20517 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

cdlord, on 28 December 2015 - 09:15 AM, said:

Regardless, still want the Flea.

well we had people begging for

so why not

what's next....

?

[Metus regem]

cdlord, on 28 December 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

YES! Even the vaunted Timber Wolf was thought to be DOA..... That alone should convince rational thinkers that each and every chassis can shine. After all, a fish may be a good swimmer, but it's crap at tree climbing. If all you look at is climbing trees, you'll never judge the fish on it's capabilities.

Hence my Signature, I was able to make the 'bad' Awesome, Dragon, Vindicator (with Bishop's advice) and Locust shine. I'm average at best at MWO, and i f I can think outside of the box on those mechs and make them work, then a real good comp player should be able to get the Death Star achievement with a MG armed Locust!

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 28 December 2015 - 10:04 AM, said:

Hence my Signature, I was able to make the 'bad' Awesome, Dragon, Vindicator (with Bishop's advice) and Locust shine. I'm average at best at MWO, and i f I can think outside of the box on those mechs and make them work, then a real good comp player should be able to get the Death Star achievement with a MG armed Locust!

Problem is the "real good" players these days don't pride themselves in winning with handicaps. The Comp mindset is the type that would use ANY advantage not specifically prohibited in black and white by the rules (and if they can get away with it, maybe a few that are).

The modern mindset is "Win at all costs". "Quality" of win means nothing.

These are the same sort who would only show up at a street race if they can get a bugatti veyron.... because working to make a lesser sports car compete is too much work, and leaves the door open to losing.

I miss the days when the top SF2 players would compete with Zangief, Dhalsim and such.... and still win, but do so with style, confident in their skill to beat the meta.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 28 December 2015 - 11:39 AM.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 28 December 2015 - 10:08 AM, said:

Problem is the "real good" layers these days don't pride themselves in winning with handicaps. The Comp mindset is the type that would use ANY advantage not specifically prohibited in black and white by the rules (and if they can get away with it, maybe a few that are).

The modern mindset is "Win at all costs". "Quality" of win means nothing.

These are the same sort who would only show up at a street race if they can get a bugatti veyron.... because working to make a lesser sports car compete is too much work, and leaves the door open to losing.

I miss the days when the top SF2 players would compete with Zangief, Dhalsim and such.... and still win, but do so with style, confident in their skill to beat the meta.

Then I guess I'm a throw back to a better time then, I like to play with style, and challeng myself to be better. Busting out my Timber Wolf almost feels like cheating these days, and I don't run a meta build.

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 28 December 2015 - 10:14 AM, said:

Then I guess I'm a throw back to a better time then, I like to play with style, and challeng myself to be better. Busting out my Timber Wolf almost feels like cheating these days, and I don't run a meta build.

and thus you will never be an Uber1337 SuperComp TRVE KVLT Alpha Gamer standing astride Mt Tryhard, waving your epeen for everyone to be in awe of.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 28 December 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

and thus you will never be an Uber1337 SuperComp TRVE KVLT Alpha Gamer standing astride Mt Tryhard, waving your epeen for everyone to be in awe of.

And I can live with that, winning at any cost isn't worth the win.

[Virlutris]

Odanan, on 27 December 2015 - 11:51 AM, said:

Curious stuff:
- MWO started the closed beta in July 17, 2012 with 4 mechs (Atlas, Catapult, Hunchback and Jenner)
- since then, more 62 mechs were released, roughly 1.5 new chassis per month.
- that means 2016 might add up to 18 new mechs to the game.

Which will be the 2016 mechs? Here are my guesses:

- Clan Battlemech pack: Piranha, Conjurer, Black Python, Kodiak
- "Phoenix Project II": Wasp, Phoenix Hawk, Crusader, Longbow;
- Possibly Stinger and Valkyrie to round up all Macross Unseen;
- Origins IIC 2: Urbanmech IIC, Shadow Hawk IIC (or Griffin IIC), Rifleman IIC, Marauder IIC; (would prefer the Wave 4 first)
- Resistance III: Flea (would prefer the Javelin), Bushwacker (hopefully the Assassin), Ostroc (heck, why not? still, I would prefer the Lancelot), Cyclops (would prefer the Charger);
(and for the beginning of 2017)
- Clan Wave 4: Fire Falcon, Black Lanner, Night Gyr, Turkina.

So, make your lists! Let's see who calls better.

I think you've got some good picks lined up there Odanan, I wouldn't bet against them.

It's mostly off-beat, but I'd like to see an OmniTech Wave IV pack with the 20-ton Firemoth (just ditch the MASC for a free ton, quirk down the top speed under threshhold needed by the servers, like inverse of the Summoner), 40-ton Viper (whee, fast!) some neat heavy (75-ton Night Gyr?) and the 90-ton, Standard-engine Kingfisher.

It's kind of a fill-in-the-blanks platter, but it's what I'm interested in. Yours is more realistic

For the IICs, I'd predict the Locust before the Urbie, tbh. I'd enjoy either, but I expect the Locust first. I'd like the Griffin, but Shadowhawk makes more sense. There's a reason it was the first-round Phoenix Pack medium. I can't argue with the Rifelman or Marauder for the IIC pack either.

Yeah, I think the only one I'd actually quibble with at all is your Light ClanTech IIC pick. It's a winner even if I'm wrong, but I don't think Urbie's going to land before the Locust.

Ed: spelling

Edited by Virlutris, 28 December 2015 - 01:12 PM.

[Metus regem]

Virlutris, on 28 December 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

I think you've got some good picks lined up there Odanan, I wouldn't bet against them.

It's mostly off-beat, but I'd like to see an OmniTech Wave IV pack with the 20-ton Firemoth (just ditch the MASC for a free ton, quirk down the top speed under threshhold needed by the servers, like inverse of the Summoner), 40-ton Viper (whee, fast!) some neat heavy (75-ton Night Gyr?) and the 90-ton, Standard-engine Kingfisher.

It's kind of a fill-in-the-blanks platter, but it's what I'm interested in. Yours is more realistic

For the IICs, I'd predict the Locust before the Urbie, tbh. I'd like Urbie, but I expect the Locust first. I'd like the Griffin, but Shadowhawk makes more sense. There's a reason it was the first-round Phoenix Pack medium. I can't argue with the Rifelman or Marauder for the IIC pack either.

Yeah, I think the only one I'd actually quibble with at all is your Light ClanTech IIC pick. It's a winner even if I'm wrong, but I don't think Urbie's going to land before the Locust.

Ed: spelling

The Locust IIC runs into the same issue as the Warhammer IIC, Marauder IIC and Phoenix Hawk IIC, she's heavier than the Inner Sphere counterpart...

[Odanan]

Metus regem, on 28 December 2015 - 01:13 PM, said:

The Locust IIC runs into the same issue as the Warhammer IIC, Marauder IIC and Phoenix Hawk IIC, she's heavier than the Inner Sphere counterpart...

I see no problem in that.

[Odanan]

Virlutris, on 28 December 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

It's mostly off-beat, but I'd like to see an OmniTech Wave IV pack with the 20-ton Firemoth (just ditch the MASC for a free ton, quirk down the top speed under threshhold needed by the servers, like inverse of the Summoner), 40-ton Viper (whee, fast!) some neat heavy (75-ton Night Gyr?) and the 90-ton, Standard-engine Kingfisher.

Firemoth, Viper, Night Gyr (the real seller) and Kingfisher (with a very small center torso, it could be a good zombie)?
That wouldn't be a bad pack at all! (and except for the Night Gyr, it is very Ghost Bear themed - Wave III was mostly Smoke Jaguar)

So, the Wave V would have Jade Falcon mechs (except for the heavy, which needs to be the Linebacker).

PS: is the change on the Speed Tweak an indication of the upcoming Firemoth?

Edited by Odanan, 29 December 2015 - 05:21 PM.

[Metus regem]

Odanan, on 28 December 2015 - 01:19 PM, said:

I see no problem in that.

PGI's codeing abilities might....

[Uncle Totty]

Metus regem, on 28 December 2015 - 10:14 AM, said:

Then I guess I'm a throw back to a better time then, I like to play with style, and challeng myself to be better. Busting out my Timber Wolf almost feels like cheating these days, and I don't run a meta build.

How is this "cheating"?

TBR-N(oob):
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4946433fd899652

PS: Someone make this canon please. (I want to use it in Stock Meck Monday.)

Edited by Nathan K, 28 December 2015 - 01:53 PM.

[Juodas Varnas]

Nathan K, on 28 December 2015 - 01:47 PM, said:

How is this "cheating"?

TBR-N(oob):
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d85814d1701f915

PS. Someone make this canon please. (I want to use it in Stock Meck Monday.)

"Feels like cheating", not actually cheating.

Heck, I "feel like cheating" when i use my Locust 1E, especially after buying the Pirates' Bane.
Oh gosh, those ARM-mounted 6E are insane in comparison to the 4E in the torsos! I mean, i can actually hit UAVs with it and mechs that're below and above me, even Jump Jetting! OH AND THOSE DURABILITY QUIRKS! It can even take more than 1 shot before falling apart!

Pirates' Bane's ECM doesn't make up for it (especially since i stripped it out so i could fit in the MGs along with the 4 MLs - don't judge me, i realize how useless those 2 MGs are, but i always run the MGs if the Stock variant uses them (like the 5S thunderbolt)

[Ovion]

Juodas Varnas, on 28 December 2015 - 01:55 PM, said:

"Feels like cheating", not actually cheating.

Heck, I "feel like cheating" when i use my Locust 1E, especially after buying the Pirates' Bane.
Oh gosh, those ARM-mounted 6E are insane in comparison to the 4E in the torsos! I mean, i can actually hit UAVs with it and mechs that're below and above me, even Jump Jetting! OH AND THOSE DURABILITY QUIRKS! It can even take more than 1 shot before falling apart!

Pirates' Bane's ECM doesn't make up for it (especially since i stripped it out so i could fit in the MGs along with the 4 MLs - don't judge me, i realize how useless those 2 MGs are, but i always run the MGs if the Stock variant uses them (like the 5S thunderbolt)

PIRATES' BANE

[BarHaid]

Strum Wealh, on 28 December 2015 - 09:15 AM, said:

So, what's with the hate-on for the Cyclops?

[snip variants and lore]

From a gameplay perspective, the Cyclops would complement the lighter Orion and the heavier Atlas & would compete with the same-tonnage Highlander and Mauler for the 90-ton slot in CW drop decks, and would truly shine in its intended role as a command vehicle if/when PGI gets the game's EW/IW systems sorted out and/or implements some form of InfoTech-related quirks.

I guess I play the stock-nerd card here. The Cyclops comes with four tons of AC/20 ammo. FOUR TONS.

Granted, the weak armor may not let you use all that ammo, but still.

[Virlutris]

BarHaid, on 28 December 2015 - 02:11 PM, said:

I guess I play the stock-nerd card here. The Cyclops comes with four tons of AC/20 ammo. FOUR TONS.

Granted, the weak armor may not let you use all that ammo, but still.

Metus regem, on 28 December 2015 - 01:13 PM, said:

The Locust IIC runs into the same issue as the Warhammer IIC, Marauder IIC and Phoenix Hawk IIC, she's heavier than the Inner Sphere counterpart...

I'm okay with both of these things, tbh. Each for their own reasons.

The Cyclops because it translates pretty well to solo PUGging (I know, not your point) and the Locust because it makes for better loadouts and moar lulz.

The weight issue mentioned is part of why I'd like the Moth and Viper. Also: speed! These are as-yet unoccupied tonnage slots for ClanTech (I don't think this was the point of the other quoted comment, either), without a bunch of options to fill them in a quirky drop deck. That line of thought opens a can of worms, so I'm gonna leave the rest of that discussion alone.

Kingfisher doesn't fill a tonnage slot need anymore with the HGN-IIC on the scene, but has a standard engine with a newly-appreciable advantage: avoiding movement and heat penalties when losing and ST. Also endo, ferro, and no locked MASC or JJs to offset the heavy engine.

And yeah, Night Gyr, the Post-Tukkayid Invasion mech with lots of opportunity to boat big weapons. Mmmmmmmmmm weapons.

As to the Speed Tweak nerf, I don't know how much it was done with a 20-tonner packing an XL200 in mind. I do think it now presents an oppprtunity to make it real

I'd like to see it tested on one of the Locusts, honestly. Pick one, like the 3M or 3V, boost the cap to 200, and let the Brotherhood of the Locust give it a whirl!

Edited by Virlutris, 28 December 2015 - 03:08 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Virlutris, on 28 December 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

I think you've got some good picks lined up there Odanan, I wouldn't bet against them.

It's mostly off-beat, but I'd like to see an OmniTech Wave IV pack with the 20-ton Firemoth (just ditch the MASC for a free ton, quirk down the top speed under threshhold needed by the servers, like inverse of the Summoner), 40-ton Viper (whee, fast!) some neat heavy (75-ton Night Gyr?) and the 90-ton, Standard-engine Kingfisher.

It's kind of a fill-in-the-blanks platter, but it's what I'm interested in. Yours is more realistic

For the IICs, I'd predict the Locust before the Urbie, tbh. I'd enjoy either, but I expect the Locust first. I'd like the Griffin, but Shadowhawk makes more sense. There's a reason it was the first-round Phoenix Pack medium. I can't argue with the Rifelman or Marauder for the IIC pack either.

Yeah, I think the only one I'd actually quibble with at all is your Light ClanTech IIC pick. It's a winner even if I'm wrong, but I don't think Urbie's going to land before the Locust.

Ed: spelling

urbie IIC would likely depend on how well Urbie actually did sell for PGI.

BarHaid, on 28 December 2015 - 02:11 PM, said:

I guess I play the stock-nerd card here. The Cyclops comes with four tons of AC/20 ammo. FOUR TONS.

Granted, the weak armor may not let you use all that ammo, but still.

and only an LRM10 for ranged combat seems a little ......odd for a command unit.

Mine always ended up modified to use a 270 engine, 25 SHS, 16.5 tons of armor, 2xPPC,, 4xLRM5 (ammox3) 4xMLs

Seemed a more sensible "command" build, stay back, direct the fight, add PPCs and LRMs where needed, have PPCs and MLs if anything gets close.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 28 December 2015 - 03:14 PM.

[Virlutris]

Bishop Steiner, on 28 December 2015 - 03:07 PM, said:

urbie IIC would likely depend on how well Urbie actually did sell for PGI.

It would indeed

I think we've got Urbire-equivalent gun-lights in ClanLand though. Remember how MetaMasters were comparing Urbie to the Kits and Adders, and even calling it better (before the Adder's flamer unlock)?

The Locust IIC would potentially give Clanners the one thing they don't have: Ludicrous Speed. At least, until and unless Firemoth arrives. It would also give an alternative to the Lynx (poor Lynx). All LCT-IIC needs is a 240-plus engine cap, and the battlemech customizability will take care of the rest

[Bishop Steiner]

Virlutris, on 28 December 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

It would indeed

I think we've got Urbire-equivalent gun-lights in ClanLand though. Remember how MetaMasters were comparing Urbie to the Kits and Adders, and even calling it better (before the Adder's flamer unlock)?

The Locust IIC would potentially give Clanners the one thing they don't have: Ludicrous Speed. At least, until and unless Firemoth arrives. It would also give an alternative to the Lynx (poor Lynx). All LCT-IIC needs is a 240-plus engine cap, and the battlemech customizability will take care of the rest

and NINE, count them NINE energy hardpoints. CERSMLs of the world, unite!!!!

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 28 December 2015 - 03:33 PM.

[Metus regem]

Virlutris, on 28 December 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

It would indeed

I think we've got Urbire-equivalent gun-lights in ClanLand though. Remember how MetaMasters were comparing Urbie to the Kits and Adders, and even calling it better (before the Adder's flamer unlock)?

The Locust IIC would potentially give Clanners the one thing they don't have: Ludicrous Speed. At least, until and unless Firemoth arrives. It would also give an alternative to the Lynx (poor Lynx). All LCT-IIC needs is a 240-plus engine cap, and the battlemech customizability will take care of the rest

Still for a 20 tonner for Clans, I'd like to see the Piranha.... 12 MG's for the win!