128 replies to this topic

[Deathlike]

Roadkill, on 23 April 2014 - 01:38 PM, said:

Oops, right. The Thunderbolts tend to blur together for me. ;-)

Which is odd, because the 5SS is my most successful Thunderbolt purely because of those two high shoulder energy mounts. You'd think I'd be able to remember that! LOL

I remember that, but not because of the high torso mounts. 2 PPCs+5med lasers gets you everywhere.

Mini-Awesome, except more awesome than the Awesome.

Edited by Deathlike, 23 April 2014 - 01:42 PM.

[Nyte Kitsune]

Didn't love or hate it, what I did do was sell it, I needed the creds to buy my Atlas AS7-D DC and didn't feel like trying to win another 20+ matches to make the additional C-bills to buy it. I did keep it on the first account I tried MWO on and Re-Armed it (Mine Has 2 torso mounted ER PC's, 4 Med Lasers-1 Arm and 3 torso, an LRM 15 and 2 AMS's, I also believe I gave it a BAP). But overall due to the weapon point layout I'd have to say its not bad.

[mad kat]

I want to like it as i think it *looks* in my opinion quite cool, but it really excels as an energy boat. I've got enough of those and want to use the ballistic slots but it seems incapable of carrying anything with any merit the barrels look stupid plonked in little boxes on the side of the huge forearms and a pair of AC2's which seems the best aesthetically all things considered seem to ruin the heat efficiency and with the necessary heavy ammo bins it's loses valuable space for other big heating weapons while retaining a decent heat efficiency.

This mech does however have a lot of hard points and I've had reasonable success mounting it with 3xsmpl, 2xMG, SRM6, 1 flamer (aimed at opponents cockpit fitted in right arm) and two large lasers in right torso (high mounting ideal for shooting over hills) for ranged work. I treat it as a bit of a crit seeker, trying to stay out of trouble until the enemy is a little low on armour then step into the fray and start picking them off. It really benefits from a 280 or 300xl but i'm finding it quite unremarkable so far. The torso speed and pitch is a joke which makes using those energy biased torso harpoints even harder to use. Hence why i'm now going to try moving the bulk of its firepower to LRMS as below so at least the arms can provide a far better target tracking ability.

It has potential i'm sure i've just not found a build yet that suits me.

Gonna give this a try next:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...bbd4f5f301a67a8

Edited by mad kat, 24 April 2014 - 01:23 AM.

[Ngamok]

Well, I sold off my 5SS last night, heh. Only thing I'll miss is having the 2E in the RA instead of 1E in the 9S but having 2B in the LA makes up for it IMO.

[Charons Little Helper]

Ngamok, on 24 April 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

Well, I sold off my 5SS last night, heh. Only thing I'll miss is having the 2E in the RA instead of 1E in the 9S but having 2B in the LA makes up for it IMO.

Plus double AMS is super cool to have.

[Coralld]

Ngamok, on 24 April 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

Well, I sold off my 5SS last night, heh. Only thing I'll miss is having the 2E in the RA instead of 1E in the 9S but having 2B in the LA makes up for it IMO.

Yep, that's one of the reasons why I did not really care for the 5SS as the entire time I had that thing I wished it had the 2x Ballistic hard points of the 5S, and now with the 9S I have that, which makes me very happy.

I am considering on tweaking my 9S build again. Replace the 2x AC5s for an AC10 which will free up 4 tons, upgrade to Ferro Armor would allow me to replace the STD 280 Engine and get the bigger 310 (the reason why I didn't upgrade the armor before is because of crit space but with the 310 I would be able to have 2x of the 3x external DHS be moved into the Engine). It would then go from nearly 80KPH (77 to be more accurate) to 85KPH.

Edited by Coralld, 24 April 2014 - 07:57 AM.

[Zerberus]

Love it.

I run it with a "Summoneresque" loadout, modified from my 5S to accomodate the dual AMS and Ammo

ERPPC, LRM 10 (vs 15 on the 5S), AC 5 (vs 10 on the 5S), 300 XL.

Right now I`m seriously considering dropping the DualAMS and going back to teh 5S loadout, because LRMs are a joke for me and other people`S lack of skill or situational awareness isn`T really my problem.. but on teh other hand, I don`t really like redundancy in my mechlab, I kind of like that no 2 of the 40 or so mechs are designed for the exact same thing... so maybe I`ll keep it like this as my "help Herp and Derp stay alive in their fabled LRM hell" mech.

Edited by Zerberus, 24 April 2014 - 08:55 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

The 9S in lore was just like the 5SS in that it kept the PPC, Md Lasers, and SRM6 but it added a few MGs. Thing is, due to MWO's interpretation and the agility restrictions, it is really better off being a "in the rear with the gear" mech. Load up a big LRM launcher, some ER Lrg Lasers, and a couple of Md Lasers for point defense to turn it into a support mech. Look, you're never going to turn the Tbolt into a really scary brawler cause it can't bend over worth a damn and all of its torso weapons are high mounts. But, that is also its strength because you don't have expose your entire mech to shoot over crap. It's like you're a poptarter without leaving the ground or a Stalker with style - take your pick. Anyway, my 9S is a back of the line gunner and my 5SS is more of a long range to get to 270m and then unleash the pain (ER PPC, ASRM6, and 6 Md Lasers).

Honestly, I don't see how people complain about the Tbolt. It is a C4 Cat and a K2 Cat smashed together without any of the drawbacks. Then again, nobody thinks that the Catapult is a good mech cause it sucks compared to the Jager. I love my Tbolts, though. Ugly as sin and twice as painful!

[a gaijin]

Reading all your posts, I feel like I "know" the mech though I haven't piloted it yet so thanks to everyone who posted and shared their experience -- I really appreciate it
Now saving up a few Cbills to make sure I can outfit the loadout the way I want before actually taking it out of the garage.

I'm torn whether I wana run it pseudo-Summoner, long-range fire support (lots Artemis LRMs+BAP backed up with an ERLL and lots of ML), or "hill-humping dual PPC sniper."

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 22 April 2014 - 06:19 PM, said:

@ HeroForHire, an AC10 is superior to an AC5 in two major ways: first, higher dps (4 compared to 3), and second, more damage per shot (10 compared to 5).

Also, T-bowls work with XLs if you put a 300+ in. You have to twist a lot, and keep moving, and try to spread the damage as much as possible if you want to make it work, but the combination of greater speed and increased firepower is quite potent. Sure it's not as friendly as a Catapult, but it's better than a Jagermech or Stalker or, Heaven forbid, an Atlas for running an XL.

@ Dracol, my experience with the 10-tube launcher on the T-bowl is that if you put an LRM 20 in it works pretty well (similar to a pair of 10s on chain fire, but using only one hardpoint). I ran one with 6 MLs and an LRM20 for a while (I reworked the build recently to add upgrade the lasers and switch to a NARC instead).

I think you're right in that an XL could work if I have the clarity in battle to remember to twist and spread damage. I know a lot of people get the blood lust though and simply keep firing at the target without thinking about torso twisting
AC 5 recycle is so fast, don't you think it's easy enough to fire off 2 rounds and get the same damage as an AC10 anyhow? I mean, I'm guessing that's part of why AC5s are "the meta" right?

Deathlike, on 22 April 2014 - 06:26 PM, said:

Well, it's not that big of a problem like the Atlas, but if you're trying to shoot stuff directly under you (like from a cliff on Alpine), you'll have a bit more trouble than the Cataphract. Note that the Cataphract's head is in a nice position... the Tbolt is at the top, but also slightly offset, similar to a Hunchback.

Yes this is of particular interest. One of things I hate about piloting tall mechs is when a Commando runs right into my mechs nuts and stays there where I can move the arms to shoot but can't see what I'm shooting

mad kat, on 24 April 2014 - 01:12 AM, said:

I want to like it as i think it *looks* in my opinion quite cool, but it really excels as an energy boat. I've got enough of those and want to use the ballistic slots but it seems incapable of carrying anything with any merit the barrels look stupid plonked in little boxes on the side of the huge forearms and a pair of AC2's which seems the best aesthetically all things considered seem to ruin the heat efficiency and with the necessary heavy ammo bins it's loses valuable space for other big heating weapons while retaining a decent heat efficiency.

This mech does however have a lot of hard points and I've had reasonable success mounting it with 3xsmpl, 2xMG, SRM6, 1 flamer (aimed at opponents cockpit fitted in right arm) and two large lasers in right torso (high mounting ideal for shooting over hills) for ranged work. I treat it as a bit of a crit seeker, trying to stay out of trouble until the enemy is a little low on armour then step into the fray and start picking them off. It really benefits from a 280 or 300xl but i'm finding it quite unremarkable so far. The torso speed and pitch is a joke which makes using those energy biased torso harpoints even harder to use. Hence why i'm now going to try moving the bulk of its firepower to LRMS as below so at least the arms can provide a far better target tracking ability.

It has potential i'm sure i've just not found a build yet that suits me.

Gonna give this a try next:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...bbd4f5f301a67a8

Mad Kat, your build is exactly the LRM support build I was thinking of trying out. Have you been seeing success using this build?
And though some think the TBolt's are ugly I also think they look pretty badăŝŝ

Zerberus, on 24 April 2014 - 08:54 AM, said:

Love it.

I run it with a "Summoneresque" loadout, modified from my 5S to accomodate the dual AMS and Ammo

ERPPC, LRM 10 (vs 15 on the 5S), AC 5 (vs 10 on the 5S), 300 XL.

Right now I`m seriously considering dropping the DualAMS and going back to 5S loadout, because LRMs are a joke for me and other people`S lack of skill or situational awareness isn`T really my problem.. but on teh other hand, I don`t really like redundancy in my mechlab, I kind of like that no 2 of the 40 or so mechs are designed for the exact same thing... so maybe I`ll keep it like this as my "help Herp and Derp stay alive in their fabled LRM hell" mech.

All long range weps. Are you seeing a lot of success with this build?
I love Summoners so of course this build appeals to the Galaxy Commander in me

[FupDup]

I think I managed to find a loadout that I don't completely hate for the free mech:
TDR-9S

Does get a bit hot, though...

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 24 April 2014 - 04:54 PM, said:

I think I managed to find a loadout that I don't completely hate for the free mech:
TDR-9S

Does get a bit hot, though...

I knew you'd kinda come closer to my side of the table.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

HeroForHire, on 24 April 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

I think you're right in that an XL could work if I have the clarity in battle to remember to twist and spread damage. I know a lot of people get the blood lust though and simply keep firing at the target without thinking about torso twisting
AC 5 recycle is so fast, don't you think it's easy enough to fire off 2 rounds and get the same damage as an AC10 anyhow? I mean, I'm guessing that's part of why AC5s are "the meta" right?

AC5s were part of the meta more because they synergize very nicely with PPCs in regard to projectile speed, which allows for tighter groupings when they're fired together. This is especially true after the AC10-20 projectile speed reduction made it that much harder to fire AC10s and PPCs together, especially at long range.

As for matching AC10 performance with a single AC5, you can do it with a UAC5 (indeed, you can exceed it significantly), provided you don't jam. Jam included, UAC5s still beat out AC5s for raw damage over time and usually for burst damage, though standard AC5s have perfect reliability and are both lighter and more compact.

Comparing damage over time between the AC5 and the AC10, though, a single AC5 has 3 dps, while a single AC10 has 4 dps. This is unequivocal. The main reason that the AC5 would be preferred specifically for the TDR-9S can fit a pair of AC5s but only a single AC10 (though the pair of 5s weighs significantly more). This, however, requires sacrificing a lot of potential firepower in other areas (MLs in the torso, or a missile launcher, or something else).

[a gaijin]

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 24 April 2014 - 05:32 PM, said:

AC5s were part of the meta more because they synergize very nicely with PPCs in regard to projectile speed, which allows for tighter groupings when they're fired together. This is especially true after the AC10-20 projectile speed reduction made it that much harder to fire AC10s and PPCs together, especially at long range.

As for matching AC10 performance with a single AC5, you can do it with a UAC5 (indeed, you can exceed it significantly), provided you don't jam. Jam included, UAC5s still beat out AC5s for raw damage over time and usually for burst damage, though standard AC5s have perfect reliability and are both lighter and more compact.

Comparing damage over time between the AC5 and the AC10, though, a single AC5 has 3 dps, while a single AC10 has 4 dps. This is unequivocal. The main reason that the AC5 would be preferred specifically for the TDR-9S can fit a pair of AC5s but only a single AC10 (though the pair of 5s weighs significantly more). This, however, requires sacrificing a lot of potential firepower in other areas (MLs in the torso, or a missile launcher, or something else).

Thanks for the good info! I never use 5's or 10's, just have seen the numbers on the weapons table.
I guess the only real good trade-off of using dual AC5/UAC5 is that you get more ammo per ton then

[Bigg Robb]

Best of the T-Bolts here in MWO.

Getting good results from-
300XL
2x PPC
AC2
3x ML
2x AMS
16 DHS

One thing- why are so many of these I see on the field NOT running double AMS? Kinda of a deal for this chassis.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

HeroForHire, on 24 April 2014 - 05:40 PM, said:

Thanks for the good info! I never use 5's or 10's, just have seen the numbers on the weapons table.
I guess the only real good trade-off of using dual AC5/UAC5 is that you get more ammo per ton then

AC10s get 15 shots per ton, AC5s get 30, which means they actually have the same damage per ton (you just have to fire twice as often with the AC5 to burn through it all).

I've been running MGs on mine, actually. I think I use a LPL on the arm and 4 MLs (2 per side torso) to get through armor.

[a gaijin]

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 24 April 2014 - 06:30 PM, said:

AC10s get 15 shots per ton, AC5s get 30, which means they actually have the same damage per ton (you just have to fire twice as often with the AC5 to burn through it all).

I've been running MGs on mine, actually. I think I use a LPL on the arm and 4 MLs (2 per side torso) to get through armor.

Sounds like a fun build:) No overheat problems?

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

HeroForHire, on 24 April 2014 - 07:08 PM, said:

Sounds like a fun build:) No overheat problems?

TDR-9S or something like it is what I've been running. It has enough heat sinks for the heat load that with only a very minimal amount of care you can manage it quite nicely. I have all the MLs on one trigger, the LPL on another, and the MGs on a third. You could maybe get away with dropping a heat sink or two to add more ammo or bump up the engine rating a bit if you wanted.

[a gaijin]

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 24 April 2014 - 07:13 PM, said:

TDR-9S or something like it is what I've been running. It has enough heat sinks for the heat load that with only a very minimal amount of care you can manage it quite nicely. I have all the MLs on one trigger, the LPL on another, and the MGs on a third. You could maybe get away with dropping a heat sink or two to add more ammo or bump up the engine rating a bit if you wanted.

That's a nice brawler build with the 4ML. You keep the LPL on the arm for light hunting? I normally put my bigger weps on my torso to help em last longer

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

HeroForHire, on 24 April 2014 - 07:41 PM, said:

That's a nice brawler build with the 4ML. You keep the LPL on the arm for light hunting? I normally put my bigger weps on my torso to help em last longer

Arm weapons are far more responsive than torso ones, so I tend to put whatever guns I most want to use to target vulnerable damage zones on the arms. This naturally requires paying close attention to your target information gathering and having arm lock disabled.

Edit: I should add that I live the LPL for this role because of its high damage and incredible accuracy. I have another T-bowl configuration (the one with JJs) that uses a pair of LPLs on its arm, which gives it more punch than an AC20 with far more accuracy.

Edited by Levi Porphyrogenitus, 24 April 2014 - 08:55 PM.

[mad kat]

HeroForHire, on 24 April 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

Reading all your posts, I feel like I "know" the mech though I haven't piloted it yet so thanks to everyone who posted and shared their experience -- I really appreciate it
Now saving up a few Cbills to make sure I can outfit the loadout the way I want before actually taking it out of the garage.

Mad Kat, your build is exactly the LRM support build I was thinking of trying out. Have you been seeing success using this build?
And though some think the TBolt's are ugly I also think they look pretty badăŝŝ

Yes actually although i'm presently running mine with the standard 260 engine (don't need the speed as much right as the primary weapons are the lrm 20) and with 4-5 tons of LRM ammo i just let loose with the LRM20 using the TAG in the right arm to improve accuracy then when an enemy mech closes in too much i use the 5 medium lasers to defend myself and the std gives you enough ability to torso twist left and let your right side take the pounding without harming your firepower too much.

How mine is currently configured:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5f169111290a790

The one thing i have noted is this mech is as easy to shoot as an awesome or Atlas and it feels very sluggish. Even with the stock engine its as fast as my firebrand but that is much more maneuverable (that is elited mind). Therefore the torso twist upgrade and hard brake and speed burst or whatever it's called is a must.

So keep it at range, use an XL if you've got one spare and load up on lrms, If you want and have the space bung two LL in the right torso and a TAG in the right arm and i find its the best loadout for this mech.

Something like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c0e0569891e1db2

Edited by mad kat, 25 April 2014 - 01:05 AM.