20517 replies to this topic

[Metus regem]

Ghostrider0067, on 14 March 2017 - 12:42 PM, said:

I am interested in the ultra version though and wonder how much more effective it could be. Same goes for the LBX20.

The LB-20 will be hot garbage if they do not reduce the Crit slots on it..

AC/20:
14t
10 crits
7 heat

LB-20X
14t
11 crtis (10% more crit space than a normal AC/20 or UAC/20)
6 heat

UAC/20
15t
10 crits
7 heat/shot

Now in TT the extra crit space on the LB-20 is kind of justified thanks to dual ammo types, but in MWO it is going to be hot garbage unless they reduce the crit slots to 9 or 10.... Even at 10 crit slots, it's still hot garbage compared to the AC/20 or UAC/20....

Zergling, on 14 March 2017 - 12:45 PM, said:

I suspect the IS UAC10/20 will fire in bursts of 5 damage shells, which will result in the regular AC10 and 20 retaining some niche role despite their 1 ton lower weight.

As for the HGR, we don't know how it is going to be. It might not have damage drop off like the TT version.

If they go the burst route for the IS UAC/s, I'd like to see 2 rounds for the UAC/10&20, but I'd take a 4 shell UAC/20 in a pinch.

[Ghostrider0067]

They need to either reduce the weight or the crit slots to make the LBX worth considering in my book as at present, there is no sense in me swapping out a perfectly effective platform. Perhaps keep the weight the same but have one fewer critical slot? I could work with that.

The ultra is.... just not really for me. Perhaps in just the right scenario or build but not in general. I would much rather have that 20 PPFD followed by a delayed repeat shot of the same instead of 20 followed by a potentially fatal jam.

[Metus regem]

Ghostrider0067, on 14 March 2017 - 12:54 PM, said:

They need to either reduce the weight or the crit slots to make the LBX worth considering in my book as at present, there is no sense in me swapping out a perfectly effective platform. Perhaps keep the weight the same but have one fewer critical slot? I could work with that.

The ultra is.... just not really for me. Perhaps in just the right scenario or build but not in general. I would much rather have that 20 PPFD followed by a delayed repeat shot of the same instead of 20 followed by a potentially fatal jam.

I'd take the option for up to 40 damage in a short double tap for only 1 more ton over the normal AC/20....

[Ghostrider0067]

Metus regem, on 14 March 2017 - 01:04 PM, said:

I'd take the option for up to 40 damage in a short double tap for only 1 more ton over the normal AC/20....

I get that... but if the jam chance is increased over what it is currently? Would you still take that chance? I've got great quirks on my 'phract 2X in addition to having it mastered and also having the cool down module. It fires plenty fast for me and with no jams. Granted, that's not the situation with most folks but I'm sure you understand my point.

[Metus regem]

Ghostrider0067, on 14 March 2017 - 01:23 PM, said:

I get that... but if the jam chance is increased over what it is currently? Would you still take that chance? I've got great quirks on my 'phract 2X in addition to having it mastered and also having the cool down module. It fires plenty fast for me and with no jams. Granted, that's not the situation with most folks but I'm sure you understand my point.

Oh I get your point, but on something like my Len Yo Wang, the ability to fire my main weapon out to a greater distance as well as potentially double that damage is appealing for only a minor weight increase... Hell I'd make it work on a Bushwacker...

Now here's something to really bake your noodle...

Hunchback 4G

250 LFE
Endo
Light FF (some armour stripping required)
Targeting computer
UAC/20 with 2-3t of ammo
2x ERML

That's one mean little street fighter.....

[Pariah Devalis]

No HAG but yes to micro lasers. Interesting.

Also, that ATM description? Nailed it.

[TheArisen]

I really hope the heavy ppc does all it's 15 DMG up front. Otherwise it won't be worth the heat, weight and slots

[Zergling]

TheArisen, on 14 March 2017 - 03:28 PM, said:

I really hope the heavy ppc does all it's 15 DMG up front. Otherwise it won't be worth the heat, weight and slots

Yeah, Heavy PPC needs pinpoint 15 damage to be worth it. It just wouldn't be worth spending the 3 tons, 1 slot and 5 extra heat over the regular PPC otherwise.

[TheArisen]

Zergling, on 14 March 2017 - 03:48 PM, said:

Yeah, Heavy PPC needs pinpoint 15 damage to be worth it. It just wouldn't be worth spending the 3 tons, 1 slot and 5 extra heat over the regular PPC otherwise.

If it does that could be the one saving grace for the Uziel. A dual hvy ppc poptart

[Sereglach]

The mech packs are interesting. A complete deviation from the roadmap and also apparently a "change of pace" from single mech packs. All of these mechs are bought separately. How is that a big change other than more are offered at once? That's not really a change, and it's not really going back to the old "big pack" system, either. Is their plan to only do quarterly mech announcements, or are they just so inundated with artists that they can crank out new mechs at obscene rates compared to all other content? It honestly makes little sense to me in the grand scheme of things.

In regards to the new tech, Stealth Armor being included tells me that either the old InfoTech ECM change will be coming live, or -unlike ECM alone- Stealth Armor will have no "inside the bubble" effects and it'll be impossible to lock onto such a mech at all. The second option might make ECM lights more viable for scouting mode, since it'd be a hard counter to streaks, but really fixing ECM should be a part of stealth armor implementation. It makes me wish Bloodhound and Angel ECM were being introduced to fully flesh out the proper Electronic Warfare suites and all of their TT interactions as they're supposed to be.

A lot of the other new tech is nice, but I think they could have included a lot of other stuff in there. Seems like a bit of a missed opportunity. However, I suppose if one wave of advanced tech is successful then we'll probably see more weapons making their way out in the future, which is a nice upside to it. On the other hand, I'm really disappointed that there's no Plasma Rifle/Cannon, ER/Heavy Flamers, Magshot, AP Gauss, Mech Rifles, or Light AC's. Oh well, at least we're getting Laser AMS (now if only there were in-game rewards for providing a nice 3 AMS bubble for a team).

[TheArisen]

Sereglach, on 14 March 2017 - 04:01 PM, said:

The mech packs are interesting. A complete deviation from the roadmap and also apparently a "change of pace" from single mech packs. All of these mechs are bought separately. How is that a big change other than more are offered at once? That's not really a change, and it's not really going back to the old "big pack" system, either. Is their plan to only do quarterly mech announcements, or are they just so inundated with artists that they can crank out new mechs at obscene rates compared to all other content? It honestly makes little sense to me in the grand scheme of things.

In regards to the new tech, Stealth Armor being included tells me that either the old InfoTech ECM change will be coming live, or -unlike ECM alone- Stealth Armor will have no "inside the bubble" effects and it'll be impossible to lock onto such a mech at all. The second option might make ECM lights more viable for scouting mode, since it'd be a hard counter to streaks, but really fixing ECM should be a part of stealth armor implementation. It makes me wish Bloodhound and Angel ECM were being introduced to fully flesh out the proper Electronic Warfare suites and all of their TT interactions as they're supposed to be.

A lot of the other new tech is nice, but I think they could have included a lot of other stuff in there. Seems like a bit of a missed opportunity. However, I suppose if one wave of advanced tech is successful then we'll probably see more weapons making their way out in the future, which is a nice upside to it. On the other hand, I'm really disappointed that there's no Plasma Rifle/Cannon, ER/Heavy Flamers, Magshot, AP Gauss, Mech Rifles, or Light AC's. Oh well, at least we're getting Laser AMS (now if only there were in-game rewards for providing a nice 3 AMS bubble for a team).

One of the biggest issues with the old big pack system was you had to go A la carte or buy the full pack which really stank cuz the carte option was a terrible deal.

[Sereglach]

TheArisen, on 14 March 2017 - 04:08 PM, said:

One of the biggest issues with the old big pack system was you had to go A la carte or buy the full pack which really stank cuz the carte option was a terrible deal.

I realize that but to me the difference between the single mech system and this current release aren't really any different, unless they somehow now have the ability to crank out obscene amounts of mechs in an incredibly short timeframe. Otherwise you're really only talking 1 mech pack per quarter or so to release larger batches of chassis in bulk instead of 1 new chassis a month. I suppose the real answer will come in when the next pack of new chassis is announced and PGI establishes a new pattern.

[Pariah Devalis]

Nobody actually posted any pictures of the new ones here, yet. Odd.

Pariah Devalis, on 14 March 2017 - 05:59 PM, said:

Anyone? Nobody? Crickets?

*Sigh*

Fine.

[Odanan]

Metus regem, on 14 March 2017 - 12:19 PM, said:

On that note:

LB-2&5 are going to suck hard if taken from their TT stats, as PGI tends to use TT stats, those two weapons are gonig to be overly punished in MWO

LB-20, this one I think needs a reduction in crit slots to be kind of viable for the IS..

Remember that those weapons will have a higher rate of fire than the regular ACs. So maybe they will be usable.

[Odanan]

And I agree rate of fire, range, damage and heat should be adjusted for the IS LB'xs, but never, ever the weight and volume. That would break canon loadouts (just like MW4 did).

BTW, the Annihilator looks monstrous and hideous! (loved it)

[Metus regem]

Odanan, on 14 March 2017 - 06:58 PM, said:

Remember that those weapons will have a higher rate of fire than the regular ACs. So maybe they will be usable.

No, the LB-2X still sucks... 6t and 4 crit slots! It is flat out worse than the AC/2, it grew by 300% for an ability it does not have in MWO, the ability to swap ammo.

The LB-5X isn't as bad by comparison, but still not fantastic... It's 8t and 5 crits while the normal AC/5 is 8t and 4 crits, that's a 25% increase in size for an ability it will not have in MWO.

This is compounded by the UAC versions of those weapons are in the case of the UAC/2 smaller physical (only a crit space requirement of 3) while only being 1t heavier... and we all know the UAC/5 is the same phsical size as the LB-5, while being 1t heavier....

So Odanan, please tell me when would you take a LB-2X or 5X over their UAC counter parts? I mean we all know how MWO treats LB series AC/s....

This growth problem is also magnified at the LB-20X level, it's 11 crits, that means that with out MWO doing something drastic, either massive crit size reduction or crit splitting, it is going to be relegated to only ST mounts, making it massively inferior to the IS UAC/20, that is 15t and 10 crits, yes folks an IS UAC/20 can be arm mounted or work with a LFE.

[Ghostrider0067]

I'm surprised that no one has yet mentioned the absolutely tortoise-like speed of the Annihilator. Even at a maximum speed, it's 48.6 kph before speed tweak. That's awful. It makes the ridiculously slow Mauler builds I've seen look zippy by comparison. I guess this is as close to a battleship as we're going to get to this point, so it is how it is. Lights are going to have a field day on these, I'm afraid.

[Pariah Devalis]

To be honest, Ghostrider, I expected the Anni to have an even lower engine cap. It's a mech that on paper looks fearsome in firepower potential... but in practice would never be nearly as good as one would hope. Also, how the hell does the pilot sit in the cockpit? Laying down?

[Metus regem]

Ghostrider0067, on 14 March 2017 - 07:13 PM, said:

I'm surprised that no one has yet mentioned the absolutely tortoise-like speed of the Annihilator. Even at a maximum speed, it's 48.6 kph before speed tweak. That's awful. It makes the ridiculously slow Mauler builds I've seen look zippy by comparison. I guess this is as close to a battleship as we're going to get to this point, so it is how it is. Lights are going to have a field day on these, I'm afraid.

No, a lot of us had mentioned that, a lot. But we got told, many times by people with nostalgia vision, that it would be awesome.... Well I hope everyone that wanted one is going to be happy with it... But I suspect lots of salt, once it hits the actual game... low weapon mounts, slow speed.... yea it's not going to be pretty...

[Ghostrider0067]

Pariah Devalis, on 14 March 2017 - 07:15 PM, said:

To be honest, Ghostrider, I expected the Anni to have an even lower engine cap. It's a mech that on paper looks fearsome in firepower potential... but in practice would never be nearly as good as one would hope. Also, how the hell does the pilot sit in the cockpit? Laying down?

Fearsome, yes. Sensible? Not so much. It sure would be an interesting take if the piloting perspective were as you mentioned, no?

Metus regem, on 14 March 2017 - 07:16 PM, said:

No, a lot of us had mentioned that, a lot. But we got told, many times by people with nostalgia vision, that it would be awesome.... Well I hope everyone that wanted one is going to be happy with it... But I suspect lots of salt, once it hits the actual game... low weapon mounts, slow speed.... yea it's not going to be pretty...

I'm not a light pilot as I don't do drugs but I'm sure the prospect of annihilating an Annihilator have said pilots salivating at the opportunity to gut one of these like a fish. I was considering buying the pack but have already talked myself out of it for the measure of outright frustration I might have could cause me to become... physically irresponsible. I can't have any of that since I've got a lot of nice, expensive stuff in my office and on my desk. LOL