349 replies to this topic

[Lily from animove]

That Dawg, on 27 September 2014 - 08:40 AM, said:

Avid Nova user here
I enjoy it.

, I get caught alone all the time and WIN those staring contests easy peasy...Or take one or two down and cripple the rest of the

sry but when you get into this situation and can do what you describe, your opponent is just poop. It's not you beign good its them being horrible. 2 Alphas of a decent loadout and your Nova is done. If you can kill one and cripple parts of a lance this requires a lot of time to do so. And you should already be dead in this time. If not, your opps did it horribly wrong. But mistakes on the opposite does not judge a mech beign good or not.

Escef, on 29 September 2014 - 12:40 AM, said:

Which would limit you to only 2 jump jets, the S has 5.



And this is also a pointful observation. If you HAVE to use the S CT, what's to stop someone from swapping pods in from other variants? It doesn't actually solve anything. The only real change would be that Timbies with c-bill bonuses (Invasion and Gold) wouldn't have jets, and other Timbies would basically never see play.

Adder has the same problem. So why is the TW allowed to on all chassis?

Edited by Lily from animove, 29 September 2014 - 02:57 AM.

[Tesunie]

Escef, on 29 September 2014 - 12:40 AM, said:

And this is also a pointful observation. If you HAVE to use the S CT, what's to stop someone from swapping pods in from other variants? It doesn't actually solve anything. The only real change would be that Timbies with c-bill bonuses (Invasion and Gold) wouldn't have jets, and other Timbies would basically never see play.

Just trying to present possible thoughts on the subject, as people do have decent points about things. Can't say they are good or not, but I'm just thinking.

Overall, I don't see people's complaints (then again, I don't own those mechs), but I'd honestly probably would use the Thor and Nova over other options anyway. Heck. You should be informed that I'm a crazy stock mech user. I use stock mechs in public matches, so I'd just see using a customized Thor as a challenge to overcome and find a custom that could work for me. Honestly, the basic prime version doesn't look bad to me.

My suggestions with the S Mad Cat, having JJ locked to the S variant only, would be if you see an S class, you know what you might be dealing with more. It also would limit the other variant a bit?

Another thing we haven't discussed as another option, what if the Thor and the Nova has bonuses to cooler jump jets, or an increased thrust quark? Might that help balance these mechs in people's eyes? So many options that could work. (We could even reduce lift or increase JJ heat quarks on the Mad Cat as well...)

[Marcel Bekker]

Well, suffice to say that the Timber Wolf S side torsi would need some pretty hefty negative quirks (@Tesunie: It is Quirks, not Quarks ) to discourage taking them just for one or 2 Jumpjets. Armor % or Internal Structure % reduction would fit that bill. However this would just be another lame bandaid. What really needs to happen is that JJs need to only be really usefull if you take the MAXIMUM amount that the chassis can take. In an ideal MWO, JJs would let you determine the direction of the jump midair or at least when starting the jump, there should be no need to rely on mech movement for that, that is not how JJs are supposed to work. They need to propell you more in the horizontal than the vertical anyway, something like either 3 m upwards OR 9 meters in a direction and 1 meter upwards (do not nail me on those values, they are out of the blue) per jumpjet fitted.

One can only hope...

Onanother note, pray that we never get so far in the timeline to see this. If there ever was a munchkin mech, this is it.

Edited by Marcel Bekker, 29 September 2014 - 11:28 AM.

[Tesunie]

Marcel Bekker, on 29 September 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

(@Tesunie: It is Quirks, not Quarks )

Sure.. get technical...

Anyway, JJs probably need a large change to actually be how they are described in lore. One such change is the ability to use them to change direction while in flight.

A change I think should be done is to remove the "hoverboots" like effect. Right now, JJs bring you up so slowly, it doesn't feel right. Even with maximum jets, you still don't really rise very fast. (My poor Quickdraw seems to barely be able to even get it's feet off the ground anymore.) How JJs should feel by lore descriptions is a quick thrust up or in a direction. This leaves me to believe that JJs should be a fast "burst" of height, but as with any advantage it would increase chance to damage your legs, unless you are good at being able to save fuel to land well. This would also reduce poptarting abilities, as it would greatly reduce the amount of time in the air, increase the speed you are moving, which will make it harder to line up a shot in that short amount of time.

Right now, MW:O's JJs are a very slow accent, which provides plenty of time for one to aim their guns, let go of their jets, shoot, and then hit the jets again to slow decent. This doesn't feel right to me, and doesn't seem correct either.

Consider JJs as being like a Grasshopper's leap. Should be a fast affair. (We would also have to adjust the amount of fuel one would go through in a given time, make it so fuel is used up faster. This adds more skill to JJs, and gives them a decent risk to reward factor from my perspective.)

[Escef]

Well, for those kvetching about Timber Wolf jump jets: http://mwomercs.com/...tober-road-map/

As for stock mechs, some of the clan mechs are actually good stock. The Stormcrow Prime was good stock (haven't touched it since the energy weapon changes, so I'm not sure now), and the Nova Prime is tricky but still usable stock. Summoner Prime I swapped the LRMs for a Streak4 and up-armored the mech.

[Tesunie]

Escef, on 29 September 2014 - 05:43 PM, said:

Well, for those kvetching about Timber Wolf jump jets: http://mwomercs.com/...tober-road-map/.

You were just too fast for me! (Was moments away from posting this myself!)

And yes, I'm the crazy one wielding stock mechs. I have good luck with the Nova Prime so far...

[Tzukasa]

To the OP in short, Yes. With the new heat on erml, it's junk. They should have left the heat alone and lowered the dmg by 1 pnt instead.

[ShinobiHunter]

Tesunie, on 28 September 2014 - 05:04 PM, said:

If the Thor was the only heavy clan mech to be able to jump, then it would help define it's role better on the battlefield, similar to how the Uller is useful and can have a more defined role because it (currently) is the only clan (light) mech that can take ECM. I can't say taking JJs away from the Mad Cat would make the Thor more effective, but it could help balance the power between the two chassis?

I understand where you're coming from. I haven't had the opportunity to pilot a Summoner yet, but I kinda wish they had left the JJ's off the Timberwolf. It would have helped the Summoner have it's own role vs the TW. But he did get what he was promised in the pack, so PGI wouldn't really be at fault if they refused his refund request. It would be nice of them to though...

[Temptis]

Marcel Bekker, on 29 September 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

Onanother note, pray that we never get so far in the timeline to see this. If there ever was a munchkin mech, this is it.

I do not see your point....

[That Dawg]

Lily from animove, on 29 September 2014 - 02:48 AM, said:

sry but when you get into this situation and can do what you describe, your opponent is just poop. It's not you beign good its them being horrible. 2 Alphas of a decent loadout and your Nova is done. If you can kill one and cripple parts of a lance this requires a lot of time to do so. And you should already be dead in this time. If not, your opps did it horribly wrong. But mistakes on the opposite does not judge a mech beign good or not.

in reply to my post about the banshee (in my hands) taking on and winning brawls.
How you read I typed out, and thought I was talking about a Nova isn't so shocking- I took the time to read some of your other posts. You're a very excitable person. Probably not a good team mate.

Saying that I'm not that good, and my opponents suck, requires the complete dismissal of reality.

I do so wish that our stats were public knowledge, we would quickly see these forum "experts" melt away.

I'd say you need spell check, but that would be just cruel.

[That Dawg]

Lily, you really edited the hell out of my post. Bad show

[Marcel Bekker]

(direct copy of my post in the med mech builds section)

After a long time of running the Prime pretty much stock except for the armor distribution, I got a bit bored with it and since I needed the Alt. S anyway for the skills, I bought it.

Threw all the med pulses out, was sick of lasers at that point, and fitted 1 ER PPC in each arm, the 4 MGs were retained with half a ton of ammo, the AMS and its ammo were replaced by a Mk II TarComp. Armor is 2 points shy of maximum.

My Eleanor

I am having the most fun and success with this one out of all the various things I tried, its combat role is that of a ranged skirmisher, using the jumpjets at every opportunity to get in unexpected positions and let some charged particles fly, then jumping/running away behind the nearest cover and looking for another good approach (within 20 seconds) and repeat. Usually I am appearing and disappearing on one of the flanks of my team, thus also acting as a lookout for enemy flanking attempts, and trying to delay those by harassing them while my buddys get into a good ambush position. The MGs are mostly for self defence against fast light mechs, and taking out exposed sections/components in the late match or if forced into a close range fight.

[Ruccus]

Marcel Bekker, on 30 September 2014 - 05:09 AM, said:

(direct copy of my post in the med mech builds section)

After a long time of running the Prime pretty much stock except for the armor distribution, I got a bit bored with it and since I needed the Alt. S anyway for the skills, I bought it.

Threw all the med pulses out, was sick of lasers at that point, and fitted 1 ER PPC in each arm, the 4 MGs were retained with half a ton of ammo, the AMS and its ammo were replaced by a Mk II TarComp. Armor is 2 points shy of maximum.

My Eleanor

I am having the most fun and success with this one out of all the various things I tried, its combat role is that of a ranged skirmisher, using the jumpjets at every opportunity to get in unexpected positions and let some charged particles fly, then jumping/running away behind the nearest cover and looking for another good approach (within 20 seconds) and repeat. Usually I am appearing and disappearing on one of the flanks of my team, thus also acting as a lookout for enemy flanking attempts, and trying to delay those by harassing them while my buddys get into a good ambush position. The MGs are mostly for self defence against fast light mechs, and taking out exposed sections/components in the late match or if forced into a close range fight.

You could also use the Nova-B left arm for the 5% pitch and yaw movement quirk. I'd also suggest considering dropping a bit of armour to fit a full ton of ammo - 4 MGs will go through a half ton pretty quickly. I would rather have a Mark I Targetting Computer and a Double Heatsink instead of a Mark II Targetting Computer, but that's personal preference: NVA-S

[HashtagComStarWasRight]

Escef, on 29 September 2014 - 05:43 PM, said:

Well, for those kvetching about Timber Wolf jump jets: http://mwomercs.com/...tober-road-map/

Yep, PGI is basically doing what I suggested. Maybe I should get myself checked for psychic powers.

[Marcel Bekker]

Temptis, on 30 September 2014 - 03:35 AM, said:

I do not see your point....

Look at the number of double heatsinks, look at the at the max heat output of 4 cERPPC ... the Hellstar has enough Heatsinks to continously fire ALL 4 ER PPC as fast as they can reload while staying heat neutral, even while running at full speed. And of course, this is with the TT 30 point Heat Threshold

Ruccus, on 30 September 2014 - 05:24 AM, said:

You could also use the Nova-B left arm for the 5% pitch and yaw movement quirk. I'd also suggest considering dropping a bit of armour to fit a full ton of ammo - 4 MGs will go through a half ton pretty quickly. I would rather have a Mark I Targetting Computer and a Double Heatsink instead of a Mark II Targetting Computer, but that's personal preference: NVA-S

The PPCs block lower arm and hand actuators, so the +5% is not worth it imho. The low ammo supply for the MGs is a concious decision to keep myself from treating them as a regular use weapon and thus get into short range, which the Nova really should avoid. For the heatsink vs TC argument, yes this is indeed purely personal preference... I take anything that speeds up the PPC projectile first! also I am used to riding the heat scale and prefer my mechs that way.

Edited by Marcel Bekker, 30 September 2014 - 11:03 PM.

[TheSteelRhino]

First of all I appreciate the ligical conversation here vs the usuaal screaming and ranting.

I can honestly say that i have bought something in every pre-release package. But I an stopping with wave 2. Again sadly, with current state of nova and summoner they just are worth it.

There were references to the phoenix pack (i also have saber pack as well)

The only mech I was truly disappointed in there was the locust. Thats a pretty good ratio.

My concern is more around the way heat works (and needs to) in this game and in the choice of that mech in the first place. 12 er medium is just not viable.period. Obviously they will quirk it in some way , but I just think some other chassis would have been a better choice. Or at least give us one of the missile versions. The nova prime and S are just kind of similar. Ya know?

[Lily from animove]

That Dawg, on 30 September 2014 - 03:59 AM, said:

in reply to my post about the banshee (in my hands) taking on and winning brawls.
How you read I typed out, and thought I was talking about a Nova isn't so shocking- I took the time to read some of your other posts. You're a very excitable person. Probably not a good team mate.

Saying that I'm not that good, and my opponents suck, requires the complete dismissal of reality.

I do so wish that our stats were public knowledge, we would quickly see these forum "experts" melt away.

I'd say you need spell check, but that would be just cruel.

sry I took a , for a . and so thought your writing about thew banshee already ended. scientifically dack background and light letters is a bad choice for writing, because it causes misreading easier. You can google the science.

Not sure what you want to pull off stats, they mean hardly anything. They don't tell you if a guy is pugging or not, if he runs with newbs, or big pro groups.

NVA-PRIME 141 78 63 1.24 105 103 1.02 38,352 131,179 12:41:54
NVA-B 81 37 43 0.86 45 63 0.71 16,430 63,128 06:39:51
NVA-S 70 38 32 1.19 38 48 0.79 17,223 62,566 06:36:39

And these stats are inaccurate because at the beginning of the clan pack release I was poor and i had to run some fun builds on the Nova Prime. like 13 flamers xD damn that was fun (and uselss, but still lods of fun). So they are inaccurate. NVA B was always a trollish build mech. NVA S was more serious build at the beginning until I could afford pos ans switched the trollbuilds from prime to S. (because prime has the more beauty camo).

Edited by Lily from animove, 02 October 2014 - 01:55 AM.

[Tesunie]

Lily from animove, on 02 October 2014 - 01:52 AM, said:

scientifically dack background and light letters is a bad choice for writing, because it causes misreading easier. You can google the science.

As a graphic designer (by college degree), there are pros and cons to any decision. The dark background combined with bright letters is more relaxing to the eyes and reduces eye stress. This makes it "easier" to read for the eye as it is more relaxed. (I personally have no problems with this.)

Also, I believe (and I could be wrong) that there is a way to change the colors of the forums through a customization button. Look on the bottom of the forum page, above the web site routing links (can't recall proper terminology here). There is a button called "Change Theme". If you select "MWOMobile" it will convert the forums for a black and white scheme (with other adjustments). There is also a windows option to make text larger as well, if desired. You can even manually zoom in on these pages by Ctrl+. As a final way to make a post black letters on white background, quote the suspected post (probably least effective). Your response spot will convert it to black letters on white background.

As a side note, your mistake is easily made. Just makes things really confusing for people...

[Nightmare1]

I run my Prime in its stock config to great effect (700+ damage matches). It's difficult to do though, and required a lot of firing discipline. I converted another Nova into a CERPPC sniper with twin PPCs, twin CERSLs, and four CMGs. The final Nova has a single CERPPC, quad CERMLs, and twin CMGs along with a Targeting Computer MK III.

Overall, I like all three of these builds. The Prime with its 12 CERMLs is the trickiest to pilot, but also the most devastating. The PPC sniper usually gets me into the 500+ damage range and is great for suppressing enemy movements while the CERSLs and CMGs work great against Mechs that try to crowd me. Finally, the single CERPPC/Quad CERML build is my least favorite, but it too has merits and has proven to be a decent Mech.

So, the short answer, is no, Novas are not a useless Mech. It all depends on how you build them and how good of a pilot you are with them.

[Monsoon]

My experience is that the Prime and S are monsters, a combination of Machine Guns and either ERML or MPLs. High DPS that can quickly overcome enemy armour. They do tend to be heat hogs, so fire discipline is a must.