233 replies to this topic

[Blue Footed Booby]

Heading? Legging? I'm all for crotching.

[Melthir]

In the words of a crazy barbarian "Go for the eyes Boo, go for the eyes." If i see an Mech walking around with a damaged leg I'm going to blow that leg off. Same as i would if i saw you limping in paintball. Makes for an easier target for the follow up shot.

[wanderer]

Blue Footed Booby, on 21 July 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

Heading? Legging? I'm all for crotching.

I see a healthy future for you in the Confederation involving a Catapult and as many Streak SRMs as you can find.

[The Outlaw Kazzen]

I do so love philisophical debates on the proper way of reducing your enemy to a boiling pool of slag.

[Squidhead Jax]

The Outlaw Kazzen, on 22 July 2012 - 10:34 AM, said:

I do so love philisophical debates on the proper way of reducing your enemy to a boiling pool of slag.

If identifiable slag remains, you're not hitting hard enough.

[Tank]

I just leave this link to video, some may find it interesting.

[Milkman Luke]

Grim pragmatism. The Chinese way of getting **** done.

[Haruyuki]

IMTatsu, on 29 June 2012 - 07:09 AM, said:

There's been considerable activity in other forums, so I thought I'd bring it here. From the beginning of time, in as much as it relates to us here, we have followed the Honor Code of mech combat, primarily defined as: 1. No Heading 2. No Legging 3. No Unnecessary Beatdown of an Incapacitated Foe. With the potential massive influx of the new 'Pepsi Generation', they're understanding is 'Play to Win'. Every rule of warfare they've ever been subjected to up to this point is 'By Any Means Necessary' Battletech purists would argue that the most effective method of mech combat completely contradicts the Honor Code we have traditionally clung to. If the game employs salvage rules, this is going to be an even more important topic. Here it is gang. What do you think?

I understand the honorable sentiments for which you have chosen to set yourself upon this steep uphill path.
I will wholeheartedly agree that rule no.3 is indeed honorable and respectable, but I feel that rule no.2 is not viable and rule no.1 is leaves me feeling rather surprised.

Allow us to view these rules in numerical order and discuss them. I will point out at this time that I am not being sarcastic, but am employing a method of arguing how silly this sounds. Please bear with me and do not take this as an insult. Allow me to begin. Shooting the head would require skill. Now, I haven't tried the beta, but I would assume that as in the past, the hit box for the head would be rather small. As stated by myself, this would mean that a degree of skill would be needed to perform head shots. Furthermore, different mechs would definitely have head shot boxes of different shapes and sizes.

If the argument that head shots shorten the degree of fun as it kills opponents too fast, then I will go on to counter by suggesting that arm shots should not be made either. While not crippling and while arms shots do not mean that the enemy is defenseless, you might be taking out a great deal of their armaments. The counter to this would be to simply target the enemy's center torso at all times and slug it out.

Having already established that skill is not a factor, and since we are worried that new players are unable to target as fast as veterans, I will then go on to motion that we should stand still facing each other and just slug it out. To lessen the possibility of unequal play, I would once more go on to suggest that everyone uses Atlases. The loadout will be the same, as will armor.

This is why it doesn't sound right. I fully understand the noble sentiments behind the idea, but it's just not feasible. To restrict headshots, is certainly a step too far in my honest opinion. To restrict skill is akin to making this a slug fest.

I will now address legging. Assume you are in an assault mech and you have a pesky light mech shooting you in the rear. What will you do? As a veteran, you can surely deal with it, but we all know it can be annoying. It doesn't even have to be a light mech... I do recall a rather annoying Thanatos with ECM and multiple LBX-10s... Now, imagine the person controlling the assault mech is a new player, while the light mech pilot is a veteran? The new player is not going to have fun at all. He probably won't have the skill or know how to counter the light mech, especially if he's trying to limit himself to torso shots. The new player will be annoyed. The counter to this would be making a rule that bans the attacking of rear armor... but what are light mech pilots going to do then? They certainly cannot go head to head with an assault mech... certainly not without attempting a headshot, but we have already established that that too is banned.

The alternative is allowing the assault mech to take down the light mech anyway possible... although I must admit that intentionally trying to hit a light mech in the legs can be rather hard... (Yes Raven, I'm looking at you...)

As I mentioned that I like rule No.1, I hope you are not intending to include overheating. It would be pretty sad if your opponents exploit the rule by alphastriking you repeatedly until they overheat... leaving you unable to do anything when they shutdown. It's back to the slug feast yet again... (this time with a valid and plausible reason for being unable to move...)

I have made this post not to discourage you, rather, I have done so to ask that perhaps you might want to update the rules. Everything evolves and nothing can stay stagnant. To be stagnant is to be outdated and irrelevant.

I on my part do love House Liao, but due to certain real world considerations will be going with House Kurita (which I also greatly love). In the typical classical Chinese honor (The code of Xia as practiced by the jianghu), I pledge to face you honorably by my own standards. To be gracious in both victory and defeat, to avoid beating down an opponent when they are incapacitated and to treat my opponents with respect. Respect dictates that when I am fighting you, I will attempt to defeat you to the best of my abilities without holding back; to do otherwise would be disrespectful on my part and would shame us both; you for "apparently" not being a worthy foe and me for choosing to shame you.

On a sidenote:

For those of you who keep on repeating that bushido is a Japanese thing, you are absolutely right!
However, to say the Chinese do not have something similar would be wrong.

Please go and read up on Wulin, Jianghu and the Code of Xia. Finally read up on the Wuxia (which literally translates into Martial Hero).

[Stalkerr]

Honor made complete sense when we were in Solaris and weren't actually at war. Now, in an actual war simulation? Victory at any cost. Done.

[justin xiang]

I hope you like drumsticks cause I'm about to have a whole bucket of Davion Fried Mech legs. Nothing I love more, whether it was in MW2 or the table top BattleTech, is seeing a mech fall over without a leg.

[Adridos]

justin xiang, on 28 July 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

I hope you like drumsticks cause I'm about to have a whole bucket of Davion Fried Mech legs. Nothing I love more, whether it was in MW2 or the table top BattleTech, is seeing a mech fall over without a leg.

They'll only limp, however, and to quote Bryan: "We have found that our beta users don't leg."

[Veevslav]

AceTimberwolf, on 29 June 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

If you are going to Role Play leave the "Bushido" Code of Honor to the Kuritans and the Combine. House Liao and the rest of the Capellans have no honor. By being of House Liao You are allowed to use every underhanded Tactic in the book

Kuritans and honor do not belong in the same sentence.... They role play at honor but have none.... Just look at the long line of coordinators......

Smoke Jaguar acted just like them and they get offended at the honor-less behaviour...... And accuse The jags of having no honor......... Pot calling the pot black and wanting him punished for being so......

[Hajima Kuroko]

Having just read this story, this was fresh in my mind:

"You in the Clans try to wrap up war in a pretty little box. As long as you can keep the world on the outside of the box clean and safe, you don’t care what bloody horrors you spawn on the inside.”

“That is a lie.”

“But they have not yet built the box that can hold war. As you are about to learn.”

“You are a monster.” The woman’s voice shook with emotion.

“Maybe so, but I am winning.”

“There can be no true victory without honor,” she said firmly.

“Really? Now who is hiding behind words?

Sho-sa Shintaro Yamada of the DCMS speaking with Star Commander Birgit of Clan Ghost Bear, "Of War and Peace and Cherry Trees, Pt II" by Steven Mohan, Jr.

Edited by Hajima Kuroko, 02 August 2012 - 04:24 AM.

[Kharnifex]

Please invent a hilarious honour code system for yourselves and try to actually put it into play.

[Fl3tcher]

Kharnifex, on 02 August 2012 - 04:51 AM, said:

Please invent a hilarious honour code system for yourselves and try to actually put it into play.

This.


An interesting argument, but just remember. . 99% of the people who will play MW:O are simply here to blow **** up.

In 6 months time MW:O will be all about which is the best mech to fit with the best build to kill other mechs.

You can deny that, but as in all FPSMMOGs it will happen.

[Cutama]

Fl3tcher, on 02 August 2012 - 05:08 AM, said:

This.


An interesting argument, but just remember. . 99% of the people who will play MW:O are simply here to blow **** up.

In 6 months time MW:O will be all about which is the best mech to fit with the best build to kill other mechs.

You can deny that, but as in all FPSMMOGs it will happen.

Well I don't know about this.

I think MWO will be more on teams and working together as a unit. The devs have said that no one mech is going to overwhelm the other team. Each have their roles they are suited to. The Atlas has the most weapons and armor but is still vulnerable to a smart and capable Jenner.

And who is to say how this will progress with the role warefare which is something that i have not personally experienced in previous MW games so I for one am very excited to see how that comes about.

[Ryuishi]

A Warrior without Bushido, is a Warrior without Honor, Purpose or a Soul.

[SakuranoSenshi]

I'm always honourable in my Atlas. I grant the quickest death possible with massive use of firepower, especially if you stand still so I can make it a clean shot.

[NoirWolf]

I will fight ingame the same way I fight in real life: no quarter, no mercy. The code of Bushido is a fun thing to discuss but in real life it does not get **** done and ingame being all peppy and honourable may be an option but aside from maybe entertaining the notion of a fair duel (IE 1vs1 with everything allowed in my conception) there will be nothing standing between the muzzle of my AC/PPC and my target except air.

Edited by NoirWolf, 02 August 2012 - 08:08 AM.

[Cutama]

SakuranoSenshi, on 02 August 2012 - 07:52 AM, said:

I'm always honourable in my Atlas. I grant the quickest death possible with massive use of firepower, especially if you stand still so I can make it a clean shot.

Truely a giver....