84 replies to this topic

[InspectorG]

Wild Kadabra, on 28 April 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

It was bad enough, very very bad when clan had laser vomit meta, now IS seems to have laser vomit meta too with only TDRs and Stalkers with large lasers in CW, why not simply remove all other mechs that are not SCRs, TBRs, HBRs, Stalkers and Thunderbolts!!! Also remove all laser heat may as well! Lets turn this into a full light show rave party!

Lasers. Wave of the future.

[ThisMachineKillsFascists]

PPl were complaining about the thunderbold and its high mounted 3 er ppc weapons. I tell you something. The stalker is the most obnixious mech i faced in cw hiding behind wall shooting 6 ErLL at you while 2% of the mech is visible for you.
Good luck replying the fire

InspectorG, on 29 April 2015 - 06:05 AM, said:

Lasers. Wave of the future.

Ikr even the usa switched to lahzor wapons. THE only future LAzohrs

Edited by ThisMachineKillsFascists, 29 April 2015 - 06:13 AM.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

ThisMachineKillsFascists, on 29 April 2015 - 06:10 AM, said:

i faced in cw hiding behind wall shooting 6 ErLL at you while 2% of the mech is visible for you.
Good luck replying the fire

Well, 4. The two torso mounts are fairly low. But the point stands, it is annoyingly effective.

Edited by Mirumoto Izanami, 29 April 2015 - 06:23 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Kiiyor, on 28 April 2015 - 10:04 PM, said:

stuff

If you buff AC's to the point where they are preferred (and they would have to be preferred for anyone to run them competitively) then we will see the exact same complaint threads about mechs that can boat AC's, how the meta has shifted to AC boating, and how medium and light mechs are dead because they can't boat them.

more stuff

Ahhh yes, The days of 3X Range modifiers on Ballistics. Guess what, the "Whine and QQ Brigade" got them reduced and so you may thank them for the current Laser BOON.

Yes they are ammo dependent, but when they had good range, they kept the enemies heads down and allowed for Mechs to advance without getting shredded by the Energy boats of the day. Now, with useable Ballistic Ranges nearing equality with LL and erLL (Clan Ballistics are notorious for their their level of "suck"), you take Energy fire while trying to get to Ballistic ranges (save for the Gauss which has its own downside - Go Boom)

So if you wish Ballistics to return, give them back what made them useful. 3X range. Easy peasy.

But you can expect the "Whine and QQ Brigade" to back out in full force if it happens, cause they do love dem some LASERS....

P.S. When did having a Ballistic weapons with energy back up (or visa versa) become some kind of disease that needed to be eradicated? Ballistic Genocide should be outlawed.

Edited by Almond Brown, 29 April 2015 - 07:04 AM.

[Mar-X-maN]

I am all for getting ballistics and missiles back into viable shape. I do miss my Gauss, but the chargeup is just unacceptable. And UACs suck ass with their constant jamming. Can't complain much about clan ballistics, except for the jamming on CUACs.

Ballistics IMO don't need range. They need better refire rates. And less heat across the board, to make up for all the downsides.

Edited by Mar X maN, 29 April 2015 - 11:25 AM.

[Sarlic]

This laser vomit is getting more out of hand by the day.

[Joseph Mallan]

And once PGI fixes it we will begin complaining about the NEXT player based whine. If its not lasers its missiles, or ACs. we can't have anything good cause someone uses a lot of one thing.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 30 April 2015 - 04:14 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 April 2015 - 04:14 AM, said:

And once PGI fixes it we will begin complaining about the NEXT player based whine. If its not lasers its missiles, or ACs. we can't have anything good cause someone uses a lot of one thing.

I partly agree with you, namely that you cannot have everything. However, when it comes to weapon variety...I am sorry, I want variety because it is the spice of the game. We do not only have the same crappy maps again but we also see mostly just one weapon system: lasers, laser, and some more lasers. It is getting monotonous quickly (well, at least for me)

[Joseph Mallan]

Bush Hopper, on 30 April 2015 - 05:05 AM, said:

I partly agree with you, namely that you cannot have everything. However, when it comes to weapon variety...I am sorry, I want variety because it is the spice of the game. We do not only have the same crappy maps again but we also see mostly just one weapon system: lasers, laser, and some more lasers. It is getting monotonous quickly (well, at least for me)

Then bring variety and let the other guy bring what he wants. It does wonders for my blood pressure not worrying what you, Bish and DaZur bring.

I have fun playing the Mechs I bring.

[Weeny Machine]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 April 2015 - 05:24 AM, said:

Then bring variety and let the other guy bring what he wants. It does wonders for my blood pressure not worrying what you, Bish and DaZur bring.

I have fun playing the Mechs I bring.

I do that. I hardly run lasers, however, that doesn't change much for me because everyone else seems to bow down to that laser crap.

However, it doesn't raise my bloodpressure I just see me playing less and less

[Sarlic]

Bush Hopper, on 30 April 2015 - 05:44 AM, said:

I do that. I hardly run lasers, however, that doesn't change much for me because everyone else seems to bow down to that laser crap.

However, it doesn't raise my bloodpressure I just see me playing less and less

Or make actually worth carrying a LRM rack. I carry one, and it helps. But many don't because its not that effective.

Edited by Sarlic, 30 April 2015 - 05:54 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Sarlic, on 30 April 2015 - 04:05 AM, said:

This laser vomit is getting more out of hand by the day.

And Resistance II ain't gonna help much...

[Mystere]

Bush Hopper, on 30 April 2015 - 05:05 AM, said:

I partly agree with you, namely that you cannot have everything. However, when it comes to weapon variety...I am sorry, I want variety because it is the spice of the game. We do not only have the same crappy maps again but we also see mostly just one weapon system: lasers, laser, and some more lasers. It is getting monotonous quickly (well, at least for me)

[Molossian Dog]

Almond Brown, on 30 April 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

And Resistance II ain't gonna help much...

You can be sure it is gonna be nerfed due to the clam whining agenda until those Mechs arrive.

[mogs01gt]

Wild Kadabra, on 28 April 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

It was bad enough, very very bad when clan had laser vomit meta, now IS seems to have laser vomit meta too with only TDRs and Stalkers with large lasers in CW, why not simply remove all other mechs that are not SCRs, TBRs, HBRs, Stalkers and Thunderbolts!!! Also remove all laser heat may as well! Lets turn this into a full light show rave party!

What do you expect? Lasers are the only reliable weapon.

[DaZur]

mogs01gt, on 30 April 2015 - 10:16 AM, said:

What do you expect? Lasers are the only reliable weapon comprise over 60% of the stable of weapons both present and future.

FTFY

[lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol]

So long as you give players a choice, usually players will choose what gives them the best advantage, especially in a super time-grind environment where getting cbills or xp or winning in CW is a very important incentive so you don't waste that large amount of time and effort.

But maybe that's just me and because I have other things I like to do.

If you want to get rid of metabuilding mentality, limit it, or remove it. Suddenly more mechs would have more of a purpose.

Edited by 00ohDstruct, 30 April 2015 - 10:57 AM.

[Void Angel]

Kiiyor, on 28 April 2015 - 04:57 PM, said:

So... You want the only 'Sphere mechs that have even the most infitessimal chance of competing with the MadCat and StormCrow nerfed?

Even with the preported god like untouchable firepower most clanners seem to think the 'sphere suddenly has, the better mechs still lie in the clan touman. The 'Sphere is completely one dimensional in what it brings to the table. It is most competitive with medium to long range direct laser fire - and that's it. IS forces aren't mobile. They reward careful defensive play. The clans reward aggressiveness.

In my experience, a decent aggressive push from a flock of MadCats will shatter a nest of Stalkers - yet most Clan groups I see insist on trying to out-trade instead, which is insanity. Few mechs outside a DireWolf out trade a Stalker, yet all mechs out maneuver them.

Soon, the clans may very well have viable lighter mechs, and we might start seeing some diversity in Clan drop decks. Keep that in mind also when thinking of future balance.

This is all IMHO, of course. I only have my own unit's experience to speak of.

Er... If you look at the Clan weapons and analyze them properly, you should find a few interesting things. First, you know how the Clans like to cry about how hot their guns are? Well, they're not that much hotter - at long range. The DPS per HPS of Clan ER Lasers is quite close to the Inner Sphere's corresponding gear, and the Clans are well-compensated with superior range, additional weapon options, and reduced tonnage. Consider the ER Larges as a test comparison: the CERLL's DPS/HPS is 1.10; the Inner Sphere works out to 1.12. This is a real difference, but it's a very small real difference; much of the Clans' faulty perception of a disadvantage in this arena is due to the amazing number of guns they can cram into their Omnimechs. Even with longer stare times and certain quirked mechs taken into account (cough-thndrblt-chough,) the Clans have the clear advantage in this area.

However, Close-range HPS/DPS is another matter. The Inner Sphere's close-range armaments are clearly superior to the Clans. Medium-grade pulse lasers' DPS/HPS coeficients work out to 1.33 for the Clans, compared to the Inner Sphere's 1.50. Large-grade pulses give 1.30 and 1.60 respectively. Those are not small differences in efficiency. Add in front-loaded close-range autocannons and shorter laser durations for the Inner Sphere, and you have a significant disadvantage for the Clans' ability to fight at close range - provided their enemy is using close-range guns themselves, and responds with the proper aggression.

This is why my unit's experience is that most successful engagements against the Clans involve short range. We want to get into their faces and murder them with fire, and the Clans have - consciously or not - adapted by going to long-range, high-alpha laser vomit builds.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Well if you don't like lasers, brace yourself. Resistance 2 is coming. *insert Winter is Coming Meme Picture here*

[FupDup]

Mirumoto Izanami, on 30 April 2015 - 10:56 AM, said:

Well if you don't like lasers, brace yourself. Resistance 2 is coming. *insert Winter is Coming Meme Picture here*

Edited by FupDup, 30 April 2015 - 10:59 AM.