210 replies to this topic

[AEgg]

InRev, on 28 January 2015 - 04:54 PM, said:

-Snip-

Your point is a lot simpler than this.

"Just ignore it" is a completely effortless and fullproof solution to this problem. For at least the majority of people. Apparently some people can't ignore things. I don't understand that, most of us probably don't (seeing as we use the internet without worrying about it).

That said, there's only two things that can be done about it. Teach the people that can't ignore it to ignore it, or regulate everybody for the benefit of the few.

Nobody knows if the first option can be done, and most attempts at the second one end poorly, either because of lack of resources (i.e. MWO) or because you can game the system (i.e. LoL).

[0111101]

InRev, on 28 January 2015 - 04:54 PM, said:

And here I was, about to write a lengthy reply covering all the points you just mentioned. Good thing I refreshed before posting.

Thank you, InRev.

[0111101]

AEgg, on 28 January 2015 - 05:06 PM, said:

Your point is a lot simpler than this.

"Just ignore it" is a completely effortless and fullproof solution to this problem. For at least the majority of people. Apparently some people can't ignore things. I don't understand that, most of us probably don't (seeing as we use the internet without worrying about it).

That said, there's only two things that can be done about it. Teach the people that can't ignore it to ignore it, or regulate everybody for the benefit of the few.

Nobody knows if the first option can be done, and most attempts at the second one end poorly, either because of lack of resources (i.e. MWO) or because you can game the system (i.e. LoL).

"Just ignore it" doesn't stop the person from being a toxic member of the community. They shouldn't be acting out to begin with. Since you and others ITT don't seem to be grasping the point of mutual respect in virtual discourse, I'll try a comparison.

Let's say you're on a sports team IRL. One of your teammates is always negative and unreasonable. He takes out his frustration on you and your teammates in every game that you play with him. How long would you tolerate his verbal abuse before you got together with the rest of the team and decided to boot him to the curb for being a complete jerk 24/7? Just because the internet grants you a degree of anonymity not available IRL doesn't mean that the behavior is acceptable.

[Brody319]

[AEgg]

0111101, on 28 January 2015 - 05:13 PM, said:

"Just ignore it" doesn't stop the person from being a toxic member of the community. They shouldn't be acting out to begin with. Since you and others ITT don't seem to be grasping the point of mutual respect in virtual discourse, I'll try a comparison.

Let's say you're on a sports team IRL. One of your teammates is always negative and unreasonable. He takes out his frustration on you and your teammates in every game that you play with him. How long would you tolerate his verbal abuse before you got together with the rest of the team and decided to boot him to the curb for being a complete jerk 24/7? Just because the internet grants you a degree of anonymity not available IRL doesn't mean that the behavior is acceptable.

But I was arguing your point...

Personally, I could care less what people say. If he was a good player, I'd tolerate him indefinitely. There is no "tolerating" for me. I just ignore it and that's the end of it.

My post was simply stating that I realize there are people who can't do this, and what the only options are for those people.

[Ted Wayz]

Rewards for behaving the way civilized people should behave....

How about our mechs shoot pillows and everyone wins?

Really this is the least toxic game I have ever played. There are a few randoms here and there, but it really is infrequent. Especially for a F2P. Given that I don't know if it warrants the development time for a rating system.

[Escef]

AEgg, on 28 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

If he was a good player, I'd tolerate him indefinitely.

Wow, battered wife syndrome right there.

[Brody319]

Escef, on 28 January 2015 - 05:20 PM, said:

Wow, battered wife syndrome right there.

yes because being beaten, verbally abused, and emotionally destroyed by your partner is the same thing as someone saying a bad word on the internet.

[0111101]

AEgg, on 28 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

But I was arguing your point...

Personally, I could care less what people say. If he was a good player, I'd tolerate him indefinitely. There is no "tolerating" for me. I just ignore it and that's the end of it.

My post was simply stating that I realize there are people who can't do this, and what the only options are for those people.

I must have misinterpreted the last two blocks of text. I apologize. My main point of contention with your reply was in "regulate everybody for the benefit of the few". I disagree with that part specifically -- Regulating toxic behavior would benefit ALL, in my opinion.

[Brody319]

0111101, on 28 January 2015 - 05:23 PM, said:

I must have misinterpreted the last two blocks of text. I apologize. My main point of contention with your reply was in "regulate everybody for the benefit of the few". I disagree with that part specifically -- Regulating toxic behavior would benefit ALL, in my opinion.

Except its only a FEW people being offended. Most people Don't care! I don't care. I don't even use text chat that much if ever, I never tell everyone on the server "they suck" because I died. I may get pissed off and say it or thinking in my room, but I don't type it out.

but when I see someone go off on me because they are pissed off, I ignore it, and in 2 minutes I've forgotten it happened!

Most people on the internet just DEAL with it.

but because a small percentage are genuinely offended by these things, we should police EVERYONE!?

[0111101]

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:22 PM, said:

yes because being beaten, verbally abused, and emotionally destroyed by your partner is the same thing as someone saying a bad word on the internet.

You're missing the point over and over again. It's not about bad words. I couldn't care less about swearing. What I do care about is people thinking it's okay to unleash a torrent of verbal abuse on their teammates in every match that they play because they have a degree of anonymity granted to them by virtual interaction. Let that sink in, please.

[Escef]

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:22 PM, said:

yes because being beaten, verbally abused, and emotionally destroyed by your partner is the same thing as someone saying a bad word on the internet.

Same general idea. "This person treats me badly, but provides something I value, therefor I tolerate the treatment."

Son, I saw my mom verbally and emotionally abused by my old man for years. The crap stinks.

[Brody319]

0111101, on 28 January 2015 - 05:27 PM, said:

You're missing the point over and over again. It's not about bad words. I couldn't care less about swearing. What I do care about is people thinking it's okay to unleash a torrent of verbal abuse on their teammates in every match that they play because they have a degree of anonymity granted to them by virtual interaction. Let that sink in, please.

Yea, and I've played several online games. You wanna see a torrent of hate, go play CoD, Counter-Strike, Gmod, and some TF2 servers.

Every place has douchebags, but that person is not "ruining the whole game because he acts like an ass wherever he goes"

Where does the limit start? when I say my team sucks 5 games in a row? how do you know its every game? Do you group drop every game with him?

Escef, on 28 January 2015 - 05:30 PM, said:

Same general idea. "This person treats me badly, but provides something I value, therefor I tolerate the treatment."

Son, I saw my mom verbally and emotionally abused by my old man for years. The crap stinks.

Yea, but on the internet, if you just not pay attention, you forget it in 2 minutes. Real abuse would be this person following specific people and attacking them, but when its just them being like "u guz sukz" and saying it every match means that person is on the same level as a wife beater, you are pushing some dangerous thinking.

"someone can help me win this game, then I can just join a new game or block them and never have to see them again"

[Escef]

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

Yea, but on the internet, if you just not pay attention, ..

Yeah, just ignore it and it goes away? Ignore the problem and you don't have to fix it? Ignore it and MAYBE the toxic players won't drive people away?

Look, son, treating people like crap is still treating people like crap. The attitude of ignore it and let them play is counter-productive.

But, hey, if you don't like the idea that some people find toxic behavior offensive, why don't you ignore it? No, ignore the fact that people don't like being treated like crap. It's cool. You have no reason to be posting.

[Ratpoison]

RG Notch, on 28 January 2015 - 03:39 PM, said:

Have you been banned? If not you have no idea if that is true.

Yes.

Now you will call me a liar because you're just that jaded and predictable. You asked a loaded question with the intent of blocking conversation to vent your mistrust in PGI for unrelated issues, and it wouldn't matter if anyone said either yes or no to you. You're trying to stir up the same feelings in other people to make yourself feel better, and are therefore being toxic by trying to dissuade people from staying a part of the community. So just stop.

[burns]

Vassago Rain, on 21 December 2014 - 07:38 PM, said:

Yes, all the trolls and kiddies will surely download an infamous F2P title related to a franchise three times as old as they.

You don´t seem to know alot about steam-chaos it seems. There´s far crappier and costier games on steam that only have deteriorated in playerbase because of a steam release. (of course theres also titles which actually got better after going steam!)

Edited by burns, 28 January 2015 - 05:47 PM.

[0111101]

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

Yea, and I've played several online games. You wanna see a torrent of hate, go play CoD, Counter-Strike, Gmod, and some TF2 servers.

You talk as if I've never played any other online games. I have seen plenty of hate and this is beside the point, again.

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

Where does the limit start? when I say my team sucks 5 games in a row? how do you know its every game? Do you group drop every game with him?

No, why would I group drop with such a colossal ass? You clearly didn't read my first reply to this thread where I detailed exactly the problem. For your convenience I will reiterate. I've been matched with him multiple times over the span of weeks. It's not like I'm keeping track of the exact span of time. However, I recognize him instantly because of the fact that he verbally abuses the team every single time I see him. He isn't just saying the team sucks. He's throwing the blame on everyone else for his own lack of skill/teamwork/whatever. He uses slurs, hate speech and keeps going for minutes at a time after he's died, until he gets his fill of it and rage quits. From my experience with him doing this in, again, every game I've been around him, I can extrapolate that he must do this in damn near every game of MWO he plays.

Where does the limit start? That's not for me to decide. Like I also said earlier, occasionally voicing your frustration is just fine. Everyone gets frustrated and has bad days. Sometimes they slip up and say something they shouldn't. But when you're doing it in every match you play to everyone on your team day in and day out, that's problematic and should be addressed.

I'm gonna practice "ignoring the problem" on you now if you don't mind.

[Brody319]

Escef, on 28 January 2015 - 05:39 PM, said:

Yeah, just ignore it and it goes away? Ignore the problem and you don't have to fix it? Ignore it and MAYBE the toxic players won't drive people away?

Look, son, treating people like crap is still treating people like crap. The attitude of ignore it and let them play is counter-productive.

But, hey, if you don't like the idea that some people find toxic behavior offensive, why don't you ignore it? No, ignore the fact that people don't like being treated like crap. It's cool. You have no reason to be posting.

That implies that this is a problem.

That because a few outliers exist, we should go out of are way to get rid of them and police everyone more.

One person fails the test so we should make the class more harsh and go over the subjects again.

[Escef]

Brody319, on 28 January 2015 - 05:51 PM, said:

That implies that this is a problem.

Other people having a problem with it must be a problem for you, because you can't shut up about it. Why don't you just ignore it?

[occusoj]

0111101, on 28 January 2015 - 05:23 PM, said:

Regulating toxic behavior would benefit ALL, in my opinion.

It wouldnt benefit me as some rage-kid tantrums are fun to read. The non amusing stuff get simply ignored. Its meaningless trashtalk.
Add an ignore function and an optional wordfilter for those who dont want to read it.

In case theres rascism, stalking or other criminally offensive stuff in it, this individual player of course needs to be banned. But just for behaving like a douche? No way.
Especially in games like CS, Q,BF,... the hatespeech is a fundamental part of gaming experience. Doing a lol noscope 360 headshot is only half the fun if your opponent isnt a 15 years old kid or manbaby that ragequits.

Escef, on 28 January 2015 - 05:30 PM, said:

"This person treats me badly, but provides something I value, therefor I tolerate the treatment."

Thats basically how a large part of the world works today. From states to business and even personal relationships.
Look at some of MWOs customers. PGI treats them badly and they even pay money for it.