117 replies to this topic

[WarHippy]

Khobai, on 28 July 2014 - 12:14 PM, said:

I have not met a single person to date that likes the new drop points.

1) PGI realized deathballing was a problem so they split up lances at the start as a bandaid for deathballing. Unfortunately it doesnt work most of the time and creates more problems, especially when slow mechs spawn in the farthest spawn points. Game was way better when everyone spawned in the same location.

2) certain maps are just too small for 12v12. PGI needs to readd 8v8 as an option. And smaller maps like river city should only appear in the 8v8 map pool.

I tend to agree with you on the first one, but the second I'm a little more hesitant to agree.

Edited by WarHippy, 28 July 2014 - 12:19 PM.

[Ultimax]

Roadkill, on 28 July 2014 - 12:06 PM, said:

It's not guaranteed, but I do it all the time. 53.5 kph in a Dire Whale is not significantly different than 60 kph in a flat-out sprint. Both are too slow. (The real difference is in maneuverability, but that's irrelevant to this discussion.)

And the advantage of running across the water... sort of... is that there's no terrain to maneuver around so you can scream at your teammates the entire time to get them to stop running away from the battle. All it really takes is for Bravo lance to turn and provide fire support.

The times I've made it cleanly is when the entire lance is slow.

Then at least we can make a tactical escape firing on what are generally lights and mediums.

If you're the only slow mover then you are also the only target.

I managed to survive a situation like that once in my Misery with 300 STD, moving backwards and only showing my shield side while a spotter worked with a catapult with nothing but LRM 5s and just rained on me the whole way, tearing my right side off.

I made it, but not due to any help from the team and without my right arm or torso, back armor also stripped and down about 7 or 8 DHS.

[Khobai]

Quote

But... Brawling!

brawling would be more common in 8v8 because you arnt getting focused fired as much. makes it easier to close the distance.

Quote

I tend to agree with you on the first one, but the second I'm a little more hesitant to agree.

why? it would be an option. you could play 8v8 or 12v12.

And it would speed up the queues because you would need less players for the 8v8 games.

Edited by Khobai, 28 July 2014 - 12:23 PM.

[Jman5]

Khobai, on 28 July 2014 - 12:14 PM, said:

I have not met a single person to date that likes the new drop points.

/waves

Now you have.

Edited by Jman5, 28 July 2014 - 12:24 PM.

[LawDawg]

Smaller maps need less players.

Could cut down on the everlasting "CONNECTION" time too. River and Forest 8v8? Even Frozen City...

Not sure how PGI could do it, since simple stuff is well beyond them. Just an Idea to make it go faster and make it more
interesting!

[Roadkill]

Ultimatum X, on 28 July 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

I managed to survive a situation like that once in my Misery with 300 STD, moving backwards

Misery with 300 STD goes 62.9 kph... unless it's going backwards, in which case it goes 40(?) kph.

Don't go backwards. That's why you got pounded; you gave the enemy an extra 40 seconds to shoot at you.

I know the theory... back up so that you can return fire... but that means you're taking fire as well. I'm usually able to sprint across the water in a Dire Wolf at 53.5 kph without taking anything more than random potshots of damage.

You need to move. Your own return fire is irrelevant if you're trying to run... get the {scrap} outta Dodge and call on Bravo Lance to provide any fire support you think you need.

[WarHippy]

Khobai, on 28 July 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

why? it would be an option. you could play 8v8 or 12v12.

And it would speed up the queues because you would need less players for the 8v8 games.

Well, for me the maps don't seem too small for 12v12, and while I wouldn't mind having an option for 8v8 I don't want to see maps segregated based on the group sizes. I shouldn't have to choose between bigger or smaller groups just to play on certain maps I might want to play on.

[Bilbo]

Roadkill, on 28 July 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

Misery with 300 STD goes 62.9 kph... unless it's going backwards, in which case it goes 40(?) kph.

Don't go backwards. That's why you got pounded; you gave the enemy an extra 40 seconds to shoot at you.

I know the theory... back up so that you can return fire... but that means you're taking fire as well. I'm usually able to sprint across the water in a Dire Wolf at 53.5 kph without taking anything more than random potshots of damage.

You need to move. Your own return fire is irrelevant if you're trying to run... get the {scrap} outta Dodge and call on Bravo Lance to provide any fire support you think you need.

Meh. If I'm left alone I'm going to my best to make someone pay for it. Can't do that with my back to the enemy.

[Roadkill]

Bilbo, on 28 July 2014 - 12:33 PM, said:

Meh. If I'm left alone I'm going to my best to make someone pay for it. Can't do that with my back to the enemy.

Then don't start across the water. If you plan to fight, take up a defensive position in or around the spawn point. You can last for quite a while and completely forestall the enemy advance if you do it right. And if you warn your teammates, they might even come help and then you'll get to smash that charging enemy lance to bits and laugh at their aggressiveness.

But if you're going to run for it, you need to run. Walking backwards is the worst of all worlds in this particular scenario.

[Ultimax]

Roadkill, on 28 July 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

Misery with 300 STD goes 62.9 kph... unless it's going backwards, in which case it goes 40(?) kph.

Don't go backwards. That's why you got pounded; you gave the enemy an extra 40 seconds to shoot at you.

No, I survived because I went backwards and had a shield side.

I turned around because at that point, back armor had been stripped clean it was either present my shield side and hope for the best or let 6x LRM 5s rip through my internals. The Catapult firing on me even apologized, lol.

Shield side absorbed the rest, unfortunately it houses DHS but that was expendable.

Managed to survive to the end of that match with 2x PPCs and AC 20 intact.

[Bilbo]

Roadkill, on 28 July 2014 - 12:35 PM, said:

Then don't start across the water. If you plan to fight, take up a defensive position in or around the spawn point. You can last for quite a while and completely forestall the enemy advance if you do it right. And if you warn your teammates, they might even come help and then you'll get to smash that charging enemy lance to bits and laugh at their aggressiveness.

But if you're going to run for it, you need to run. Walking backwards is the worst of all worlds in this particular scenario.

I'm speaking more generally. I don't have any trouble getting across the water. Doesn't mean anyone is still there once I get there though.

[Lykaon]

GoManGo, on 28 July 2014 - 08:48 AM, said:

This is the condescending type of rubbish the belongs in K-Town. When I play assault I flank with my unit and team and lay down crippling fire so the heavy's mediums and lights can get the cherry kills.I still get many assists and a few kills plus 200-800 damage averaged per battle.So you can have your point of view but I think your just a crybaby wannabe that is mad you cannot win battles because you might have low skills.

How is it rubbish if it's true. Or did you not comprehend the post?

He was talking about spawn points in Skirmish not Assault or did you mean you play an Assault Mech?

If it was an assault mech was it a 54.5kph top speed mech? and if it was specificly a direwolf 200-800 damage is kinda well terrible I have corpmates who consistantly lay down 1k+ in direwolves under 500 is considered a terrible showing.

Also,Grouped or solo? pretty sure this guy was talking about solo queue not groups were you can use comms to coordinate a flanking manuver.Just try it in DERPville and see how quickly you die because those heavies and mediums you were talking about...well um...they ain't coming.They all ran off to try to catch the enemy team's isolated lance in the opposite direction you were going.


Low skills? it takes a grasp of tactical manuver to even understand what this guy is talking about.The simple fact that he noticed this and is likely talking about the solo queue (meaning he is likely a lonewolf) speaks highly of his potential performance as a team member in the solo queue.This guy is exactally the guy I want on my solo drop and on my team.If I can't use comms I want a team mate with a mind for tactics.

Edited by Lykaon, 28 July 2014 - 01:08 PM.

[NextGame]

Regarding this issue: depends on the player who is lagging behind. If they look like they are trying to blob up and play properly, cover them. If they are taking in the sights, doing circles on the spawn and whining about incoming fire on their isolated position then don't pace your team around them, let them die.

[East Indy]

It's going to take awhile for players accustomed to 7 or 8 Inner Sphere assaults per team to accept the change.

[Jman5]

East Indy, on 28 July 2014 - 01:44 PM, said:

It's going to take awhile for players accustomed to 7 or 8 Inner Sphere assaults per team to accept the change.

Yeah. I think another part of the problem is that many people simply don't know the spawn locations very well. They don't realize they're in a vulnerable start and need to get moving or they're toast.

Smurfy's has a great resource that will show exactly where everyone spawns in each game mode. It's worth remembering the skirmish ones.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...pinepeaks&m=tdm

[Solahma]

Jman5, on 28 July 2014 - 01:49 PM, said:

I think another part of the problem is that many people simply don't know the spawn locations very well

Very true, we learn based on what you see behind the starting screen, but they should really show where you spawned on the little map before the round starts

Edited by Solahma, 28 July 2014 - 01:53 PM.

[Gladewolf]

...So an assault mech that spawns in lower city(already in range and in full view of the enemy) is going to escape from the upper city lance...across open water...with no support, because they turned their mech in the "appropriate direction" and kicked the throttle to max? No. This post is also based on the premise that the tactic mentioned is always a good idea....when it isn't. It's why I've taken to calling River City(either version) the toilet bowl.

[Heeden]

I think I'd be inclined to stay and help the heavy. Maybe it's just the groups I've been getting but whenever folks go for that "aggressive style" it seems to go the same way;

One or both teams might lose a fatty.
Everyone picks their favourite building to hide behind
The next 7-10 minutes are spent figuring out who has the best snipers and/or most LRMs.
If you're lucky a brawler on the other team might go insane with boredom and solo charge your team.
If that doesn't happen one of your brawlers might go insane with boredom and solo charge their team.*
Once the score hits a certain point/the ammo has run out/everyone's torso is red you'll either get charged and shot in the face or get a chance to charge forth and shoot people in the face (easy kills for fast strikers - my record on Alpine is 5 kills with less than 150 damage).

Compared to that, the option of dying in the first couple of minutes in a glorious shower of cannons and lasers whilst helping an obese buddy seems really attractive.

*Tip for a brawler or other pilot who prefers to engage at less than 300m. Find 6.5 tons for an AC-2 and join in the snipey "fun". It won't do much damage but it will help prevent those longing gazes across the water to your star-crossed opponents. Take time to marvel at the fact that some people find it the most exciting part of the game.

[Bilbo]

Heeden, on 28 July 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

...

*Tip for a brawler or other pilot who prefers to engage at less than 300m. Find 6.5 tons for an AC-2 and join in the snipey "fun". It won't do much damage but it will help prevent those longing gazes across the water to your star-crossed opponents. Take time to marvel at the fact that some people find it the most exciting part of the game.

I can find better things to do with 6.5 tons. If I bring a brawler, in the end, it's my job to get into effective range.

[Be Rough With Me Plz]

Solahma, on 28 July 2014 - 12:04 PM, said:

I agree about the standing still part, but I've had a couple games in my Dire Whale where I am moving right at the start in the correct direction as quickly as possible and I am still too slow to catch up on my own (aka, abandoned) there was literally nothing that could have been done. People never pay attention when you let them know you are running behind it seems. It sucks, and in hindsight it is hard to be angry about it, but it will still legitimately happen every now and again (especially in solo-queue). When it does happen, it is frustrating. I have gotten angry with my team and vocal about it before, lost my temper, etc. The feeling of uselessness when you have potential is very frustrating. But saying something gets nothing done and is meaningless, so I try to keep cool head if it does happen. It is just a game after all.

That doesn't mean that I disagree with you Jman, I completely agree about making a positioning and/or mobility error. But sometimes it legitimately happens, and people use that as an excuse like they know what you did (even if you did everything you could)

Think about it this way. You increased the distance between the enemy's forward position and your team blob's rear position. That means you've also allowed your team blob to close the distance on the enemy main blob's rear. That's a pretty significant contribution. I've done that on the map with the saddle. People usually do the NASCAR over saddle while the other team goes tunnel. If I'm on the tunnel team then I'll purposefully go to the saddle to hold up the enemy team while my team smashes into them from the rear. On very very rare occasions I'll actually be thanked for the sacrifice instead of being called "stupid" or a "noob". Of course, if your team isn't aggressive and stops the moment they get shot at then it's a wasted death and your team is probably going to lose anyway. Not only will they have stopped to camp a spot, they're letting the enemy team complete the pincer.

Sometimes you just gotta say "F*ck it" and go out guns blazing!

Edited by Be Rough With Me Plz, 28 July 2014 - 03:13 PM.