102 replies to this topic

[Bilbo]

Mister Blastman, on 01 April 2014 - 11:42 AM, said:

Not if they are behind you...

... correct me if I'm wrong but my mech doesn't have eyes in the back of it's head.

Strikes need a huge nerf or an option to play games without them.

If they got behind you, you deserve what you get.

[3rdworld]

Bilbo, on 01 April 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

If they can see you to put the strike on target, you can see them.

What is your point? If you are saying that Arty/air do full damage at unlimited range vs all weapons having a max is another ridiculous part of why they are overpowered. Than I agree.

[Mister Blastman]

Bilbo, on 01 April 2014 - 11:44 AM, said:

If they got behind you, you deserve what you get.

If they get behind you from a kilometer away?

Come on. For real? Get a life. There's a difference between getting behind someone at 50 meters and over 1000 meters.

[Bilbo]

3rdworld, on 01 April 2014 - 11:47 AM, said:

What is your point? If you are saying that Arty/air do full damage at unlimited range vs all weapons having a max is another ridiculous part of why they are overpowered. Than I agree.

My point is....Remaining stationary for prolonged periods of time is a bad idea and is punished as it should be.

[3rdworld]

Bilbo, on 01 April 2014 - 11:52 AM, said:

My point is....Remaining stationary for prolonged periods of time is a bad idea and is punished as it should be.

Prolonged.....

Do you even know how arty works?

[Bilbo]

Yes, I'm well aware of how it works.

[3rdworld]

Bilbo, on 01 April 2014 - 12:04 PM, said:

Yes, I'm well aware of how it works.

I have my doubts.

[meteorol]

R Razor, on 31 March 2014 - 01:57 PM, said:

I giggle when my light mech drops an arty or an air behind some fat assault or heavy that is too busy button mashing his little fingers to death to notice the HUGE cloud of RED smoke that gives him several seconds worth of MOVEMENT opportunity and then comes on the forums and WHINES about how OP it is.

Drop behind, too busy to notice? He could do nothing but stare at the monitor, he still wouldn't notice the HUGE cloud of RED smoke, because it's behind him.

And several seconds are five. If you don't run a 350+ engine on an assault, and are not moving at full speed the moment the red smoke appears infront of you, you will be hit. Even if you accelerate to full speed, those 5 seconds will get you nowhere. Dodging air/arti strikes in an assault which goes like 60 kph is not possible if you are not already moving. And noone uses consumables on already moving targets.

You should pilot an atlas once in a while, and see how far you get with those several seconds worth of MOVEMENT opportunity. Hint: you won't get out of an arti strike if you are not already running at full speed.

Edited by meteorol, 01 April 2014 - 12:33 PM.

[Pygar]

Meh...typical for PGI, they released it originally with so little hit power that nobody used it after the "new car smell" wore off...and then in an attempt to get people to use it, they buffed it by an outrageous amount.

As it currently works with the appropriate boosts...it can hurt people really bad in the right situation- but, it is not always very easy to catch people in that perfect place to do the damage, most of the time arty just ends up being a good way to scare people out of position for a moment.

[ColourfulConfetti]

Mystere, on 01 April 2014 - 11:29 AM, said:

That is the price you pay for not having any situational awareness while sniping. It is no different from someone getting behind you and firing a large alpha at your back.

Me not knowing an Arty was dropped on me is not a lack of situational awareness, I had no way of knowing they had one at all. I knew were my enemies were, and where they were engaging, but NOTHING can give me any sort of heads up over whether somebody brought or used an arty, I have the situational awareness to avoid somebody sneaking behind me, but no sort of preparation can help me avoid or anticipate an arty, cause I have no way of telling if the enemy I'm shooting at has one. (Though it would be great to be able to see what modules people are running) It takes all of a mere second to target somebody and use an arty. And unless I want to severely hamper my damage output and pace back forth all the time with gauss I'm not going to to know if somebody dropped one on me while I'm targeting someone. I'd take being drilled in the back over an arty any day believe me, as unlikely as that is to happen to me. And let me add it's possible to atry drop on somebody from 1200 km away behind them with the right equipment and modules, I don't consider that fair in any way at all.

Edited by PalmaRoma, 01 April 2014 - 01:06 PM.

[topgun505]

1. Increase arty/airstrike cooldown.
2. Only permit mechs with command console to use them.

[Charons Little Helper]

topgun505, on 01 April 2014 - 12:56 PM, said:

1. Increase arty/airstrike cooldown.
2. Only permit mechs with command console to use them.

#2 alone would work

[Bront]

Ecliptor, on 30 March 2014 - 01:55 PM, said:

i have no opinion on this matter, but i was just thinking...when you're under the satellite on hpg network would the arty or air strike hit you? or even further under at theta on hpg network?
i have never tried or seen it tried so i'm assuming it doesn't go through roofs

You can drop them below in the garrage area, and they hit up above. It's a cheap way to set them off if you have seismic active to tell you there are people above you.

[Mister Blastman]

Charons Little Helper, on 01 April 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

#2 alone would work

This!

Pay four tons... get big badda boom!

(I can't see this becoming a popular option but maybe I'm wrong. It would be limited use--and restrict it further... only certain chassis-types can use a command console... say mechs that are NOT capable of powerful sniping.)

[Kiiyor]

R Razor, on 31 March 2014 - 01:57 PM, said:

I giggle when my light mech drops an arty or an air behind some fat assault or heavy that is too busy button mashing his little fingers to death to notice the HUGE cloud of RED smoke that gives him several seconds worth of MOVEMENT opportunity and then comes on the forums and WHINES about how OP it is.

Unless the plume of smoke is behind you...

...or it's deployed in a choke point you have no hope of reversing out of.

The second bit is OK, I guess, but the first one sucks. Running a medium mech and getting hit with just one strike can effectively take you out of the battle.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

Hey this thread again. Since the OP brought up all good points I would this is just a bump in agreement. LOL@people who think module strikes = sneaking behind players. An arty strike has no counter other than total awareness. You can easily counter sneak players with BAP, seismic, UAV ect. Do you people even play this game? LOL

[Mystere]

PalmaRoma, on 01 April 2014 - 12:51 PM, said:

Me not knowing an Arty was dropped on me is not a lack of situational awareness, I had no way of knowing they had one at all. I knew were my enemies were, and where they were engaging, but NOTHING can give me any sort of heads up over whether somebody brought or used an arty, I have the situational awareness to avoid somebody sneaking behind me, but no sort of preparation can help me avoid or anticipate an arty, cause I have no way of telling if the enemy I'm shooting at has one. (Though it would be great to be able to see what modules people are running) It takes all of a mere second to target somebody and use an arty. And unless I want to severely hamper my damage output and pace back forth all the time with gauss I'm not going to to know if somebody dropped one on me while I'm targeting someone. I'd take being drilled in the back over an arty any day believe me, as unlikely as that is to happen to me. And let me add it's possible to atry drop on somebody from 1200 km away behind them with the right equipment and modules, I don't consider that fair in any way at all.

As a sniper, you should have positioned yourself in such a way that no one was able to place anything highly visible (i.e. red smoke) anywhere near you without noticing it. So, not only was your situational awareness lacking, your positioning was also found wanting.

The best sniper is one who remains unseen.

[Mystere]

3rdworld, on 01 April 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

It is actually nothing like that at all.

If a sniper did not see the big red smoke, then his situational awareness was lacking. As such, maybe that is the wrong role for him because situational awareness goes with the job.

[Archon Adam Steiner]

I'm very much of a proponent of the idea of only Command Console-equipped 'mechs being able to call for arty/artillery; in all honesty, I was thinking of that months ago, so it's good to see that others have put the idea forward and that it has at least some supporters. I think that there are several solid reasons for the idea; first, it gives the Command Console (and the 'mechs that can use it) a dedicated and important role to fill. As it stands, CC-equipped 'mechs don't really add anything for that module whatsoever... it's dead weight. Second, for anyone who wants to use lore as justification (and like it or not, this game is based on Battletech), requiring a CC module makes 'realistic' sense; the average pilot is not going to have the power or 'rank' to call for artillery whenever they feel like it.

Artillery is useful, tactical, and takes brains to use properly - especially in 12-mans. It does, however, 'settle' a lot of battles before they even really begin, not because the module itself is over-powered, but rather due to how proliferate - and necessary - it is to succeed. If the module was limited to only CC-equipped 'mechs, the module will still remain very valuable, but it would no longer be deciding the outcome of battles on so very many drops.

[Mystere]

topgun505, on 01 April 2014 - 12:56 PM, said:

2. Only permit mechs with command console to use them.

Considering that only a limited number of mechs will be able to carry one, then the number of available modules will need to be increased accordingly. And/or, the damage density should be significantly increased. Otherwise, no one will use them ... again.

Or is that really the objective?

Just like the calls to nerf LRMS ...
Just like the calls to nerf jump sniping before that ...
Just like the calls to nerf AC/20s before that ...
Just like the calls to nerf PPCs before that ...
Just like the calls to nerf Gauss rifles before that ...

Arrachtas, on 01 April 2014 - 04:02 PM, said:

Artillery is useful, tactical, and takes brains to use properly - especially in 12-mans. It does, however, 'settle' a lot of battles before they even really begin ...

Isn't that also the reason why artillery barrages usually take place in the beginning of battles, from ancient times to today?