1251 replies to this topic

[Desdain]

Mackman, on 17 September 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

[/i]

I think this is especially appropriate here. All the "true Mechwarrior fans" are taking to Metacritic to, as Azantia above pointed out, exact "payback" against the devs of MWO. These people talk about how "disappointed" they are by the state of the game, and then go and make sure that the game never has a chance to get better. They talk about how excited they were to see where the game was going, and then they try to stop it in its tracks.

If you truly hate this game, then I'm sorry for you: I would advise you stop playing. If you enjoy this game, and want to see it succeed, then don't go and vent your anger at Metacritic. Don't open up that review box and think, "Now is the time for payback!"

Instead, think: "Judging the game on its own merits, how can I honestly review this free-to-play game to new people who will likely check here to see if it's worth playing?" Use the review to help MWO, not to kill it.

Some people just want to see the world burn.


Others are driven to it.

[armyof1]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:47 PM, said:

Wouldn't it be better if they never mentioned an ETA, just said that they were working on it, and released screenshots of CW stuff now and then until it was done? People don't get mad at a long ETA (hell, games have features that people wait 3 years for); people get mad at missed ETAs.

I seriously doubt asking for people to found MWO without any schedule whatsoever would bring in $5M. You have to let people know what you'll do with their money... and then develop 2 other games with I don't know how big a portion of it instead.

Edited by armyof1, 18 September 2013 - 12:52 PM.

[Krivvan]

RG Notch, on 18 September 2013 - 12:39 PM, said:

Yes the key to having a good (read compliant) community is to not tell them anything. Too much communication sets up things like expectations and you can't have that.

Expectations can be too strong.

Mentioning that the game would primarily be 1PV was a mistake (even though it's still true). I doubt many people were actually so adamant on 1PV only until they mentioned it. Every single other Mechwarrior title to date (except the first I guess) has had some form of 3PV.

[Heffay]

DEMAX51, on 18 September 2013 - 12:48 PM, said:

I still would have. I bought into the Founder's package just to be able to play in the Beta, because I had a deep craving for some giant stompy robot combat.

Same here. While I would like CW, I am patient and can wait for it. Doesn't take away from the fun I'm having today playing it.

Plus, I need to save up c-bills so I can upgrade 18 freaking mechs when Project Phoenix comes out... ugh. So much grinding to do!

[Shumabot]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:47 PM, said:

Wouldn't it be better if they never mentioned an ETA, just said that they were working on it, and released screenshots of CW stuff now and then until it was done? People don't get mad at a long ETA (hell, games have features that people wait 3 years for); people get mad at missed ETAs.

Do you really think people would be less mad at the graphics if they didn't believe dx11 was being worked on? Do you really think people would be less mad at the lack of gameplay modes if more hadn't been announced? This game is incredibly featureless, no one would be here to be angry on metacritic at all if they didn't string people along with promised systems that are always and forever a month away.

Edited by Shumabot, 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM.

[armyof1]

DEMAX51, on 18 September 2013 - 12:48 PM, said:

I still would have. I bought into the Founder's package just to be able to play in the Beta, because I had a deep craving for some giant stompy robot combat.

Sure some like you would, but frankly I doubt a lot of people would have your patience or think 2 years ahead is something worth investing that much in.

[Krivvan]

armyof1, on 18 September 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

I seriously doubt asking for people to found MWO without any schedule whatsoever would bring in $5M

You just have to prove that you're still working on it and create general hype. Quite a number of successful Kickstarter projects don't really have any schedules. Star Citizen's schedule is a series of estimates with release in 2015 (and I'd be amazed if they hit their estimated deadlines).

[Heffay]

armyof1, on 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

Sure some like you would, but frankly I doubt a lot of people would have your patience or think 2 years ahead is something worth investing that much in.

I've spent more money in Star Citizen than I have in MWO. 2 years is nothing.

Edited by Heffay, 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM.

[Deathlike]

armyof1, on 18 September 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

Really good point that is often disregarded as simply QQ. Is it just a coincidence the MWO players are way more inclined to act out on their disappointment than the average gamer? Or has this game community been mistreated worse than usual by the devs? I know which version I find a lot more likely.

PGI's action/reaction to the player disappointment is akin to "putting salt in the wound" or "salting the charred earth". Instead of people simply being disappointed because of the state of things in MWO, they are actively being told that their opinions are "noise in the signal"... so in essence it amounts to "kicking a person while they are down".

It doesn't help matters either way.

[Krivvan]

armyof1, on 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

Sure some like you would, but frankly I doubt a lot of people would have your patience or think 2 years ahead is something worth investing that much in.

Star Citizen

[Deathlike]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

You just have to prove that you're still working on it and create general hype. Quite a number of successful Kickstarter projects don't really have any schedules. Star Citizen's schedule is a series of estimates with release in 2015 (and I'd be amazed if they hit their estimated deadlines).

This message amounts to "pics or it didn't happen". I think people have been actually saying this for a while now actually. The problem is, we have only recently gotten actual pics of UI 2.0... and nothing that exciting yet.

Edited by Deathlike, 18 September 2013 - 12:56 PM.

[Krivvan]

Shumabot, on 18 September 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

Do you really think people would be less mad at the graphics if they didn't believe dx11 was being worked on? Do you really think people would be less mad at the lack of gameplay modes if more hadn't been announced? This game is incredibly featureless, no one would be here to be angry on metacritic at all if they didn't string people along with promised systems that are always and forever a month away.

I haven't actually seen anyone mad about dx11, so I'm not sure if they'd be mad. The only rage I've seen for that was the missed PTS date.

I'm not saying to announce nothing. You give the announcement, show a bit of what you have so far, but give no date for it being done. The problem with "promised systems that are always and forever a month away" is the "always and forever a month away" part.

When you actually look at the game without caring about promised features and systems, it's not really that much different from the commonly sparse launches of a number of F2P titles.

[Shumabot]

Deathlike, on 18 September 2013 - 12:55 PM, said:

This message amounts to "pics or it didn't happen". I think people have been actually saying this for a while now actually. The problem is, we have only recently gotten actual pics of UI 2.0... and nothing that exciting yet.

The problem is that the game was released a year ago, and people have had plenty of time to realize that it's bad. I've been bombarded with adverts for this game for at least six months. PGI released and sold an extremely buggy and unfinished game, then cancelled features or delayed them by up to a year. This game isn't "someday", it's now, and getting pics of updates that may never come when the games been out and advertised for a year does nothing.

[Krivvan]

Deathlike, on 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

PGI's action/reaction to the player disappointment is akin to "putting salt in the wound" or "salting the charred earth". Instead of people simply being disappointed because of the state of things in MWO, they are actively being told that their opinions are "noise in the signal"... so in essence it amounts to "kicking a person while they are down".

The funny thing is that I believe that it's true, just that it isn't a smart thing for devs to say.

Shumabot, on 18 September 2013 - 12:58 PM, said:

The problem is that the game was released a year ago, and people have had plenty of time to realize that it's bad. I've been bombarded with adverts for this game for at least six months. PGI released and sold an extremely buggy and unfinished game, then cancelled features or delayed them by up to a year. This game isn't "someday", it's now, and getting pics of updates that may never come when the games been out and advertised for a year does nothing.

It's a mistake they made a year or more ago that they're paying for now. It isn't surprising for a dev without that much experience.

[Shumabot]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

I haven't actually seen anyone mad about dx11, so I'm not sure if they'd be mad. The only rage I've seen for that was the missed PTS date.

I'm not saying to announce nothing. You give the announcement, show a bit of what you have so far, but give no date for it being done. The problem with "promised systems that are always and forever a month away" is the "always and forever a month away" part.

When you actually look at the game without caring about promised features and systems, it's not really that much different from the commonly sparse launches of a number of F2P titles.

And when you consider that it's been advertised and sold for a year, is ugly, has horrible netcode issues, performs terribly on a wide variety of PC specs, is wildly unbalanced, and has extremely expensive paid content (as far as paid content in f2p titles go) you realize that it's a train wreck.

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

The funny thing is that I believe that it's true, just that it isn't a smart thing for devs to say.



It's a mistake they made a year or more ago that they're paying for now. It isn't surprising for a dev without that much experience.

I don't think sympathy for their position makes the game better. I'm actually pretty sympathetic to PGIs position, this has to be an extremely disheartening moment for all the many people who weren't making design or hiring decisions. That said, the game they designed is bad, even ignoring the technical issues that they can't seem to stop walking into the simple gameplay design decisions are so amateur-hour it makes me want to laugh/cry.

Edited by Shumabot, 18 September 2013 - 01:03 PM.

[armyof1]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

You just have to prove that you're still working on it and create general hype. Quite a number of successful Kickstarter projects don't really have any schedules. Star Citizen's schedule is a series of estimates with release in 2015 (and I'd be amazed if they hit their estimated deadlines).

Well feel free to mention some really successful crowdfunding games that say we have no freaking clue when we're done with anything, but just give us money anyway.

[PropagandaWar]

Lucian Nostra, on 18 September 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

I don't see how people can possibly give MWO a 10, even when I was knee deep in my love of MWO it was around a 7.5-8. It may be tons of fun to play and offer you battlemechs to slug it out with but it's no way a 10.

as polarozied as my view is with PGI and all the nonsense they pull I'd put MWO at a 4-6 depending..

For the same reason people are giving it a 0. I gave it a 10 allthough I felt it deserved an 8.5. Some people may balk at this, heck a lot of my friends gave it a 5. To me though its the first real FPS team based multiplayer game I have played. Others have boasted it never felt that way. No respawn, rare one shot twitch kills. It requires trying to outhink, out manuver the other team. Crazy Epic battles in big robots that cant hide in a drain. Yeah the graphics are so, so. Hopefully they can brighten them up some. Out of all mechwarrior multiplayer versions nothing holds a candle to it. No not even MWLL. Its also kept my attention for over a year. Something most games especially multiplayer only can't do anymore. I also give it a high score because this small company took the chance when nobody else would. I don't fault PGI for biting off more than they can chew because they are still chewing. Yeah their communication skills suck, but I see them getting better at it. Most of all I feel they opened the door for other guys like Star Citizen to go for it. Heck I may even get lucky and get a revision version of this game:

[Shumabot]

Quote

For the same reason people are giving it a 0. I gave it a 10 allthough I felt it deserved an 8.5.

Your name has never been more deserved.

Quote

Some people may balk at this, heck a lot of my friends gave it a 5. To me though its the first real FPS team based multiplayer game I have played.

Did you just wake up from a 30 year coma..?

Quote

Out of all mechwarrior multiplayer versions nothing holds a candle to it. No not even MWLL.

So your standards for beauty are "does this look worse than a game that came out with Windows ME?"

Quote

Most of all I feel they opened the door for other guys like Star Citizen to go for it.

Yeah, I'm sure MWOs cautionary tale of failure really helped to boost star citizen. Half the people I know that founded MWO founded SC specifically because they abandoned one naively optimistic dream for another.

Edited by Shumabot, 18 September 2013 - 01:08 PM.

[Krivvan]

Shumabot, on 18 September 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

And when you consider that it's been advertised and sold for a year, is ugly, has horrible netcode issues, performs terribly on a wide variety of PC specs, is wildly unbalanced, and has extremely expensive paid content (as far as paid content in f2p titles go) you realize that it's a train wreck.

The paid content doesn't confer any significant advantage (even the paid coolants are inferior), so I don't consider content price to be an issue since many people obviously still pay for them.

They may be slow, but the balance is getting there. I'm not even sure what I'd call an exploitative build right now.

There are netcode issues, but I believe the problem is more about regional servers than anything else.

Personally I just really like the core gameplay, and that's enough to keep me actively playing for years. I rather like having a competitive arena battle game (that isn't a MOBA) to play now and then.

[Deathlike]

Krivvan, on 18 September 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

I haven't actually seen anyone mad about dx11, so I'm not sure if they'd be mad. The only rage I've seen for that was the missed PTS date.

I'm not saying to announce nothing. You give the announcement, show a bit of what you have so far, but give no date for it being done. The problem with "promised systems that are always and forever a month away" is the "always and forever a month away" part.

When you actually look at the game without caring about promised features and systems, it's not really that much different from the commonly sparse launches of a number of F2P titles.

Well, I think many people are disappointed in the lack of DX11 (let alone it being missing at launch). AFAIK, they are trying to "fix a bug" that affects the DX11 engine, but there's no ETA for that (as there can't realistically be one), but they need to fix that ASAP. I don't remember a modern game outside of say Starcraft 2 that doesn't have a DX10/DX11 engine. At least Blizzard can get away with this (they've kinda historically done this)... PGI genuinely cannot.

Shumabot, on 18 September 2013 - 12:58 PM, said:

The problem is that the game was released a year ago, and people have had plenty of time to realize that it's bad. I've been bombarded with adverts for this game for at least six months. PGI released and sold an extremely buggy and unfinished game, then cancelled features or delayed them by up to a year. This game isn't "someday", it's now, and getting pics of updates that may never come when the games been out and advertised for a year does nothing.

This may sound sad, but I've NEVER seen any MWO advertisements. Not a one. Maybe all those ad companies are data mining me all wrong...

Edited by Deathlike, 18 September 2013 - 01:08 PM.