178 replies to this topic

[ZenFool]

The comments from pug haters are always the same. They always state that someone is "whining". Seriously. I don't think its whining to mention when something is seriously wrong. If you, as a player, don't see whats wrong with alienating a large group of the population then you really need to pull your head out. I say this as someone who regularly group drops now that CW is out, insulting people will not get them to play. Saying their whining for explaining their point of view doesn't help anyone.

I do know that one side must always lose, and sometimes there will be stomps. I do think that some of the pugs should "man" up. I do think that ultimately they should join a team. Having said that, I also can completely understand their side of things. I've never heard in group comms "Oh no, a pug group, we might lose!" It is a foregone conclusion that we will win unless we are just being silly, trying a weird strat, or teething a group of our newer players.

P.S. As soon as someone says "special snowflake or salty" I stop taking them seriously. You only think your cool. You only think those are original. You have the entire English language plus many others, come up with your own material please.

[Hardin4188]

Biggest Salami, on 22 January 2015 - 06:04 PM, said:

Who's this "we all"? Because I'm pretty sure no one told me that CW was only supposed to be an option for premade team players. As a PUG princess I don't actually have a problem with CW re: pugging, but the way you act as if puggers are not welcome and shouldn't be trying to play CW is ridiculous.

Your argument isn't "CW is fine for puggers". Your argument is "LOL dumb puggers should have known CW wasn't for them." WTH.

Yes dumb puggers should have known CW wasn't for them. It's for intelligent ones, who know how to cooperate.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

WarHippy, on 22 January 2015 - 01:19 PM, said:

I play solo and I have had little trouble doing well as an individual. I have been in games where my group of 12 randoms pugs was smashed by a 12 man team, I have been in games where 12 random pugs beat the 12 man team, and I have been in games where it ended in 48 kills to 46. A big problem most of us pugs have is our defeatist attitude where we give up before the fight even starts because we assume we can't win. You clearly fall into the category of "give up before anything happens" and frankly you are your own worst enemy. Kind of sad really.

Apparently my comment about elitist a__holes stuck a little too close to home. But hey if a player is happy being a boot licker for 12 man groups that's their business.

[Yokaiko]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 22 January 2015 - 07:50 PM, said:

Apparently my comment about elitist a__holes stuck a little too close to home. But hey if a player is happy being a boot licker for 12 man groups that's their business.

If you drop solo into an 11 man I would call that good luck, I'd follow along and be happy if I won.

[Mystere]

Biggest Salami, on 22 January 2015 - 06:04 PM, said:

Who's this "we all"? Because I'm pretty sure no one told me that CW was only supposed to be an option for premade team players. As a PUG princess I don't actually have a problem with CW re: pugging, but the way you act as if puggers are not welcome and shouldn't be trying to play CW is ridiculous.

Your argument isn't "CW is fine for puggers". Your argument is "LOL dumb puggers should have known CW wasn't for them." WTH.

PGI never said CW was only for premade teams. Only players with bad reading comprehension skills thought so and spread the (false) word. And others took their word as gospel instead of verifying the statement's veracity. That goes for both sides of the silly argument, by the way.

Edited by Mystere, 22 January 2015 - 08:15 PM.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Mystere, on 22 January 2015 - 08:15 PM, said:

PGI never said CW was only for premade teams. Only players with bad reading comprehension skills thought so and spread the (false) word. And others took their word as gospel instead of verifying the statement's veracity. That goes for both sides of the silly argument, by the way.

This discussion isn't really about what PGI said, as others have noted, what they say today doesn't necessarily determine what they do tomorrow.

This is about the objective observed reality that the way PGI has structured CW only 12 man pre-mades have anything resembling a level playing field. Pugs and small Units win occasionally against the 12 man pre-mades but the odds are very small.

The way CW is currently structured a player has to choose between joining a 12 man team or settling for the role of "designated loser".

Apparently, before my time, MWO players went thru the same BS in the regular queue where the pre-made teams were ruining the game for everyone else. Now we have a open queue where Pugs can enjoy the game and win or lose based on their play and pre-mades have to "man up" and battle other pre-mades instead of getting their jollies bashing Pugs and noobs.

PGI appears to have not learned the lesson the first time and is repeating the same mistake they made in the original roll-out of MWO.

From the comments here there are obviously some players that enjoy getting butt stomped on a regular basis and some that feel good about massacring less experienced, less organized players.

If CW continues to be structured to appeal to these S&M sicko's most players will find something better to do with their time, PGI's revenue stream will dry up and MWO will die.

[Bigbacon]

There was a very good discussion on the round table last night about the solo/small group vs the pre-made teams. Pretty much they agree it is a problem. It keeps people away from CW if they have to wait forever only to get "rolfstomped" (they used this term a lot)

The more folks that play it, the less chance of having to fight the pre-made there is but getting them to join is the issue.

Not that all 12 man teams are going to kick your butt but that seems to be what happens most of the time.

The pre-mades also need to just realize, they need the solo/small groups. At least many are starting to realize that and that is a good thing.



We need to see what happen with VOIP and better grouping comes about. it wont 100% fix getting stomped by a high level 12 man, but I think it could bring about closer match and wouldn't complain if the rounds were close win or lose.

[TWIAFU]

jackal40, on 21 January 2015 - 07:53 PM, said:

Stomping PUGs is their method of recruiting for their units. Hence the "join a unit" mantra they all spout.

This PUG won't be playing CW until there is a way to put PUGs nearly equal to the 12-mans.

And how, pray tell, do you make equal the guy who plays by him/herself with 12 that play with each other?

The only answer is for the guy that plays by himself to join 11 others and cooperatively take on that 12 man. Now you will be equal.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mystere, on 22 January 2015 - 02:28 PM, said:

OMFG! This is a 100% repeat of the public queues.

I am now willing to bet what the next screaming will be about once this "idea" is placed in the CW queues:

• "4-man teams are the Devil incarnate. We solos demand a solo-only CW queue. We do not want to fight against any groups. PGI, do it nao or I will rage quit!"

• "People are synch dropping! PGI fix this stupid thing nao!!!"

By the way, I only play solo.

have you been reading Radigast's posts he wants the "Option" to have PUG only, You are to late, its already suggested.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Bigbacon, on 23 January 2015 - 07:24 AM, said:

There was a very good discussion on the round table last night about the solo/small group vs the pre-made teams. Pretty much they agree it is a problem. It keeps people away from CW if they have to wait forever only to get "rolfstomped" (they used this term a lot)

Sounds interesting.....What roundtable?

[Ragnar Bashmek]

TWIAFU, on 23 January 2015 - 07:33 AM, said:

And how, pray tell, do you make equal the guy who plays by him/herself with 12 that play with each other?

The only answer is for the guy that plays by himself to join 11 others and cooperatively take on that 12 man. Now you will be equal.

Not really, we basically have that now and it rarely succeeds..

The answer is to limit pre-mades to playing other pre-mades and let Pugs play other Pugs. Pugs vs Pugs with VOIP and Faction wide chat for grouping would be fun.

[Bigbacon]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 08:18 AM, said:

Sounds interesting.....What roundtable?

NGNG had a CW chat last night.

[WarHippy]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 22 January 2015 - 07:50 PM, said:

Apparently my comment about elitist a__holes stuck a little too close to home. But hey if a player is happy being a boot licker for 12 man groups that's their business.

Apparently my implication of you being lazy and sad bordering on pathetic was pretty spot on.

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

The way CW is currently structured a player has to choose between joining a 12 man team or settling for the role of "designated loser".

Not really no. Like I have said one can do well as a individual, but as an individual you are just one piece of a much larger puzzle. The 12 mans are bigger pieces and have a more obvious effect on the puzzle, but that doesn't diminish the effect lone players can play. Look at it this way a group of pugs may not beat the 12 man group, but if they actually try instead of give up then they can keep that 12 man occupied for awhile allowing your factions groups to tally up wins in other games. Its about seeing the bigger picture and understanding you are not going to single handedly win CW, but that doesn't mean you can't contribute to the end result win or lose.

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

Apparently, before my time, MWO players went thru the same BS in the regular queue where the pre-made teams were ruining the game for everyone else. Now we have a open queue where Pugs can enjoy the game and win or lose based on their play and pre-mades have to "man up" and battle other pre-mades instead of getting their jollies bashing Pugs and noobs.

PGI appears to have not learned the lesson the first time and is repeating the same mistake they made in the original roll-out of MWO.

What PGI learned is catering to the people crying about groups lost them a lot of players. People want to be able to group up and play with their friends, but that was made nearly impossible. A lot of groups forced to choose between playing together and playing solo chose the third option and went to a different game. The only mistake PGI could repeat at this point is listening to players like you again.

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

From the comments here there are obviously some players that enjoy getting butt stomped on a regular basis and some that feel good about massacring less experienced, less organized players.

Yeah, I'm sure that's it, or maybe some players actually enjoy a challenge instead.

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

If CW continues to be structured to appeal to these S&M sicko's most players will find something better to do with their time, PGI's revenue stream will dry up and MWO will die.

[Dawnstealer]

Lily from animove, on 20 January 2015 - 03:51 PM, said:

faction wide grouping, this will help to make soem solo's come back and attachign them to a group.

This - I was able to actually drop a couple times in an hour last night, which is the first time that's happened on as a solo on a non-weekend for a bit.

[Hardin4188]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 08:24 AM, said:

Not really, we basically have that now and it rarely succeeds..

The answer is to limit pre-mades to playing other pre-mades and let Pugs play other Pugs. Pugs vs Pugs with VOIP and Faction wide chat for grouping would be fun.

This really isn't something anyone would want. If this were to happen and pugs could not fight pre mades then we will see increased wait times and more ghost drops, because pugs will not be able to defend a planet from a premade group.

No, the solution is simply to work together. Familiarize yourself with the other puggers and coordination will happen naturally. In game voice will help pugs a great deal.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

This discussion isn't really about what PGI said, as others have noted, what they say today doesn't necessarily determine what they do tomorrow.

This is about the objective observed reality that the way PGI has structured CW only 12 man pre-mades have anything resembling a level playing field. Pugs and small Units win occasionally against the 12 man pre-mades but the odds are very small.

The way CW is currently structured a player has to choose between joining a 12 man team or settling for the role of "designated loser".

Apparently, before my time, MWO players went thru the same BS in the regular queue where the pre-made teams were ruining the game for everyone else. Now we have a open queue where Pugs can enjoy the game and win or lose based on their play and pre-mades have to "man up" and battle other pre-mades instead of getting their jollies bashing Pugs and noobs.

PGI appears to have not learned the lesson the first time and is repeating the same mistake they made in the original roll-out of MWO.

From the comments here there are obviously some players that enjoy getting butt stomped on a regular basis and some that feel good about massacring less experienced, less organized players.

If CW continues to be structured to appeal to these S&M sicko's most players will find something better to do with their time, PGI's revenue stream will dry up and MWO will die.

Nope only a loser thinks that way. Someone with a competitive nature would find it a challenge. Which I do. You never know how competent you are until you face adversity. I suck in Lights. I do not ask for them to be made more powerful to use or for others to be "Nerfed" because I deserve to have fun in a light.

[Mystere]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 January 2015 - 07:50 AM, said:

have you been reading Radigast's posts he wants the "Option" to have PUG only, You are to late, its already suggested.

WTF?!!! Where is is stated?

Just to be clear, is it just in "suggested" state right now, or will PGI will do it?

Because if the latter, WTF?!!!

[Mystere]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 January 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

Nope only a loser thinks that way. Someone with a competitive nature would find it a challenge. Which I do. You never know how competent you are until you face adversity. I suck in Lights. I do not ask for them to be made more powerful to use or for others to be "Nerfed" because I deserve to have fun in a light.

Well, it could be a loser or someone who grew up with a lot of these:

[Mystere]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

This is about the objective observed reality that the way PGI has structured CW only 12 man pre-mades have anything resembling a level playing field. Pugs and small Units win occasionally against the 12 man pre-mades but the odds are very small.

Please speak for yourself. Your odds may be very low, but not everyone else's.

You seem to think that all 12-man teams that get matched against you are of the "elite" level. And maybe to you they are. Your defeatist attitude seems to indicate as such, perfectly illustrated below:

Ragnar Bashmek, on 23 January 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

The way CW is currently structured a player has to choose between joining a 12 man team or settling for the role of "designated loser".

[Amsro]

CW is all kinds of broken, like Ghost Heat before it and Matchmaker before that. Any programming is a lost cause, I don't think they have the right people for the job in all of the main areas.

Art department is about the only truly great thing from PGI.