297 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 10 December 2013 - 11:48 AM, said:

Post your KDR on your main. Let's see if your words and deeds match.

2,716 K/2,182 D

4,325 Matches
I have died in 50% of my drops!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 10 December 2013 - 11:54 AM.

[El Bandito]

Joseph Mallan, on 10 December 2013 - 11:51 AM, said:

2,716 K/2,182 D

That does not look like the KDR of a reckless pilot. I remember my KDR was 0.2 (5 deaths per kill) during my first 2 newbie months. And this was with a Fatlas, when C-Bill rewards were much better. Imagine newbies starting in a Commando now. I suppose the lucky ones chose RVN-3L.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 December 2013 - 11:58 AM.

[Bilbo]

El Bandito, on 10 December 2013 - 11:53 AM, said:

That does not look like the KDR of a reckless pilot.

Looks like one to me and I should know. I'm the most reckless pilot I know.

[El Bandito]

MIne is 1,933 / 1,279

Bilbo, on 10 December 2013 - 11:54 AM, said:

Looks like one to me and I should know. I'm the most reckless pilot I know.

I thought he would have around 1:1 KDR. But 1.24 is pretty good.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 December 2013 - 11:57 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 10 December 2013 - 11:53 AM, said:

That does not look like the KDR of a reckless pilot. I remember my KDR was 0.2 during my first 2 newbie months. And this was with a Fatlas! Imagine newbies starting in a Commando.

My present Alt have 1 kill and 3 Deaths in the Highlander © so a K/D of .25

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 10 December 2013 - 12:11 PM.

[El Bandito]

Joseph Mallan, on 10 December 2013 - 11:57 AM, said:

My present Alt has 1 kill and 3 Deaths in the Highlander © so a K/D of .25

It will streamline over time. There are certain mechs just hate its pilots though. I remember having some really bad days in CTF-4X. So glad when I sold it after few months of suffering.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 December 2013 - 12:02 PM.

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 10 December 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

It will streamline over time. There are certain mechs just hate its pilots though. I remember having some really bad day in CTF-4X. So glad when I sold it after few months of suffering.

Thats kinda what I am trying to see as all my previous data has the old income amounts clouding the winnings. I wanna see how long it takes to earn a 10Mil Mech from scratch.

[WarHippy]

OneEyed Jack, on 02 December 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

I'll give you that they should probably either reverse the c-bill nerf or make it up with new bonuses. But crying about how bad the grind is, is just the mewling of the pathetic "gimme-gimme-I-want-it-all-gimme" crowd.

Instead of jumping to conclusions and complaining that people are mewling and pathetic you might want to take a moment to actually discuss it with them instead of being needlessly abrasive. I don't like the grind and would be happy if they reverted the c-bill nerf or at the very least gave us a first win of the day bonus like they did with xp, but because I don't like the grind I get labeled as a "pathetic gimmie gimmie" by all the holier than thou types that prefer to belittle rather than debate.

OneEyed Jack, on 02 December 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

The "grind" they keep whining about is actually pretty fricking light compared to... I dunno... anything that vaguely resebled an actual grind? A game like this requires advancement. It's what keeps people coming back.

"Gotta get this mech leveled."

"Oh, I really want that new mech that's coming out, better scrape up the space bucks!"

Without advancement, there's no incentive. Without incentive, people stop playing. Without people playing, there's no new players. Wither no one playing and no new players, there's no money. With no money, game goes bye-bye. If you speed advancement up too much, it goes so fast there's no feeling of accomplishment, and it might as well not have been there. I'm sure some people will try to deny it, but even subscription games have some kind of grind, because they HAVE to provide a way for people to generate that feeling of accomplishment, so they stay interested.

You are correct, but you miss the part where if the advancement takes too long and the incentive is not worth it people will also stop playing. Developers need to find a balance between too much grind and too little grind. Right now a lot of people feel it is leaning a little too far into the grind category. PGI needs to work on making the game a place people want to spend money rather than a place that people feel forced to spend money.

OneEyed Jack, on 02 December 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

Does it apply to everyone? Hell no. There are also the spoiled brats that never feel like they should have to put forth any effort to get whatever they want. But those people sure as hell aren't going to keep PGI in business. If they were, they would have already activated premium time, bought Hero mechs, and would be making space bucks hand over fist instead of whining about how long it takes them to get {Scrap} for free.

I'm complaining how long it takes to get **** for free, and I'm pretty sure I am doing just fine at helping PGI keep the lights on. Then again I'm not conceited enough to look down on the people that are playing for free because I understand that they are content as well. Without those free players sticking around the population goes down and the more that leave the more likely it is for paying players to leave because there is nobody around.

Edited by WarHippy, 10 December 2013 - 12:36 PM.

[El Bandito]

WarHippy, on 10 December 2013 - 12:03 PM, said:

I'm complaining how long it takes to get **** for free, and I'm pretty sure I am doing just fine at helping PGI keep the lights on. Then again I'm not conceited enough to look down on the people that are playing for free because I understand that they are content as well. Without those free players sticking around the population goes down and the more that leave the more likely it is for paying players to leave because there is nobody around.

Yep, F2Pers are also assets. I personally would be happy if PGI at least boost the salvage bonus (current salvage bonus no way reflects the increased mechs in a match) to something that is not sucky. They claim the current system is only a prelude to better reward system in the future--along with the coming of CW. However, I cannot help but fear the newbies/F2Pers will remain discouraged by current level of rewards for months to come.

One can only hope PGI has the charts and the stats and know what they are doing.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 December 2013 - 12:14 PM.

[DaZur]

WarHippy, on 10 December 2013 - 12:03 PM, said:

You are correct, but you miss the part where if the advancement takes too long and the incentive is not worth it people will also stop playing.

In fairness... grinding without an "end-game" is what's irritating player the most IMHO. Grinding for c-bills, the next mech or the next bit of upgrade kit is all find and dandy... but we've been doing it for almost 2 years.

I think enough is enough...

[WarHippy]

DaZur, on 10 December 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

In fairness... grinding without an "end-game" is what's irritating player the most IMHO. Grinding for c-bills, the next mech or the next bit of upgrade kit is all find and dandy... but we've been doing it for almost 2 years.

I think enough is enough...

I can't disagree with this because I have no doubt it plays a role in all of this as well. There is nothing to distract us from the grind, and it only magnifies it when you want to constantly mess around with new mechs and new builds.

[MustrumRidcully]

DaZur, on 10 December 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

In fairness... grinding without an "end-game" is what's irritating player the most IMHO. Grinding for c-bills, the next mech or the next bit of upgrade kit is all find and dandy... but we've been doing it for almost 2 years.

I think enough is enough...

I think there are many different people playing the game with different reasons and different problems.

A new player doesn't really have to worry about endgame. He worries about getting to his first mech. The cadet bonus helps him here. But then he realizes to max out his skills he needs two more, and the cadet bonus is gone and now it takes a lot of time.

I believe I have 14 mechs currently, mostly being affored by Founder and MC purchases. Despite really liking the game in the begining and big hopes I never became one of these with 100 Millions of C-Bills. I believe I've now around 4 Million C-Bills. Buying a new engine would set me back, most mechs I'd be interested still I can't buy. And then the game is still the same as 1 year ago, except some fruitless balancing tweaks.

It's all a bad package for me. I had originally planned to buy another MC package at least for the next MC sale, but at 20 %, I decided it wasn't worth it. I would still take forever, and if you only play a few hours per week (now it looks more like a few hours a month), then Premium is useless.

[DaZur]

MustrumRidcully, on 10 December 2013 - 12:56 PM, said:

I think there are many different people playing the game with different reasons and different problems.

A new player doesn't really have to worry about endgame. He worries about getting to his first mech. The cadet bonus helps him here. But then he realizes to max out his skills he needs two more, and the cadet bonus is gone and now it takes a lot of time.

Oh, no doubt...

That said, for most the endeavor to procure their first mech and "make it theirs" is a fair motivation to plod though... not even taking the cadet bonus into account.

Great now they have their brand spanking new mech!... What' s next, Oh yeah... grind some more.

I love a good steak as much as anyone.... but if that's all I eat morning noon and night... I might be looking for that flipping salad PGI keeps promising.

[Roadkill]

Joseph Mallan, on 10 December 2013 - 10:59 AM, said:

I really cannot see how I am above average I have died in half of my matches to date, My K/D is a 1.25

Given the way the matchmaker currently works, you're almost guaranteed to die in half of your matches (when pugging) because half of your matches are going to be 2-12 steamroll losses and the other half are going to be 12-2 steamroll wins. (ok, I exaggerate... but you get the meaning.)

It's very difficult to have anything but a 1:1 win:loss ratio while pugging. Most of the people posting ratios that vary from that significantly are getting the results while grouping and probably with some 12-man gaming thrown in for added benefit.

Quote

11 Assists!?! I have never wracked that many Assists, I average >300 damage, and on a win with 4< assists I make 120K+ so somehow with that many assists you lost? 11 * 6500 is 71,000 C-bills... We get how much for a win? There is something wrong with your numbers! if that is the case.

That was just one of the games! And I was trying really hard to get as many assists as possible in order to boost my earnings according to the wisdom in this thread. It's much more "normal" for me to have 7-8 total kills+assists.

25k for the win, so 96k between the win and the assists. That particular game came in around 140k as I recall after adding in some Savior Kills, etc. But the losses in that set of games easily compensated for the single 140k game. If you're getting 2-12 facerolled, you're not getting much in the way of assists or anything else. 35k isn't at all uncommon for a steamroll loss. 140k + 35k = 175k... or 87.5k per match. That number look at all familiar?

Trust me, Joe, you're good. I've seen you play. Not 1%-er good (99% of us aren't!), but good nevertheless.

[MustrumRidcully]

DaZur, on 10 December 2013 - 01:16 PM, said:

[/size]
Oh, no doubt...

That said, for most the endeavor to procure their first mech and "make it theirs" is a fair motivation to plod though... not even taking the cadet bonus into account.

Great now they have their brand spanking new mech!... What' s next, Oh yeah... grind some more.

I love a good steak as much as anyone.... but if that's all I eat morning noon and night... I might be looking for that flipping salad PGI keeps promising.

I also think system mastery is a b*tch.

Because I have a pretty good idea what kind of builds will work and what won't... Experimentation is of less interest, too. THis is a direct consequence of the weak balancing of the game. There are plenty of weapons I can only ignore because they're not good enough, no matter what tricks I'd try.

If I was still naive and optimistic I might have a few more things to try out. But it just feels useless to do so when you can predict the results. (And if you forget how hard it is to predict things. You know the build everyone was talking about when the Jagermech was announced - AC/40 Jagermech. That was the main build everyone wanted to try. And basically everyone did try.)

[Roadkill]

Sandpit, on 10 December 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

8 milliion is enough to buy just about any mech in the game that you want. Will it be completely customized at the end of the 20 hours? Maybe, maybe not, depending on what you purchase with that 8 million. Another 4-5 hours and you CAN completely customize that mech though. so let's say 25 hours for a completely customized mech up to assault class. Again, to me that's just not much of a grind.

Now multiply by 3 since you can't unlock Elite without buying 3 Mechs of the same chassis. Now you're looking at 75 hours and the purchase/grind of 2 Mechs that you might not actually want just to be able to have the 1 Mech that you really do want. Still not a grind? 75 hours is a month even for the hardcore players!

Quote

Some of my statements may sound a bit harsh but there HAS to be a cut-off point where you say, "Ok, we've buffed and nerfed everything that we can in order to attract and retain new players, but we've also kept things intact and challneging enough to retain our long-term crowd." A lot of us are just tired of hearing how "hard" it is to play this game.

Agreed. We just differ on whether or not we're there yet.

What I'm worried about is that if I'm right, but PGI does nothing, then we're losing players because of it. That hurts everyone because there aren't as many people playing to fill up games.

If you're right and we're already there, but PGI makes some adjustments to the economy anyway, what does it actually hurt?

As near as I can tell, nothing.

[Bilbo]

Roadkill, on 10 December 2013 - 01:28 PM, said:

......
What I'm worried about is that if I'm right, but PGI does nothing, then we're losing players because of it. That hurts everyone because there aren't as many people playing to fill up games.

If you're right and we're already there, but PGI makes some adjustments to the economy anyway, what does it actually hurt?

As near as I can tell, nothing.

There is no level of reward that will keep a player that doesn't enjoy the game.

[Roadkill]

Bilbo, on 10 December 2013 - 01:33 PM, said:

There is no level of reward that will keep a player that doesn't enjoy the game.

Not sure how that's supposed to be relevant?

[AC]

You shouldn't have to grind for weapons and engines. They should be available for MC. It am sick of getting a mech with MC and then having to grind and grind and grind just to get it outfitted. And you have to do that 3 times just to get through the stupid pilot tree. It is a lame system and I am sick of it. There is no reason why I shouldn't be able to buy everything in the game with MC.

[Bilbo]

Roadkill, on 10 December 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

Not sure how that's supposed to be relevant?

Maybe I should have said, if rewards were lower, a player would still be playing the game if they enjoyed it. Obviously there is breaking point where advancement doesn't seem possible, but I don't think we are there.