497 replies to this topic

[Kilo 40]

Joseph Mallan, on 09 July 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

Its perfectly fair and I have only played CW as a PUG. I can end up in a group with an 11 man team against any size group on the opposite team. It is fair and random.

random =/= fair. you playing CW only as a PUG =/= fair. you being able to end up in a group with an 11 man team against any size group on the opposite team =/= fair.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:38 AM, said:

no....it's not.

saying "I'm an exception to the rule!" does not demonstrate the rule does not exist.

But he isn't the only exception to the rule. I have had some pretty amazing Solo runs in CW. And I have had them only slightly less often than in PUG and a lot MORE often than in groups!

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:42 AM, said:

random =/= fair. you playing CW only as a PUG =/= fair. you being able to end up in a group with an 11 man team against any size group on the opposite team =/= fair.

Random is as fair as it gets. You never know what or who you will be paired with or against. I could be the 12th man with the best team in the game and the next game be with 11 other PUGs. Random is fair. You prove your mettle against everyone and anyone.

[Kilo 40]

Mystere, on 09 July 2015 - 09:40 AM, said:

What rule?

single/small group players are not playing CW.

Quote

There was only the question:

the question was "Why are solo players in CW still lying about experiences that we know are not factual?". solo players lying about their experiences with CW has not been show to be true. you only dropping solo doesn't somehow prove that solo players are lying about their experiences with CW.

[J0anna]

This problem can be directly traced to decisions made by PGI. Every other online game I’ve played, the “hardcore” or “endgame” mode was specifically more rewarding thus giving players a definite reason to want to do this. PGI, for some reason known only to them, has done the opposite. Hardcore mode is decidedly less profitable, despite the fact that it requires more preparation and dedication.

Want to see the CW population go through the roof? What should be done is that winning a match in CW should be rewarding about 3x more than currently (in both exp (which should be general xp, not mech specific – thus helping people master mechs) and cbills), while losing a match should be awarding approximately 2x more than current. Taking part in a planet conquest (i.e. winning the planet) should reward players a nice bonus consistent with your participation (i.e. 1 drop, small bonus, many drops, large bonus) with the added benefit being that if you get your unit’s name on the planet, your bonuses are doubled. Bingo, many more people would be wanting to get involved and want to be in a unit for the 2x bonus.

Additionally, rather than PGI trying to break up groups (which sounds like a horrible idea) they should be giving incentives for players to devote themselves to long term contracts. For example, make LP losses about 10x more (i.e. I kill 2 kuritas, I currently lose 30 LP’s w/Kurita, that should be more like 300 LP’s) And then make it that I cannot gain any LP levels with Kurita (if I were to swap to them) until I overcome all my negative LP’s.

[Jon Gotham]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:18 AM, said:

Like the group queue, where solos aren't welcome?

Erm, the group queue was formed because very vocal solos raged enough to force small groups out of the standard queue, like to do some casual drops with friends? GTFO! Basically.

I was thinking about this whole BS thread today and the BS attitude of the playerbase as it is, underlined heavily by the last three or so pages.....

Why don't we:
Solo Queue:
Leave it as it is, except add respawn mode with current Cw maps using current modes Assault, conquest and skirmish. Up the rewards for respawn mode-especially for objective completion.

Group Queue:
Add a few more game modes,, like king of the hill, vip protection, asassination, survival behind enemy lines etc.
Add options for faction (eg Kurita vs Davion etc) drops-these would earn you the loyalty points in your faction.

Erm..Tourney Queue?:
This could be the hardcore mode where PGI take a leaf out of WoT's CW mode. A lst of planets are put up each week that are up for grabs, teams use the website to state they will attempt an attack. Teams are then paired off against each other with the winner going through to the next round till eventually you have the two finalists, the winner taking the planet. Each planet could have differing rewards, EG 100% cbill generation for whole unit, or daily MC rewards or cockpit items etc.
It works sorta like that in WoT, the clan I was in was semi comp at best and we still managed to earn ourselves some gold:)


That way, solos still get the "casual" environment, groups get more involved tactical gameplay with the new modes and the option to earn loaylty ponts to get some as yet unreleased rewards? The comp guys can compete for bragging rights and actual loot.

In the solo queue I said leave it as it is simply because of threads like this one. the average player does not want to group, or talk or interact. They want to spam drops and shoot robots.
The group queue might be a slightly less "hardcore" cw with more expanded gameplay leaving the tourney the place for the competitive people.
The further you go up the effort scale, the greater the reward-AS IT SHOULD BE.

But hey, I guess I just wasted my fingers as people would still whine....

[Kilo 40]

Joseph Mallan, on 09 July 2015 - 09:45 AM, said:

But he isn't the only exception to the rule. I have had some pretty amazing Solo runs in CW. And I have had them only slightly less often than in PUG and a lot MORE often than in groups!

and that's really awesome! but what you and Mystere don't seem to understand is that you are not representative of the player base. If you were the CW would be much larger than it is.

Quote

Random is as fair as it gets. You never know what or who you will be paired with or against. I could be the 12th man with the best team in the game and the next game be with 11 other PUGs. Random is fair. You prove your mettle against everyone and anyone.

you're the only gamer ever who thinks an RNG is more fair than matching players based on skill.

[Kilo 40]

kamiko kross, on 09 July 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

Erm, the group queue was formed because very vocal solos raged enough to force small groups out of the standard queue, like to do some casual drops with friends? GTFO! Basically.

the group queue was formed because very vocal group players threw a temper tantrum that they couldn't have a group size larger that 4 players.

the result of that tantrum was the group queue, Roadbeer getting his cockpit island item, and Russ being terrified of crossing 2-5% of the player base at the expense of everyone else.

[Jon Gotham]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

the group queue was formed because very vocal group players threw a temper tantrum that they couldn't have a group size larger that 4 players.

the result of that tantrum was the group queue, Roadbeer getting his cockpit island item, and Russ being terrified of crossing 2-5% of the player base at the expense of everyone else.

Interesting how you glossed over the rest of my post to snap at a group player. I was here before the group queue, I remember the whines and the raging about "premades" back then. Sure groups wanted bigger groups and due to the solos getting mighty angry over any more of the "farmers" or "tryhards" hey presto a solo only mode in a multiplayer game was born.
Now, can we stop the silly arguing and discuss positive suggestions?
I tried a positive, constructive suggestion in my post and you focused on defending puggies.

Edited by kamiko kross, 09 July 2015 - 10:33 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:00 AM, said:

Oh B.S.

It's not about it not being "easy mode", it's about it being totally lopsided in favor of large groups at the expense of everyone else.

speaking of easy mode....you ever notice how few of these large elite group members you never see in the solo queue, and then when you do, they do just about the same damage/score as everyone else, if not less? it makes you wonder exactly what queue is actually the easy queue.

With that logic a regular solo queue match would be of an equal or higher standard of skill than something like EMP v SJR etc. Seems legit...

[Kilo 40]

kamiko kross, on 09 July 2015 - 10:33 AM, said:

Interesting how you glossed over the rest of my post to snap at a group player.

I didn't snap at group players . I stated a fact.

Quote

I was here before the group queue, I remember the whines and the raging about "premades" back then.

ok?

Quote

Sure groups wanted bigger groups and due to the solos getting mighty angry over any more of the "farmers" or "tryhards" hey presto a solo only mode in a multiplayer game was born.

the solo only mode was the original mode.

Quote

Now, can we stop the silly arguing and discuss positive suggestions?
I tried a positive, constructive suggestion in my post

to be honest, I don't care what most people say about game design.

Quote

and you focused on defending puggies.

and you just lost all your credibility.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

and that's really awesome! but what you and Mystere don't seem to understand is that you are not representative of the player base. If you were the CW would be much larger than it is.




you're the only gamer ever who thinks an RNG is more fair than matching players based on skill.

I don't think any one player is representative of the whole player base Kilo.

I want fair, fair isn't always balanced. I don't ever wanna know the other team has been made balanced. If Murphy's Law ever captured a planet I can tell you with a straight face that I would not want you to have a fair and balanced chance to take it from us. I'd want the deck deck stacked in our favor and if you win it from us you EARNED the victory. When I think fair and balanced I think 50/50 coin toss to win. Not what I want at all.

Plain and simple if My team isn't good enough to beat the Dragoons, I should get my ass kicked. For the simple fact that I landed against them!

[RussianWolf]

kamiko kross, on 09 July 2015 - 10:33 AM, said:

Interesting how you glossed over the rest of my post to snap at a group player. I was here before the group queue, I remember the whines and the raging about "premades" back then. Sure groups wanted bigger groups and due to the solos getting mighty angry over any more of the "farmers" or "tryhards" hey presto a solo only mode in a multiplayer game was born.
Now, can we stop the silly arguing and discuss positive suggestions?
I tried a positive, constructive suggestion in my post and you focused on defending puggies.

you both are right.

First we had one queue for all. Then they made the 8 man queue and limited the non-8 man to groups of 4 or less. Then the 8 man became 12 when they upped the number.

Then the groups complained about not being able to play in groups of 5-11 and the 12 man was changed to 2-10 + 12 and the other queue remained groups 1-4. Then they finally listened to many of us who said the solos needed to be on their own to limit farming of new players by the smaller groups. So we have what we have now.

[Kilo 40]

Spr1ggan, on 09 July 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

With that logic a regular solo queue match would be of an equal or higher standard of skill than something like EMP v SJR etc. Seems legit...

the average EMP, SJR, etc... player is riding on the coattails of mediocre players better than them. whats so cute is you kids who think joining a group suddenly makes you a good player.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

the group queue was formed because very vocal group players threw a temper tantrum that they couldn't have a group size larger that 4 players.

the result of that tantrum was the group queue, Roadbeer getting his cockpit island item, and Russ being terrified of crossing 2-5% of the player base at the expense of everyone else.

Well if that 2-5% is spending more than the rest or if not more a very significant amount. Yeah, I'd like to keep those wallets open as much as possible while keeping the smaller fish satisfied or nearly so. Specially if those 5% are liking the game I WANT to produce.

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 10:51 AM, said:

the average EMP, SJR, etc... player is riding on the coattails of mediocre players better than them. whats so cute is you kids who think joining a group suddenly makes you a good player.

Nope but it does improve their chances of being in the winners circle.

[Spr1ggan]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 10:51 AM, said:

the average EMP, SJR, etc... player is riding on the coattails of mediocre players better than them. whats so cute is you kids who think joining a group suddenly makes you a good player.

[Redacted]

I guess players like Proton, Kaffe, Heim, and Jager must all be mediocre then. Lmao.

Edited by Rhazien, 10 July 2015 - 05:37 AM.
Language

[Adiuvo]

Kilo 40, on 09 July 2015 - 10:51 AM, said:

the average EMP, SJR, etc... player is riding on the coattails of mediocre players better than them. whats so cute is you kids who think joining a group suddenly makes you a good player.

Y'know we only have 18 people in EmP to specifically avoid what you described, but keep talking out of your ass I suppose.

[Weeny Machine]

TWIAFU, on 08 July 2015 - 02:33 PM, said:

So, scarp everything done on Beta 1, 2 and anything else done to date for CW and start over from scratch to push solo over group play, you know, for the sake fun.

How about no.

Instead, inform the solo player about the facts of solo play in CW as designed.

Here you are preaching what and how people have to play...

TWIAFU, on 09 July 2015 - 04:13 AM, said:

Yes, how DARE they add game modes that cater to players that want to play them.

Solo has a Queue, Pug Groups have a queue, and Units have a queue.

You sense of entitlement must be HUGE to make your playstyle trump all others even though you have a choice on where to play.

Why dont you find ways to improve your solo experience and leave the groups and units alone and not dictate were and how they can play by permission of anti-social solo players.

...only to criticize other if they do the same. Wow...hypocrisy for the win, eh?

[RussianWolf]

TWIAFU, on 09 July 2015 - 08:22 AM, said:

Ok then, if we all know that, then why are people still trying to make it into a solo game mode?

Why are solo players in CW still lying about experiences that we know are not factual?

Why are solo players still making excuses as to why they cannot participate in the core mechanic of CW, the group?

If we know it is primarily for the Unit and group, why is this still going on?

If we know it is for the Unit and Group, why is limiting the size of a Unit a good idea if CW is meant to grow?

So, there is no point to this thread if we all know CW is for Unit and Group play other then to make it a solo mode.

How is that for smug, sweetheart.

This thread was started by a CW player asking non-CW players to increase the CW population so it remains viable.

He is asking solos to play CW.

Solo players are stating why they don't play and won't play CW until something changes.

If you want solos to help your population numbers, then how do you propose to get interested without catering to them a bit?

How would you know that a solo player's experiences are not factual? Are they your experiences? If not, then you can't know for sure.

Me? I've played in CW as a pug and as a member of a 12 man team. Didn't enjoy either. The popular tactics used in it doesn't fit my play style. Is any of that a lie?

[Soy]

Adiuvo, on 09 July 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

Y'know we only have 18 people in EmP to specifically avoid what you described, but keep talking out of your ass I suppose.

But like every unit you do have some players better than others, that's just the reality.

[Xmith]

TWIAFU, on 09 July 2015 - 04:00 AM, said:

Ok, since reading comprehension is no longer tought,

CW is not the subject, the group is. The group is the core mechanic in CW that people refuse to take part in.

CW is the subject.

The group is just another part of the core mechanics of CW.

Allowing solo players to play CW is also part of the core mechanics of CW.