155 replies to this topic

[Lukoi Banacek]

Quote

ANYONE ASIDE FROM ME REALLY WISH PGI WOULD JUST STOP AND REDESIGN THE GAME?

Honestly, no I do not.

I enjoy much about this game. The visuals, the sounds, the handling of the Mechs and the weapon systems (with some caveats, but no reason to delve into that here).

I would not want them to redesign the game, because I honestly do not think it would ever come out any better. I'd like them to invest their efforts in CW and spend less time on monetized content, sales, mechs, even maps (yes I said it). I realize not all players at PGI work on the same stuff, blah blah blah, but I also believe that they struggle to manage what resources and talent they do have and that they should have a much tighter current mission statement...aka CW. Every single person at PGI could probably contribute to something that directly affects CW so I'd love for them to bear down on that aspect of this game and give us a taste of things to come.

And for them to hire some of the original NBT design team so they can see how the "strategy" level of this game should truly look and could be implemented using their current game platform. Integrated directly into the current game system as opposed to a mere "side league" would be epic, even with the flaws this game has for balance etc.

[Escef]

Livewyr, on 04 August 2014 - 08:02 AM, said:

A lot of the problem is this game, IMO, revolves around not mattering much.

Hit launch..

Die/Lose? great you get some Cbills, and start your next match.
Win? Great, you get a few more Cbills and start your next match.

There is no bonus to playing to survive, no penalty for dying like a moron...

If you want games with real penalties for failure I would recommend cashing out your life savings and going to Vegas. Expecting a video game to provide you with whatever sense of reward you are missing in your life is juvenile.

[and zero]

Vassago Rain, on 04 August 2014 - 07:39 AM, said:

FF14 did the redesign after they booted out the old dev team.

It's basically an all new game, and not a redesign - is what I'm saying.

....yea...I really wish that would happen here.

I mean, Im not saying PGI has not made significant progress here. They certainly have. Its just it took them an absolutely pathetic amount of time to still reach this, overall, profoundly mediocre state. Just look at the UI; its still ******* atrocious by modern design and functionality standards. There is simply no excuse for such ****.

[carl kerensky]

Viktor Drake, on 04 August 2014 - 07:34 AM, said:

First let me say I am not a fan of reboots especially since my SWG days, however it seemed to have worked for Final Fantasy hehe.

Anyway, anyone wish PGI would just stop and reboot the game?

Honestly about 2 weeks ago I saw my first video of Mechwarrior: Living Legends and immediately thought to myself that this was what I was hoping MWO would be. Sure it needed better graphics and some tweaks but for the most part it looked perfect.

So here we are with MWO which is well just lacking pretty much everywhere. Maps too small, battles don't feel like battles, no real sense of purpose behind the battles, no community warfare and no way to really add it in any substantial format without greatly expanding the map selections among other things.

I say start over. You already have most of the assets so you wouldn't need to fully start over, just start over on things like maps. Make them larger and more like MM:LL where you have objectives that have to be held or destroyed in order to gain victory points. Open up respawns, perhaps where you can select 4-5 mechs as "reinforcements" Add tons of maps to the game, design them so they randomly generate to make every battle unique. Add in actual faction vs faction warfare that has meaning. Just start over.

Hell I might even be convinced to buy some sort of re-boot package to hell finance it.

Anyway, yeah I know, wishful thinking but it sure would be nice.

If you played early Closed Beta this game was great. Sure it needed some TLC but the core gameplay was amazing. Just watch some very early videos on Youtube if you never experienced it. It went to hell in a handbasket if you asked me. MWO has the Charlie Chaplan syndrome now. Everything is flimsy and fast. The mechs lost there mass and visceral feel to me. Graphics were downgraded. I mean who actually made those decisions. Terrible choices. So Im all for a totel reboot. Yep. Redesign it to its original intentions because I have a feeling that some self appointed genius who thought the market was all about COD stepped in and took the Mechwarrior energy right out of the game and turned into what we have now. The man in a rubber mech suit, Charlie Chaplan style.

[Aresye]

MeiSooHaityu, on 04 August 2014 - 07:48 AM, said:

Nah, I don't think the game needs an overhaul. I actually think the core mechanics are solid. The game (controls wise) is probably the best and most intuitive control scheme for a Mechwarrior title to date.

The graphics (and overall performance) is ehh, but I still think it is a descent looking game. If they can honestly deliver some mild destructable enviroments (crushed cars, falling trees, etc...), I think that will go a long way. Some optimization to the performance would be nice too.

The Weapon balance and convergence is more of a PGI preference and less of them unable to deliver or lack of capabilities. They just want it to work the way they want it, so there.

Lastly, content is the real big sticking point for people. People want things like CW and Maps. Starting a game over from scratch would get us even farther from content.

Overall, the game has an excellent framework IMO. The core mechanics and bare bones product is solid. Most of the problems lies with PGI's slow development times and balancing decisions. That goes beyond the core game itself.

Just my 2 cents.

You're forgetting these as part of the core mechanics:
- Heat System
- Targeting/Sensor System
- Matchmaking System
- Netcode/HSR
- Intuitive UI

All of the above = abysmal.

[PANZERKAT]

But it's closed Beta...I mean...it's....ummm..what's the latest excuse?

[Tezcatli]

If you guys want something similar to Living Legends. You'd need a company with money. And experience in making games that handle big battles. Sony Online Entertainment. They made Planetside 2. So at least they have experience with a wide range of players. And they have the money behind them to get it done.

I don't think they have the freedom to rebuild the game. It's not their IP and have a contract that needs to be renewed. They're partly at the whim of their publisher. And clearly the money is going somewhere other then the game. Or at least day to day purchases in the game aren't making them enough money to warrant pouring money back into the game. I get the feeling they're subsisting on the pack deals to keep the doors open and hire a person here or there. But I doubt we'll see a sudden boost in content creation.

[Sable]

Oh my goodness what an idiot the OP was. Hey guys lets scrap all the progress we have made and start from scratch because that'll be a good idea herp derp. What a waste of a forum thread. This is worse than the normal whining about how long community warfare is taking. I've likd almost everything PGI has developed, they take their time and are trying their best to get it right. There's been problems along the way but most of them "eventually" get addressed. The only reason to post in this thread at all is to point out how rediculous of you're logcially reasoning is.

[Sandpit]

Sable, on 04 August 2014 - 07:35 PM, said:

Oh my goodness what an idiot the OP was. Hey guys lets scrap all the progress we have made and start from scratch because that'll be a good idea herp derp. What a waste of a forum thread. This is worse than the normal whining about how long community warfare is taking. I've likd almost everything PGI has developed, they take their time and are trying their best to get it right. There's been problems along the way but most of them "eventually" get addressed. The only reason to post in this thread at all is to point out how rediculous of you're logcially reasoning is.

oh my goodness what an idiot people can be when they resort to name calling when the Op has some valid points that MANY of us would like to see

Such as
doing away with ghost heat and implementing a heat scale that actually has some penalties aside fomr a 5 second shut down

or an MM system that actualyl promotes diversity as opposed to the rule of 3

or an NPE that doesn't involves new players getting tossed into the general population

or redoing the skills and modules systems (actually do away with them and add in a skills system)

yes
idiots one and all right?

Hey you like it that's great. Too bad not everyone agrees with you. And no "most" don't get addressed or when they do get addressed they don't get fixed

FLD
PPD
ghost heat
high alphas
poptarting
mech variety
NPE


You talk about whining but you just jumped into a thread to do nothing but attempt to insult someone and say "everything is good, I like the game and you're an idiot for your suggestion"

gpclose

Sable, on 04 August 2014 - 07:35 PM, said:

how rediculous

and it's ridiculously, since you're going to insult the intelligence of others.

[Ted Wayz]

I would like a campaign where my decisions had consequences and the rewards are what keep your mech functioning. But I am always careful to ask for what I want before imagining how it could realistically be accomplished.

We all have to admit that CW is a big gamble for PGI. They screw up implementation the game is dead. They deliver an unfinished product the game is dead. They deliver a game experience that the majority of players do not enjoy the game is dead.

A reboot would be even worse because the expectations would be higher. And to this date I have not heard a definitive answer as to what the community wants besides, "We want CW!". That just doesn't cut it.

I am glad PGI is taking baby steps, not throwing the baby out with the bath water.

[Noth]

Ted Wayz, on 04 August 2014 - 08:04 PM, said:

I would like a campaign where my decisions had consequences and the rewards are what keep your mech functioning. But I am always careful to ask for what I want before imagining how it could realistically be accomplished.

We all have to admit that CW is a big gamble for PGI. They screw up implementation the game is dead. They deliver an unfinished product the game is dead. They deliver a game experience that the majority of players do not enjoy the game is dead.

A reboot would be even worse because the expectations would be higher. And to this date I have not heard a definitive answer as to what the community wants besides, "We want CW!". That just doesn't cut it.

I am glad PGI is taking baby steps, not throwing the baby out with the bath water.

CW is already doomed to fail as what they have said about it so far (limited planets to invade, inability to wipe out factions, freely being able to play with any faction (seriously, why do you think they allowed you to get loyalty point medallions for multiple factions). It is not going to be what many of the hardcore want. The casuals won't care enough to really pay attention to it.

[Sandpit]

Noth, on 04 August 2014 - 08:19 PM, said:

CW is already doomed to fail as what they have said about it so far (limited planets to invade, inability to wipe out factions, freely being able to play with any faction (seriously, why do you think they allowed you to get loyalty point medallions for multiple factions). It is not going to be what many of the hardcore want. The casuals won't care enough to really pay attention to it.

that's almost exactly how MPBT 3025 ran "CW" and it worked just fine. That's not going to be much of an issue. You can't have it set up where a faction completely loses all presence in the IS. There are players to consider and given the nature of new players and anyone else able to join a faction and cause it to go through a loss cycle (Kurita and Davion jsut wait, I've yet to participate in an online campaign where they don't get flooded by players causing this cycle due to their popularity in the novels and such)

So I don't see that as a problem. The issue will be whether PGI wants a little depth to their CW or not. Little nuances and additions are going to be what makes or breaks CW. If CW "breaks" then I don't see this game ever expanding past where they're at now. It will be a stomp and shoot game that's a novelty to casual players that don't know anything about Btech, a losing battle for the "competitive" crowd and the "hardcore" players begin to dwindle, and a travesty to the Btech crowd. If CW "sucks" then what you have now (and what you've had for the past 3 years) is what you'll have until it either gets completely redesigned or dwindles into obscurity.

If PGI is comfortable with its current level of revenue and success then this is all you will ever have. If they're wanting to be a viably long-term ever expanding and growing game, then CW and the future decisions will have to "not suck"

I really think we've seen a slight change in PGI's mentality on several things after clan packs. Clans sold less than founders packs. Let that sink in for a second

Founders packs, sight and game unseen, sold more than the (arguably) most popular portion of the Btech universe, the clans. If this game had grown as some would like us to believe, the clans should have pushed PGI into the black for a couple of years. This was the clan invasion. The biggest event since founders, and the most expensive but with cheaper options, sold less.

So if I'm PGI, I'm looking long and hard at exactly why that happened. I don't care how you spin the numbers, the fact is that with a larger player base, and a much more "mainstream" popular pack in the clans, they made less money with packs that cost more.

That tells me that the founder crowd that has consistently been bashed and trolled by many, even PGI staff and president, have more disposable income they're willing to drop on what they consider a "good" MW game. Notice how the opinion on groups changed just before the end of the sale? Little things like that are quite telling to me. The founders crowd are generally older, more stable, and actually pretty intelligent and have spent decades involved in gaming, online gaming, Btech, etc.

Their numbers may be slightly smaller but their revenue potential is much larger. I honestly think that we're going to start seeing some changes to the mentalities from PGI soon because of this.

[PANZERKAT]

Since the Founder crowd helped generate the first substantial income for the game, I doubt it was a small number of players.

[MadcatX]

Sandpit, on 04 August 2014 - 08:55 PM, said:

I really think we've seen a slight change in PGI's mentality on several things after clan packs. Clans sold less than founders packs. Let that sink in for a second

Founders packs, sight and game unseen, sold more than the (arguably) most popular portion of the Btech universe, the clans. If this game had grown as some would like us to believe, the clans should have pushed PGI into the black for a couple of years. This was the clan invasion. The biggest event since founders, and the most expensive but with cheaper options, sold less.

So if I'm PGI, I'm looking long and hard at exactly why that happened. I don't care how you spin the numbers, the fact is that with a larger player base, and a much more "mainstream" popular pack in the clans, they made less money with packs that cost more.

That tells me that the founder crowd that has consistently been bashed and trolled by many, even PGI staff and president, have more disposable income they're willing to drop on what they consider a "good" MW game. Notice how the opinion on groups changed just before the end of the sale? Little things like that are quite telling to me. The founders crowd are generally older, more stable, and actually pretty intelligent and have spent decades involved in gaming, online gaming, Btech, etc.

Their numbers may be slightly smaller but their revenue potential is much larger. I honestly think that we're going to start seeing some changes to the mentalities from PGI soon because of this.

Makes sense that this happened. Of my six friends who bought the founders pack, only 1 had ever played MW multiplayer. We just wanted to see a new BTech title, even if it wasn't single-player. I'm sure we arn't the only ones who bought in because of the franchise alone.

When the clans rolled around, most of us chose to opt our of early access for various reasons, the big sticking points being:

- They were not really clan mechs seeing as they were being balanced against IS instead of implementing a 3 lance vs 2 star MM.
- There was no "invasion" to really speak of.
- There was too little information to make an informed decision before launch. We got some pretty artwork and that's about it.
- For a F2P title, prices were too high for what amounted to mostly early access privilege. The Founder program was also early access but, again, my friends and I paid to get this game going.

Me and a few friend's experience anyways.

[Escef]

Sandpit, on 04 August 2014 - 08:02 PM, said:

oh my goodness what an idiot people can be when they resort to name calling when the Op has some valid points that MANY of us would like to see

And in order to get what you want means starting from scratch and not having a game for a year or 2, maybe more. That's a stupid business decision, to say the least. Not mentioning the ill will generated amongst the fan community by not having a game so soon after all this paid content hit. So, yes, the OP is being an idiot. And if you can't deal with that, too f***ing bad. And if you hate the game so much, go the f*** away. I swear, people like you are like a bad ex, you scream about how much you hate, but then ask to get back together.

In short, the only thing insulting your intelligence is you.

[Sandpit]

KOMMISSAR KITTY, on 04 August 2014 - 08:58 PM, said:

Since the Founder crowd helped generate the first substantial income for the game, I doubt it was a small number of players.

it wasn't anywhere near the number of players they have in the game at the time of the clan announcement. So yes, founders was a MUCH smaller population than what we had 6 months ago.

[Alex Warden]

i just wish they´d used the time between open beta and launch to correct their direction... now we can only hope that by 2020 there will be a proper MechWarrior simulator for next generation VR... although i´ll be over 40 by then Oo

Edited by Alex Warden, 04 August 2014 - 11:38 PM.

[Sandpit]

Escef, on 04 August 2014 - 10:14 PM, said:

And in order to get what you want means starting from scratch and not having a game for a year or 2, maybe more. That's a stupid business decision, to say the least. Not mentioning the ill will generated amongst the fan community by not having a game so soon after all this paid content hit. So, yes, the OP is being an idiot. And if you can't deal with that, too f***ing bad. And if you hate the game so much, go the f*** away. I swear, people like you are like a bad ex, you scream about how much you hate, but then ask to get back together.

In short, the only thing insulting your intelligence is you.

No, it doesn't take starting from scratch. the only person being an insulting child is you. There's no need for childish name calling. It's quite apparent you have no desire to hold any kind of constructive discussion so just move along. You have absolutely no idea about myself, and I doubt ANYone else that plays this game. You're just letting your ignorance and want to troll and derail the thread obvious

[Escef]

Sandpit, on 04 August 2014 - 11:38 PM, said:

It's quite apparent you have no desire to hold any kind of constructive discussion so just move along.

One could say the same to you.

EDIT: That is to say, no, you don't want a constructive conversation, you just want to get what you want with no compromise. Take a wild guess what the odds of that happening are. No really, tell me what you think it is. You keep talking about how much you don't like the game. Then go away. What kind of psychopath hangs out on forums of a game he hates? Oh, that would be your kind.

Edited by Escef, 04 August 2014 - 11:57 PM.

[Black Ivan]

PGI is the wrong company for an MW online game. They bit of too much then they could chew and now have to take the consequences.

Battletech needs a company who is ready to invest serious amounts of money into an online game and who understand how Classic Battletech works. That are 2 points PGI seriously lacks.