332 replies to this topic

[Russ Bullock]

Navid A1, on 30 October 2014 - 01:15 PM, said:

So a person investing 1.5 tons in bap gets 360m counter ecm, while a person investing 3 tons in both gets nothing?

Remember the other things that BAP does - detecting shut down mechs, decrease target info gathering, Increase sensor range on top of the ECM countering

[Connaugh]

Russ Bullock, on 30 October 2014 - 12:58 PM, said:

[color=#00FFFF]"Are you saying that you are changing BAP to counter ECM when your mech also equips ECM? As of right now if both BAP and ECM are equipped you must set ECM to counter as the BAP functionality is disabled."[/color]

[color=#00FFFF]Yes you are correct and it will stay this way. I was wrong.[/color]

Then I have to say, although having BAP equipped could make fighting ECM mechs a lot easier, especially regarding a "close range" fight with lock on weapons (and I am the one in the ECM/BAP mech, so actually i dont like it really ), your attempt, to make it worth its 1.5 (or less) tons should be regardless of a possibly equipped ECM (even if this would cause new questions regarding ecm-counter-mode).
With this you are reducing the effectiveness of ECM itself but you also do not give an ECM carrier the complete advantage of its other equipment (which was fine until now, as the BAP counter bonus was less than the ECM counter bonus).

Playing mostly lights, in the recent past mostly ecm/bap-kfx (whose cover is pretty essential even in a brawl to protect the close-by team from heavy rain) I think let's see the outcome of the change, but seriously consider passing the full advantage to all players.

[Russ Bullock]

WarHippy, on 30 October 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

I agree with your reasoning, however I think changing it to 320m instead of 360m would be a better starting point for this change. 360m is probably a bit much.

We will be ready to adjust if this proves true

[vortmax]

Cimarb, on 30 October 2014 - 01:37 PM, said:

While I agree that his tone is extremely childish, he does have a point that ECM needs a big change. If you cannot equip it on every mech, like every other piece of equipment in the game, then it is too powerful.

ECM should work more like it does in tabletop - negating the benefits of advanced targeting equipment like Nicolas stated, see http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ecm - and what we have now is actually a combination of the experimental ECM (Angel ECM) and Stealth Armor like the Null Signature System (http://www.sarna.net...i/Stealth_Armor, which takes up 12 crit slots and builds ten heat while active, btw). Note that, even then, none of those systems actually blocks missile getting a lock - they just given a penalty to hit, which equates in MWO as a delay on lock time.

I'm in general agreement on the need for ECM changes, but still believe it should be limited to select mechs.

ECM did not prevent targeting at long (read outside ECM bubble) on TT. I could accept it preventing missile locks outside the bubble, but not preventing direct fire or detection. Perhaps the effects should be inverted: give the "flicker" detection outside the bubble (complete with very slow LRM lock), and no target information relay when attacker is inside the bubble.

As for the laser/PPC changes, I approve. But, again being a TT purist, I still think ISML should have 3 heat, not 4.

And to the clan folks still complaining about heat: Deal with it. Seriously, look at that Large Pulse! I doubt any clanner is going to pack an ERML when they have that extremely sweet LPL. 13 damage for 10 heat with a buff to burn and range? Gads....

[NocturnalBeast]

Hawk819, on 30 October 2014 - 01:31 PM, said:

Here comes Grayson Death and Lori Carlyle. Haven't had a tandem `Mech group since the Twin Dragon's were released. Awesome!

So we would probably get Shadowhawk and Locust heroes if that is the case. The Shadowhawk is already a strong mech I don't know how they can improve it. A hero locust might be good (if you like lights).

[Russ Bullock]

Geck0, on 30 October 2014 - 01:30 PM, said:

The recent JJ boost and now the PPC buff leave me very concerned the Poptart meta will return and I will once again not play the game for almost a year.

I am not saying the sky is falling, but it made the game unplayable for me.

Yes each time we make changes in these areas we get nervous as well - we want to boost certain things but do not want full pop tarting meta returning

[NocturnalBeast]

Actually Grayson was piloting his captured Marauder in 3049..... :-)

[PappySmurf]

Russ one of the big problems with ECM is It is countered with the R button and multiple players gaining the targeting advantage and spamming LRM'S why not make mech targeting indavidule on each mech unless a player in a battle has a command module like a Atlas-DDC which can link the targeting signal to all mechs in the battle group.

If the command mech dies in a battle the remaining team must individually use LOS to get a target lock this way ECM works like it should for each indavidule mech it is equipped on the same with bap.

Edited by PappySmurf, 30 October 2014 - 01:58 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

All of the DPS values on this chart are wrong. Because lasers don't deal max damage instantaneously, you have to sum beam duration with weapon cool-down and divide the damage by that result to get actual DPS.

So, here are the fixed DPS values:

Inner Shere
Small = 1
Small pulse = 1.45

Medium = 1.28
Medium Pulse = 1.67

Large = 2.12
Large Pulse = 2.81

Clan
Small = 1.54
Small Pulse = 2.00

Medium = 1.69
Medium Pulse = 2.08

Large = 2.32
Large Pulse = 2.97

[Kaeb Odellas]

Yeonne Greene, on 30 October 2014 - 02:06 PM, said:

All of the DPS values on this chart are wrong. Because lasers don't deal max damage instantaneously, you have to sum beam duration with weapon cool-down and divide the damage by that result to get actual DPS.

So, here are the fixed DPS values:

Inner Shere
Small = 1
Small pulse = 1.45

Medium = 1.28
Medium Pulse = 1.67

Large = 2.12
Large Pulse = 2.81

Clan
Small = 1.54
Small Pulse = 2.00

Medium = 1.69
Medium Pulse = 2.08

Large = 2.32
Large Pulse = 2.97

This.

Also, I think your "default" range numbers for the small and small pulse lasers are off as well. IS SLs and SPLs are both at 100m right now, while the clan versions are both at 150m.

[Summon3r]

were Grayson and Lori ever married?

[EarlGrey83]

Oh god, those changes. LLaser with shorter duration? PLaser with value per ton?

My Warhawk says thank you.

[Jonathan Paine]

Voting with my wallet:
Quirks, laser adjustments and taking feedback from community into account:
Bought IS package!

When the Swamp map is online:
1 month of premium time.

Overall: generally happy about the direction the game is heading in! Thanks!

[Felbombling]

When did Grayson Carlyle upgrade to the Victor? We could be looking at a Victor / Shadow Hawk combo with Lori in the Shadow Hawk.

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

Yes, Grayson and Lori were married.
- Together they both Piloted a Locust as well as a Shadow Hawk, so the matched pair could be seen in either, depending on the year.

After Grayson died Lori assumed command of his unit.

9erRed

[Navid A1]

Russ Bullock, on 30 October 2014 - 01:49 PM, said:

Remember the other things that BAP does - detecting shut down mechs, decrease target info gathering, Increase sensor range on top of the ECM countering

Yes. I was referring to 360m counter ecm capability. Which the person gets with a 1.5ton piece of equipment. And looses when he has another piece of equipment. To describe it simple, the mech having both should get 360m counter ecm when he switches his ecm to counter or off.!
Is it a programming barrier?

[Jetfire]

Yeonne Greene, on 30 October 2014 - 02:06 PM, said:

All of the DPS values on this chart are wrong. Because lasers don't deal max damage instantaneously, you have to sum beam duration with weapon cool-down and divide the damage by that result to get actual DPS.

So, here are the fixed DPS values:

Inner Shere
Small = 1
Small pulse = 1.45

Medium = 1.28
Medium Pulse = 1.67

Large = 2.12
Large Pulse = 2.81

Clan
Small = 1.54
Small Pulse = 2.00

Medium = 1.69
Medium Pulse = 2.08

Large = 2.32
Large Pulse = 2.97

Only in a certain sense such as an extended brawl in the open is this really relevant though. In many case the more relevant interest is the ability to front load or simply load damage onto the target quickly. In that sense the CD is irrelevant as I will be back behind cover waiting for recharge. This is not WoW where you just stand in the open and trade volley's, that's largely a horrible strategy unless you have picked your brawl carefully.

I would argue in most cases more relevant is the DMG/Duration for an Instantaneous DPS and Dmg/(duration+CD) for a Sustained DPS. The DMG/CD number doesn't mean much at all to me though, I agree.

Edited by Jetfire, 30 October 2014 - 02:56 PM.

[Bartholomew bartholomew]

How about some pics of the swamp map. Miss the videos you guys used to do.

[Cattra Kell]

Summon3r, on 30 October 2014 - 02:10 PM, said:

were Grayson and Lori ever married?

Yes. He married Lori.

[That Guy]

i like those things that i see. but, with a new map focused on vegetation and trees and such, i do hope to see in the near future trees becoming destructible objects that do something like block LOS/sensors, or slow mechs down as they move through them. something. having actual trees would completely change the way many maps are played.

also please consider adding in various sensor quirks. and things like built in 360 sensors/seismic, variable ranges and powers, some sort of stealth/detectability rating and other such tweaks to current standardized sensor system. in addition to things that you mentioned way back like multi tracking.
and when doing movement and mech quirks, dont be afraid of negative quirks! those make a mech more unique than a positive quirk