147 replies to this topic

[MadcatX]

DAYLEET, on 28 December 2015 - 04:39 PM, said:

if i want to run a stock Amber i will in solo and it most likely will be a fun challenge. Im not stupid enough to do that in group queue or CW. Solo is for doing whatever because we can.

Why not? Group queue and CW are just another part of MW:O and so, they're both equally "just a game" as well.

[Bonger Bob]

symptom of a section of players who want EVERYONE to be in a team of some sort for anything, so to them pug rounds don't count for shite.

two possible solutions that could work :

craft an AI solo campaign / 1v1 deathpit vs AI or something to give people a better testing ground than the one PGI are passing off as the current one. Basically anything with an AI ( which is beyond PGI's skillset, see turrets now and early days. )

build an in-game system to allow people to join teams / groups easily in the actual game, which is currently done by third party websites setup and maintained separately to anything PGI has built in. No, not just another browser opening option because they can't code. Where is any level of a lobby outside of factions in CW ??? how about really mixing things up and allowing people to browse a list of groups, and perhaps a recruiting page / tab in said list.

Anything that is built into the game that would allow easy group finding / joining > playing would be a massive step in favor of the "you must join a team or ****-off and die" players that seem to be hand in hand with the "pugs don't count" people.

[Sandpit]

Bonger Bob, on 28 December 2015 - 11:55 PM, said:

symptom of a section of players who want EVERYONE to be in a team of some sort for anything, so to them pug rounds don't count for shite.

two possible solutions that could work :

craft an AI solo campaign / 1v1 deathpit vs AI or something to give people a better testing ground than the one PGI are passing off as the current one. Basically anything with an AI ( which is beyond PGI's skillset, see turrets now and early days. )

build an in-game system to allow people to join teams / groups easily in the actual game, which is currently done by third party websites setup and maintained separately to anything PGI has built in. No, not just another browser opening option because they can't code. Where is any level of a lobby outside of factions in CW ??? how about really mixing things up and allowing people to browse a list of groups, and perhaps a recruiting page / tab in said list.

Anything that is built into the game that would allow easy group finding / joining > playing would be a massive step in favor of the "you must join a team or ****-off and die" players that seem to be hand in hand with the "pugs don't count" people.

my favorite tonight was 3 people calling for "clan duels"
so we got 3 people on our team just stomping off to watch a "duel", then they get upset when I ask them to keep that in private matches.

I really am just going to start reporting people without a word, getting tired of it. Play by the rules ppl stop crapping all over everyone else on your team in the name of "fun"

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

MadcatX, on 28 December 2015 - 11:53 PM, said:

Why not? Group queue and CW are just another part of MW:O and so, they're both equally "just a game" as well.

Why stress about any of it. My point.

Sandpit, on 29 December 2015 - 12:15 AM, said:

I really am just going to start reporting people without a word

please do. Its against the CoC to report ppl for erroneous reasons now. So you might be the one that gets the ban not them.

[Sandpit]

MadcatX, on 28 December 2015 - 11:53 PM, said:

Why not? Group queue and CW are just another part of MW:O and so, they're both equally "just a game" as well.

No offense to anyone, but it really seems to be coming from some of those "top players" who just treat the pub queue like it's nothing more than a glorified testing ground

[Nerdboard]

Sandpit, on 28 December 2015 - 03:22 PM, said:

If you say this to me, you automatically go on my block list and I ignore any further contact and communication with you. Period

It doesn't matter playing "well" because it's a PUB drop. I've heard this several times over the past week or so.

The PUB queue isn't your personal toilet. It isn't where you get to go to "screw around and play horribly" just because.

Anything that is not straight out griefing is completely ok in the Public Que. You wanna run a mech with 4 flamers and 4 machine guns? Go ahead. If you want to compare to MOBAs the pub que are non-ranked games. The fact that we do not have ranked games in mwo doesnt matter. It is exactly the place for trying out stuff and making risky (and if they fail stupid) plays.

That said griefing obviously is not ok. If you feel that people actually do that, then please report them.

[Sandpit]

Nerdboard, on 29 December 2015 - 12:31 AM, said:

Anything that is not straight out griefing is completely ok in the Public Que. You wanna run a mech with 4 flamers and 4 machine guns? Go ahead. If you want to compare to MOBAs the pub que are non-ranked games. The fact that we do not have ranked games in mwo doesnt matter. It is exactly the place for trying out stuff and making risky (and if they fail stupid) plays.

That said griefing obviously is not ok. If you feel that people actually do that, then please report them.

that's what I'm getting at. Those that are doing stuff like this are actively ruining the experience for the other 23 people that waited for that game to launch. Should be interesting to see them called out on it when it's posted in streams and replays soon

[Sjorpha]

I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing to be honest. I'd agree that actively trying to lose once you're in a match is not ok if that is your point.

But when it comes to testing silly things and roleplaying stock builds and so on, that has to be ok because where else would you do it?

I'll always try to win in-game, but if I want to do that in a stock urbanmech, a 12 flamer nova or in an actually good build is entirely up to me.

Since most of my unit members are tier 1 and frequently in a big group I am generally fighting both more skilled opponents than myself and at a tonnage disadvantage, there is simply no leeway for me to do testing and leveling mechs in group queue, so solo queue is where that has to be done. Is this sometimes an inconvenient thing for teammates doing serious business? Sure, but that can't be avoided. The expectations have to be limited to simply participating and not actively griefing and throwing games.

If there was a casual/ranked separation of queues I would agree it would be wrong to bring bad builds into ranked, but there is no such divide and mechs are actually sold with terribad loadouts to begin with, so yeah.

[Chagatay]

Sjorpha, on 29 December 2015 - 01:05 AM, said:

Stuff

I agree with most assessment. I have tried the 12/13 flamer Nova and it fails to meet expectations at least for this weapon class. Unfortunately for the Nova, the target must be almost exactly 90m to get full flame-broiled 'mech experience*. Gargoyle has some of the same issues. To really get the desired result the array of flamers needs to be in the Torso sections and regrettably most clan mechs use arm mounts. The best experience is probably a Hunchback IIC-A (only 8) but I don't have IICs so I can't try...Cheeto...I guess could as well with 7 flamer petite course option.

*otherwise you tend to miss inside 90m as the wide as a barn aspect of the Nova kills it and no one wants a half flame-broiled 'mech.

[Sassori]

Oh my <insert deity of choice here>, he actually got so raged he made a post about it.

That.
Is.
Awesome.

So I was playing a pub game, trying out an AC-10 Cicada because, why the hell not, and it was on Caustic, which means hot as H-E-Double-Hockeysticks.

Sandpit is playing a Stalker-4N laser boat I think it was and the lights run off to scout around the mountain, find the enemy, you know, do light things.

One of the other players asks if it's Nascar yet, and Sandpit just goes off on how everyone who runs off is a bad player(Any light moving at /Stalker/ speed is a free kill mind you).

So the match progresses, we get in some fights, most people are having a pretty good time and he keeps ranting about how everything everybody does but him is bad tactics (Contrary to the fact where I've seen nascar win because it catches their heavies and assaults, but it's always a bad tactic to him).

So I am like, it's just a pub match, it doesn't mean anything, and this guy just starts ranting and raving about how we're never going to climb into the higher tiers, and how we're never going to amount to anything, and how he has statistics to back him up etc, and at the end of the match... he has 442 damage.

That's it.

442 damage.

And he's like: Anyone want to say anything about me now? I didn't think so.

Dude... pub matches don't matter. I'm sure I am blocked because I was one of the ones who kept saying that in chat when he ranted about how bad everyone else was.

I personally am climbing the tiers, I am climbing towards Tier 2, I mostly do CW, but pub matches are where I go to have fun, experiment, and try new things, new tactics, new builds, see how they work because let's face it the practice grounds shooting at immobile mechs is about as useful as knocking over trees in forest colony when it comes to determining how mech performs in live environments.

Pub matches aren't serious bizniz.

Pub matches are luck of the draw.

Sometimes people's tactics mesh and it goes awesome, sometimes it doesn't.

If you were such a strong player, you'd have done better /helping/ than raging.

But we all know when it's everyone else's problem as to why a team lost don't we.

[MonkeyCheese]

I will play my 160kphish ERPPC Locust the WAY I WANT TO DAMMIT!

[Illuzian Pryde]

Sandpit, on 28 December 2015 - 03:22 PM, said:

If you say this to me, you automatically go on my block list and I ignore any further contact and communication with you. Period

It doesn't matter playing "well" because it's a PUB drop. I've heard this several times over the past week or so.

The PUB queue isn't your personal toilet. It isn't where you get to go to "screw around and play horribly" just because.

Yes but it is just a game, and people not cooperating with you doesn't give you a right to go batshirt crazy at them or yell at them/call them names. Absolutely not saying you do but this generalised "I am holier than though, It's a team game and I know better" attitude generally breeds toxicity.

Jump in a game and play, someone does something you don't like - give them constructive criticism if you feel like it... or just move on with your life, don't go mental at them. So the whole team is blobbed together and actually trading quite well... you rage hard about pushing.. don't go ape when the suggestion to hold and be patient is suggested(just using a recent example not reflective of you here)

You want results... actually be nice to people.. throw ideas around don't just demand of everyone to do what you want. Remember that not everyone is on the same level, and some people just want to have fun.

Absolutely agree it's a team game, but it's not fun for anyone when some try hard is raging at the team or an individual because they think they are useless... the community can't be great unless people are nice and constructive.

So you're being positive and constructive and someone says it's just pub? Lost cause, move on and forget about them.. threatening to block them/not talk to them is childish.. they are already being dismissive and childish and you just dropped down to their level.

Admittedly I rage but it's at my screen, I never open voice coms or text chat to pick out something negative and let rage... because I'm not a cassive munt.

TL;DR = never go full ******, quit being entitled and expectant of how another individual should behave. There's more important things in life and even if you're an amazing player or a skilled leader/tactician: you win some, you lose some.

Apologies to my clan brethren for using contraction, it is very uncharacteristic of me.

[Sandpit]

Sjorpha, on 29 December 2015 - 01:05 AM, said:

I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing to be honest. I'd agree that actively trying to lose once you're in a match is not ok if that is your point.

But when it comes to testing silly things and roleplaying stock builds and so on, that has to be ok because where else would you do it?

I'll always try to win in-game, but if I want to do that in a stock urbanmech, a 12 flamer nova or in an actually good build is entirely up to me.

Since most of my unit members are tier 1 and frequently in a big group I am generally fighting both more skilled opponents than myself and at a tonnage disadvantage, there is simply no leeway for me to do testing and leveling mechs in group queue, so solo queue is where that has to be done. Is this sometimes an inconvenient thing for teammates doing serious business? Sure, but that can't be avoided. The expectations have to be limited to simply participating and not actively griefing and throwing games.

If there was a casual/ranked separation of queues I would agree it would be wrong to bring bad builds into ranked, but there is no such divide and mechs are actually sold with terribad loadouts to begin with, so yeah.

I don't know if (or why) I have to keep repeating this
yes
this applies to people actively going out there and doing their best to ruin the game for others as opposed to just playing the game and allowing everyone in the game to have some fun. Their idea of "fun" seems to be causing other players to have a poor gaming experience and then get indignant when you see them (and assume it wasn't malicious) doing stuff like this and ask them to stop or politely offer tips.

Illuzian Pryde, on 29 December 2015 - 02:01 AM, said:

quit being entitled and expectant of how another individual should behave.

lol
you REALLY need to look up the word entitled and this isn't an RP thread so the whole "apologize clan contractions" is unneeded

Bringing this to light of other players. asking them to report them, announcing that I'll do the same from here on out is acting entitled how exactly?
can't wait to hear this one...

[MeiSooHaityu]

I always try my best no matter what.

That said, I don't always take the most effective builds, I only occasionally meta, and sometimes I run far out stuff because I'm curious/bored and want a chuckle.

Still, I always try to do my best with what I bring.

[occusoj]

So, just for clarification, wheres the line for getting "reported" or "wasting other peoples games" in terms of very non-optimal builds? If running serious WTF-builds is against the CoC, wheres the official list of builds one gets the banhammer for?

How about the AC40 Cicada for example? Allowed? Bannable?

[Sjorpha]

Sandpit, on 29 December 2015 - 02:20 AM, said:

I don't know if (or why) I have to keep repeating this
yes
this applies to people actively going out there and doing their best to ruin the game for others as opposed to just playing the game and allowing everyone in the game to have some fun. Their idea of "fun" seems to be causing other players to have a poor gaming experience and then get indignant when you see them (and assume it wasn't malicious) doing stuff like this and ask them to stop or politely offer tips.

The reason is that it is unclear what you mean by "doing their best to ruin the game", and it is still unclear to me in the above post. For example I have seen you reporting (or at least saying you will) a person on my team who was kiting the last two mechs in his erppc panther, when he was hiding for a bit to try and get an angle on the enemy you claimed it was a breach of conduct despite the fact that he was still trying to win and actually managed to kill one mech and make the match a tie.

In this thread you still have not made clear what the distinction is, I would agree with you if it was limited to active griefing, as in shooting your teammates and such, but Christopher Daysons description is not of that sort, rather it seems you were simply going off about people playing the game different from yourself, now that's obviously totally uncool.

In my book for example, taking a stock Urbie and trying to set up a very slow ambush for the heck of it is not trying to ruin the game for others. Or defending the base in assault with a dual ac20 cicada, or doing kamikaze kills with a Direstar, or whatever you wish. That's just taking a break from the tryhard business and playing around a bit, it's not a breach of conduct or trying to ruin matches and you have no business trying to police it.

Now maybe those examples doesn't fall into the category you are ranting about, but as I said you haven't actually made the distinction clear.

Now if it is about the "it's just a pug match" attitude in itself, that would all depend on which action it is used to excuse. If it's used to excuse some kind of actual griefing then ok yeah sure it's uncool, but if it's about just playing a bit casually or doing something unorthodox, then I don't see a problem.

[Illuzian Pryde]

Sandpit, on 29 December 2015 - 02:20 AM, said:

I don't know if (or why) I have to keep repeating this yes this applies to people actively going out there and doing their best to ruin the game for others as opposed to just playing the game and allowing everyone in the game to have some fun. Their idea of "fun" seems to be causing other players to have a poor gaming experience and then get indignant when you see them (and assume it wasn't malicious) doing stuff like this and ask them to stop or politely offer tips. lol you REALLY need to look up the word entitled and this isn't an RP thread so the whole "apologize clan contractions" is unneeded Bringing this to light of other players. asking them to report them, announcing that I'll do the same from here on out is acting entitled how exactly? can't wait to hear this one...

I think you took my post too personally, it was not directed specifically at you.

Couple of things - not an RP thread but I RP, it makes it more enjoyable for me personally across the board.

My point is - anyone actively going out of their way to ruin the game are not worth your time, your frustration, your forum posts or your retaliation.

Expecting people to behave the way you think they should is entitlement "believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment."

People might be "screwing around" as you put it but as long as they are not spouting profanity/abuse or doing team damage they are doing no harm. Now if you perceive this as ruining the game, a perspective change might help alleviate the frustration(because writing a forum post about it probably means something pushed you a little too far)

Also, posting in a discussion forum about how you are going to react to certain people.. if in fact that is all you were doing, is it really necessary? So you feel a desire to report people and not interact with people that do not confirm to your point of view? Just do it, if you need to announce it, announce it to those people.. not that I would recommend it as you will just be feeding them or making someone having a bad day feel more horrible.

Not saying that you are, but by posting what you have as a forum post, it sounds like you have an expectation that people play well in the game. Consider that maybe people saying that are actually embarrassed players that know they are not actually that good of a player, or playing poorly for many reason, maybe they are too afraid to admit that they are not very good.

Absolutely not trying to say you are wrong, I honestly do not know what message you were trying to convey or what you meant at the time, you are probably a reasonable/cool guy.. this is just my perception of what I read... and my frustration with seeing this behaviour... in any game, I should take my own advice really.

Even if you do not feel entitled, you have to admit there are a number of posts with a similar tone to your original post out there from people who have this strange expectation that people to act the way they think they should without compromise.

Reading your responses though, it just sounds like frustration not entitlement.

Edited by Illuzian Pryde, 29 December 2015 - 03:07 AM.

[Lupis Volk]

I thought pub games were where people had "fun"

[Jae Hyun Nakamura]

Is there any RL money to grab or hungry mouth to get fed? If not...



...it doesn't matter.

[Pjwned]

So...where do you get to screw around (and perhaps as a result play horribly) then?

I'll do what I want in public queue if I feel like it, but usually I'm motivated to not have garbage performance so it's not a huge issue most of the time.

If that's a problem to anybody then my response is "kiss my ***."

Edited by Pjwned, 29 December 2015 - 04:31 AM.