637 replies to this topic

[AlmightyAeng]

So, if they nerf LRM's...what incentive do people have to take TAG and NARC again other than farming their reward system?

[Karl Streiger]

still the same problems as ever.

had used indirect LRMs in TT - in 3025 they suck - bad.... in 3050 indirect LRM in TT still bad - because they can't use TAG

What makes them great are two inventions - called Semi Guided LRMs (blame the cappelans, and the C3i - blame the WoBs)
and you know what happens when you match 3 LRM carriers with semi guided missiles and LRM 20 to a TAG spotter....
180 LRM in a salvo - melting armor on most targets. But for the most cases you need a trooper to make the kill count... for example with a Gauss or PPC.

Ok and you don't have the misses. Lets say 50% chance to hit - you may need 400 to 500 missiles to kill a medium Mech dead, kill a heavy and cripple an assault. For semi guided LRMs and LOS

Without semi guided narc capable LRMs... it should be near 600-800

the LRM is a weapon for Support - not Killing - LRMs have to sandpaper the target - and your gauss that punch through
LRMs felt very good with 0.7 dmg short after the "working" introduction of the splash damage - light damage but in combination with a Gauss on Atlas and Highlander it did work great

[Syrkres]

It's funny in competitive play you rarely see LRM builds.

Because players usually don't run out in the open, thus lack of ability to use.

A Single LRM boat is not bad (in pugs or small groups). It's when you get 3+ LRM boats, and all of a sudden it's rain from {lower planes}.

So individually they are not bad, or even 2 LRM boats, but it's when they all stack, and the rain is non-stop until you die, which is quick in most cases. That is where the problem lies.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Blakkstar, on 28 October 2014 - 05:15 AM, said:

Actually, yes. TT rules have a missile hits table based on a die roll which causes missiles to hit in general around 75% power. That's what keeps missiles from being OP.

Spotting for indirect LRM fire should also be significantly harder, like requiring the spotter to maintain a hard lock as if firing streak SRMs until the LRMs hit.

And in TT, do you then have to sit there and roll hit location for each individual missile that hits?

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 28 October 2014 - 05:18 AM, said:

Mechwarrior without TT = not Mechwarrior. I was directing you to a game like that.

SW with out the Saturn 5 = not star wars - Star trek = 1966 which planted the seed of imagination.

(just so you know the S5 and ST happened in 1966, which one planted the seed for space exploration as we as a society see it today?)

[PhoenixFire55]

Kilo 40, on 28 October 2014 - 05:11 AM, said:

*facepalm*

turn left or right 90 degrees, then back up. viola, no "chasing" LRMs.

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 28 October 2014 - 05:12 AM, said:

learn to play please. Cover 100% stops LRMs as does powering down when behind cover

I run neither AMS not ECM.

I play only assault/heavy. Why am I not being routinely melted by LRMs?

So when did Forest Colony hills got high enough to stop LRMs? Or most River and Frozen City buildings? Sure I can power down and LRMs will home into the last known position i.e. exactly where I powered down. Sure I can turn left or right 90 degrees except that left is that same said cover (i.e. a wall in front of me) and right is too far from cover and in the open again.

Most of cover we have on all maps is either too low or not wide enough to affect LRMs with their current flight patterns as long as opposing LRM launchers aren't standing in nearly exact same spot. If two LRM mechs are at least 200m away from each other then at least one of them will always be able to rain on you even when you are standing behind cover. There are always exceptions and places that do provide solid cover, but they are either scarce or are in places where nobody fights in the first place.

[Bigbacon]

Syrkres, on 28 October 2014 - 05:20 AM, said:

It's funny in competitive play you rarely see LRM builds.

Because players usually don't run out in the open, thus lack of ability to use.

A Single LRM boat is not bad (in pugs or small groups). It's when you get 3+ LRM boats, and all of a sudden it's rain from {lower planes}.

So individually they are not bad, or even 2 LRM boats, but it's when they all stack, and the rain is non-stop until you die, which is quick in most cases. That is where the problem lies.

same could be said for the high pin point stuff then as well. a singledual gauss isn't bad, get 2 or 3 and boom.

I fear a UAC boated anything before LRMs and LRMs have counters, high pin points don't unless out of LOS

[StalaggtIKE]

Quxudica, on 27 October 2014 - 11:26 PM, said:

Snark aside, Repair and Rearm did absolutely nothing to fix anything in the game, it only made it worse. The only change ammo based builds like LRM users made was adding a few additional tons of ammo so the free Rearm circumvented their need to ever pay it.

One little problem and the whole system is a bust? Couldn't free Rearm just be removed!?

Did I just blow your mind?

[Kjudoon]

Joseph Mallan, on 28 October 2014 - 04:14 AM, said:

Actually no, I was commenting on you saying only BADs use LRMs. I am not a Bad so to speak, and used LRMs due to system limitations. They allow folks with low end systems to have a chance at playing the game. The players in question could be a great player but low end equipment does have an affect on in game performance.

Ooh ooh! right here!! OOH!

But in a couple of weeks that'll change.... muhuhahahahahaaaaaa!!!!!

[PhoenixFire55]

Syrkres, on 28 October 2014 - 05:20 AM, said:

It's funny in competitive play you rarely see LRM builds.

Because players usually don't run out in the open, thus lack of ability to use.

Actually, no. They run in the open all the time if they need. Only difference is that when somebody runs into the open first he knows that there are 11 more running into the open right behind him.

[Kjudoon]

StalaggtIKE, on 28 October 2014 - 05:26 AM, said:

One little problem and the whole system is a bust? Couldn't free Rearm just be removed!?

Did I just blow your mind?

Price accordingly and you should have no problems. If we were doing campaign rules for MWO, you could bid on contracts and actually be very profitable, or mess up and lose money on the deal. Happens to mercs all the time. That said, being part of a house, you're like a soldier in the US military. You go where they say you go, but all your gear is taken care of. You don't get paid like a merc, but the benefits and extras are far better.

The choice would be up to you.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 28 October 2014 - 05:18 AM, said:

Mechwarrior without TT = not Mechwarrior. I was directing you to a game like that.

The reason I am here is because of TT. I do not play other Mecha games cause I do not have the history of enjoyment. If my being here can help this game flourish, it can bring more notice to TT and keep a flow of players going there as well. So I will be helping both games by promoting the IP.

[Kilo 40]

PhoenixFire55, on 28 October 2014 - 05:24 AM, said:

So when did Forest Colony hills got high enough to stop LRMs? Or most River and Frozen City buildings?

since forever.

Quote

Sure I can turn left or right 90 degrees except that left is that same said cover (i.e. a wall in front of me) and right is too far from cover and in the open again.

you have to move like the length of you mech, at most.

Quote

Most of cover we have on all maps is either too low or not wide enough to affect LRMs with their current flight patterns as long as opposing LRM launchers aren't standing in nearly exact same spot.

you're a founder, who's been playing this game for how long?

unbelievable...

[StalaggtIKE]

Kjudoon, on 28 October 2014 - 05:29 AM, said:

Price accordingly and you should have no problems. If we were doing campaign rules for MWO, you could bid on contracts and actually be very profitable, or mess up and lose money on the deal. Happens to mercs all the time. That said, being part of a house, you're like a soldier in the US military. You go where they say you go, but all your gear is taken care of. You don't get paid like a merc, but the benefits and extras are far better.

The choice would be up to you.

Ideally this is how CW should work.

[Widowmaker1981]

Kilo 40, on 28 October 2014 - 05:31 AM, said:

since forever.



you have to move like the length of you mech, at most.



you're a founder, who's been playing this game for how long?

unbelievable...

no no, you don't get it. Even though LRMs are the most easily avoided weapon in the game, it shouldn't EVER be possible to do damage with them because they require NoSkill, because as we all know, the ONLY skill that matters is the ability to click on the correct pixel quickly







(and yes, i accept that aiming correctly and fast does in fact require skill, its just not the ONLY skill)

[DarthPeanut]

As I said before recently...

I understand LRMs have to have a place in the game, although I have no use for them anymore and do not like them.

The problem is in the targeting mechanics IMO and the subsequent play style it promotes.

[Karl Streiger]

Kilo 40, on 28 October 2014 - 05:31 AM, said:

since forever.

Should i kill the guy be the first in the few spots where you are secure of fire?

Maps are to crowded with 12 mens - heck sometimes i eat missiles that were not aimed at me at all.

Its complete stupid to say people should learn to use cover - when 6 out of 12 go for cover and the other 6 charge you can kill your self in the same moment - not so painfull

[Kilo 40]

Karl Streiger, on 28 October 2014 - 05:35 AM, said:

Should i kill the guy be the first in the few spots where you are secure of fire?

Maps are to crowded with 12 mens - heck sometimes i eat missiles that were not aimed at me at all.

Its complete stupid to say people should learn to use cover - when 6 out of 12 go for cover and the other 6 charge you can kill your self in the same moment - not so painfull

hilarious. excuse after excuse after excuse.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The whining about LRMs won't stop until there is an LRM Invulnerability module.

[Kjudoon]

Joseph Mallan, on 28 October 2014 - 04:50 AM, said:

Oh I like this!
on TT it would be called "Attacking the Hex"

Three words why this is a bad idea (though I'd abuse the crap out of it): Artilllery Head Shot.

[Moonlander]

Plenty of opinions out there. The only issue I see with LRMs is the LRM boats ability to never need LoS and the huge influx of TAG/NARC being used lately. I've said it 100 times before but ever since the new rewards system, they are out of control and I rarely had an issue with them before. If you've ever seen an LRM post pre-rewards 2.0, I've always disagreed with the LRM issues people had and used the generic "find cover" or "ams" comments in those threads. But, when you 2-5 people per team using TAG/NARC it's virtually impossible to survive once you've been spotted since have the teams have mulitple LRM boats and anyone else with a missile hardpoint has LRMs. It's tempting for me even, but LRMs aren't fun to use.

If you take out the TAG and NARC rewards then LRMs would return back to normal. No one would use it and people would go back to calling LRM boats all kinds of pejoratives. Before rewards 2.0 you were a "scrub, ******, ****** noob" (fill in the blanks) for using LRMs. After rewards, "kk I have TAG/Narc for you bbgirl <3"

In conclusion, LRMs as a weapons system are fine. It's just the huge influx of TAG and NARC users after Rewards 2.0!

Edited by Moonlander, 28 October 2014 - 05:44 AM.