115 replies to this topic

[ice trey]

Like... right screwed. Too few players using teamspeak, too few organized units, and too few of said organized units dropping strategically. Hell, too few combine units actually playing Community Warfare to stop the Planet-a-day onslaught of the clans.

Now, I don't think that this is because the lore for the Draconis Combine somehow magnetically attracts only bad players, or attracts players who refuse to use teamspeak, or attracts players who hate community warfare and therefore refuse to participate, but for whatever reason, the combine is getting stomped. When I can find a group, we do great, but often times, it feels all for naught as every win we get seems thrice over ghosted away unless 100% of our efforts are concentrated on one border, leaving every other planet to be conquered.

I'm not one to complain about losing over a well fought battle, but looking at the Steiner line, they've barely lost any worlds - and they've been facing some of the best units out there that took up the Falcon banner. They've also got even more factions bordering them than the Combine does, but they've held the line reasonably well. Meanwhile, in Kurita space, we've systematically lost a world to each of the clans nearly every ceasefire, with only the Davions being nominally held at bay. The Smoke Jaguars are so few jumps away from Luthien that unless the automated planet selection is feeling really generous or the possibility is forbidden by the game programming, I'd be betting the family farm that the capital is a clan holding by weeks' end.

I can only make conjectures as to "Why" this is, but I would like to motion to PGI to look into their number-crunching machine to tell us what it is that's causing the massive imbalance, and what will fix it. The Combine is clearly being outclassed to such a degree that no other faction - save maybe for Rasalhague - can compare. I'm not going to pin it on the clans being clans - as I've had the privilege of dropping with some units that took the fight to the clans and wiped the floors with them - but there's clearly some community player issues at work here that are tipping the scales.

Edited by ice trey, 06 January 2015 - 03:20 AM.

[NextGame]

Factions that have the most organised units active approx 3 hours prior to and through to the ceasefire have the advantage. The rest of play doesnt really matter other than getting a bit of fun by upsetting people over breaking imaginary ceasefires.

[ice trey]

NextGame, on 06 January 2015 - 02:58 AM, said:

Factions that have the most organised units active approx 3 hours prior to and through to the ceasefire have the advantage. The rest of play doesnt really matter other than getting a bit of fun by upsetting people over breaking imaginary ceasefires.

It's not that other factions have more organized units, but why they have more organized units... and by how much that concerns me. Also if the Combine has a comparable player base to other factions, it shouldn't have this many issues holding it's borders. I'd like to see what proportion of a factions' drops are done as a part of a group versus as a pug player, and more importantly, what factors are contributing to those numbers.

[_Comrade_]

pretty much the way CW is, the heavy populated factions always win, the more units you have fighting the more you have a chance to capture a planet. Because 60 players all in 12 men premades attacking a planet have more of a chance to get pug/ghost drops compared to the 60 defenders who are not premades. And unfortunately it's going to stay like that unless PGI decides to introduce more balancing. So your expectations of your faction should be lowered into just maintaining one planet, you're not alone , Clan JF and Wolf are having problems atm holding on to planets

Edited by Grimwill, 06 January 2015 - 04:37 AM.

[Shauma]

Well what you feel is not the number of your faction is the numbers of your faction vs the numbers of your faction playing CW, since stocking stuffer event is out no way players go to CW matches why? well lets pick from the list:

-Too long to get a match
-rewards vs fun = low
-no point in lore wise unless you live in a suitable timezone

Kuritans suffer a lot from the EU timezone problem, most EU players are either Steiner Kurita Marik or Liao, a few clan a few Davion like, on the other hand if we go to the America Timezone, i feel a lot of the player base goes for Davion and Steiner, few Marik few Kuritans and a few clans, so thats why you are suffering for what is called population attrition in my opinion a big game mechanics flaw but of course they will try to solve it, but the question is when they did solve it, will be enough players around, just wait and see....

[Joseph Mallan]

So here in MW:O House Kurita is the House Liao of TT? I feel for you, I like House Kurita as a faction. Never a fan of their main Mechs (which is a deciding factor to me) but I liked the background.

And No in CW We are the balancing factor, if we want to play faction X and less of you wanna be faction Y guess what should happen? It is a combat game, Combat is not always fair and balanced. You give your best, and take pride in what you can do with less.

[p4r4g0n]

Shauma, on 06 January 2015 - 04:50 AM, said:

Well what you feel is not the number of your faction is the numbers of your faction vs the numbers of your faction playing CW, since stocking stuffer event is out no way players go to CW matches why? well lets pick from the list:

-Too long to get a match
-rewards vs fun = low
-no point in lore wise unless you live in a suitable timezone

You missed one - if you're in a non US time zone, it pretty much seems like CW battles mean jack all.

[Shauma]

p4r4g0n, on 06 January 2015 - 04:59 AM, said:

You missed one - if you're in a non US time zone, it pretty much seems like CW battles mean jack all.

I not misssed that one just explained that in point 3

[ice trey]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 January 2015 - 04:56 AM, said:

So here in MW:O House Kurita is the House Liao of TT?

Wait... what do you mean by that, exactly? If you mean their getting stomped in the 4th succession war, that's already reflected in the MWO map.

Personally, I'm a bit surprised at Liao's performance, but only because I thought that the Goonsquad was still a thing that was going to happen.

I'd like to wish that "He with the most players wins by default" wasn't the way things go, but at the very least, reason as to why Kurita is getting the short end of the stick with their player base - and what can be done to fix it - is what I want to hear about. I don't know if the boosts to Liao rewards have helped them or not.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

I love how everyone complains about how long it takes to get a match going in CW...so they avoid CW...which results in longer wait times because less players.

This is why I want to see units that are playing together FORCED into CW, because people are so uninformed about how the que system works in CW, they figure that because it's taking so long, not participating at all is helping, when it's not at all the case.

If you want to see CW thrive... encourage EVERYONE YOU CAN TO PLAY THE MODE. It's either that, or PGI will have to enforce that units are locked into CW matches no matter what... because otherwise, it's literally been a waste of resources to put in a gamemode that won't get used.

Which is a shame, because CW is amazing in regards to how it changes the feel of the game overall... but too many people are impatient.

[ice trey]

Shauma, on 06 January 2015 - 04:50 AM, said:

Kuritans suffer a lot from the EU timezone problem, most EU players are either Steiner Kurita Marik or Liao, a few clan a few Davion like, on the other hand if we go to the America Timezone, i feel a lot of the player base goes for Davion and Steiner, few Marik few Kuritans and a few clans, so thats why you are suffering for what is called population attrition in my opinion a big game mechanics flaw but of course they will try to solve it, but the question is when they did solve it, will be enough players around, just wait and see....

What is worse, I'm not US or EU. I'm APAC, so finding players to drop with is harder still. There are always general drops, but rarely people on teamspeak. I don't know if it's a language barrier thing, but Teamspeak is never more dead than when it would be most convenient for me to play.

Murphy's law in action.

[Klappspaten]

I don´t know if the reward boost has helped Liao, but it certainly helped the FRR.
Several FRR units have already dropped in defense of DC worlds at the clan border and will continue to do so as often our own operations allow it. Thats all we can do right now.

In the long term you will need to find a way of making peace with Davion.

And you wont help the wait times if you do not drop in CW. The more players, the more games can be started. And by the way, I had a lot of matches where I could organize a few PUGs in a way that we sucessfully attacked against an organized unit.
In CW I have seen better PUG performance than in all the other modes since closed beta.

Edited by Klappspaten, 06 January 2015 - 05:25 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

ice trey, on 06 January 2015 - 05:09 AM, said:

Wait... what do you mean by that, exactly? If you mean their getting stomped in the 4th succession war, that's already reflected in the MWO map.

Personally, I'm a bit surprised at Liao's performance, but only because I thought that the Goonsquad was still a thing that was going to happen.

I'd like to wish that "He with the most players wins by default" wasn't the way things go, but at the very least, reason as to why Kurita is getting the short end of the stick with their player base - and what can be done to fix it - is what I want to hear about. I don't know if the boosts to Liao rewards have helped them or not.

On TT and in the fiction House Liao was the whipping boy of BattleTech.

Second He who has the most players WILL win Wars Unless there is a serious mismanagement of force distribution. The adage in CBT fiction is to ensure victory one MUST have a clear 3:1 advantage. Numerical advantage is a huge thing in combat and this is a combat game.

[Grynos]

It is really a product of the population during the peak hours before ceasefire, as well as how the map was originally setup. In all honesty , the map setup was a poor setup even if it is in the Lore. Three IS factions have to personally worry about clans taking their territories, three do not. Now take into account that Davion is the most populated during the current 3-4 hour window before the ceasefire for the IS, for their own personal territories to be taken , it can happen by only three groups ( not counting Steiner due to truce ) DC,Marik , and Liao. During the peak hours before ceasefire, Liao hasn't the population to send any units to DC, I am pretty sure that Marik is the same as well. While Davion has the numbers during this time to help Steiner if they are needed. Figure on a normal night, Davion needs roughly 2-4 units for Liao , 3-6 units for Marik , that means the excess units can do other things like defend for Steiner against the clans.

When originally designing the map PGI should have considered the impact of having 3 IS factions ( one of which is the largest faction ) who have no direct contact with the Clans. But yet again I hear the voices ( It's the lore, it's the lore ) . I tend to look at things from a gaming aspect, while lore is nice and all , to use it as law for how this MMO had to be , only hinders the game in general.

[Joseph Mallan]

Grynos, on 06 January 2015 - 05:42 AM, said:

It is really a product of the population during the peak hours before ceasefire, as well as how the map was originally setup. In all honesty , the map setup was a poor setup even if it is in the Lore. Three IS factions have to personally worry about clans taking their territories, three do not. Now take into account that Davion is the most populated during the current 3-4 hour window before the ceasefire for the IS, for their own personal territories to be taken , it can happen by only three groups ( not counting Steiner due to truce ) DC,Marik , and Liao. During the peak hours before ceasefire, Liao hasn't the population to send any units to DC, I am pretty sure that Marik is the same as well. While Davion has the numbers during this time to help Steiner if they are needed. Figure on a normal night, Davion needs roughly 2-4 units for Liao , 3-6 units for Marik , that means the excess units can do other things like defend for Steiner against the clans.

When originally designing the map PGI should have considered the impact of having 3 IS factions ( one of which is the largest faction ) who have no direct contact with the Clans. But yet again I hear the voices ( It's the lore, it's the lore ) . I tend to look at things from a gaming aspect, while lore is nice and all , to use it as law for how this MMO had to be , only hinders the game in general.

This is why the Star League reformed! So everyone could send forces to rally against the Clans. Yes Its the Lore. I am here to play a BattleTech Universe game. I am here for the lore I grew up on, If it were not for the Lore, I could play any Mecha game, But I am a BattleTech fan and BEFORE MechWarrior was a video game it was the RPG portion of BattleTech. You come to play a CBT video game then expect it to be according to YOUR desired house rules. Not going to work that way.

Sorry you picked the faction furthest from the fighting in the Clan Invasion. If you want You can always join one of the 3 front line Houses and provide support that way.

[Grynos]

Flash Frame, on 06 January 2015 - 05:14 AM, said:

I love how everyone complains about how long it takes to get a match going in CW...so they avoid CW...which results in longer wait times because less players.

This is why I want to see units that are playing together FORCED into CW, because people are so uninformed about how the que system works in CW, they figure that because it's taking so long, not participating at all is helping, when it's not at all the case.

If you want to see CW thrive... encourage EVERYONE YOU CAN TO PLAY THE MODE. It's either that, or PGI will have to enforce that units are locked into CW matches no matter what... because otherwise, it's literally been a waste of resources to put in a gamemode that won't get used.

Which is a shame, because CW is amazing in regards to how it changes the feel of the game overall... but too many people are impatient.

While yes, CW is fun to play. It is less so for the solo queue player. For CW to thrive , it is going to need support from those solo queue players , Right now the benefits for solo queue players in CW are not really worth it. Think about it, wait in queue , for how ever long , sometimes very long. Great the player gets into a group, now the match starts. If they are in with a PUG against a decent pre made group, they lose. So they spent sometimes 45 mins to an hour, to get 500,000 cbills if they do great damage, usually on a defense. Now that same solo queue player can play one hour of solo matches, and make close to double sometimes even more than that amount in the same time frame.

[ice trey]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 January 2015 - 05:27 AM, said:

On TT and in the fiction House Liao was the whipping boy of BattleTech.

I fathom you haven't been around to witness the whole Xin Sheng, Jihad period, and Dark Age lore.


The Cappies have a pretty significant fanbase in Tabletop, now, and the lore changes seem to be reflecting that. That, or the changes in the lore have increased their popularity.

They were the whipping boys, but since Sun-Tzu took the reigns, things were on the up for them. That's a whole lotta lore ago. Not 80s lore, but certainly mid-90s-to-current lore.

Edited by ice trey, 06 January 2015 - 06:09 AM.

[NextGame]

Does Kurita even have some kind of self appointed command group like a lot of the other factions do? If so, they should be trying to co-ordinate which borders to fight on, and lobbying mercenary units to join their faction to strengthen it. If not, then, thats why you are the whipping boys, unfortunately.

Edited by NextGame, 06 January 2015 - 06:08 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

ice trey, on 06 January 2015 - 05:09 AM, said:

Wait... what do you mean by that, exactly? If you mean their getting stomped in the 4th succession war, that's already reflected in the MWO map.

Personally, I'm a bit surprised at Liao's performance, but only because I thought that the Goonsquad was still a thing that was going to happen.

I'd like to wish that "He with the most players wins by default" wasn't the way things go, but at the very least, reason as to why Kurita is getting the short end of the stick with their player base - and what can be done to fix it - is what I want to hear about. I don't know if the boosts to Liao rewards have helped them or not.

The goons largely left MWO in august 2013. They got a couple small squads up when CW was announced, but they're not nearly enough to fight back against the most populated factions (marik, davion) who outnumber them at least ten to one.

I believe there's actually a ceasefire between purple bird and green arm, but don't quote me on that.

[Grynos]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 January 2015 - 05:54 AM, said:

This is why the Star League reformed! So everyone could send forces to rally against the Clans. Yes Its the Lore. I am here to play a BattleTech Universe game. I am here for the lore I grew up on, If it were not for the Lore, I could play any Mecha game, But I am a BattleTech fan and BEFORE MechWarrior was a video game it was the RPG portion of BattleTech. You come to play a CBT video game then expect it to be according to YOUR desired house rules. Not going to work that way.

Sorry you picked the faction furthest from the fighting in the Clan Invasion. If you want You can always join one of the 3 front line Houses and provide support that way.

I am glad you are so engrossed in the lore aspect of the BattleTech Universe. But in REALITY , this is a Mech MMO. In order for the MMO to be successful it needs have a draw for not only for the people who love BattleTech, but it needs to expand its reaches to those that are not into the lore as well for the MMO to survive.