594 replies to this topic

[Divine Retribution]

Appogee, on 12 February 2015 - 11:55 PM, said:

Clan QQers got their wish on the Thunderbolt 9S, restoring their significant DPS-at-range advantage..

Wonder if we can outrange that CERLL vomit...

BLR-1S
Specialty
Armor Strength (RA&LA) +14
Missile Weapon Cooldown +12.5%
Missile Weapon Heat Gen -12.5%
Laser Duration -12.5%
Energy Weapon Range +25%
Medium Laser Heat Gen -10%
Energy Weapon Heat Gen -10%

1S with ERLL and range module = max optimal range of 911.25m. Being able to touch the clans from 1822.5m doesn't seem like a terrible idea. Add in the duration and heat gen buffs, the 1S can be more than a LRM boat. BLR-1S ERLL vomit inbound. Nice high-mounted energy points, good speed for an assault and a STD engine.

Or a mix of LRM and laser vomit that worked well for me when I bothered to use LRMs at all. BLR-1S ERLL/LRM mix has the 1822.5m ERLL touch with a dose of LRM goodness. Oh right and 25% bonus range (937.5m total range) on that TAG. Eat that magic jesus box bringers!

Edited by Divine Retribution, 13 February 2015 - 02:27 AM.

[VIPER2207]

Sean Lang, on 12 February 2015 - 01:56 PM, said:

BLR-1D
Specialty
Armor Strength (RA&LA) +14
PPC Velocity +20%
Medium Laser Duration -10%
Laser Duration -10%
Energy Weapon Range +12.5%
Energy Weapon Cooldown +12.5%
Ballistic Weapon Cooldown +12.5%
Ballistic Weapon Velocity +12.5%

[Appogee]

Divine Retribution, on 13 February 2015 - 02:13 AM, said:

1S with ERLL and range module = max optimal range of 911.25m. Being able to touch the clans from 1822.5m doesn't seem like a terrible idea. Add in the duration and heat gen buffs, the 1S can be more than a LRM boat. BLR-1S ERLL vomit inbound. Nice high-mounted energy points, good speed for an assault and a STD engine.

Good thinking, thanks. How would the heat management compare to the Clan laser vomits?

Duke Nedo, on 13 February 2015 - 12:04 AM, said:

You can't argue that this doesn't affect IS vs Clan balance though, so I am all for some agility nerf on Timber and a hitbox fix for the Stormcrow....

Yeah, I was expecting that when they inevitably nerfed the 9S they'd also do something about the laser vomit Timbies and Crow hitboxes. But no, only the IS got hit with the nerf bat, apparently.

[Ursh]

I like that the Ilya Muromets quirks reflect the build I found most effective in it anyways, 3xAC5 + 3xMlas.

Kudos.

[Divine Retribution]

Appogee, on 13 February 2015 - 02:26 AM, said:

Good thinking, thanks. How would the heat management compare to the Clan laser vomits?

7.2 heat for 9 damage (IS) vs. 10 heat for 11 damage (Clan). IS ERLL duration is close to a half second shorter than the CERLL too. For comparison with double basics unlocked:

The BLR-1S I posted shows 57% cooling efficiency (in weaponlab) but runs at 63% cooling efficiency once the quirks are taken into consideration. For comparison I just slapped 4 CERLL and as many DHS as I could on a Warhawk, which showed a 63% cooling efficiency w/ double basics. The Warhawk can do more burst damage (44 vs. 36) but the BLR-1S has longer range, same heat efficiency, and a shorter beam duration. Basically it's a better WHK for the long range game.

Just hope me pointing it out doesn't get the BLR-1S beaten to death by a nerf bat before I get to try it out.

The 1-3 CERLL + some CERML builds (meds and heavies) are generally hotter as well.

EDIT: numbers were off, getting tired.

Edited by Divine Retribution, 13 February 2015 - 02:59 AM.

[Lily from animove]

looks mostly fne nothing looks overqurked so far, but the LOCUST? seriously? the structure buffs at these components? are you serious?

Most locus I kill, die by getting your badly shaped CT/ST blown off. I doubt that arm and leg HP really help them as much.



I mean look at it, you aim at the middle, you fire, poof somethign blows, and with XL it's dead. Even form the side, who is even aiming on the arms? the entire middle sideprofile is the vulnerable deadly area. so 50% armor strength for a section a skilled player does not even aim at? strange choice.

Edited by Lily from animove, 13 February 2015 - 02:44 AM.

[Degalus]

lol. Funny to see how many IS Player whine about thier BONUS BUFFS / Quirks.
Srly its like noone was able to beat 1 clanmech ever without quirks...

You got a BONUS to your mechs and complain that they are not the one you wanted?... Srly?

Currently its way more fun to drive a Quirkmech then a Clanmech.
IS have way cooler (heat) weapons with quirks then clans, oh and dont forget the pin point dmg (I LOVE the IS AC 20)
And hey, also with the Omnipods you still stuck with only a hand full of useable builds on Clanside and IS get soon maaany Quirks for all IS Mech that make a weaponsystem better then Stock. So what you want more? (beside of a "i win vs Clans" button)

What i want to say with this is...

Just be happy with your BONUS BUFFS and dont be so unthankful...

Sry for my tone in this post but it just makes me angry when people complain about BUFFs...

[goatreich]

More important than quirks? when are the old mechs going to be updated with new geometry? Dragon, cataphract and awesome need some love and be able to display what they really have in the loadout...

As for quirks, I will survive despite all.

[xengk]

Quote

TBT-LoupDeGuerre
Specialty
Additional Structure (RA&LA) +8
Missile Weapon Cooldown +10%
Missile Weapon Range +10%
Medium Pulse Range +7.5%
Energy Weapon Range +7.5%
Energy Weapon Heat Gen -10%
Energy Weapon Cooldown +10%
Torso yaw speed +25%

I am glad the missile quirk is now generic, instead of SRM4 specified.
I run my LG with mix of SRM4 and SRM6, and have to install modules for SRM6 to synch the 2 launchers. (I know it is more optimal to run all SRM4 but I like the punch of having dual SRM6)

[Appogee]

Divine Retribution, on 13 February 2015 - 02:40 AM, said:

7.2 heat for 9 damage (IS) vs. 10 heat for 11 damage (Clan). IS ERLL duration is close to a half second shorter than the CERLL too. For comparison with double basics unlocked:

The BLR-1S I posted shows 49% cooling efficiency but runs at 63% cooling efficiency once the quirks are taken into consideration. For comparison I just slapped 4 CERLL and as many DHS as I could on a Warhawk, which showed a 55% cooling efficiency. The Warhawk can do more burst damage (44 vs. 36) but the BLR-1S has longer range, better heat efficiency, and a shorter beam duration. Basically better in every other way than the WHK.

Just hope me pointing it out doesn't get the BLR-1S beaten to death by a nerf bat before I get to try it out.

The 1-3 CERLL + some CERML builds (meds and heavies) are generally hotter as well.

Very nice work, thanks for sharing it.

[Appogee]

Ursh, on 13 February 2015 - 02:30 AM, said:

I like that the Ilya Muromets quirks reflect the build I found most effective in it anyways, 3xAC5 + 3xMlas.

Kudos.

I've always preferred the 3UAC5 with 3MLs. I might change to AC5s for the additional ammo and bigger engine, now.

[Karl Streiger]

INCOMMING!

Check the figures.
Do you like the Wubverine - do you think its dead?
ITS NOT

DO NOT REMOVE YOUR LPL!
the LL even with better quirks is inferior to the LPL.

STAY WITH LPL nothing did change. Heck they can even remove all "Energy Weapon" Quirks for the Wubverine - and still the Tripple LPL Wubverine is superior.

Edited by Karl Streiger, 13 February 2015 - 03:11 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Sean Lang, on 12 February 2015 - 02:07 PM, said:

It actually got more refined to be fair. The 9S shines from long range combat, so it got increased 'PPC Velocity' so time to target will be reduced. But the trade is less overall dps (reduced heat). So it will still shine at long range engagements, but if pressed it won't be able to handle quick engagements (such as brawling).

Why?

Quote

Based on the older 5SS model, the 9S was built in 3050 by Olivetti Weaponry using off-the-shelf structural components and armor after extensive changes delayed production. The 'Mech is armed with a Defiance 1001 ER PPC in its right arm as its primary long-range firepower. This is supported at closer ranges by an TharHes Maxi SRM-6 in the left torso along with the original three medium lasers. While retaining the left arm machine guns, in the right torso it carries a pair of Zippo flamers and a SureFire 444 Anti-Missile System along with one ton of AMS ammo.[8] BV (1.0) = 1,244, BV (2.0) = 1,494[22]

With only ONE Long Range Weapon, why does this Mech need to Shine at long range?

[meteorol]

Wait what, the 9S will get a nerf on the heat quirk? no one saw that coming
inb4 ThisMachineKillsFacists:

ThisMachineKillsFascists, on 09 January 2015 - 03:24 AM, said:

FolgenRuss Bullock‏[color=#8899A6][color=#B1BBC3]@[/color]russ_bullock[/color][/color][/color]

[color=#959595][color=#66B5D2]@[/color]cimarbs[color=#66B5D2]@[/color]LilPika[color=#66B5D2]@[/color]Wolfofthevoid I only said I reduced some in the past and I am not adverse to doing that again[/color]

Turns out you were dead wrong on this one, eh?

[Lily from animove]

goatreich, on 13 February 2015 - 02:51 AM, said:

More important than quirks? when are the old mechs going to be updated with new geometry? Dragon, cataphract and awesome need some love and be able to display what they really have in the loadout...

As for quirks, I will survive despite all.

never? youc na nto make geometry updates without destroying what they are, thas why they get structure HP buffs. dragon got amazing buffs for the geometry it has and is very tanky now.

[El Bandito]

Joseph Mallan, on 13 February 2015 - 03:13 AM, said:

Why?

With only ONE Long Range Weapon, why does this Mech need to Shine at long range?

[Jakob Knight]

Fate 6, on 12 February 2015 - 07:59 PM, said:

You entirely missed the point. It had no weakness and it outperformed all other IS mechs. It's balanced as a sniper now, and can't brawl as effectively as before, though it can certainly still defend itself up close. It's on the same level as clans now, whereas before it was actually better in the hands of a good pilot.

I'm afraid it is you who missed the point. The point isn't to balance it against other IS mechs, but against -Clan- mechs. That was the point of the Quirk system. Every mech doesn't have to have a weakness, nor did it matter that it outperformed other IS mechs -against Clan mechs-. What mattered was that it could match Clan mechs in effectiveness, and now it cannot, despite what you claim. There is no way the TDR-9S is as robust as a Hellbringer, for instance, when both are at the same speed and mounting the same weapons.

The TDR might be balanced against Inner Sphere mechs, but that only means it is now inferior once again to Clan units, which is entirely counter to the purpose of adding quirks to the mech.

As for the 'no weakness and outpeformed all other IS mechs', how is this rationale then not applied to the Timberwolf, the Stormcrow, the Dire Wolf, ect? If every mech needs to not outperform any other mech in the game, then why only nerf the TDR-9S, and not all other mechs with 'no weakness' (and if you say the Dire Wolf's slow speed was it's weakness, the same can be said for the TDR when compared to the Timberwolf or Hellbringer, so that's a non-issue)?

Edited by Jakob Knight, 13 February 2015 - 03:49 AM.

[o0Marduk0o]

The Wakelord, on 13 February 2015 - 01:54 AM, said:

Remind me why to play the 3M?
1E = 1AMS, 6E
3M = 2AMS, 4E

1E seems a lot better
Sad both hit so hard though.

Yes, they made the 3M and to a lesser extend the 1E useless with the removal of laser range quirks. The 1E can do almost everything better now and without weapon specific quirks you can build the same weapons in both, just less in a 3M.

No idea who thought the change was necessary.

[Devil Fox]

Won't someone think about the Clans!

On a real note, if quirks are coming down to their base load-outs... well half the stock loads on most IS mechs are the same flavour across the chassis. I'm more pissed that their assigning quirks based on these stock weapon systems which effectively kill that variant. Look at the Loup De Guerre:

Quote

TBT-LoupDeGuerre
Specialty
Additional Structure (RA&LA) +8
Missile Weapon Cooldown +10%
Missile Weapon Range +10%
Medium Pulse Range +7.5%
Energy Weapon Range +7.5%
Energy Weapon Heat Gen -10%
Energy Weapon Cooldown +10%
Torso yaw speed +25%

You notice it has a ton of energy generalist quirks and MPL quirks... it has 2... yes TWO energy hardpoints compared to the 4 missile hardpoints. Any decent build on the Loup was brawler based with SRM 4's... I used 2xPPC 2xSRM4 to level and fell into the 4xASRM4 2xML brawler in group play. The old SRM quirks gave it the extra life as a brawler and let you trade above your weight as a 50t machine with bad hitboxes and the desperate need for an XL.

But that energy quirks... and tonnage wasting MPL one to boot... I can't think of any build off hand that would make use of that simply because the weight of MPL on a tonnage sparse mech is massive, and the fact that those arms are damage soakers, so extended fights (or just when it's full alpha fests) you'll lose the point of the majority of your quirk decision.

Seriously think there should be better consultation with actual players, and not users of the forum warrior cliche... good ideas do come from here, but why is it always the whiners that get their way...

Edited by Apostal Sinclair, 13 February 2015 - 04:25 AM.

[totgeboren]

The Wubverine nerf feels extremely excessive. Sure, it was perhaps a bit too much quirking, but a simple nerf of say the range buff would have been enough, considering the bad hardpoint locations and no jjs.

Now there will only be a single medium mech with any LPL quirks, the BJ-1X.

Incredibly boring.