164 replies to this topic

[PlzDie]

Johnny Reb, on 10 October 2013 - 10:02 PM, said:

Yeah, Streaktaro gave the streakcat its walking papers!

I have to agree with this, the Kintaro gives up one streak launcher to the streak cat but gains 2 medium lasers to hit the areas on a mech that was already opened by the streaks, like the legs that usually gets their armor stripped of first on lights.

[Nryrony]

Duppie1974, on 10 October 2013 - 11:49 PM, said:

I have to agree with this, the Kintaro gives up one streak launcher to the streak cat but gains 2 medium lasers to hit the areas on a mech that was already opened by the streaks, like the legs that usually gets their armor stripped of first on lights.

Streak Cat will still do good with 4 streaks and 2x Artemis 6SRMs -> especially if you can aim.

But the Kintaro is the better light hunter especially thanks to its speed.

[18 Inches of Hard Steel]

Khobai, on 10 October 2013 - 07:49 PM, said:

So is the Kintaro; 116kph is too slow to hunt down a 151kph light with JJs. Both the Kintaro and A1 are reactionary at killing lights and neither can proactively hunt them down.

35kph difference is 9.7mps. that means if the kintaro is chasing the jenner from the same point it has 27 seconds before the light will leave the streak range. let's say the kintaro is in a ****** position and only gets ten seconds. 5ssrm will do 75 damage in that time.

[William Mountbank]

I would also like to point out the Quickdraw QKD-4H, with an XL360 engine, JJs, 2LLs, 2S/MLs, BAP, and 3 SSRM-2s. Top speed 106kph, but the shorter SSRM window is made up for the fact that it has LL punch - plus it's also effective against heavies and assaults because the QKD is so durable and in such a fast heavy it's trivial to out position an Atlas. It's also not reliant on SSRMs to deal damage, like with the Streakcat, I only use them against lights or heavier mechs with exposed internals.

[Drehl]

here we are again.. the weekly lights are overpowered thread.

go ahead.. take jenner/commando/raven.. hell even spider and try to keep a positive k/d and w/l ratio.
do this for a week and tell us again how overpowerred lights are.

this bs is getting ridiculous.

Edited by Drehl, 11 October 2013 - 04:22 AM.

[Kiiyor]

ICEFANG13, on 10 October 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

If you think its so easy, you do it, and you can see first hand. Against good players, playing a light is hard.

This!

If you drop in a light against a decent player, you need to be on your game. Move in a predictable pattern (or across open ground) for more than a second or two and you're toast, or mauled at the very least.

Light mechs are unique in that they have far more piloting tricks up their sleeves than their heavier brethren, yet all these tricks can be countered somewhat with experience.

Light circle jerking you? Baffles and frustrates new pilots, but experienced ones will smite you through your predictable pattern.

Trying to hit a spider buzzing around you like a steel gnat of doom? New pilots will impotently try to swat it out of the air, experienced ones will be waiting just for this moment, to nail you as you foolishly take a longer jump, or wait for you to land.

Fighting a losing battle with a striker in tighter confines (like canyon or buildings)? Either get to open ground or... Well, die, as lights are great at strafing runs.

Lights are exciting, volatile, and reward skilled players. A light mech in the hands of a skilled pilot is ELO's way of telling you to put your big boy pants on and learn how to fight them. Really. The whole 'learn to play' thing has been touted so much that it's usually trite nonsense, but where light mechs are concerned, it is utterly true.

[Joseph Mallan]

Quote

The Raven's job is first and foremost to provide electronic warfare and countermeasure support to other units; any mission in which the 'Mech is forced into a combat role is seen as a failure.

Quote

The Jenner's primarily laser armament and phenomenal speed helped to make the the 'Mech extremely well suited as a guerrilla fighter.

Quote

Spider's are generally used as fast strike forces to hit an enemy's rear with lightning speed.

Quote

the COM-1A Commando its second own developed BattleMech for the LCAF and one of the first ever, that was suited for reconnaissance.

Quote

The Locust was built exclusively for reconnaissance.

As far as saying they can't take a hit, None of these mechs had full armor. The Locust came the closest, and a PPC could nearly cripple it with a single leg hit. All our Lights are scouts or harasser Mechs made for hit and run style fighting. Now if the Valkyrie, Panther or Wolfhound were in game I could agree not all Lights are Scouts. But we have scouts.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 11 October 2013 - 04:44 AM.

[Curccu]

kongman, on 10 October 2013 - 04:34 PM, said:

just as the title says , lights need to be nerfed in a huge way .nothing more to add really .

L2P, Nothing more to add really.

[Shadey99]

FupDup, on 10 October 2013 - 07:36 PM, said:

The Streaktaro is the most optimal counter, but it's not the only one by far. Pretty much any mech with SSRMs and lasers will give lights a hard time, and with good aim ballistics will really murder them too (I once saw a Gausscat kill 3-4 lights in one match, in one shot each).

I've taken out every light on an enemy team in my JM6-A 2xGauss build before in 1 shot. And the JM6-A is considered 'bad' for arm and torso turn ability among the JM6 line... And that was even after the silly charge mechanic was added.

Anything that packs a solid one hit punch (PPC, ACs larger than AC2s, Gauss, etc) are great anti-light weapons in a skilled players hands. SSRMs are just super easy solid one hit (5 damage) weapons that can almost never miss.

Not being able to aim (helped by bad latency on the shooters end) is by and large the sole reason lights are considered 'overpowered' by so many.

[BlackJackRaider]

Buy the Saber package--the Griffin should be a really good light hunter with up to 360 engine, 3 SSRM2s and 3 energy hardpoints. http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7ba06950e266154

[CrashieJ]

PEEFsmash, on 10 October 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

If this thread survives through the night, I'm going to make two threads, both identical to yours, but with the words "heavy" and "assault" replacing "light"

for the hell of it, I'll make one that replaces those two with "medium"

yes "MEDIUM MEDIUM MECHS MECHS NEED NEED TO TO BE BE NERFED NERFED"

[-Muta-]

kongman, on 10 October 2013 - 04:34 PM, said:

just as the title says , lights need to be nerfed in a huge way .nothing more to add really .

SEEMS LIKE SOMEONE IS BEING GETTING OWNED LATELY...

kongman, on 10 October 2013 - 04:46 PM, said:

well reading most topics on this 90 % of people agree with me , but looks like nothing will happen , just delete the thead no point , all the cry baby light pilots will get there way

hahahaha YOU SHOULD HAVE NEVER STARTED IT NOOB

[Mehlan]

Commando

Quote

As early as 2463 Coventry Metal Works (then known as Coventry Defense Conglomerate) introduced with the COM-1A Commando its second own developed BattleMech for the LCAF and one of the first ever, that was suited for reconnaissance. Much lighter and faster than their precursors, though they still used primitive BattleMech technology, Commandos were able to destroy much heavier Kuritan Gladiators during the first large-scale battle between BattleMechs in 2475 on Nox.^[3]. But since its large laser caused several problems and other 'Mechs were introduced (like the Wasp in 2464 and the Stinger in 2479), that were better equipped for scouting and even mounted Jump Jets, the Commando's profile was radically changed with the introduction of the sophisticated COM-2D variant in 2486, that exchanged the laser weaponry with short range missiles and turned the machine into a striker. With four tons the armor is too light to allow a stand-up fight with heavier enemies, but it excels at hit-and-run tactics and as a scout hunter.^[4]

Spider

Quote

The 'Mech gets its name from the unique pattern on its chest that radiates from the Medium Laser mounts in its center torso. The Spider is one of the most maneuverable BattleMechs ever conceived. It has a ground speed that is comparable to a Locust and can out jump either the vaunted Wasp or Stinger light 'Mechs. Spiders are generally used as fast strike forces to hit an enemy's rear with lightning speed

Jenner

Quote

, the Jenner remained a common sight among the regiments of the DCMS until Luthien Armor Works reopened a line on Luthien in 3046^[3]. The Jenner's primarily laser armament and phenomenal speed helped to make the the 'Mech extremely well suited as a guerrilla fighter .

Note in each of these the reference to COMBAT roles... and I know my 5k has every bit of armor I can fit on the lil ******.

Edited by Mehlan, 11 October 2013 - 05:18 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Quote

With four tons the armor is too light to allow a stand-up fight with heavier enemies, but it excels at hit-and-run tactics and as a scout hunter

Quote

Spiders are generally used as fast strike forces to hit an enemy's rear with lightning speed

Quote

Guerrilla warfare is a form irregular warfare in which a small group of combatants such as armed civilians (or "irregulars") use military tactics including ambushes, sabotage, raids, petty warfare, the element of surprise, and extraordinary mobility to dominate a larger and less-mobile traditional army, or strike an invulnerable target, and withdraw almost immediately.

And still an AC20 hit or three will end your 5K. Light Mechs are not for Fighting in the traditional military sense. They are scouts, raiders, flankers and harassers.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 11 October 2013 - 05:30 AM.

[culverin]

lols @ sillies who don't know anything.
Fine, not everybody knows their lore.
But if you're going to talk lights, mech designs and class roles, then maybe you should do a little research first.
bigger is better, durrr....

Mehlan, on 10 October 2013 - 05:00 PM, said:

No, you just really can't play for squat.... but why dont you provide canon documentation and or original BT documentation that says lights are supposed to be scouts and can't 'take a hit'.

Meanwhile I will point out Sarna docs referring to certain light mechs as rear strike force, strikers and guerillas fighters.

These are unique roles...
Rear strike force = last minute reserves
Strikers = hit the enemy deep
Guerilla fighters = hit and fade.

But you missed one


HUNTER KILLERS
Lights behaving like a pack of wolves,
Hunter-killers = Roam together, find the weakest link, finish him off, move onto the next.
See, I'm not making this stuff up.
http://www.sarna.net...er+killer&go=Go





Solitaire is probably my fave for looks

Weighs as much as the Commando (25 tons)
Runs faster than the Jenner current does (162km/h)
42 damage alpha strike!





Pack Hunter is my favorite for armaments.

Same weight as a spider (30 tons)
Same mobility (7/11/7)
15 damage from a Clan ER PPC. Essentially, a gauss rifle that doesn't need ammo.

[Shadey99]

Joseph Mallan, on 11 October 2013 - 05:28 AM, said:

And still an AC20 hit or three will end your 5K. Light Mechs are not for Fighting in the traditional military sense. They are scouts, raiders, flankers and harassers.

Except BT was never about 'traditional fighting forces'... Even with infantry and vehicles besides mechs. If you wanted to 'scout' aerospace units were quicker (and had several airborne recon models) or if you needed to get up close hover scouts or other aerodynes were the best choice. Light mechs were a step up from those and had a higher combat ability, much like 20 ton 'light tanks' did. It took the clans before a true 'I'm not for combat' light mech with truly lightning fast speed would exist.

[Joseph Mallan]

culverin, on 11 October 2013 - 05:42 AM, said:

lols @ sillies who don't know anything.
Fine, not everybody knows their lore.
But if you're going to talk lights, mech designs and class roles, then maybe you should do a little research first.
bigger is better, durrr....




These are unique roles...
Rear strike force = last minute reserves
Strikers = hit the enemy deep
Guerilla fighters = hit and fade.

But you missed one


HUNTER KILLERS
Lights behaving like a pack of wolves,
Hunter-killers = Roam together, find the weakest link, finish him off, move onto the next.
See, I'm not making this stuff up.
http://www.sarna.net...er+killer&go=Go





Solitaire is probably my fave for looks

Weighs as much as the Commando (25 tons)
Runs faster than the Jenner current does (162km/h)
42 damage alpha strike!





Pack Hunter is my favorite for armaments.

Same weight as a spider (30 tons)
Same mobility (7/11/7)
15 damage from a Clan ER PPC. Essentially, a gauss rifle that doesn't need ammo.

However those units are not in MWO... Yet. The designs we do have were designed for scouting & raiding.

BTW... Solitaire is sexy as Hel!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 11 October 2013 - 05:53 AM.

[3rdworld]

The cool thing about mechwarrior, we don't have to use mechs how the TRO's say they were used....in a make believe universe....based on a table top game.

[meteorol]

Lights don't need a nerf, hitreg needs to be fixed.

[Taemien]

Getting lights nerfed. Now explain to me how much sense does that make? We know they are bugged because of hit detection. But yet the OP wants to nerf them. Now I'm not going to insult his intelligence by saying he doesn't know a damn thing and forgot to read the dev posts and QnAs that say such things are being worked on. And I am not going to insult his skill level by saying he has no idea how to deal with them.

So that leaves us with one possibility. He has an agenda. He doesn't like lights. Its not that they are OP. He just doesn't like them. He wants them nerfed so no one wants to use them. If he didn't have to deal with lights he could force his opponents into playing even more how he thinks they should play.

That my friends is the purpose of this thread. For it is rude to assume that the OP is misinformed. Its best to assume the OP has all the information on the subject and has read the QnAs and Command Chair posts showing that hit detection is being worked on. So I'm assuming that the OP knows this. I'm also going to assume that he is at better than average skill level and can deal with lights like the rest of us.

Unless... the OP wants to set the record straight and inform us that he didn't read such posts. But that would require him to remove the foot from his mouth. I doubt he'd do that IF this was the case. Or that he isn't as skilled as the rest of us as that would be a bit embarrassing. Though I can honestly say I wouldn't look down on them, though I cannot speak for anyone else.