363 replies to this topic

[SuperFunkTron]

MovinTarget, on 17 January 2017 - 02:47 PM, said:

would be good, but how would PGI enforce it?

I gave this a lot of thought a while back, and its less and less viable as clan and IS tech is made more equal, especially with IS mechs not needing to respect clan tactics whatsoever and being able to gang up without consequence. As IS mechs approach parity in terms of ability with clan mechs, it makes less and less sense for a clan mech to implement clan tactics which were viable with the power gap, even if the clan mech wanted to take on 2 enemies at once, only addressing the 2nd after killing the first.

Some sort of damage counter type mechanic (similar to KMDD) could be used to track to see if a clan mech attacks a single mech before putting up any damage on another mech. This would account for rewarding a clan mech for attacking only one mech at a time until the kill is achieved, however, it wouldn't be able to keep track of how many other players are shooting that same mech. I'm not sure if it would work, but the same damage counter system could reward if all the damage is delivered by a single mech as opposed to varying amounts by different clanners. I don't code so I've got no idea how viable those ideas are in reality.

[MovinTarget]

In theory, but there is so much crap going on, especially in close quarters... I just don't know if it could done w/o penalizing a lot of false positives...

[Talos7]

SuperFunkTron, on 17 January 2017 - 04:24 PM, said:

I gave this a lot of thought a while back, and its less and less viable as clan and IS tech is made more equal, especially with IS mechs not needing to respect clan tactics whatsoever and being able to gang up without consequence. As IS mechs approach parity in terms of ability with clan mechs, it makes less and less sense for a clan mech to implement clan tactics which were viable with the power gap, even if the clan mech wanted to take on 2 enemies at once, only addressing the 2nd after killing the first. Some sort of damage counter type mechanic (similar to KMDD) could be used to track to see if a clan mech attacks a single mech before putting up any damage on another mech. This would account for rewarding a clan mech for attacking only one mech at a time until the kill is achieved, however, it wouldn't be able to keep track of how many other players are shooting that same mech. I'm not sure if it would work, but the same damage counter system could reward if all the damage is delivered by a single mech as opposed to varying amounts by different clanners. I don't code so I've got no idea how viable those ideas are in reality.

Sounds interesting but all of this would go right out the window the second the surat IS pilots ganged up on a Clan target. Thus breaking the need for the Clanners to stick to the traditions of Zellbrigen. It just wouldn't work in a PvP environment.

I like the idea tho

Edited by Talos7, 17 January 2017 - 08:35 PM.

[Arkhangel]

Well, my "Falcon-ey" friend, putting Zelbrigen in somehow would also let them swap Clan stuff back to being as overpowered as it's supposed to be. Also, if i recall correctly, a Clanner is allowed to shoot someone who shoots at them first as well, even if it is technically someone else's kill. I think the whole thing there is more "can't gang up from the get-go"... there's.. loopholes

[Uncle Totty]

Arkhangel, on 18 January 2017 - 01:38 AM, said:

Well, my "Falcon-ey" friend, putting Zelbrigen in somehow would also let them swap Clan stuff back to being as overpowered as it's supposed to be. Also, if i recall correctly, a Clanner is allowed to shoot someone who shoots at them first as well, even if it is technically someone else's kill. I think the whole thing there is more "can't gang up from the get-go"... there's.. loopholes

We can also fire on shutdown mechs if the shutdown is do to overheating. (They should have been more carful. )

[Reno Blade]

I'm very exited about the new skill tree and the new game mode.
New technology? Yes please.
but looking for Heavy laser, PPC Capacitor and Heavy Gauss... I see worse TTK than ever.



Imho, we need some serious balancing for TTK, and I hope that we can get some kind of Energy Draw system working before this power creep comes into play. (more heat, cooldown, beam/burst durration if you are too high)

First thing I would do: double the structure of all mechs. That way TTK increases and disarming might get more important than going for CT. (it would also increase survivability of XL engines by a bit, because you won't lose the side torso as fast).

I would also go as far as reducing torso movement speeds, so the whole twitch-shooting alphas are going to have a rough time and arm weapons gain more importance.



New weapons:
I think Heavy Laser wont be a problem. They are basically performing as 2x IS Lasers from the stats, so all we need to do is double all damage/range/beam values.
(same range as IS laser, but only weight of 1 IS laser).

For PPC Capacitor, we just add a charge mechanic to PPCs (in general) and then add a double charge for the Capacitor.
Same can be done for Heavy Gauss, where the second charge increases the damage, or the charge would just be twice as long.

Another idea for UACs: they could be changed to just jam every time you double tap for 1x extra cooldown. (That way you would trade burst vs cooldown.)
Then we can also finally go on and make IS uACs burst fire with different bursts.
And increase all Lasers burn (e.g. 20-30%), to make it more challenging.

Leaving missiles (new and old)....
I'm for changing all missiles to fire in streams of some sort, so the target doesn't get a huge fireball to the face.
And if a working ED system increases the duration of the stream, if you alpha, the effect is much stronger than if you gain more heat after the huge alpha was already going out.



Imho changes like these would make the game feel more like piloting a huge battlemech instead of a quick moving Gundam/Macross fighter which one-shots everything (or get's oneshot) because of the 100 missles/Blasters they are using...
But I guess most people will dislike these ideas just because twitch-shooting is so much more fun (ppl think the smallest nerf will make everything into wet noodles).

[MovinTarget]

Reno Blade, on 18 January 2017 - 02:54 AM, said:

but looking for Heavy laser, PPC Capacitor and Heavy Gauss... I see worse TTK than ever.

In my case it will probably be from blowing myself up with heat

[SuperFunkTron]

Arkhangel, on 18 January 2017 - 01:38 AM, said:

Well, my "Falcon-ey" friend, putting Zelbrigen in somehow would also let them swap Clan stuff back to being as overpowered as it's supposed to be. Also, if i recall correctly, a Clanner is allowed to shoot someone who shoots at them first as well, even if it is technically someone else's kill. I think the whole thing there is more "can't gang up from the get-go"... there's.. loopholes

That was the original means of balance and I think it made it much more interesting having one side over powered but at the immediate disadvantage of being out numbered. I know that PGI's 10 vs 12 didn't go well, but I still am convinced that it is something that requires players with more experience to make work. I think that, just like any other change that's been made, it just takes about a week to learn and adapt to the new fighting conditions. I would be really interested in having a PTS open to everyone else to allow the public to try that original setup, even if it is just to show us how bad it is

[Odanan]

I'm calling it!

- Fire Moth (light omnimech, Clan)
- Uziel (medium battlemech, IS)
- Avatar (heavy omnimech, IS)
- Mad Cat MK II (assault battlemech, Clan)

What do I get if I nail all of them?

[Felicitatem Parco]

ShadowHimself, on 18 January 2017 - 07:20 AM, said:

There will be no mrms or hags just saying and write off the staradder/blood asp, never balanceable with the plasma ppcs, this is pgi we are talking about, heavy laser lmao not happening, I only see them adding mg platforms and laughing at the buildup they gave us. This is Russ we are talking about

Your optimism and tone really make me want to discuss this game with you. Seriously, it does.

How about dem MG Arrays, huh?

[Edward Hazen]

Arkhangel, on 18 January 2017 - 01:38 AM, said:

Well, my "Falcon-ey" friend, putting Zelbrigen in somehow would also let them swap Clan stuff back to being as overpowered as it's supposed to be. Also, if i recall correctly, a Clanner is allowed to shoot someone who shoots at them first as well, even if it is technically someone else's kill. I think the whole thing there is more "can't gang up from the get-go"... there's.. loopholes

Remember, after ComStar tricked the Clans at Tukayyid, the Clans would only honor Zellbrigen if their opponents agreed to as well.

Odanan, on 18 January 2017 - 07:28 AM, said:

I'm calling it!

- Fire Moth (light omnimech, Clan)
- Uziel (medium battlemech, IS)
- Avatar (heavy omnimech, IS)
- Mad Cat MK II (assault battlemech, Clan)

What do I get if I nail all of them?

Fire Moth is cool just because of Ghost Bear's Legacy training mission nostalgia, but I would rather see PGI release the Stinger or Wasp first.

[Odanan]

S0ulReapr, on 18 January 2017 - 08:10 AM, said:

Fire Moth is cool just because of Ghost Bear's Legacy training mission nostalgia, but I would rather see PGI release the Stinger or Wasp first.

Isn't the Wasp coming this month? Heck, it could be announced today or tomorrow!! (and no, I don't have inside info, unfortunately)

[Luscious Dan]

Not gonna lie, any combination of the Argus, Uziel, or Templar would make me super happy.

I don't know if the demand would be there for Wasp/Stinger I'm afraid. Flea as well. 20 tonners are pretty limited in what they can do (in terms of variety). A Flea with MASC would make me happy but it's just so similar to the Locust...

Edited by Luscious Dan, 18 January 2017 - 09:24 AM.

[Odanan]

Luscious Dan, on 18 January 2017 - 09:23 AM, said:

Not gonna lie, any combination of the Argus, Uziel, or Templar would make me super happy.

I don't know if the demand would be there for Wasp/Stinger I'm afraid. Flea as well. 20 tonners are pretty limited in what they can do (in terms of variety). A Flea with MASC would make me happy but it's just so similar to the Locust...

Locust it's a good mech. Wasp (and/or Stinger) would be even more versatile because of their jump jets. Not to mention: tiny!

[Tordin]

I would be sooo very happy to see we get the Flea, Wasp, Stinger (also Valkyrie). The Flea and Locust are kinda similar yet very different same for the Wasp and Stinger. They need their buddies kinda like Mechs in arms, wingmen. Annoying bigger fellas until the tears fall hard around them

[Falconer Cyrus]

The game crashed 5 times today. Why the roadmap does not include bugfix??

[Arkhangel]

ShadowHimself, on 18 January 2017 - 07:20 AM, said:

There will be no mrms or hags just saying and write off the staradder/blood asp, never balanceable with the plasma ppcs, this is pgi we are talking about, heavy laser lmao not happening, I only see them adding mg platforms and laughing at the buildup they gave us. This is Russ we are talking about

dude...... the Blood Asp never HAD Plasma PPCs. those were a stupid invention of MechAssault. also..... technically.... when you fire a PPC, it's firing Plasma already, that's like going to a Mexican restaurant and asking for "Salsa Sauce".

as for the tech we'll get, i can't see us getting anything more IS-wise than IS Tech II, like the rest of the ACs, Streaks, maybe MRMs, Light Gauss, possibly even Light Fusion Engines, Compact Gyros, etc.

Heavy Lasers, not so much, because also bear in mind the Blood Asp is a Star Adder 'Mech, which means it's back on the homeworlds of the clans, and literally only just got released as of 3060, thus the other clans'd have to do trials to get it, then Diamond Sharks have to get their hands on it to sell to the IS-based Clans. it's also the first mech to carry those... so.. yeah. probably not overly likely to see Heavy Lasers (specially since a lot of heavy laser using 'Mechs happen to be IS allied too, like Clan Wolf-in-Exile's Solitaire, for instance).

might see ATMs though.

[Sniper09121986]

Arkhangel, on 18 January 2017 - 10:30 AM, said:

might see ATMs though.

This and http://www.sarna.net...issile_Launcher are the things that bug me the most. I watch the game rather irregularly now, so I might miss something, but last time I checked they have not resolved the coding issue that prevents ammo switching and has caused the heresy that is Clan AC's. The rest should be trivial to implement (Clan HAG rifle being essentially a resized Gauss that fires bursts in Clan UAC fashion, for instance), but ATM and MML present a major challenge. Any news on that?

[Ovion]

The Javelin.
https://mwomercs.com/javelin

Well.
That's boring.

[Weepy Wanebow]

actually the javelin doesn't seem too terribly awful. It can go pretty fast (255/30)x16.2 = 137.7

you can do semi decent hit and run close range mech (which is the majority of IS lights any how). All torso mounted hard points except on 2 variants means that you can be a little tanky but having consistent arm shields. I man it's nothing to write home bout but then we knew that there weren't a lot of good IS options left.

Edited by Smell Da Glove, 18 January 2017 - 12:09 PM.