178 replies to this topic

[Priest4357]

CrockdaddyAoD, on 21 January 2015 - 09:06 AM, said:

"[color=#959595]2) A niche release for the elitist minority?"[/color]

How exactly does your very slanted comment help with the discussion? All team based FPS games need PUGs to grease the wheels of game play. This isn't news exactly. However your supposed "elitist minority" would typically be referred to as "whales" in F2P speak. These are the guys and gals whom actually fund the game. Ya know buy the new packs ... premium time, get into it so to speak.

I would have to say, that your guess that the whole game is being funded by the elitist minority is off. There's not enough of them to pay for this, or any other, game to keep going. The PUG is the one who isn't online much. They want the new shiny mech, but are never going to play enough to buy it outright. They have to have premium time to make C-Bills, they have to pay for mechs if they hope to ever have their own DireWhale.

I put money into this game even though it's my 3rd or 4th choice to play it. Mechbays, premium time, Founders package, etc... There's a lot more like me than the players that devote lots of time to the game. At least it's my opinion that is true. I have no numbers to back me up. Logic is my only backing.

I salute those that post here daily, and help to shape this game, but forums warriors, and elite players, have always been the biggest minority, and usually most vocal. Still, without them, we wouldn't have the game we do today. The PUGs (yes I am with a house unit, but still solo mostly) are the bread and butter, and you wouldn't enjoy a steak as much without a roll.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Well, I tried out CW again this morning, with the new patches, and it still sucks. It is still a waste of time if you are not in a 12 man pre-made. It is CW for elitist a--holes only. Pugs and small groups need not apply, unless you have a particular fondness for the "Cannon Fodder" role.

None of the proposed "fixes" by PGI or otherwise, will change this.

The way CW could become enjoyable for the majority of players is to do away with the 12x12 drops in favor of 4x4 drops.

This would substantially reduce MM wait times and would allow Pugs and small Lance sized groups to participate in a meaningful and enjoyable way.

It would also put the established 12 man competition teams back to doing whatever it is they normally do and get them out of everybody elses hair. Russ seems to be obsessed with "what the competition players want/think" and unfortunately this is reflected in the design of CW.

Until I can Pug drop into CW without having to face 12 man comp teams, I'm done with CW. This really pisses me off because I was sooo looking forward to CW and it has turned out to nothing but a BJ for the comp teams.



.

[BourbonFaucet]

We're just not CSGO. We don't have enough players or people wanting to play competitively to support any kind of a 12 man system. And even in that game, you still only have 5 people working together, not 12.

[Bigbacon]

and I will say.... though it is beatable when they are attacking....Thunderspam is just boring and lame. 3 waves of bolts and an ECM light rush at the end.

[Tastian]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 21 January 2015 - 12:26 PM, said:

Well, I tried out CW again this morning, with the new patches, and it still sucks. It is still a waste of time if you are not in a 12 man pre-made. It is CW for elitist a--holes only. Pugs and small groups need not apply, unless you have a particular fondness for the "Cannon Fodder" role.

None of the proposed "fixes" by PGI or otherwise, will change this.

The way CW could become enjoyable for the majority of players is to do away with the 12x12 drops in favor of 4x4 drops.

You don't think it would be easy for 3 groups of 4 to sync drop in CW? Cause it would. Form 3 groups of 4. All 3 attack the same planet.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Tastian, on 21 January 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

You don't think it would be easy for 3 groups of 4 to sync drop in CW? Cause it would. Form 3 groups of 4. All 3 attack the same planet.

Of course they could. So could 4 groups of 4 or 6 groups or 2 groups or whatever. But on a individual match basis the comp teams advantage would be considerably reduced. Many of the Units (like mine for instance) that can't consistently put together a strong 12 man would be able to assemble a solid 4 man team and be able to compete on a more equal footing.

As a member of a strong 4 man team, I would definately prefer to square off against 4 Lords than to be a 4 man team plus 8 Pugs going against 12 Lords.

This would also benifit solo Pug droppers. It is MUCH easier for a Lance of 4 pugs to coordinate effectively than for a group of 12 Pugs.

Also, at the 4 man team level it would be much more practical for the MM to play Pugs against Pugs and Teams against Teams.

[jackal40]

Fragnot, on 21 January 2015 - 10:41 AM, said:

TL:DR Join a large Unit if you still want to hang on to a sense of that PuG lyfe.

Nope, did the "Unit" thing in WoT - not one of the frontline groups, but we were good sized. Not interested in all the backyard BS that goes on.

If joining a unit is a requirement to play CW - I'll not be playing ever.

Also, you unelected faction leaders who keep deciding "Attack here" and "Ceasefire with this group" are a big part of the problem as well. Those of us who had the time and made plans to play CW during the Christmas Holidays got a big fat F.U. with the wait times and the number of players available.

[C E Dwyer]

so pugs shouldn't play CW according to Russ

That's fine by me..

as long as PGi can churn out mechs that I'll get and grind,

[BourbonFaucet]

Cathy, on 21 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

so pugs shouldn't play CW according to Russ

And pugs are 84% of the playerbase! That means 84% of all players will never play CW. And now you know why there's nobody playing.

I gotta wonder when people will stop whining that games are designed for people worse than them at the game.

Edited by Techorse, 21 January 2015 - 02:42 PM.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Cathy, on 21 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

so pugs shouldn't play CW according to Russ

That's fine by me..

as long as PGi can churn out mechs that I'll get and grind,

I think the Russ quote was more along the line of Pugs shouldn't play CW if the goal is grinding C-Bills, or something to that effect.

I mostly spend my play time grinding new mechs as well, but I'm running out of candidates having mastered most of the "good" ones. The Resistance mechs next month will be a welcome addition to the old mech hanger.

CW "should" be a useful and fun alternative play mode and if Russ gets over trying to force everyone to play in 12 mans it might become enjoyable.

[Ax2Grind]

Stop misquoting Russ!

Russ also said that he will be merging MWO with My Little Pony. How dare he! I don't want to have to play with Bronies! Grrr! More indignant words here! Doesn't he know that we don't want rainbows being shot out of our AC cannons? Wait...rainbows shot out of AC cannons? Ok, I'm sold...

[Mystere]

Almond Brown, on 21 January 2015 - 09:08 AM, said:

You may want to verify the validity of the accuracy of what that Poster said. Otherwise I have a Bridge for Sale, that you would love, and it's cheap too.

What's wrong with you? Something heard by someone who told someone who whispered to someone's ear is as good as fact in these forums. Forum noob.

[oldradagast]

Flaming oblivion, on 20 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

I'm seeing 37 attackers 47 defenders across the entire ghostbear front this is primetime.

So I'm going to shoot for no.

But tbh the minute russ said PuGs shouldn't play CW in the townhall I snickered. Numbers went down immediately

Thing is you need pugs to make CW happen but PuGs don't want 12 mans

So the big question is

PGI do you want to make 12 mans or PuGs happy ?

The optional matchmaker idea that I've suggested before would handle this nicely.

Those who are PUG's, new to CW, in very small units, or just not good at the game mode yet could turn it on and only be paired against other new people of about equal skill.

The 12-mans could turn it off and face anything (except, of course, those who have the optional matchmaker turned on and who are not at that level of coordination or play.)

This idea was roundly shouted down by the various trolls and try-hards who have turned this forum and CW into their own personal playground and epeen polishing contest, because apparently rolling PUG's is a key part of the "skill" in CW, and getting rolled is supposedly "fun" because a few drunken masochists enjoy it since they believe "someday" they'll be the ones doing the rolling, fun be danged.

So, we're down to barely enough people to make matches, but I guess that's okay... because new players who get their faces kicked in from playing CW are *clearly* going to enjoy the experience and join one of the units that rolled them while spitting insults the whole time... right... that's how human nature works...

If "they" think they don't need PUG's and casual players for CW, they may as well shut that aspect of the game down now since soon enough, nobody will be playing it.

Edited by oldradagast, 21 January 2015 - 06:47 PM.

[jackal40]

Stomping PUGs is their method of recruiting for their units. Hence the "join a unit" mantra they all spout.

This PUG won't be playing CW until there is a way to put PUGs nearly equal to the 12-mans.

[Lukoi Banacek]

jackal40, on 21 January 2015 - 07:53 PM, said:

Stomping PUGs is their method of recruiting for their units. Hence the "join a unit" mantra they all spout.

This PUG won't be playing CW until there is a way to put PUGs nearly equal to the 12-mans.

Pugs do not need to be, nor will they ever be on par with organized, comms using 12s. Teamwork is OP.

What PUGs and smaller units need is a ROLE commensurate with what they bring to the table, that can impact CW.

[ZenFool]

Right now the role of pugs is obvious in CW. They even fixed the little button in the bottom right of your faction screen! Before, you would click on this button and wait for half the evening before finding a match. Now, in the IMPROVED CW!!!!!!, clicking on this button will launch you and eleven other people you've never heard of directly into the path of an organized group!

Welcome to the farm boys and girls.

[NotASecretAce]

It feels like they've nerfed the CW loyalty point gains and the cbills from CW matches... hard to stay interested when there's more profit in playing solo skirmishes >.< I only get about half of what I did a week or two ago

[Lukestah]

Fragnot, on 21 January 2015 - 10:41 AM, said:

For PuG players who feel as you do, my suggestion is to join the largest Unit you can find. That's what I did right after CW came out and I'm very glad I did.

Being in a really large Unit I think you get the best of both worlds. I do lots of PuG games everyday and can almost forget that I'm in a Unit sometimes, because being so large, you can easily be overlooked; which is sometimes what I enjoy. But when I do feel like doing team games I can always hop in TS and, because the unit is so large, there are always groups going I can join.

Because the Unit is so large I always feel like there is new people to meet. Because the Unit is so large I always have a team to join when I want. Because the Unit is so large I can go unnoticed if I feel like it. Because the Unit is so large I don't have an obligations except for ones I make for myself. Because the Unit is so large...that's what she said : P

TL:DR Join a large Unit if you still want to hang on to a sense of that PuG lyfe.

100% agree. I came back to MWO to checkout CW and did the same thing, joined the largest active unit in my time zone.

Last night got 3 x CW matches in during Australian prime time. Considering until this patch CW was dead in my timezone waiting times were reasonable and not a put off.

A global chat and a VOIP combined with the faction group capability should allow for PuG teams to form into effective 12-man teams.

Optimising mechs, modules, drop decks, etc., requires organisation both as a player and as a unit.

I think ideas like missions for smaller groups (e.g. a raid on airfield may suit a 4 v 4 or 8 v 8 match up) or using the current maps / modes should contribute to a CW outcomes for a given faction. If you are not in a 12-man team on voice comms you are at a distinct disadvantage.

More maps, scenarios, weight limits and incentives can broaden the appeal of different mechs for different missions.

Currently for the IS the Thunderbolt 9S is great on the current maps and drop deck weight limit constraints (e.g. 1 x 45 ton, 3 x 65 tons) so having one or more in your drop deck is probably optimal. However when a new map is introduced, or a new drop deck weight limit or indeed a 4x4 or 8x8 matches the meta winds will shift.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Boy, playing the objective in CW does not pay well....dear god


just now, 1 kill, 610 dmg, we won through destrruction of the gun.....97K total.....

Playing the obj in CW should pay the best.

It should be:

50K per gate gen-500XP
100K per shield gen-750xp
250K for the gun-1000xp-250GXP
Net pay: 650K just for the objectives+LP+performance pay+acheesement bonus+prem+champion. XP for obj 4250xp, 250GXP

Cuz seriously, it almost takes away the entire point of destroying the obj and not just fighting it out if were not gunna get paid for our efforts.



Also, on a slightly unrelated note, I thought the (C)(I) Clan mechs gave a 30% Cbill boost.....do they not anymore? I only have been getting my 2.5% xp for the 8/8 pods.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 21 January 2015 - 11:18 PM.

[DaynarFaol]

Russ has said such game modes are in the works.

Say it with me folks:

"We have had CW for a MONTH."

Let them build content for it. Now that PGI owns the rights they have been busting butt to get things built.

Last Town Hall: 1 new CW map a Month starting Feb.

Resistance Mechs start dropping next month (Hello Enforcer)

New Game Mode for Counter-Attack

Varible drop deck tonnage and also 4 vs 4 and 8 vs 8 missions as well.

This is just the START of CW guys.

So just chill and give it at least until they get us to at least 5 maps and the new game mode.

I read reviews when all there was was like 3 maps and Assault and Conquest when the game got going. The reviews loved the graphics and thought the game play was too repetitive.

PGI is not like Ubisoft with facilities in twenty countries and the manpower to grind out games.

It is going to take time. And they kept their word that before X-mas we would get the CW BETA.

Beta as in things will change, and change rapidly.