174 replies to this topic

[Solahma]

Lyoto Machida, on 25 June 2015 - 08:00 AM, said:

How about don't get too close to a streakboat in a light? If I turn a corner in my Awesome and run into a Dire Wolf or something, I might be pretty screwed also.

Lights have a pretty decent chance of getting outside SSRM range if they pilot well enough.

That's a very poor excuse. Extemely actually and i'm sad that many people feel that way. An Awesome has less chance of turning a corner against a DWF because Assault combat speeds progress at a much slower rate than lights. Light's job is to tell you if there is a DWF around that corner, but who is going to tell the light that there is a Streak Boat around that corner? Can't, because that's THEIR role. The light mech is supposed to be getting in close (definitely within clan streak range), gather intel, and draw attention (situational).

The last time I hopped in my Locust, I decided to go quickly along the flank of Terra Therma and see which ramp the enemy was taking to center, hopefully stall them and allow the team to enter center. BUT low and behold I am running across one of the many open areas and a Streak Crow pops up directly infront of me, in the middle of nowhere. He said he was intentionally looking for light to do that. Two shots. Dead. No chance to dodge or take cover. The hill he came over was 150m infront of me. I can't turn and put ~400 m between me and him before I die. There was absolutely ZERO solution to it. Game over.

Pre-clan SSRMs, and IS Streak boat would have scared me, I would have been able to put distance before getting rekt. I would have skirmished with him, find a way around, or regroup with team. His purpose and role would have been fulfilled without killing a mech that would have had zero chance to survive.

Saying that Light mechs have "Pretty decent chance of getting outside SSRM range if they pilot well enough" is bogus. You can't dodge SSRMs until you're out of range. You WILL take an alpha and you WILL be crippled by it. If that didn't kill you, the next will unless RNG gods are completely in your favor. It's a huge restriction against light mechs, a weight class that already has to rely on skilled piloting to survive without SSRMs existing at all.

[Roadkill]

Solahma, on 25 June 2015 - 08:13 AM, said:

The last time I hopped in my Locust, I decided to go quickly along the flank of Terra Therma and see which ramp the enemy was taking to center, hopefully stall them and allow the team to enter center. BUT low and behold I am running across one of the many open areas and a Streak Crow pops up directly infront of me, in the middle of nowhere. He said he was intentionally looking for light to do that. Two shots. Dead. No chance to dodge or take cover. The hill he came over was 150m infront of me. I can't turn and put ~400 m between me and him before I die. There was absolutely ZERO solution to it. Game over.

So let's get this straight...

• A Mech that's specifically designed to kill Lights
  
• Sets up an ambush along a predictable corridor
  
• Which you blunder into because you weren't being careful
  
• It still takes him 2 salvos to kill your LOLcust
  
• Which means ~10 seconds
  
• During which you didn't use your 170 kph to escape
  
• So you died.

And this is somehow a bad thing? He's got one job that he can do, and that's destroy Lights that aren't paying attention. He pulls it off, and because of that you think he's OP?

[cSand]

SoggyGorilla, on 24 June 2015 - 04:19 PM, said:

what does the inner sphere have that can counter 6x6 streak mad dog? or 5x6 streak crow?


i don't understand why this became the new meta, but they forced everyone to use that now instead of laser vomit.

does anyone agree with me on this?

damage spreads all over, and also 7 seconds is enough time to blast off an arm or something that is carrying all them streaks

or at least enough time to run like hell

[Wintersdark]

Solahma, on 25 June 2015 - 08:13 AM, said:

That's a very poor excuse. Extemely actually and i'm sad that many people feel that way. An Awesome has less chance of turning a corner against a DWF because Assault combat speeds progress at a much slower rate than lights. Light's job is to tell you if there is a DWF around that corner, but who is going to tell the light that there is a Streak Boat around that corner? Can't, because that's THEIR role. The light mech is supposed to be getting in close (definitely within clan streak range), gather intel, and draw attention (situational).

The last time I hopped in my Locust, I decided to go quickly along the flank of Terra Therma and see which ramp the enemy was taking to center, hopefully stall them and allow the team to enter center. BUT low and behold I am running across one of the many open areas and a Streak Crow pops up directly infront of me, in the middle of nowhere. He said he was intentionally looking for light to do that. Two shots. Dead. No chance to dodge or take cover. The hill he came over was 150m infront of me. I can't turn and put ~400 m between me and him before I die. There was absolutely ZERO solution to it. Game over.

Pre-clan SSRMs, and IS Streak boat would have scared me, I would have been able to put distance before getting rekt. I would have skirmished with him, find a way around, or regroup with team. His purpose and role would have been fulfilled without killing a mech that would have had zero chance to survive.

Saying that Light mechs have "Pretty decent chance of getting outside SSRM range if they pilot well enough" is bogus. You can't dodge SSRMs until you're out of range. You WILL take an alpha and you WILL be crippled by it. If that didn't kill you, the next will unless RNG gods are completely in your favor. It's a huge restriction against light mechs, a weight class that already has to rely on skilled piloting to survive without SSRMs existing at all.

You can be out of range fast. Unless he's seen you coming, it takes a couple seconds for him to get a missile lock. Clearly, there is cover around (or else how did he get so close?). Those SSRM6's have a SIX SECOND cycle. He loses missile lock when he loses LOS. Run past him and away. At best, he's firing the SSRM's when you're very close to him, then has 6 seconds before he can launch a second volley. That first volley will typically not cripple you in a 35t light (see Escef's Commando video: a full 6x6SSRM volley not crippling a stock and thus under-armored 25t commando); sure, in a 20t lolcust it's BAD... BUT!

Getting hit by ANYTHING in a 20t locust is bad. *shrugs* tears because someone two-shot you with 18t of weapons + ammo over ~10 seconds in a locust is pretty unreasonable.



Your whole story here, though, smacks of "I got rekt by X; X is OP!"

[cSand]

Plus ECM compeltely nullifies that streakboat so it's kinda an all or nothing build

[Agent 0 Fortune]

If Hit Registration and HSR worked correctly, every other weapon in the game would be more deadly to lights.
There is only one class of weapon that is unaffected by lag shield, and it is considered OP?

[Serpieri]

SoggyGorilla, on 24 June 2015 - 04:19 PM, said:

what does the inner sphere have that can counter 6x6 streak mad dog? or 5x6 streak crow?


i don't understand why this became the new meta, but they forced everyone to use that now instead of laser vomit.

does anyone agree with me on this?

Are you being serious?

[Wintersdark]

cSand, on 25 June 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:

Plus ECM compeltely nullifies that streakboat so it's kinda an all or nothing build

Well, a streakboat should have (C)AP, so a single ECM doesn't nullify it.

However, it does need saying:

CAP doesn't mean you can ignore ECM. Having CAP on your Streakboat only allows you to shut down ONE ECM unit, that is within 180m. This effectively limits your Streaks to a 180M range, and if the ECM mech pilot isn't stupid, he'll understand that moving out of that CAP Counter-ECM bubble even briefly will cause you to lose your missile lock, thus requiring you to take the time to get closer and then re-acquire your missile lock. A fast ECM light can therefore dance out of CAP range to be largely immune to the streaks.

[Nightshade24]

MerryIguana, on 25 June 2015 - 07:35 AM, said:

This is so wrong it hurts. Clan ssrm 2 has a cooldown of 3.5, so does IS ssrm 2. Clan ssrm 2 velocity 180, IS velocity 200. Clan range 360, IS range 270.

and this does nothing but prove my point.

[cSand]

Wintersdark, on 25 June 2015 - 11:53 AM, said:

Well, a streakboat should have (C)AP, so a single ECM doesn't nullify it.

However, it does need saying:

CAP doesn't mean you can ignore ECM. Having CAP on your Streakboat only allows you to shut down ONE ECM unit, that is within 180m. This effectively limits your Streaks to a 180M range, and if the ECM mech pilot isn't stupid, he'll understand that moving out of that CAP Counter-ECM bubble even briefly will cause you to lose your missile lock, thus requiring you to take the time to get closer and then re-acquire your missile lock. A fast ECM light can therefore dance out of CAP range to be largely immune to the streaks.

Yep this is all true. Plus I think lock time is longer against an ECM even with an AP

They should make some mechs have a BAP quirk for extra range. Or make a BAP range module

[Bregan]

bad arcade kitty, on 24 June 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:

hahaha, if you complain of the damage, ordinary srms, not streaks, do more focused damage, especially vs something like your thunderbolt, and have significantly higher (33% higher) dps

but it's silly to compare the damage of lasers and (s)srms, how about you think that ac-5 does just 5 damage weighting with ammo like two is large lasers which deal 10 damage etc; cannons run cooler than lasers, lasers run more focused than missiles

is players are really annoying, firstly they complain of the prevalence of laser vomit, now when lasers were nerfed they complain that people use sometimes missiles too

Firstly, normal SRMS are dumbfire, and thus take skill to actually use. I dont mind that at all. That makes perfect sense that skill with a good weapon = success.
Secondly, every time i fight at least one full lance from any clan unit, each wave is at least half streak stormcrows, or mad dogs.
Its not ridiculous to compare DPS. thats the premise for ALL games ever.
please put on your thinking cap before you respond to one of my posts.
Thanks.

[Escef]

Solahma, on 25 June 2015 - 07:55 AM, said:

Honestly though, lights stand no chance against a SSRM6 boat. 1 alpha has a good chance of instantly killing any IS light mech.

A stock Commando can tank 72 Streaks and run away.



Random number generation might make a 2 Alpha kill possible.

[Aiden Skye]

Untill firestarters are brought down. Streak 6's are here to stay.
The counter to streak 6 is pretty easy.
-Terrain
-Stay outside of 360m

SoggyGorilla, on 24 June 2015 - 04:19 PM, said:

i don't understand why this became the new meta, but they forced everyone to use that now instead of laser vomit.

does anyone agree with me on this?

Also lol? I don't know what ELO you are playing in but streakboats are very, very rare outside of CW. Even then they are still kinda rare.

[bad arcade kitty]

>1 alpha has a good chance of instantly killing any IS light mech

i did some math - a very low chance to die from 1 alpha even for a locust and even when it's shot from behind

on average a light needs 3 alphas (not avoided) or more which is 18 seconds

[CygnusX7]

Just because you get completely rekt by a build doesn't mean that particular weapon should be nerfed. Even if it happens multiple times, it's more than likely your fault.

[bad arcade kitty]

Bregan, on 25 June 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:

Secondly, every time i fight at least one full lance from any clan unit, each wave is at least half streak stormcrows, or mad dogs.

it's mostly because is units used light rushes in cw, streakboats are good for killing lights who go into the brawl range hoping that their speed and lagshield will save them

i bet with those protective cases over generators the number of streakboats in cw decreased

also streakboats are good for protecting assaults from lights fitted as assault killers, it seems as a pretty good case of role warfare for me

[bad arcade kitty]

Wintersdark, on 25 June 2015 - 11:53 AM, said:

Well, a streakboat should have (C)AP, so a single ECM doesn't nullify it.

However, it does need saying:

CAP doesn't mean you can ignore ECM. Having CAP on your Streakboat only allows you to shut down ONE ECM unit, that is within 180m. This effectively limits your Streaks to a 180M range, and if the ECM mech pilot isn't stupid, he'll understand that moving out of that CAP Counter-ECM bubble even briefly will cause you to lose your missile lock, thus requiring you to take the time to get closer and then re-acquire your missile lock. A fast ECM light can therefore dance out of CAP range to be largely immune to the streaks.

imo the numbers are bit incorrect
a bap nullifies ecm at 240 meters while extending the range of 200 meters at which you can target a ecm mech from 200 to 250 (since it buffs your sensors), so actually it's 250 meters to get the red square and 240 meters to counter ecm

still it drastically decrease the range of streaks, yeah

[Bregan]

bad arcade kitty, on 25 June 2015 - 01:15 PM, said:

it's mostly because is units used light rushes in cw, streak boats are good for killing lights who go into the brawl range hoping that their speed and lagshield will save them

i bet with those protective cases over generators the number of streakboats in cw decreased

also streak boats are good for protecting assaults from lights fitted as assault killers, it seems as a pretty good case of role warfare for me

I'm just here to point out, that as per my original response to this whole topic, the spreading for clan Streaks (specifically 6's because i cant recall seeing anyone with a 4, or a 2) seems to be off. I'll take a few screen shots when I play tonight.
But I was in that match with Soggy, and I lost my Yen-Lo and my Dragon1n to streak boating, but I also lost my CT almost exclusively where my extremities, and side torsos were largely untouched.
(this ends the portion related to the quote, FYI)

But that's a trend I've noticed a lot lately, along with getting shot in the head while moving, and torso twisting and doing all the things a regular pilot does. I'm not saying I'm an amazing pilot, I pull in 900-1300 damage in CW on an average match, But Soggy, pulls in at least 2000. hes quite good at this game, I've played enough times with him to know that he does not make dumb mistakes.
I'm just saying that all these people going "Huhu you must sux at this game" might just want to check out his stats. This wasn't a flame war in the making, Its really disappointing how many people are simply unwilling to have a discussion, in lieu of flinging feces at people.

I do appreciate the videos of training sims, and suchlike, I think we are more speaking of feels like anomalous occurrences, because the streaks weren't behaving as expected. Thanks for everyone who actually contributed to this thread.

I'll try to make a video next time i feel this is happening, but I'm not especially sure my rig can handle such a feat.

[Damien Tokala]

Lololol, get outta here with your butthurt

[Wintersdark]

bad arcade kitty, on 25 June 2015 - 01:21 PM, said:

imo the numbers are bit incorrect
a bap nullifies ecm at 240 meters while extending the range of 200 meters at which you can target a ecm mech from 200 to 250 (since it buffs your sensors), so actually it's 250 meters to get the red square and 240 meters to counter ecm

still it drastically decrease the range of streaks, yeah

yeah, I forgot the buffed BAP a while back, my bad, thanks for fixing that