138 replies to this topic

[G Light]

This map is a lot better than I thought it would be, there are a lot of options and it really pays off to have some teamwork. Scouts are essential. If you can find them before they find you it makes a world of difference

[3DELWEISS]

Personally i hate this map. I prefer playing in therma with my laser builds. I claim BS to all who say there's plenty of cover.

It's filled with slopes marked on the map as trenches that couldnt even hide a bike.

Check the map, see a trench, oh well im not stupid-range nor indirect fire so gotta use it, run there, ah **** its not a trench is just slightly angled snow, shall i go forward? ah no, no cover either, lets turn... oh, looks like ERL + LRM boats already cored me.

If i wanted constant ERL sitting duck teams i'd go invade some planets in CW.

[topgun505]

Are you laying your mech down and making mech-snow-angels in the snow staring upwards to notice stuff like this??

Mister Blastman, on 19 January 2016 - 12:44 PM, said:

The map is pretty. I love the little roads and nooks and crannies for smaller 'mechs to move through. However...

*spoiler alert!*

The clouds rotate in a circle around the map like they are on a merry-go-round.

[Kjudoon]

3DELWEISS, on 21 January 2016 - 04:30 AM, said:

Personally i hate this map. I prefer playing in therma with my laser builds. I claim BS to all who say there's plenty of cover.

It's filled with slopes marked on the map as trenches that couldnt even hide a bike.

Check the map, see a trench, oh well im not stupid-range nor indirect fire so gotta use it, run there, ah **** its not a trench is just slightly angled snow, shall i go forward? ah no, no cover either, lets turn... oh, looks like ERL + LRM boats already cored me.

If i wanted constant ERL sitting duck teams i'd go invade some planets in CW.

Couldn't even hide a bike? You realize you're driving something 3-6 stories tall, right?

These 'little trenches' could hide a business class hotel.

Edited by Kjudoon, 21 January 2016 - 04:55 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

So far I have only played the map twice. It seems OK.

It will take some time to really form a good opinion. I feel that a lot of "I hate this map" or "this map sucks" is a bit premature since no one has spent a lot of time with it yet. Once people learn the map and the best approaches and downfalls, then I think it would be better to really say how good or bad the map really is.

TL;DR...Two days isn't enough time to definitively say if a map is bad or good. No one knows the map that well and the meta for movement hasn't had time to be established. Give it time and then we will see.

[Madcap72]

This map separates people who understand fire and maneuver, and the use of micro terrain, from those who don't. This map is what tons of people have been demanding forever. It's large, complex (don't think it's not because it doesn't have 500M tall spires), and requires the use of real tactics.

Look at all the complaints people have! All addressed by using available assets, then utilizing real armored warfare tactics in match.

I.E. look at everyone crying about LRM's. AMS, Radar Derp, ECM. If you don't have any of that, use the micro terrain to stay out of line of sight. In fact, why are LRM boats getting locks? Why are the lights not flanking and harassing thier lrms, and also getting locks for friendly lrms to counter battery? Are the mediums set out in a skirmish line to screen for enemy lights? How about your faster heavies? Why not have them do some hit and run then kite bad guys back into a prepared ambush set up with the assaults?

"But you can't get pugs to do that"

Playerbase problem, not a map problem.

Sounds like the haters need to suck it up.

[Madcap72]

Also, it was stated that this map is a throwback to the older MW3/4 style maps. If you've never played them, or your selective memory is taking over to make it easier to hate on this map, go back and load those bad boys up and check it out. This new map is EASY to play. While you're at it tweet Russ your thanks that NARC's don't work like in the old games.

[Evil Ash]

Map gives an unmitigated and absolutely horrendous advantage to LRMs and specifically NARC. There is no cover you can use to block LRMS around conquest points. There is not enough actual protection from LRMs in the map itself, and the center of the map is fairly smooth to where LRMs will never get caught on something. Horrendous tactical design, it's fine to have LRM alleys, but a LRM map is just awful. Props to the LRM boats that save up 12x multipliers so they can force people to play it.

Madcap72, on 21 January 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

This map separates people who understand fire and maneuver, and the use of micro terrain, from those who don't. This map is what tons of people have been demanding forever. It's large, complex (don't think it's not because it doesn't have 500M tall spires), and requires the use of real tactics.

Look at all the complaints people have! All addressed by using available assets, then utilizing real armored warfare tactics in match.

I.E. look at everyone crying about LRM's. AMS, Radar Derp, ECM. If you don't have any of that, use the micro terrain to stay out of line of sight. In fact, why are LRM boats getting locks? Why are the lights not flanking and harassing thier lrms, and also getting locks for friendly lrms to counter battery? Are the mediums set out in a skirmish line to screen for enemy lights? How about your faster heavies? Why not have them do some hit and run then kite bad guys back into a prepared ambush set up with the assaults?

"But you can't get pugs to do that"

Playerbase problem, not a map problem.

Sounds like the haters need to suck it up.

If PGI is trying to keep steam player retention, they can't afford to have a tactically heavy map that requires a true plan. Each map should be able to be played decently without knowledge of its nuances, of course tactically aware teams will have a major advantage, but this map forces that to an extreme.

[Malleus011]

Kerensky's ghost. This map requires tactics and strategy. Learn some.

Keep your 'mech from skylining or the enemy will see you.
If they see you, they can and will shoot you.
If you're a fast scout, find the enemy main body and let your team know a grid reference. Information is ammunition. (This is called 'role warfare').'
If you aren't a fast scout, stick with the main body and move through cover and concealment.
COVER stops enemy weapons from hitting you. Cover is better than concealment.
CONCEALMENT stops the enemy from seeing you. Concealment is better than being in the open.
If you hit the enemy main gun line, don't just stand there getting shot. Fire and maneuver. There are plenty of avenues to flank their gunline, use some.
Watch your flanks; the enemy *will* try to flank *your* gunline.
Protect you heavy, slow friends from being flanked. If you abandon your assaults to die, you die.
There *will* be LRMs. Plan accordingly or die.
There *will* be a lights NARCing. What will you do when you get Narc'd? Have a plan or die.
If you have LRMs, stick with your gunline and support the gun 'mechs.
If you have LRMs, and sit in one spot indirectly bombarding, lights will find you and you will die.
If you are a brawler, don't peek; anchor a flank while in cover or concealment. The brawl will happen.

Edited by Malleus011, 21 January 2016 - 01:54 PM.

[Lyoto Machida]

3DELWEISS, on 21 January 2016 - 04:30 AM, said:

Personally i hate this map. I prefer playing in therma with my laser builds. I claim BS to all who say there's plenty of cover.

It's filled with slopes marked on the map as trenches that couldnt even hide a bike.

Check the map, see a trench, oh well im not stupid-range nor indirect fire so gotta use it, run there, ah **** its not a trench is just slightly angled snow, shall i go forward? ah no, no cover either, lets turn... oh, looks like ERL + LRM boats already cored me.

If i wanted constant ERL sitting duck teams i'd go invade some planets in CW.

Congrats on your first post with a 2012 account. Focus on thinking outside the box and you should be alright. Or not and just keep complaining about it. Either way, welcome to the forums.

[Darth Hotz]

"A Thinking Person's Shooter"...sadly this claim seems to be forgotten by many players.

[Kjudoon]

Evil Ash, on 21 January 2016 - 12:48 PM, said:

Map gives an unmitigated and absolutely horrendous advantage to LRMs and specifically NARC. There is no cover you can use to block LRMS around conquest points. There is not enough actual protection from LRMs in the map itself, and the center of the map is fairly smooth to where LRMs will never get caught on something. Horrendous tactical design, it's fine to have LRM alleys, but a LRM map is just awful. Props to the LRM boats that save up 12x multipliers so they can force people to play it.


If PGI is trying to keep steam player retention, they can't afford to have a tactically heavy map that requires a true plan. Each map should be able to be played decently without knowledge of its nuances, of course tactically aware teams will have a major advantage, but this map forces that to an extreme.

No it doesn't. You've been coddled too long by bad arena map design. We saw the first hints of this in Forest Colony and it was glorious. Now we have a whole map of this new design philosophy and it is wonderfully refreshing. Now to bring this design philosophy to CW as well and make this game something special.

Edited by Kjudoon, 21 January 2016 - 03:42 PM.

[Lyoto Machida]

Kjudoon, on 21 January 2016 - 03:41 PM, said:

No it doesn't. You've been coddled too long by bad arena map design. We saw the first hints of this in Forest Colony and it was glorious. Now we have a whole map of this new design philosophy and it is wonderfully refreshing. Now to bring this design philosophy to CW as well and make this game something special.

Forget Solaris...PGI needs to make an MWO style map like Shipment in MW2 for players like that.

Maybe 12 vs 12 in a map that's 500m x 500m. Make it a separate queue with 1/2 or 1/3 the rewards of the regular PUG queue for people that don't want to have to use tactics (since games will probably be over in a couple mins).

[Atreus Ofiach]

This map is just plain boring. Picket roll firing lines or just plain nascar stupidity along with Lurms. It's lazy map design plain and simple. It's canyon network without any canyon walls and a ridiculous size for 24 man games. (A hint at more players in each game?) lol I know I know, that's just a pipe dream.

The old MW games had these huge rolling maps because the technology couldn't render a lot of buildings and geometry was shady at best back then.

I said it in another thread but I want to see more cityscape and multilevel maps. Take the snow drifts out of frozen city put an open plaza where the plane crash is, a raised highway where jenner alley is and a subway tunnel where the armpit is.

Give us a map where the center is a major highway crossing with ramps and different levels all over.

You can make bigger open maps without making them featureless and boring.

[Kjudoon]

Lyoto Machida, on 21 January 2016 - 03:53 PM, said:

Forget Solaris...PGI needs to make an MWO style map like Shipment in MW2 for players like that.

Maybe 12 vs 12 in a map that's 500m x 500m. Make it a separate queue with 1/2 or 1/3 the rewards of the regular PUG queue for people that don't want to have to use tactics (since games will probably be over in a couple mins).

Better get rid of map voting real soon at this rate. I don't disagree with you, but with population supposedly rapidly rising, and I have no reason to doubt it with all the new names I see, The return of mode and map selection is going to become necessary to quell a lot of strife that is about to take off in this game. Save the random/selected battlefields for CW.

[stVillain]

i'm sitting here at work, pushing paper, because sometimes that needs to happen, mind wandering back to a few PH rounds. it brought a smile to my face and i had to log on in and post a little gush.

the maps great.
It makes scout mechs scout.
Narc is a thing you might actually take now
Brawlers can very much still creep up on people.
Hell flanking is a thing an actual thing!

the map is great. make more.

Darth Hotz, on 21 January 2016 - 02:46 PM, said:

"A Thinking Person's Shooter"...sadly this claim seems to be forgotten by many players.

Can't tell if you think PH is a non thinking person's map or if it is a thinking person's map. this map has easily required and promoted more coordination and effort from all the pug teams i've been dropping with. those that have mics anyways. no mic and it's a shitshow but no mic and it's a shitshow on any map.

Edited by stVillain, 21 January 2016 - 04:29 PM.

[Madcap72]

Evil Ash, on 21 January 2016 - 12:48 PM, said:

Map gives an unmitigated and absolutely horrendous advantage to LRMs and specifically NARC. There is no cover you can use to block LRMS around conquest points. There is not enough actual protection from LRMs in the map itself, and the center of the map is fairly smooth to where LRMs will never get caught on something. Horrendous tactical design, it's fine to have LRM alleys, but a LRM map is just awful. Props to the LRM boats that save up 12x multipliers so they can force people to play it.


If PGI is trying to keep steam player retention, they can't afford to have a tactically heavy map that requires a true plan. Each map should be able to be played decently without knowledge of its nuances, of course tactically aware teams will have a major advantage, but this map forces that to an extreme.

That's a steaming pile of garbage.

There is no purpose to dumbing down the game on thinly reasoned logic. You're literally advocating keeping it brainless modern warfare levels of play.

[Summon3r]

absolutely love this map, finally a map that feels like a dynamic battlefield. i really hope PGI takes what they have done here and expand upon it across the board

[Thunder Child]

3DELWEISS, on 21 January 2016 - 04:30 AM, said:

Personally i hate this map. I prefer playing in therma with my laser builds. I claim BS to all who say there's plenty of cover.

It's filled with slopes marked on the map as trenches that couldnt even hide a bike.

Check the map, see a trench, oh well im not stupid-range nor indirect fire so gotta use it, run there, ah **** its not a trench is just slightly angled snow, shall i go forward? ah no, no cover either, lets turn... oh, looks like ERL + LRM boats already cored me.

If i wanted constant ERL sitting duck teams i'd go invade some planets in CW.

I would recommend you run around in the Testing Grounds to figure out where all the cover is. Because there is enough concealment to lose an Atlas. I believe the trench the Atlas is in is about 2, maybe 3 Atlai tall.

The thing people don't seem to get, is that this map is about concealment and movement, not about derping towards the enemy and ignoring the terrain.