191 replies to this topic

[Roughneck45]

JimEvolved, on 30 April 2014 - 01:28 PM, said:

I think my biggest thing, which has been said in this thread but I don't mind contributing my $.02, is that the tools are not available to easily find a group you're comfortable with.

This right here is the biggest problem.

PGI hasn't done a damn thing to make the game a social experience and has completely relied on the passion and hard work of the community to organize itself outside of the game.

Some of us have been playing for over 2 years now and they STILL don't have a proper tutorial? How long did it take them to actually have ANYTHING in game that told the player about ghost heat?!

We literally have what seems like a team of forum users scanning the new player section every day to help get people into the game and understand what is happening, because there is no other way for them to learn it!

PGI owes so much to the battletech fan base and their devotion, because if this game wasn't called Mechwarrior it would have been shutdown a looonnng time ago, if they could have gotten it started at all.

Edited by Roughneck45, 30 April 2014 - 01:44 PM.

[Vlad Ward]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

I totally get that. Problem is, the application pretty much forces any given new player to make a hard commitment to one UND ONLY VUN given group, generally before they have the foggiest idea if there's anyone in that group they even like.

GTFC has a completely open-door recruitment policy - if someone asks for an invite, they get it. End of story. If someone turns out to be a derp, or a doosh, then they get the axe later on, but that's no big deal. Someone can say "Hey, mind if I tag along with you guys for a little bit, see if it works?", and not only can they totally do that, but there's no hard feelings or wasted time/space if it doesn't work out. And no "Thanks for trying, now GTFO" messages in response to applications which were solicited from the player in the first place.

1453-R <- *still rather sore over the Skjaldborg incident, however it went down.*

You know, after the first couple of pages, I kinda assumed you were a troll given the vitriol of your original response and your absence afterwards. Checking this thread later, it's interesting to see the plot twist.

A bit of advice, if you care for it: Strict rules about having no rules are still rules, and your linked thread came off more draconian than any competitive advertisement I've seen in this game. When you're serious and antagonistic like that, you're going to turn off any actual casual groups who may toss you an invite. Well, barring the obvious ads in this thread.

I'm not going to throw one of those at you, by the way. It's not because I particularly dislike you or anything. In general, I don't feel like my team needs to advertise in that way. Name recognition is not something we lack, if you'll excuse the lack of modesty. My team does all the things you complain about "casual" teams not doing, though, and we still placed Top 5 NA in the last season of RHOD. That's including having a "Hey can I drop with you guys to get a feel for how you work before I commit to joining?" button on the app - which we respect, and have no time limit on.

So, you'll forgive me if my personal reaction tends more towards general frustration than eager helpfulness. I'd say something about catching more merc corps with honey, but I think that's been thoroughly hashed out at this point.

[Sephlock]

Quote

Why Don't You Want To Join A Team?

Because it usually goes like this:

Also, to an outsider, most of you look like this:



I'm just sayin'.

Edited by Sephlock, 30 April 2014 - 03:53 PM.

[Gyrok]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

To All Respondents to My Original Post

First of all, damn. I did not expect the recruiters to come out of the woodwork in response to that. Heh, while I can see where it might appear otherwise, I did not consider myself to be complaining about not having a unit, just stating my reasons why there aren't any units that work for me.

Secondly:

Ye know, I suppose that's the real problem.

I met the only guild/unit/league/whatever that I feel comfortable with and enjoy playing alongside in GW2, and I met them...because two of them found me in-game, pulled my face out of the ground, and then offered to help me not get my face stuck in the ground again for the rest of the evening. One thing led to another, and now I'm what passes for command staff over in GTFC, and was one of the better/more prolific dungeon players before my job ate my life.

There is no 'one thing led to another' in MWO. I've been paying attention to my 'Quoted By's' in this thread, buzzing through it and clicking on signature banners, and I'm mostly seeing a loooot of application forms. i totally understand why, but I also understand that applications are things I submit to employers, not things that should get in the way of a band of casuals looking to drop together. I tried an app-form group once, actually - a Shieldwall of Rasalhague member sent me a "Good work in your Locust the other day, not often I see scouts who actually scout". Checked the 'About Us' section of their site, decided 'what the hell', submitted an app, had a week's solid discussion in the thread...and was told politely and with all due regret and their thanks for checking us out at the end of the process to go p!ss on myself.

I hate throwing darts at a board covered in clickable sig banners. I will not go through all the same ridiculous rigmarole to find a unit in MWO that I went through to get an actual IRL paying job. I'm not going to join a unitful of complete strangers I've never seen in action, I don't even remotely have the time/inclination to start one of my own, and the people whom I like/respect on these forums are already full-up doing things far more important than cozening the introvert. Again, a thing for which I don't blame them the slightest bit.

This is hardly any fault of anyone here, it's just the way the game works at the moment. It's easier, cleaner, and just so much less of a hassle to run solo when I feel like shooting robots. And until the day when I can just shoot someone a message and say "Hey, care to drop a match or two?", I'll pretty much continue to PUG along as usual. Thanks anyways.

Our application process is a bit different...let me elaborate...

As we understand not every unit is the best fit for every player. We ask for an application (primarily to weed out the trolls, and very young children), that gives us an idea of who you are and what times you will likely want to play.

When you apply with us, you start as a Sibkin, which is essentially in layman's terms, an applicant. You will go through this process for about 1-2 weeks while you get a chance to feel us out, and we get a chance to review you internally.

After that time period, if we think you are a good fit, we will have a discussion with you about what you think in terms of fit and schedules. If you like the group, and want to commit to joining us, then cheers, let us go shoot big stompy robots together.

If, at that time, you think this may not be the group for you...then we can give you some casual tags on our TS, you can come around and drop when you like, you just will not have full access to the forums and other things that we keep privy to only our trothkin.

I understand you may not find the fit you are looking for on the first attempt, all of us in Clan Wolf Delta Galaxy know that. We are not fascist dictators demanding you do anything. So, if anyone out there reading this likes the sound of this application process (especially you included), then feel free to drop an application in and hang out on TS.

Someone will come up to talk to you about your intentions, and when you talk with them, tell them you are exploring whether or not the unit is a good fit. They may give you casual or sibko tags at that time, depending on if you put an application in already or not.

My thoughts run to this being a game, a game we should all enjoy. If you do not enjoy it with us...you will probably find a group of players you do like along the way somewhere. We have contact with many of the other clans, and have had some players jump ship from other clans to join us...or leave to go to other clans(ironically they both came back shortly afterward).

Either way, best of luck in your search for a group to drop with, and may you find a group of guys that enjoy shooting big stompy robots with you. Hopefully many laughs will be shared, and a few alcoholic beverages consumed along the way (in good humor, and safety of your own home).

-my 2 cents

[1453 R]

Vlad Ward, on 30 April 2014 - 03:34 PM, said:

Valid points

The issue, I suppose, is that I’ve been burned several times, and got lucky precisely once, in a game as encouraging of and equipped for social interactions as MWO is not. The one time a unit reached out to me here in MWO (said Skjaldborg incident) on my own merits as a player…well, we’ve been over that.

I’m also somewhat trapped in a bitterly amusing Catch-22; the problem with my Chillax Challenge (which I actually expected to go nowhere, honestly, for many of the reasons you pointed out – nobody was supposed to take it seriously, which was at least three quarters of the point), and with posts I make in threads like this, is that I then get a brief flurry of recruitment offers – not because the recruiters are interested in me as a player of MWO, but because they want to prove me wrong. Wanting to prove me wrong is a terrible reason to invite me to whatever group the recruiter is holding up as a collection of cats-most-cool – it starts off both sides on the wrong foot, and there’s unfortunately nothing I can do about it.

It turns into a realization of that old quote – “I will not be a part of any organization that will have me as a member.” And continues to leave me dropping solo. Just means I’d best continue to be perfectly okay with solo drops, which I should be for the foreseeable future.

[Craig Steele]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

The issue, I suppose, is that I’ve been burned several times, and got lucky precisely once, in a game as encouraging of and equipped for social interactions as MWO is not. The one time a unit reached out to me here in MWO (said Skjaldborg incident) on my own merits as a player…well, we’ve been over that.

I’m also somewhat trapped in a bitterly amusing Catch-22; the problem with my Chillax Challenge (which I actually expected to go nowhere, honestly, for many of the reasons you pointed out – nobody was supposed to take it seriously, which was at least three quarters of the point), and with posts I make in threads like this, is that I then get a brief flurry of recruitment offers – not because the recruiters are interested in me as a player of MWO, but because they want to prove me wrong. Wanting to prove me wrong is a terrible reason to invite me to whatever group the recruiter is holding up as a collection of cats-most-cool – it starts off both sides on the wrong foot, and there’s unfortunately nothing I can do about it.

It turns into a realization of that old quote – “I will not be a part of any organization that will have me as a member.” And continues to leave me dropping solo. Just means I’d best continue to be perfectly okay with solo drops, which I should be for the foreseeable future.

Awwww, you spoiled my little test.

So far there's been 9 posts to recruit people posting on a thread entitled "Why don't you want to join a team".

I wanted to see how many we could get and now you've gone and pointed out the obvious

lol

[DeadlyNerd]

because there's so much hassle in setting up a group and starting a drop, god forbid someone disconnects, or matchmaker fails, that I just find PuG drops far less painful.

[1453 R]

Craig Steele, on 30 April 2014 - 04:20 PM, said:

Awwww, you spoiled my little test.

So far there's been 9 posts to recruit people posting on a thread entitled "Why don't you want to join a team".

I wanted to see how many we could get and now you've gone and pointed out the obvious

lol

Lulz.

Somehow I knew that's what the numbers meant Sorry to spoil your fun, Craig.

[Kyle Wright]

Just to break the common notion that every Unit has time requirement i task some of you to go search around and talk to people in units. Yeah some of the more hardcore guys want you on everyday think Swords of Kenatres are like that youll have to correct me if i am wrong. But they also run leagues pretty often so its understandable they need to keep practicing. Then you have units like HeadHunters of Davion (HHoD) where there are a couple hundred players all with different lives, time constraint, etc. None of them are required to be on everyday. if you hold a officer position you might have to check in more then others. if you play once a weak you can join Active Reserve which allows you to drop still with any of the regular battalion 12-mans ( just for fun), the 3 semi- comp teams we have, and if you are doing Team 007 then you need at least 3 nights of play time to practice. Not to mention we Have training course by some of the best league players out their to help new people or those who simply want to improve their PUG experience. We also run drops differetly through all the teams some more strict then others with what mechs they want others simply dont care.

What I am getting at is before you say every team has time requirements i suggest you go talk to every team and get the facts, because its clearly not the case. And even then if you are pugging for 30 mins you dont even have to log on to TS or if someone ask to drop with you can always say getting off after this drop. But when you are on for 2 hours hey you have 200 friends that want to run 4 mans or 12-mans etc.

Edited by Kyle Wright, 30 April 2014 - 04:53 PM.

[Vlad Ward]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

The issue, I suppose, is that I’ve been burned several times, and got lucky precisely once, in a game as encouraging of and equipped for social interactions as MWO is not. The one time a unit reached out to me here in MWO (said Skjaldborg incident) on my own merits as a player…well, we’ve been over that.

I’m also somewhat trapped in a bitterly amusing Catch-22; the problem with my Chillax Challenge (which I actually expected to go nowhere, honestly, for many of the reasons you pointed out – nobody was supposed to take it seriously, which was at least three quarters of the point), and with posts I make in threads like this, is that I then get a brief flurry of recruitment offers – not because the recruiters are interested in me as a player of MWO, but because they want to prove me wrong. Wanting to prove me wrong is a terrible reason to invite me to whatever group the recruiter is holding up as a collection of cats-most-cool – it starts off both sides on the wrong foot, and there’s unfortunately nothing I can do about it.

It turns into a realization of that old quote – “I will not be a part of any organization that will have me as a member.” And continues to leave me dropping solo. Just means I’d best continue to be perfectly okay with solo drops, which I should be for the foreseeable future.

Which is the inevitable outcome of 99.9% of these sorts of threads. Half of the solo players pop in to say something along the lines of "I'm solo because I want to be", and that's cool. Despite leading a comp team myself, if I started MWO today I'd probably roll solo too - my schedule isn't what it used to be.

Then, you'll get the other half of the solo players who will walk in and vomit up these novellas about how awful all groups are. This is inevitably followed by every casual group on the planet smelling fresh blood and spamming recruitment offers and assurances that they are way more super chill than those awful guys. Of course, as you mentioned, those relationships rarely work out very well.

At the end of the day, and this goes both for you and any other solo players lurking in the forum hinterlands, chill groups do exist. It's not all groups, mind you - it's not even all non-competitive groups. To be honest, in my experience, competitive groups tend to be more chill than casual groups =/.

Regardless; if playing solo is something you do because you prefer it that way, go for it. But if you do enjoy adding a social aspect to games, there are plenty of groups out there that you'll probably mesh well with. If you want to avoid any false positives, do a bit of research first. By that I don't mean posting a thread looking for casual groups. You'll want to take anything people say about their own corp with a grain of salt the size of Montana. Asking unit leaders (or people who OP recruitment threads) in PM is usually helpful, provided you ask them about other units or "other units similar to theirs". This takes the pressure off them and nets you a more accurate (read: honest) response.

And of course, as with everything else, the motivation has to come from within. Can't give up on love and all that. Plenty of fish in the sea. Fill in a few more cliches for me and we'll call it there.

Edited by Vlad Ward, 30 April 2014 - 05:54 PM.

[GrandLocomon]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 April 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

You've been on the Red team as far as I have seen.

:ph34r:Lies, lies and slander!

[MischiefSC]

Short version -

Don't wanna.

Long version -

I've created, run and been in online game guilds since dial-up days. In fact prior to that I've played in Warhammer 40k and Battletech league play in tabletop gaming for nearly 20 years. I've gamed with groups of people both in person and online literally for about as long as gaming has been around. I staffed one of the first real 'MMO' games, before even Ultima Online (though I did beta and volunteer work there too, and in other online games). I've worked on staff at 4 different multiplayer online games over the years, generally working with player orgs for coordination with staff for events and member management. I got invited into that work because I've created and run player organizations online with 6 figure active membership roles.

I work with a team at work - in fact part of my job is literally refining teamwork and interpersonal communication down into fundamental behaviors and their impact on the outcome of that interaction.

I don't just understand 'teamwork' and 'communication', I make a reasonable wage studying and dissecting it for benefits and refinement. I get it. I do.

I also have my lovely, wonderful wife who plays at her computer right next to me. She's a gamer girl who's also a trained gourmet cook and bangs me like a pornstar.

However, I'm pretty much done with it in games. I've got no more energy, no headspace for more groups of people. I'm sure you're all awesome folks. I play with friends in MW:O and other games sometimes and they're great folks.

I've got nothing left to invest though. No energy, no, well, ***** left to give. I don't want to be part of another group. Also, even if I got in a mood for it I've made an agreement with my wife where I don't use any sort of VOIP (it'd be like inviting strangers into our home) and in return, she continues to make me incredible food and bang the holy living shit out of me whenever and however I want. Unless you're smoking hot and show up to my house with pan fried asparagus drizzled with a balsamic reduction, roasted baby red potatos in a gorgonzola cream sauce and saba soaked fresh diced strawberries in a chocolate ganache for desert and then proceed to do to me all the things to me you saw surfing porn in between cooking and waiting for me to come home.... yeah, the case for VOIP is pretty weak. Whatever perks it may provide when playing MW:O are just not very compelling by comparison.

I play MW:O for shooty stompy robots. I'd pay $100 for a single player version. I do not find people more difficult than AI, if the AI are done well. Go ahead and play Wing Commander 4 with 'if you die you start over from the beginning' and tell me how that goes for you. I spend all day coordinating with people professionally, I have a circle of friends that's about as big as I can manage and I actually meet them face to face regularly.

I enjoy playing with other people who want to coordinate as a team *for that drop*. However, I absolutely get that using VOIP is an advantage. There's a big chunk of people (about 84% in MW:O) who, for their own version of my reasons above, don't want to. Thus we are faced with two options:

1. Play at a disadvantage, which we will do until it becomes irksome, at which point we'll leave. Hopefully PGI will, in order to keep our business, give us an option to still play but like-minded people.

2. Leave MW:O for another game that better caters to my interests.

There is no option 3. "Get on VOIP, join a group", for a number of reasons that are 100x more important than MW:O will ever or could ever be to me.

I get that other people like playing games in guilds and groups. I used to be one! Was for many years! Organized them, ran them as a player and facilitated them as an admin! I want you to have what you want - with other like-minded people, playing in reasonably balanced environments.

All I'm asking for is the same consideration. If not, I'll probably hang out for a bit still, but I absolutely will leave. There is no aspect of MW:O or anything else that's more significant to me than the other factors involved in where and with who I spend my time.

Very long version, but there's probably about as many versions of it as whatever 84% of the games population is.

[Sephlock]

Ariana Rifkin, on 30 April 2014 - 07:44 PM, said:

So much good stuff

I think I love you <3.

Quote

Let it be known that I do not have anything against premades, nor do I consider them evil. What I think is evil is the attitude of certain people who do not wish for the game to be made balanced for pugs.

Yeah, not everyone wants/is able to show up and coordinate with six kajillion buddies.

Versus! Versus! Versus! Combine our powers.
Let our hearts become one, burn and fight.
Versus! Versus! Versus!
In order to grant your wish, a peaceful dream.
Versus! Versus! Super Sentai!

No matter when, you will not be alone,
so don't show me your sorrowful tears.
No matter where, your friends will be with you,
they will give you more power than you can imagine.

When a faint scream is heard,
my heart feels like it will crumble with sparks.
Because the ones protecting this blue planet are us heroes!

Versus! Versus! Versus! Let's roar!
Once your have reached your resolution, we will go and crush them.
Versus! Versus! Versus! We will make you smile.
We will bet our life in order to win.
Versus! Versus! Super Sentai!

Believe in our bonds, if you can gather enough courage,
there will be nothing to be afraid of.
Pray for tomorrow,
when the warriors join forces, a miraculous force will be born.
Chase after the hope of those who have been sinking in sorrow.
Go go go go and fight!
The soul of Sentai will bring back the light to those eyes!

Versus! Versus! Versus! Hey, warriors!
When the battle is over, the sun will gently smile again.
Versus! Versus! Versus! Our faraway dream
is here right now, in the palm of this hand.
Versus! Versus! Super Sentai!

Versus! Versus! Versus!

Versus! Versus! Versus! Let's roar!
Once your have reached your resolution, we will go and crush them.
Versus! Versus! Versus! We will make you smile.
We will bet our lives in order to win.
Versus! Versus! Super Sentai!

Versus! Versus! Versus! Combine our powers.
Let our hearts become one, burn and fight.
Versus! Versus! Versus! In order to grant your wish, a peaceful dream.
Versus! Versus! Super Sentai!

Edited by Sephlock, 01 May 2014 - 12:26 AM.

[GalaxyBluestar]

teams are fickle about conduct some encourage douchebaggery but you no meta you out. others aren't bothered how you play the game but if you post complaints on forum you out. for the sake of gaming it gets rediculous like a second job stupid times and conditions just kills the fun and now with the pgi lobby which means forever typing names and invites and stuff you either derp pug / or tied to l33t-unit-junkies with no earnings or go home. great lobby system.

Sephlock, on 30 April 2014 - 09:12 PM, said:

now i've seen everything, nono i've seen power rangers and understand all the japanese stuff, those costumed stunt ninjas is well founded entertainment there...

but at 1:04 a guy flicks a hula hoop to knock down enemies like bowling pins... OMG MWO IS SAVED add a hula hoop module and i'd play religiously! LOL and shove someone with an exercise ball better than knockdowns will ever be!

plus lyrics like that will never be written again

Edited by GalaxyBluestar, 30 April 2014 - 10:30 PM.

[Sephlock]

GalaxyBluestar, on 30 April 2014 - 09:33 PM, said:

teams are fickle about conduct some encourage douchebaggery but you no meta you out. others aren't bothered how you play the game but if you post complaints on forum you out. for the sake of gaming it gets rediculous like a second job stupid times and conditions just kills the fun and now with the pgi lobby which means forever typing names and invites and stuff you either derp pug / or tied to l33t-unit-junkies with no earnings or go home. great lobby system.

now i've seen everything, nono i've seen power rangers and understand all the japanese stuff, those costumed stunt ninjas is well founded entertainment there...

but at 1:04 a guy flicks a hula hoop to knock down enemies like bowling pins... OMG MWO IS SAVED add a hula hoop module and i'd play religiously! LOL

What about the ball? I'd feel really sorry for that guy/girl...

Edited by Sephlock, 30 April 2014 - 10:47 PM.

[Aym]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

I totally get that. Problem is, the application pretty much forces any given new player to make a hard commitment to one UND ONLY VUN given group, generally before they have the foggiest idea if there's anyone in that group they even like.

That's perception as much as reality sometimes. I'm welcome in many units team speaks and had to apply to get into the permissions, but many units and communities, such as ours at www.house-marik.net hint hint, have specific tags to welcome people who aren't "committing to one and only one" community.

[Gyrok]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

The issue, I suppose, is that I’ve been burned several times, and got lucky precisely once, in a game as encouraging of and equipped for social interactions as MWO is not. The one time a unit reached out to me here in MWO (said Skjaldborg incident) on my own merits as a player…well, we’ve been over that.

I’m also somewhat trapped in a bitterly amusing Catch-22; the problem with my Chillax Challenge (which I actually expected to go nowhere, honestly, for many of the reasons you pointed out – nobody was supposed to take it seriously, which was at least three quarters of the point), and with posts I make in threads like this, is that I then get a brief flurry of recruitment offers – not because the recruiters are interested in me as a player of MWO, but because they want to prove me wrong. Wanting to prove me wrong is a terrible reason to invite me to whatever group the recruiter is holding up as a collection of cats-most-cool – it starts off both sides on the wrong foot, and there’s unfortunately nothing I can do about it.

It turns into a realization of that old quote – “I will not be a part of any organization that will have me as a member.” And continues to leave me dropping solo. Just means I’d best continue to be perfectly okay with solo drops, which I should be for the foreseeable future.

The irony is, not all groups will take just anyone...and you have to get your feet wet to determine what group that would take you as a player may be a good fit.

As I said above, and you seemed to gloss over, we have a relatively lengthy (comparatively) process for entrance into the clan that culminates with a Trial.

If you make it to become anything above a sibkin, then odds are you will be fine and fit in...though, we are a highly competitive group, we also have many casual players...though we have that luxury because we have 70+ players from all kinds of time zones.

I am not going to tell you that you must join a group...however, I think your jaded view is based on a poor experience and leaving that bitter taste in your mouth to marinate a while is doing you no favors.

[Craig Steele]

Gyrok, on 30 April 2014 - 10:27 PM, said:

The irony is, not all groups will take just anyone...

This is true and absolutely fair enough.

But the additional point of irony is those same group's that have selection standards then often turn around and say they are not "elitest" or they are just "casual gamers".

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Guilds to have clear guidelines and expectations of their members for whatever type of player they want to attract / cater to. That's their call.

But it is a bit silly to then turn around and portray otherwise.

[Sephlock]

Craig Steele, on 30 April 2014 - 10:58 PM, said:

This is true and absolutely fair enough.

But the additional point of irony is those same group's that have selection standards then often turn around and say they are not &quot;elitest&quot; or they are just &quot;casual gamers&quot;.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Guilds to have clear guidelines and expectations of their members for whatever type of player they want to attract / cater to. That's their call.

But it is a bit silly to then turn around and portray otherwise.

I think there's a rather large grey area between having no standards at all and being an elitist.

[Craig Steele]

Sephlock, on 01 May 2014 - 12:28 AM, said:

I think there's a rather large grey area between having no standards at all and being an elitist.

Not to the guy who gets rejected?