bluepiglet, on 19 July 2014 - 07:00 AM, said:
Are you sure the newer data will aid your case?
The Clan ER PPC makes you so sad, because it's identical to the IS counterpart, except for 50% extra splash damage, and being 17% lighter...... Such depressing for you, isn't it?
Like I said, some players are willing to say anything now, to keep the broken game broken so they can have an edge in weaponry to make up what they are lack in skill.
Again, clane energy weapons are still hotter.
The PPC generates 15 heat, while dealing only 10 PP damage, and between 2.5 to 5 splash damage, isnce it can lose half of it magically if the beam hits an arm.
Are you sure the data supports your arguments?
So far you have presented none that actually stand up to the data. Especially since the only thing you like to focus on is the energy weapons, and you still ignore factors like heat, ghost heat, beam duration, and so on and so forth. That's JUST with the weapons, we haven't even gotten into the mechs themselves. Actually we haven't even gotten into the other weapons.
You've focused on the weight and slot cost of the energy weapons, and due to that one factor have declared clan mechs OP.
Biaxialrain, on 19 July 2014 - 08:15 AM, said:
Hey, they didn't spend $55-500 to lose, right?
I'm often told that the Clans are supposed to be OP.
According to, I guess, lore, but so what?
Biaxial, you have been a lost cause for months, since regardless of what information we present to you, you magically seem to miss, and continue to stubbornly claim that clan mechs are OP.
Also, anyone that says clan mechs are OP because they are supposed to be, is an idiot.
Not to mention your first line is just flat out wrong. You don't seem to understand the concept of pay to win. Clan mechs are definitely not P2W. Especially not when they lose and get killed like everything else.
bluepiglet, on 19 July 2014 - 08:41 AM, said:
Right, bringing your skill into the mech comparison is totally scientific and smart, the later part could be true and intended.
Your hypocrisy is phenomenal. You are doing the exact same thing by ignoring so many factors that should be considered. At least his skill can be evaluated by elo, and is comparable to what he should be facing. (Mavairo, I am assuming you are male, feel free to correct me if you want to).
Hobgoblin I, on 19 July 2014 - 09:56 AM, said:
You forget that those heat sinks only take up 2/3 of their IS counterparts.
You forget that the stalker in question is also an energy boat..is this somehow not a fair comparison?
You talk about ammo is pointless when we were taling about a stalker laser boat vs. a warhawk laser boat.
You forget that the fastest any stalker will ever go is 65kph while the warhawk does 71.3.
I have no idea why you mentioned a 4 PPC anything.
You're still cherry picking.
You forget that the stalker can CHOOSE not to do that silly loadout. You forget that the stalker has INFINITELY better hitboxes than the Warhawk, and that it can switch engines, upgrades, internal structure slots, and heatsink amount. The stalker can carry a lot more firepower than the Warhawk any day of the week. While the Warhawk will have more mobility for less firepower.
Why is it that people always structure their arguments so at least one party is completely stupid?
bluepiglet, on 19 July 2014 - 10:05 AM, said:
Not sure if serious.... you are comparing HPS in a 1v1 comparison?
IS LL has a damage/heat value of 1.06 vs Clan's 1.32, which means for each heat unit generated, the Clan LL about 30% extra damage over IS one, combined with 10% high DPS, which means in the scenario you described while the WHK might overheat first, by the time it happens a lot more damage would have been done to the STK, and even when the damage output of both meches are bottlenecked by the heat, WHK still have a 30% advantage over STK simply because the D/H value is so.
And I don't even want to start on the range issue here.
And don't you dare mention PPFLD as long as the 2 CL-Gauss + 2 CL-ERPPC DireWolf is still out there.
Good job, you have a problem with the Direwolf's worst build? If you have problems with that, you have bigger problems than worrying about stats. It's high heat, low slung arms, and extremely immobile. Unless you stand in front of it, you should have no problems dealing with it.
Also, unless both parties are brain dead and would just sit there and open fire like idiots at each other, the stalker wins that duel. It doesn't have the huge CT problem the WHK has.
That's before factoring in the high mounts on the stalker which would make any duel over uneven terrain a forgone conclusion in favor of the STK.
Adiuvo, on 19 July 2014 - 10:05 AM, said:
None of that matters if we're comparing specific configs that would make use of the forced equipment anyways. Which, in this case, is between ERLL boats. The Warhawk is flat out better than the Stalker in that config, whether in 12s or pubs.
You know as well as I do that ridge humping becomes more important in coordinate drops, and high mounted energy weapons are preferred to low mounted ones. The STK still has the advantage in hitboxes, energy mountings, and customizability. The WHK has the advantage over it in mobility.
Hobgoblin I, on 19 July 2014 - 10:53 AM, said:
Are you mental? The topic is about clantech being overpowered or not. Or in your desperation to make a point did you just acknowledge that the warhawk is superior?
I expected PGI would make clantech superior, but in the context of community warfare and at a numbers disadvantage. In mixed matches without the numbers disadvantage they are overpowered without any mechanism to balance them out.
Clan tech is not superior my cherry picking friend. In fact, I'm willing to go down with you point by point and show you exactly how wrong you are. The point made by the person you're quoting is still valid. Why are you not complaining about the AWS vs. STK comparison? The reason the complaints are actually being made is because the clan mechs are still not available to people. That's why.
Not to mention your grasp on the concept of balance is very tenuous. You seem to think that balance means everything should work the same way. That clan DHS should be 3 slots like IS DHS. When in fact 2 slot Hardwired fixed slotted DHS is a valid tradeoff.
Hobgoblin I, on 19 July 2014 - 11:22 AM, said:
fixed some stuff
cute, but flat out wrong. Since anyone engaging in these types of combat will be doing that around <700 Meters anyways. Good try on the range difference, wrong tactic to try it with.
bluepiglet, on 19 July 2014 - 11:22 AM, said:
Banshee, along with Highlander currently is the best IS can offer to take on Dire, mostly because they can both bring some fairly high alpha damage. 45 unsustainable burst damage is still behind Dire's constant 50+10(splash), but that's what you get for nothing paying 55 bucks while your opponent does.
Are you forgetting the Atlas? AC20, 3SRM6, +MLs is the standard build for any Atlas that has been dropping DWFs left and right in close range combat. Or maybe the DS that can kill it with a couple of jump shots without any fear of retaliation.
Roland, on 19 July 2014 - 07:03 PM, said:
I think maybe your understanding of the weapon stats is out of date.
Since being buffed, the erll only has 1.5 points more heat than the standard version, and gets a ton more range in exchange for it.
There's basically no reason to run standard inner sphere large lasers.
1.5x5 = 7.5 heat without calculating ghost heat, and that builds up fast, considering your heat threshold is in the 40s.
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