829 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:29 AM, said:

IMO all current era Omni Assaults are overrated garbage. Even the Battlemechs are getting a little limited aside from the IICs.

(3060 will have some nice options when it arrives, like the Canis)

You are underestimating the Kingfisher. LT hardpoint visible in the sarna pic is as high as it can get without increasing the static envelope of the hitbox. It stands to reason that hardpoints on the other torso would be equally as high. Even if it were low on firepower, those hardpoints are unparalleled among the clans. Only the Hunchback IIC has such perfect hardpoints.

[Wintersdark]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:05 AM, said:

so would I, TBH.... if Russ hadn't said "3053ish".

Yeah, I get that. Don't care, either, personally. But that's why I said Night Gyr myself on Twitter.

This thread doesn't matter as far as "the vote" goes, so here I'm just saying what I'd actually like.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 08:32 AM, said:

You are underestimating the Kingfisher. LT hardpoint visible in the sarna pic is as high as it can get without increasing the static envelope of the hitbox. It stands to reason that hardpoints on the other torso would be equally as high. Even if it were low on firepower, those hardpoints are unparalleled among the clans. Only the Hunchback IIC has such perfect hardpoints.

Cool story. Hard to underestimate an over-STANDARD-engined Assault. Hardpoints are nice, but it's available tonnage sucks, and I don't see it even laservomiting as well as current options because that Std Engine eats up DHS tonnage, too.

Plus the last thing we need is another mech that really can only laservomit. Let's keep reinforcing a stale, boring meta.

Wintersdark, on 14 January 2016 - 08:37 AM, said:

Yeah, I get that. Don't care, either, personally. But that's why I said Night Gyr myself on Twitter.

This thread doesn't matter as far as "the vote" goes, so here I'm just saying what I'd actually like.

Fully agree, TBH; I mention timeline only to:
1) clear things up for those who might get confused
2) annoy a couple people.

Metus regem, on 14 January 2016 - 08:31 AM, said:

True, and I'm looking forward to being out of the age of over sized engine clan mechs to be honest...

Perhaps, though tbh, as a guy stuck running sub 70 on most IS Heavies, I actually think most of the base clan omnis heavies are running at just about the perfect speed to actually have tactical flexibility.

I'll still run one of the big 3 of Clan Heavies over ANY IS Heavy option atm.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 14 January 2016 - 08:49 AM.

[reign]

KingFisher with locked gear..

Wow this thing has same problems as ExE for torso space.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:51 AM, said:

Cool story. Hard to underestimate an over-STANDARD-engined Assault. Hardpoints are nice, but it's available tonnage sucks, and I don't see it even laservomiting as well as current options because that Std Engine eats up DHS tonnage, too.

Plus the last thing we need is another mech that really can only laservomit. Let's keep reinforcing a stale, boring meta.

Its not all it can do, it can loadup on a UAC20/LB20, 2 SRM 6s w/Art and some small brawly lasers. 2 LPL, TAG, and 2 LRM 20s, with Art... not that I would do that.

It will laser vomit just as well as an Executioner or Timber Wolf, and if those hardpoints are where they are supposed to be, it will do it better than both of them.

[Bishop Steiner]

reign, on 14 January 2016 - 08:53 AM, said:

KingFisher with locked gear..

Wow this thing has same problems as ExE for torso space.

Yup. No tonange, and only space in arms... which are still pretty low. Yay.

[Gas Guzzler]

reign, on 14 January 2016 - 08:53 AM, said:

KingFisher with locked gear..

Wow this thing has same problems as ExE for torso space.

Yeah but lasers don't take up that much space and you don't need those torso slots for ballistics. Its because it has 17 hardlocked DHS, 3 out side of engine. So most of the time you would use those DHS anyway even if they weren't locked.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

Its not all it can do, it can loadup on a UAC20/LB20, 2 SRM 6s w/Art and some small brawly lasers. 2 LPL, TAG, and 2 LRM 20s, with Art... not that I would do that.

It will laser vomit just as well as an Executioner or Timber Wolf, and if those hardpoints are where they are supposed to be, it will do it better than both of them.

Doubt it will do it better, as both mechs can outmaneuver the Fisher which is just as important as the guns. Torso points are pretty limited, and arms aren't THAT much higher than the competition.

Not seeing it, sorry.

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 08:59 AM, said:

Yeah but lasers don't take up that much space and you don't need those torso slots for ballistics. Its because it has 17 hardlocked DHS, 3 out side of engine. So most of the time you would use those DHS anyway even if they weren't locked.

yay...more vomit.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:58 AM, said:

Yup. No tonange, and only space in arms... which are still pretty low. Yay.

How are they low. They are like sternum high. Executioner's are at its groin... that is low.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 08:59 AM, said:

How are they low. They are like sternum high. Executioner's are at its groin... that is low.

still ain't talking Jager or BJ...you are exposing a third of the mech instead of half... on a relatively clumsy assault. Color me unimpressed

just going to be another sucky Clan Assault omni

also look how high the hips are... I doubt that would survive translation. The arms are actually at it's waist.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 14 January 2016 - 09:02 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:59 AM, said:

yay...more vomit.

Not many Clan mixed builds are particularly efficient with less than 17 DHS... UAC 20 and SRMs aren't exactly cool, especially mixed with small backup lasers.

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 09:01 AM, said:

still ain't talking Jager or BJ...you are exposing a third of the mech instead of half... on a relatively clumsy assault. Color me unimpressed

just going to be another sucky Clan Assault omni

also look how high the hips are... I doubt that would survive translation. The arms are actually at it's waist.

Warhammer doesn't have BJ or Jager arms either, I guess it shouldn't have been added to the game, you meta humping tryhard!

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 14 January 2016 - 09:04 AM.

[pbiggz]

kingfisher might be better than an executioner, but you aren't setting a very high bar there.

Again, I want an assault that justifies itself, can achieve that right mix of speed and firepower and doesn't just run clones of the timberwolf laser vomit build.

[Gas Guzzler]

But whats your response to the Banshee level shoulder hardpoints.. I'm just saying, the thing can vomit like a Banshee 3M and is only 3.5 kph slower, and much more durable. (Considering 3 LPL and 5ML is about equal in fire power to the 4 ER ML 2 cLPL loadout, but the latter has more range but slightly less firepower)

*shrugs*

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 14 January 2016 - 09:08 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

pbiggz, on 14 January 2016 - 09:06 AM, said:

kingfisher might be better than an executioner, but you aren't setting a very high bar there.

Again, I want an assault that justifies itself, can achieve that right mix of speed and firepower and doesn't just run clones of the timberwolf laser vomit build.

What mech would you have then? Mad Cat Mk. II can be cloned by the Night Gyr (dual gauss, 4 ER ML), or you can down grade its engine and go slower, but do you really want to go slower than 70?

[Widowmaker1981]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 January 2016 - 08:09 AM, said:

and you must not research...
http://www.solaris7....Info.asp?ID=997
ALL variants available of the NovaCat have only SH+UA actuators, plus being an Omni, automatically would lose the LA actuator once you mount Ballistics or PPCs anyhow. So not, NOT "fully articulated".

They are decently high, though. And most importantly, those shoulders should let you roll some serious damage away from the torsos.

before you call someone out for not researching, its a REALLY good idea to double check your facts

http://www.solaris7....Info.asp?ID=997

C variant has LAA on the 2E LA.

3xUAC5 + 2xLPL/2xERLL with the LAA in the left arm would fit my view of fully articulated.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 14 January 2016 - 09:12 AM.

[pbiggz]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 09:10 AM, said:

What mech would you have then? Mad Cat Mk. II can be cloned by the Night Gyr (dual gauss, 4 ER ML), or you can down grade its engine and go slower, but do you really want to go slower than 70?

No the night gyr can't clone the mk ii because the mk ii was double gauss 4 er ml 2 lrm 10s, it mounts more weapons than you are stating and I can size the engine to whatever i'd like. I'd most certainly prefer the MK II over a kingfisher, but as i understand it we're looking for an omnimech, so I wan't one that doesn't suck. The blood asp fits the bill if they fudge the loadouts. The turkina fits the bill but only if its quirked to go at least 60 kph and actually get lift from its hard wired jumpjets.

The kingfisher is just more of the same, an over engined assault with reasonable hard points but effectively no more podspace than a timberwolf. I understand you want the kingfisher, and I wouldn't be upset if I saw it, but its not what I want out of a clan assault.

Edited by pbiggz, 14 January 2016 - 09:17 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 09:10 AM, said:

What mech would you have then? Mad Cat Mk. II can be cloned by the Night Gyr (dual gauss, 4 ER ML), or you can down grade its engine and go slower, but do you really want to go slower than 70?

Mad IIC and/or Whammy IIC wouldn't be a terrible option but really none of the Clan assaults are built like the Banshee.

[Widowmaker1981]

reign, on 14 January 2016 - 08:53 AM, said:

KingFisher with locked gear..

Wow this thing has same problems as ExE for torso space.

wow, i didnt realise that. Locked equipment strikes again.. (still prefer it to the Dire Turkey though)

IICs/Battlemechs pls. PGI wont unlock the Omnis at all because of all the IS fanboy rage.

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 14 January 2016 - 09:18 AM, said:

Mad IIC and/or Whammy IIC wouldn't be a terrible option but really none of the Clan assaults are built like the Banshee.

Banshee-3M with mixtech is my ultimate mech for MWO (clan engine, ES, FF, DHS, IS LPLs in the shoulders. Unstoppable slaughter machine)

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 14 January 2016 - 09:29 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Widowmaker1981, on 14 January 2016 - 09:28 AM, said:

wow, i didnt realise that. Locked equipment strikes again.. (still prefer it to the Dire Turkey though)

Well lets be real, the "meta" side torsos have 1E and 2E hardpoints respectively. LT can fit 2 of any energy weapons and a TC1, RT can fit whatever energy you want. It isn't really limiting. Judging by the art looking at the LT, those hardpoints will be much like the Banshees shoulder points.

3 shoulder points plus likely a mid height CT point, and some LA points for corner poking. Not built exactly like the Banshee but it could trade shots with one, but no IS XL so more durability.

pbiggz, on 14 January 2016 - 09:15 AM, said:

No the night gyr can't clone the mk ii because the mk ii was double gauss 4 er ml 2 lrm 10s, it mounts more weapons than you are stating and I can size the engine to whatever i'd like. I'd most certainly prefer the MK II over a kingfisher, but as i understand it we're looking for an omnimech, so I wan't one that doesn't suck. The blood asp fits the bill if they fudge the loadouts. The turkina fits the bill but only if its quirked to go at least 60 kph and actually get lift from its hard wired jumpjets.

The kingfisher is just more of the same, an over engined assault with reasonable hard points but effectively no more podspace than a timberwolf. I understand you want the kingfisher, and I wouldn't be upset if I saw it, but its not what I want out of a clan assault.

Oh and your not going to replace the LRM10s with more gauss ammo and heatsinks?

Why would a Turkina be quirked with like 15% extra speed? That is the least likely event of anything being discussed in this thread. It is going to go 52 kph.

How does the Blood Asp do on crit slots? (my SSW doesn't load for some reason) My concern there is if you want to dual gauss, it will be in the STs, which hurts your durability.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 09:41 AM, said:

Well lets be real, the "meta" side torsos have 1E and 2E hardpoints respectively. LT can fit 2 of any energy weapons and a TC1, RT can fit whatever energy you want. It isn't really limiting. Judging by the art looking at the LT, those hardpoints will be much like the Banshees shoulder points.

3 shoulder points plus likely a mid height CT point, and some LA points for corner poking. Not built exactly like the Banshee but it could trade shots with one, but no IS XL so more durability.

The Executioner pretty much fits that bill already though right, just mirrored? You have 3 high torso energy mounts with an arm for side poking. Despite being 5 tons more, the Exe has more toys to play with that make it better imo.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 14 January 2016 - 09:44 AM.