (under the premise "if I spend money, maybe my opinions will have more weight" true or not.) We have tried AtD feedback, feedback forum threads, emails, etc.

What we have received for our efforts is a constant and growing deviation from the initial sales pitches that got us to buy Founders Packs. And 3PV, Coolant, and other topics were all brought up in numerous early FAQ's and Dev Blogs and forum posts and the information we got in reply from PGI seemed to tell us they had heard us and were trying to not repeat the "mistakes of MW:4" as many of us saw it.

I won't say that the lack of 3PV and Coolant Flushes were the SOLE reason I bought my Founder's pack, but seeing the Devs talk about MW:4 issues with apparently a plan to avoid those problems was a large part of why I chose to do the pre-order.

You cannot crowd-fund a game (even if not bound by Kickstarter rules...) and then not give those who funded the game the game you had actually advertised to get them to fund the game.

Judging from your response i can only surmise that you are one of the few sound of mind people out there. You gotta understand that there are a lot of people who are just plain nitpicking. Complaining and generally being aggressive for the sake of it.

Yes, PGI could handle things better, but honestly. I do think the game will turn out pretty damn good. I've had a lot of enjoyment out of the game so far and i imagine i will continue to do so. Im gutted i didnt get in intime for the founders pack!

[Deathz Jester]

Heffay, on 26 August 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

War Thunder, eh? Aren't they the company that had one of their developers change code/stats that other developers were working on so that his favorite nation's planes were better than the others?

I dont remember anything like that, I know theyve had issues since closed beta with some planes not being finished, but each nation has their own strengths.

I was mainly getting at the fact that a Russian game developer, I've never heard of until last year when I started playing their game, is more successful than PGI and is branching out further with their game and actually listening to their playerbase about gameplay aspects. Like having 3 different game modes, arcade mode: with 3rd or 1st person view and less realistic flying mechanics, also youd see any plane on either team, historical mode, and simulation mode. oh and they have some tutorial missions because the people ask for them.

[Sybreed]

War Thunder is actually quite fun, I would recommend it to anyone. It doesn't have gold ammo of any kind, although it is slightly Pay2Win as in you can get all upgrades right now by paying, which will make you stronger than all other F2P pilots in your aircraft tier. I still have to try simulation mode, but I can't on my laptop.

[RG Notch]

Oh well might as well shut this movement down after that latest CDU. Everything is going great and people are happy!