362 replies to this topic

[Brody319]

Vassago Rain, on 28 September 2014 - 08:17 AM, said:

People aren¨t gonna bring the bad mechs, no matter what silly limits you impose on them. Do you see cicadas in the world of 3x4?

People aren't going to bring bad mechs?! Are you high? You evidently haven't seen the 9 PPC dire wolf, I've seen people bring Novas, Cicadas, locusts, quick draws, commandos. You think that people won't bring bad builds you are insane

[Johnny Z]

King Arthur IV, on 26 September 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

although im opposed to 1111, (tin foil hat on) it probably wont get changed.

forcing players to play 1 of each class encourages players to own more mechs and mech bays. $CHA-CHING$

(double layered foil hat on)

They need to add a tinfoil hat smiley. Would make it alot easier wouldnt it.

[Geck0]

Hoax415, on 28 September 2014 - 06:15 AM, said:

That is not what is happening. What is happening is players are being given more choice. A "heavy mech purist" (if such a thing exists) can pilot more heavy mechs than they used to be able to. Ditto an assault purist. So EVERYBODY literally wins.

The sour grapes are that a medium pilot could use 4 mediums (or 4 lights) but in all likelyhood the medium guy will take 1 heavy or assault mech to max out his tonnage and in order to max out tonnage you probably will never take 3-4 lights.

So the sour grapes got even stupider. People in this thread are literally demanding a tonnage floor because someone might do something. We can wait and see on that. Adding restrictions for the sake of restrictions is asinine.

Unfortunately this is untrue. I know too many people who will literally just take 4 lights, or 4 meds because they can and want to. You assuming they won't is just as flawed as assuming there are no heavy/assault specialist pilots. I love my heavy mechs and my assaults, and have a grand total of 1 game played in my founder jenner years ago.

Just because I can play more heavies than a 1/1/1/1 doesn't make it ideal. Better for sure but not ideal. I'm sure we can find a better solution. But with tonnage light/med pilots are easily getting the best deal here as they don't have to compromise anything. And literally bring the mechs they want and not bring ones they don't. Let's not for a moment pretend they aren't completely benefiting from this.

That being said I still think its the best idea on the table for solo players. For group play I still maintain a shared tonnage pool is ideal. Even if you can only restrict certain group sized because of technical requirements. It literally has the best of both worlds. It imposes tonnage limits while allowing teams to stick pilots in the mechs of their choice.

For solo play I think maybe an extra slot more than the spawns you get could be useful. In this example we assume we have the same amount of spawns (4). You could increase the tonnage by 50-60 tons but require a 5th mech be chosen. This means you will have one mech that's not going to be used. Then impose a minimum tonnage limit.

The benefits of this are: A heavy/assault player can fill this with the lightest thing they can to maximize the tonnage on the 4 they will bring. Light/mediums can fill this slot with assault/heavies just in case the situation warrants it and to meet the minimum tonnage limit. And a flexible player will benefit most from this as they will have 5 mechs to choose from to best suit the situation. In this case (as you said it) everyone wins.

I think this is reasonable.

[Karamarka]

Brody319, on 28 September 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

People aren't going to bring bad mechs?! Are you high? You evidently haven't seen the 9 PPC dire wolf, I've seen people bring Novas, Cicadas, locusts, quick draws, commandos. You think that people won't bring bad builds you are insane

random matches are not worth putting in effort, community warfare will. It's like bring crap setups to matchmaker and real setups to a clan warefare battle.

[Screech]

My refined dream dropship mode.

200 tons, 6 mech limit. Will allow people to play to their preferred strengths.

[Brody319]

Screech, on 28 September 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

My refined dream dropship mode.

200 tons, 6 mech limit. Will allow people to play to their preferred strengths.

More than 4 mechs is not going to happen. They said they will be pushing the servers at 4.

[Kjudoon]

Quote

You want to get rid of a system that offers more team composition flexibility than this game has ever had because someone might try to bring 2 DWF even though that forces them to use 2 twenty tonners because you imagine that might be unfair or something.

The 1/1/1/1 system is more of the same, it means at least half the chassis in the game are incredibly sub optimal and will almost never be seen in CW.

The 4 mechs @ 240 tons system might result in seeing a 48 Vulture team or a 24 Atlas 24 Locust team. That's funny and exciting to me. I highly doubt you will see it often but let people try to build gimmick teams or interesting teams. 48 Quickdraws new meta?

Actually I have seen the 12 Jagergauss team and they just nuked EVERYTHING that showed up line of sight on a small map. I see nothing that would control this by tonnage, but do with 1/1/1/1 (as much as I'm not satisfied by that either.)

[White Bear 84]

SirLANsalot, on 25 September 2014 - 05:32 PM, said:

On another note, here is something for everyone to think on. With having multiple respawns for the enemy (as well as yourself). What is going to happen to Ballistics? What about LRM's? Ammo based mechs are going to have to think long and hard about how much ammo they want to take with them. LRMs might be in need of an ammo buff as they already suffer greatly from so many limitations.

OMGEEE.. ..players would have to actually *think*^™.

If there are bases being defended, they could use something like ammo drops or supply depots that mechs can re-arm. Albeit maybe your mech must first shut down in the bay and have a set time for each tonne to reload.

Alternatively we could do away with double armor....

[Brody319]

White Bear 84, on 28 September 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:

OMGEEE.. ..players would have to actually *think*^™.

If there are bases being defended, they could use something like ammo drops or supply depots that mechs can re-arm. Albeit maybe your mech must first shut down in the bay and have a set time for each tonne to reload.

Alternatively we could do away with double armor....

Shut down reloads sounds fine to me, but It would have to be quite a long reload time, or progressive reloads. Like 10 LRMs, 5 SRMs, 10 AC/2, 10 ac/5, 5 AC/10. and 2 AC/20, every 10 seconds you remain shut down. Or stay offline for 30-60 seconds and get a complete reload. Also it shouldn't allow you to load more ammo than you started with. If you bring 10 AC/20 shots, you will never get more than 10 via reloading.

[White Bear 84]

Brody319, on 28 September 2014 - 05:10 PM, said:

Shut down reloads sounds fine to me, but It would have to be quite a long reload time, or progressive reloads. Like 10 LRMs, 5 SRMs, 10 AC/2, 10 ac/5, 5 AC/10. and 2 AC/20, every 10 seconds you remain shut down. Or stay offline for 30-60 seconds and get a complete reload. Also it shouldn't allow you to load more ammo than you started with. If you bring 10 AC/20 shots, you will never get more than 10 via reloading.

Absolutely.

Even crazier idea, why not have an 'ammo drop' module that cost's the same as say arty... ...im sure that would have its fair share of problems...

[KraftySOT]

The worst part of this thread, is the fact that theyre still changing what seems to be a core mechanic and havent nailed that down yet.

Was kind of hoping theyd figured this out and coded it by now. Thats disappointing.

Edited by KraftySOT, 28 September 2014 - 05:37 PM.

[N0MAD]

Russ Bullock, on 26 September 2014 - 08:33 AM, said:

I admit I read very little of the entire thread - too little time in a day.



I will say this - in a perfect world we would have our groups limited to 4, 8 and 12 in CW and make each lance of a light, medium, heavy and Assault pilot with their drop ships full of those types of mechs - that way our MM can very easily put together matches.



But we know the players wouldn't like this concession they would prefer to have their groups of 5,6,7,9,10....



When you have group sizes like this it gets very difficult on the MM as seen in the public Group Queue - one group of 10 might not even fit with some of the groups of 2 based on all the heavy or assault slots being taken and it goes from there.



1 of each weight class gets past this and ensures variety.



However internally we are now discussing tonnage limits for CW and I am pushing this notion pretty strongly. It will end up providing more flexibility to players who want to perhaps take nothing but their Jenner's out for instance. But will become more restricting as you go higher, for instance nobody is going to take 4 Direwolf's - in fact if they take 2 their last two mechs are going to be pretty dang light.



But Tonnage restrictions does allow us to change it per planet if we desire.



I know players would like to push the tonnage limit up as high as possible so they can take as many of their favorite heavy mech as possible but I currently like the number of 240 tons.

So you think you can force me to play a chassis i dont want to or like playing?.
No you cant.
Im not here to play something i dont want to or enjoy playing.

[Joe Mallad]

N0MAD, on 28 September 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

So you think you can force me to play a chassis i dont want to or like playing?.
No you cant.
Im not here to play something i dont want to or enjoy playing.

what about my idea?
http://mwomercs.com/...drop-ship-mode/

[Kain Demos]

N0MAD, on 28 September 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

So you think you can force me to play a chassis i dont want to or like playing?.
No you cant.
Im not here to play something i dont want to or enjoy playing.

If you can't be effective in more than one weight class than you are a terrible player.

[Brody319]

Kain Thul, on 28 September 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

If you can't be effective in more than one weight class than you are a terrible player.

which is funny, because making a tonnage limit forces Me as a heavy fan to play lighter mechs, while the light players can bring any mech they want. Where as if we said have a 150 tonnage minimum, they would have to learn to be effective in at least a medium or heavy.

[Joe Mallad]

Kain Thul, on 28 September 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

If you can't be effective in more than one weight class than you are a terrible player.

no your not! Thats like telling someone who is a fighter pilot that they also have to be just as effective as a bomber pilot lol.

Some just take better to moving fast and doing the light mech thing. While others take better to being a heavy brawler. Sure, some can and will do it all. But to tell someone if they cant be effective in more than one weight class, they are a terrible player... thats just not the case in this game. I have guys in my unit that only play lights and can take down a heavy or assault just as well as anyone else. ****, id much rather have the exceptional light Ace pilot as my lance mate than a pilot that is ONLY effective in all weight classes lol.

Edited by Yoseful Mallad, 28 September 2014 - 06:01 PM.

[Iyica de Tylmarande]

On ammo/energy loadouts. I thought the attacking side had to breach a wall or something to win the right to reinforce. If so than ballistic heavy mechs would be strategically ideal as the first drops.

[Kain Demos]

Yoseful Mallad, on 28 September 2014 - 06:00 PM, said:

no your not! Thats like telling someone who is a fighter pilot that they also have to be just as effective as a bomber pilot lol.

Some just take better to moving fast and doing the light mech thing. While others take better to being a heavy brawler. Sure, some can and will do it all. But to tell someone if they cant be effective in more than one weight class, they are a terrible player... thats just not the case in this game. I have guys in my unit that only play lights and can take down a heavy or assault just as well as anyone else. ****, id much rather have the exceptional light Ace pilot as my lance mate than a pilot that is ONLY effective in all weight classes lol.

Notice I said "effective", not "just as good" or "elite" in all classes.

Naturally if someoen is best in an assault then light would be their worst....but how could heavy be your best class but then you couldn't even contribute in a medium or assault?

[Brody319]

Yoseful Mallad, on 28 September 2014 - 06:00 PM, said:

no your not! Thats like telling someone who is a fighter pilot that they also have to be just as effective as a bomber pilot lol.

Some just take better to moving fast and doing the light mech thing. While others take better to being a heavy brawler. Sure, some can and will do it all. But to tell someone if they cant be effective in more than one weight class, they are a terrible player... thats just not the case in this game. I have guys in my unit that only play lights and can take down a heavy or assault just as well as anyone else. ****, id much rather have the exceptional light Ace pilot as my lance mate than a pilot that is ONLY effective in all weight classes lol.

Yes, so why force heavy and assault players to play some mechs they don't like?

[N0MAD]

Kain Thul, on 28 September 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

If you can't be effective in more than one weight class than you are a terrible player.

I dont care what you perceive as a good player.
I dont want or like, i repeat i dont want or like playing certain classes, and i wont.