647 replies to this topic

[Macksheen]

I hope it isn't too late to suggest, but when doing quirks with specific weapons in mind, try and make the quirk applicable to others if possible but non-optimal.

As an example, a buff to ballistic range by 25 or 50 meters isn't much of a gain for AC2, but is for a 20 without being an AC20 only quirk. A heat reduction buff on ballistics won't help the gauss or AC5 much, but would be huge on the AC2 ... without being an AC2 only quirk. I realize that this may not always be possible, but if you can that would promote both the referential load out and leave room for creativity and variety.

For instance ...

• on the HBK-4G, could the AC20 range be replaced by a 50m range increase on ballistics? It will add *something* to the others without only applying to the AC20.
  
• on the AWS-8Q, can the PPC cooldown be a general energy weapon cooldown? You'd still likely mount PPCs (and dear god I hope those buffs also work for ERPPCs) but someone who did mount LPLs or ERLLs would get something.

I'd also strongly advise against pigeon-holing some of the hero mechs. Few people I know run the lowly Grid Iron with the Gauss, because that thing in a torso as easy to hit as an HBK is a liability. Unless you're going to make it so it doesn't explode in a HBK, please don't make it so the only smart Grid Iron is the gauss - otherwise I think your quirks will not move mechs like that forward as well. I mention heros specifically, because people have paid $ for them, and will be more crankified if they are (essentially) forced to run configs they dislike.

Edited by Macksheen, 16 October 2014 - 06:59 PM.

[Evogenesis]

After seeing the quirks for the AWS8Q I'm really worried about my Awesome 9M now. I run it as a pulse boat both med and large pulse lasers. If they take away the general energy heat reduction quirks and make it all about a PPC boat I'm going to have to throw it away in the trash bin.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

A question about PPC quirks: do they apply to both standard and ER versions? They should. The same question applies to Medium Laser quirks: just standards, or Pulse as well?

[FupDup]

Are the example cooldown quirks in the Command Chair a typo? Right now they say +X% cooldown, which means that the afflicted weapons will fire slower rather than faster. I.e. a nerf. Cooldown changes should use a negative sign (-) to indicate a buff.

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 16 October 2014 - 07:04 PM, said:

Are the example cooldown quirks in the Command Chair a typo? Right now they say +X% cooldown, which means that the afflicted weapons will fire slower rather than faster. I.e. a nerf. Cooldown changes should use a negative sign (-) to indicate a buff.

Fast Fire said:

Please fix my description. Thanks.

[YueFei]

HBK's are supposed to be city fighters, strike and fade. I would've preferred faster turning and acceleration / deceleration. Better maneuverability for the HBK line.

It takes almost 3 seconds to turn 180 degrees in a HBK. =/

[Walluh]

Keep in mind these are BUFFS, people. If your build worked on the chassis beforehand, surprise, it's going to work exactly the same, and potentially better, depending on the quirks. All these do is make it more beneficial to stay in the spirit of the variant. Whatever build works for you now, will still work.

[Macksheen]

Walluh, on 16 October 2014 - 07:47 PM, said:

Keep in mind these are BUFFS, people. If your build worked on the chassis beforehand, surprise, it's going to work exactly the same, and potentially better, depending on the quirks. All these do is make it more beneficial to stay in the spirit of the variant. Whatever build works for you now, will still work.

Yes and no. As much as this is a game, we are at least partially competing against each other. This will move some build combos up the curve and, by doing so, move others down the curve even though there may be no "changes" in the way of direct nerfs to the existing build.

Just an example....

My LPL AWS-8Q may work the same as it does today, but now that guy with the PPCs may tear me apart because his works *better* due to the quirks being all PPC specific. Mine may look the same, but it does not perform as well as the PPC version - so while "unchanged" since everything else moved forward, it would be lower on the curve.

[Felio]

I am relieved that they will be more impactful than the clan omnipod quirks.

[JayKay17]

I really welcome the quirk system, it´is a fine way to make not so good chassis competitive.
Now reading the numbers I think, whoa, 25% buff, thats a lot. Am I the only one, who thinks that this coulld be a bit too much.
I fear that after a few days with the new quirks in game, ther e will be the next hot fix, nerfing the buffs back, cause they are way over the target. May I suggest to half this numbers and see what impact it has on the game and then carefully increase, when it was not enough ?
One other thing, a buff of 25% for Tier 5 and 20% for Tier 4 and so on, is actually a 5% buff per Tier. So does this result in a 5% buff for Tier 1 ? I thought Tier 1 will get no quirk, if this would be right shouldn't get tier 5 only 20% buff.

[ExAstris]

JayKay17, on 16 October 2014 - 10:19 PM, said:

Now reading the numbers I think, whoa, 25% buff, thats a lot. Am I the only one, who thinks that this coulld be a bit too much.

25% buffs are only for the tier 5 mechs, and I doubt we'll have too many cases of it being too much. Take that 8Q for example, even with a free 33% more dps added to its ppc builds, will it really be competing with DDCs and Whales? No. The 8Q would need something like 50% or so to be thoroughly competitive (energy only on heavy+ is bad news, heat caps your dps real quick). For the 8Q at least, 33% will not even get close to making it overpowered, it will just save it from being so hilariously bad that you curse your teammates who bring one.

Without seeing the buffs for each individual mech, I can't say none will get too much, but given that most of their tier list seemed to be within about a tier of where I'd put stuff, I don't imagine anything will get too far out of line unless they do something stupid like give the Jagermechs u/ac5 damage and rof buffs.

And even if there is some mech that's OP for a while, it'll be worth it to pull the dozens of other ones out of the trash bins (hopefully, permanently).

[Karl Marlow]

xWiredx, on 02 October 2014 - 10:10 AM, said:

My feedback (sorry, a little late)

Fall damage: I feel like the amount of fall damage could probably be scaled back a bit. Surely when a 100 ton war machine is designed, they take shock absorbance of that level into account.

They did. They are called Knees

[Kirtanus]

Please do not touch velocity and speed of balistics and ppc. IT will make much harder use them on different mechs. Other quirks looks interesting to test on my own on the 4th of november.

[Ens]

Interesting Quirks!!!
It´ll bring the meta guys to tears xD

as for velocity and speed:
deal with it!! yes it will make it harder to use on different mechs....but you will get better in the end.

[Tezcatli]

I was wondering. Are those the only kind of quirks? So far it's just primary weapon, survival, and general weapon quirks. But are there like acceleration quirk, terrain quirk, JJ quirks?
Any other unique quirks?

[van Uber]

Macksheen, on 16 October 2014 - 06:57 PM, said:

I hope it isn't too late to suggest, but when doing quirks with specific weapons in mind, try and make the quirk applicable to others if possible but non-optimal.

I disagree. I love that the quirks ar so specific, they add flavour that is desperatly missing from the chassis. It not only makes lowly mechs viable again, they also give me a reason to bring out the HBK-4G instead the 4H *and* vice versa.

If quirks were more general (albeit non-optimal) they would give less incentive to use different chassis.

[Kamies]

Gooooddammit that "+25% cooldown" bothers me way more than it should!

FIX IT!

Edited by Kamies, 17 October 2014 - 12:51 AM.

[BladeXXL]

OMG ... it makes no sense that Mech Quirks affect weapons that way!!! WHY?
It would be Ok if you say Awesome has more heat dissipation or can fire 3 PPC without heat penalty, but why the hell PPC should have a higher velocity? It depends on physics NOT on the Mech!
Just another lump in the clear red line of BT rules! Another "wrong" way to balance the game.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Weapon-specific quirks are BLEGH.

You're going to kill any variety in loadouts for each variant. You'd be crazy to run an HBK-4G without an AC20, and you'd be stupid to run an 8Q without PPCs. BAD.

General ballistic/missile/energy quirks would be far better.

[Karl Streiger]

Kaeb Odellas, on 17 October 2014 - 01:17 AM, said:

Weapon-specific quirks are BLEGH.

You're going to kill any variety in loadouts for each variant. You'd be crazy to run an HBK-4G without an AC20, and you'd be stupid to run an 8Q without PPCs. BAD.

General ballistic/missile/energy quirks would be far better.

Nope
if you have a generalistic buff for all ballistic weapons on each hunchback - for example 25% for the 4G and 20% for the 4H - i would run all the time the 4H - because the additional energy slots are worth the missing 5%

Its a nice system to achieve what those "we need hardpoint sizes" fraction wanted to have -without forcing it.
You think you are smooth with 2 Ultra 5 Autocannons in your 4G - you don't have to change it - but you don't get a bonus.

Its ok