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General Locust Builds, Locust Theory, Locust Help


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#1 Ovion

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 06:03 AM

This was originally (and one day, hopefully will be) part of a full fledged Locust Theory document.

However, this is a collection of info on how to build a Locust, the basics of Locust theory and effective builds for the mech.

This document will be updated, and feel free to ask for Locust advice and suggest new builds for the list.

These are the Stock Locusts:This is what they look like when you get them.
Bar the Pirate's Bane, outside of Stock Matches, it's all pretty bad.

What you want instead, is to craft the following 'blank slates' for each of your Locusts.
Base Locusts (Armour, Engine):Locust Armour Theory is slightly counter intuitive, and more than a little scary to look at on paper, but hopefully it will all become clear as you read the following.

The goal here is pure optimisation.
With how small the Locust is, and how light, you can't put enough Armour anywhere to properly shrug of anything, and you're quite reliant on speed.
Spoiler


Additionally, if absolutely necessary, you can reduce the Engine Size for certain builds / gimmicks, this gives you the following speeds:
Spoiler




Common and Uncommon Locust Builds:
LCT-1E

LCT-1M

LCT-1V

LCT-3M

LCT-3S

LCT-3V

LCT-PB

Edited by Ovion, 11 June 2016 - 12:15 PM.


#2 3xnihilo

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 06:14 AM

Yes! Now I have a reference to link to when people ask locust questions!

#3 Shadey99

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 06:54 AM

This is actually the second thread of it's type. I did a 'Ultimate Guide to the Locust' back on the locusts release and updated it a year ago.

#4 Tim East

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 08:39 AM

No LPL 1V? Heresy!

I also use a 5SPL+BAP 3M on occasion, which I like better than taking AMS, not that AMS is bad.

#5 TercieI

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 09:25 AM

Just looking at the 1E, I have two major comments: 1) The 5ML build is more common (and superior to in most cases) the 6ML build and 2) If you're putting AMS on a LCT, you're doing it very, very wrong.

#6 Ovion

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 11:49 AM

View PostShadey99, on 08 May 2016 - 06:54 AM, said:

This is actually the second thread of it's type. I did a 'Ultimate Guide to the Locust' back on the locusts release and updated it a year ago.
This is more based on building and theory, with more in-depth than a 'general overview'.

Based on your build advice (encouraging skipping Ferro? you're going to be under-armed and over armoured. (Optimal is 7T free with a XL190, which needs stripped head (1) + arms (5), max+5 head with ferro you get 6.5T, and without 6T, that's quit a bit of difference when you've got so little to play with.)
Also, looking at the builds, a lot of them have 'balanced' armour which is often a death sentence on a locust, as no where is well enough protected.

(Your quirk info is out of date, the thread having not been updated as you said, in a year (since "Edited by Shadey99, 14 April 2015 - 12:42 AM."), meaning several things are a out by that much.)

View PostTim East, on 08 May 2016 - 08:39 AM, said:

No LPL 1V? Heresy!

I also use a 5SPL+BAP 3M on occasion, which I like better than taking AMS, not that AMS is bad.

View PostTercieI, on 08 May 2016 - 09:25 AM, said:

Just looking at the 1E, I have two major comments: 1) The 5ML build is more common (and superior to in most cases) the 6ML build and 2) If you're putting AMS on a LCT, you're doing it very, very wrong.


My own builds are, for some out of date, I will update them.
The AMS is on there because honestly, I can't fit another heatsink in (which is why people often go 5ML, but that's honestly what the 3M is for dammit) and I do recommend it's off by default.

Edited by Ovion, 08 May 2016 - 11:54 AM.


#7 TercieI

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 12:44 PM

View PostOvion, on 08 May 2016 - 11:49 AM, said:

My own builds are, for some out of date, I will update them.
The AMS is on there because honestly, I can't fit another heatsink in (which is why people often go 5ML, but that's honestly what the 3M is for dammit) and I do recommend it's off by default.


Unfortunately the quirks and, more importantly now, the all arm mounts make the 1E plain superior to the 3M. Looking again, I can't figure out why you're stripping the arms (where your guns are) down to 5. Sure, LCT arms aren't hit that much, but it's not never and protecting your weapons is more important that putting AMS on a mech that moves nearly 170kph. My two LCT-1Es are built thus: Tamarind and Hyssop.

#8 Ovion

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 01:15 PM

View PostTercieI, on 08 May 2016 - 12:44 PM, said:

Unfortunately the quirks and, more importantly now, the all arm mounts make the 1E plain superior to the 3M. Looking again, I can't figure out why you're stripping the arms (where your guns are) down to 5. Sure, LCT arms aren't hit that much, but it's not never and protecting your weapons is more important that putting AMS on a mech that moves nearly 170kph. My two LCT-1Es are built thus: Tamarind and Hyssop.
Because, generally, the weight is more effective than the extra 7pts of armour you get, and you get +6pts from quirks currently.
Thanks to how tiny the Arm hit boxes are, you'll more than likely lose the Side Torso the arm is on (and die), rather than the arm.

I can't think of many times I've lost an arm before the match ended or I died outright.

But I've included up-armoured 5 and 6 laser versions and shifted the AMS to uncommon.

#9 TercieI

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 01:51 PM

View PostOvion, on 08 May 2016 - 01:15 PM, said:

Because, generally, the weight is more effective than the extra 7pts of armour you get, and you get +6pts from quirks currently.
Thanks to how tiny the Arm hit boxes are, you'll more than likely lose the Side Torso the arm is on (and die), rather than the arm.

I can't think of many times I've lost an arm before the match ended or I died outright.

But I've included up-armoured 5 and 6 laser versions and shifted the AMS to uncommon.


I agree it's unusual, but I have lost arms on LCTs and had them stripped other times, where AMS doesn't do enough against streaks to matter (we've tested it thoroughly) and LRMs shouldn't concern a LCT at all.

#10 Ovion

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 02:14 PM

View PostTercieI, on 08 May 2016 - 01:51 PM, said:

I agree it's unusual, but I have lost arms on LCTs and had them stripped other times, where AMS doesn't do enough against streaks to matter (we've tested it thoroughly) and LRMs shouldn't concern a LCT at all.
No, not alone, and that AMS gives away your position.
But in a group... or if you want to be found?
Then it'll work. ;)

But I accept what's actually common and have updated.
Also adding the LL, ERLL and LPL builds for each variant.

#11 Virlutris

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:51 PM

Even if it's not the best build on the variant, the 1LL, 2ML build I floated for the 3M a while back may actually be equivalent or better on the 1E because of the beam duration coupled with the range.

Yes, the 3M's cooldown lets you push the build a bit harder, and the heat-gen-for-heat-dissipation trade hurt it less than the 1E. I'm wondering if the current quirkset makes 1E a better variant to use as a poker platform. Testing awaits.

#12 paws2sky

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 07:22 AM

Some interesting builds here.

I'm definitely going to tinker with the missile versions and see if those work for me. When I was leveling my swarm, I had success with LCT-3S and LCT-1M, but I was never entirely happy with the performance of the 3S.

I can't really get behind the stripped down armor theory. I get where you're coming from though. Logically, arms and head are small, unlikely to be hit. Torsos, being much larger, are much more likely to be hit. Small target or not, I've been hit in the cockpit more than a few times and lost weapon arms frequently enough that it just doesn't work for me. My unit mate who turned me on to the LCT insanity tried to convince me, but the very next game, he took a Gauss Rifle round to the face within 2 minutes of the match start. It was probably a one in a million shot, but... it happened.

So, 6 tons of weapons and gear is more than enough for me, thanks. I'll leave that 0.14 tons on the table as payment for a little piece of mind.

-paws

#13 Lolo van Trollinger

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 07:49 AM

I run the LCT-1E with 3 small lasers and additinoal double heatsinks when fighting Tier 4+5s
I also have two CW variants of the dual AMS locust - 3 M laser or 5 small laser with two AMS and 2 tons of ammo:
we use them as force gard in pairs in FW to neutralize scarecrows we moving with assaults or to sneak behind their LRM boats.

(and yes, the dropdeck is dual KGC, dual Locust.)

Edited by Lolo van Trollinger, 17 May 2016 - 07:49 AM.


#14 Dawnstealer

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 08:28 AM

View PostTercieI, on 08 May 2016 - 09:25 AM, said:

Just looking at the 1E, I have two major comments: 1) The 5ML build is more common (and superior to in most cases) the 6ML build and 2) If you're putting AMS on a LCT, you're doing it very, very wrong.

A surprise Streakcrow or Streakdog might change your opinion on that...

#15 Brizna

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 08:39 AM

Very nice guide but I have to side with Terciel, low armor on arms as defaults isn't necessarily a good idea, certaily not if you are geting a useless AMS in exchange, that said it IS something to consider.

Heck I am remembering a match a month ago when I was legged in front of an enemy direwolf, it was badly injured already but you know it was freaking DIREWOLF, he aimed and I torsoed more out of desperation than anything else but he hit the damn arm, lol, the damage did go all the way though to the side torso leaving it almost destroyed but bought me enough time to splash him with my 3 spls and kill it, man that was freaking hilarious.

#16 Jables McBarty

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 02:06 PM

View PostOvion, on 08 May 2016 - 06:03 AM, said:

Locust theory


I love that this is a thing.

Edited by Jables McBarty, 17 May 2016 - 02:06 PM.


#17 Tim East

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Posted 17 May 2016 - 06:40 PM

View PostJables McBarty, on 17 May 2016 - 02:06 PM, said:


I love that this is a thing.

I love your signature about the FW solo queue. I miss it too.

#18 Ovion

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 12:06 PM

erm... reserved.? xD

Edited by Ovion, 22 May 2016 - 12:07 PM.


#19 Virlutris

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Posted 23 May 2016 - 11:12 AM

View PostDawnstealer, on 17 May 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

A surprise Streakcrow or Streakdog might change your opinion on that...


I'm not sure I can see AMS doing much against a clan streakboat. Especially in a Locust. If you're caught out, you're cooked anyway.

In my humble locust hobbyist's opinion, the best defense in a locust is terrain, speed, maneuvering, and the strategic use of other mechs. And Radar Dep. That's all designed to break locks and to drag missile clouds into something else (dirt, red doritos...) before they land. AMS would only help for a couple missiles, unless your team's boating it, which is a very different set of discussion parameters.

#20 Tim East

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Posted 23 May 2016 - 11:23 PM

View PostVirlutris, on 23 May 2016 - 11:12 AM, said:

AMS would only help for a couple missiles, unless your team's boating it, which is a very different set of discussion parameters.

Had the mental image of a lance of dual-AMS 3M's dropping and wolf-packing. Can't decide if it would work or not. Funny thought though.





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