95 replies to this topic

[El Bandito]

Yeonne Greene, on 14 March 2017 - 08:11 PM, said:

The Grasshopper and Marauder are going to pop-tart as well as the Clan champions if PGI doesn't screw up the Heavy PPC, possibly better. Mauler or Banshee with twin Heavy PPC and a Gauss will almost compete with the Kodiak.

Heavy PPC has crap range. I really hope the LFE would be the miracle cure, cause skill tree sure aint.

Edited by El Bandito, 14 March 2017 - 08:23 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

El Bandito, on 14 March 2017 - 08:21 PM, said:

Heavy PPC has crap range.

Which is one of the reasons why it will almost certainly retain it's 15 PP dmg. And 540 isn't crap, it's just not ERPPC long.

[El Bandito]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 March 2017 - 08:23 PM, said:

Which is one of the reasons why it will almost certainly retain it's 15 PP dmg. And 540 isn't crap, it's just not ERPPC long.

Would be nice if it has 15 PPFLD. At this stage, unlike new mech specs, nothing on new tech is certain.

[Lightfoot]

I am going to be pessimistic though and say the Heavy PPC is going to clock in at 800 meters per second. Not the 300 miles per second from physics and lightning.

[Y E O N N E]

El Bandito, on 14 March 2017 - 08:21 PM, said:

Heavy PPC has crap range. I really hope the LFE would be the miracle cure, cause skill tree sure aint.

540 meters is well within the standard engagement bracket, if it were crap then nobody would have been using Warhammers in MWOWC. If you need cover from extreme range, get the Light Gauss and ERLL boats to provide it; even Clan PPFLD doesn't handle a Grasshopper in its power zone very well. If it doesn't have 15 PPFLD, though, we're in trouble. There would be zero purpose to the HPPC without it.

LFE is going to be a cure for bread-and-butter type (3xLL+5xML) laser boats and SRM bombers, but the ballistics boats will still be on XLs.

[Bishop Steiner]

El Bandito, on 14 March 2017 - 08:27 PM, said:

Would be nice if it has 15 PPFLD. At this stage, unlike new mech specs, nothing on new tech is certain.

This is true, which is one reason people need to speak up on these things with well reasoned arguments.

The IS Heavy PPC weighs 4 tons more and is 2 crit bigger than the C-ERPPC, while having a much shorter range, and retaining a minimum range, while costing the same heat burden. If it does not get 15 pp, it will be bloody useless, at 10 tons.

All 3 of the new IS PPCs could prove very useful, and I put more weight on them and the MRMs helping out than I do any of the lasers or ballistics or streaks. Add id the LFE and and some of our mechs may better be able to press our PPFLD advantage, in more situations.

Yeonne Greene, on 14 March 2017 - 08:29 PM, said:

540 meters is well within the standard engagement bracket, if it were crap then nobody would have been using Warhammers in MWOWC. If you need cover from extreme range, get the Light Gauss and ERLL boats to provide it; even Clan PPFLD doesn't handle a Grasshopper in its power zone very well. If it doesn't have 15 PPFLD, though, we're in trouble. There would be zero purpose to the HPPC without it.

LFE is going to be a cure for bread-and-butter type (3xLL+5xML) laser boats and SRM bombers, but the ballistics boats will still be on XLs.

LFE will fit my Splatlas pretty nice, too, for sure.

[Gas Guzzler]

FupDup, on 14 March 2017 - 08:01 PM, said:

Do you really think the Cougar will eclipse the Adder?

Minimal quirks needed on a light mech that goes only 87.1 kph with Speed Tweak? Are you mad?

You're starting to sound like an anti-Gyrok now.

Depending on the implementation of ATMs, it actually could be a good little mini ATM boat. Could also do 4 streak 6s with plenty of ammo/BAP/ECM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 March 2017 - 08:36 PM, said:

Depending on the implementation of ATMs, it actually could be a good little mini ATM boat. Could also do 4 streak 6s with plenty of ammo/BAP/ECM.

4 streak 6s with terribad hit boxes, at 85 kph. I have Assault mechs that do 85 kph.

[Pariah Devalis]

Can't even opt to have JJ on the Cougar while retaining a significant punch due to no ST hardpoints, without resorting entirely to heavy lasers. Which necessitate closing rage with the enemy. Which is made difficult as you're a 85 kph light mech. ....

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 14 March 2017 - 08:50 PM.

[I_AM_ZUUL]

Yeonne Greene, on 14 March 2017 - 08:29 PM, said:

540 meters is well within the standard engagement bracket, if it were crap then nobody would have been using Warhammers in MWOWC. If you need cover from extreme range, get the Light Gauss and ERLL boats to provide it; even Clan PPFLD doesn't handle a Grasshopper in its power zone very well. If it doesn't have 15 PPFLD, though, we're in trouble. There would be zero purpose to the HPPC without it.

LFE is going to be a cure for bread-and-butter type (3xLL+5xML) laser boats and SRM bombers, but the ballistics boats will still be on XLs.

are you really so dense that you do not understand why Warhammers were used??? It is because the server was locked from when Warhammers had there good buffs before they were nerfed into the ground 3 times AND because Night Gyrs were not an available option. So no... Warhammers are a shadow of what they were using in MWOWC & wouldnt be used even if they werent cause the Night Gyr would be used now.

Edited by I_AM_ZUUL, 14 March 2017 - 08:49 PM.

[El Bandito]

Pariah Devalis, on 14 March 2017 - 08:39 PM, said:

Can't even opt to have JJ on the Cougar while retaining a significant punch due to no ST hardpoints, without resorting entirely to heavy lasers. Which necessitate closing rage with the enemy. Which is made difficult as you're a 85 kph light mech. ....

CLPLs have good enough range. Especially on ECM mech. And ATM boating might turn out to be very good since ATM is effective at all ranges. One weakness of Adders was that they could be spotted even with their small size due to having no ECM. Cougar has less such issue. And Cougar will probably replace Kit Fox as prime escort Light, as well.

Edited by El Bandito, 14 March 2017 - 09:09 PM.

[Pariah Devalis]

El Bandito, on 14 March 2017 - 08:57 PM, said:

CLPLs have good enough range. Especially on ECM mech. And ATM boating might turn out to be very good since ATM is effective at all ranges. One weakness of Adders was that they could be spotted even with their small size due to having no ECM. Cougar has less such issue.

That depends if PGI is willing to up the ammo per ton of ATM from 60 to something closer to 75. RIght now, at 60 rounds per ton, you need 1 ton per ATM3, 2 tons per ATM6, 3 tons per ATM9, or 4 tons per ATM12 to get 20 shots off. That tonnage for necessary ammunition is pretty prohibitive.

When comparing damage per ton, SRM are at 200, LRM at 198, and ATM are between 180-60. If ATM were adjusted to 75 shots per ton, it puts it at 225/150/75, and 25 shots per ton for the ATM3, which is the same number of shots per ton as the SRM4. More reasonable, I think.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 14 March 2017 - 09:05 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

I_AM_ZUUL, on 14 March 2017 - 08:46 PM, said:

are you really so dense that you do not understand why Warhammers were used??? It is because the server was locked from when Warhammers had there good buffs before they were nerfed into the ground 3 times AND because Night Gyrs were not an available option. So no... Warhammers are a shadow of what they were using in MWOWC & wouldnt be used even if they werent cause the Night Gyr would be used now.

Less dense than you, because a lack of range has nothing to do with why Warhammers aren't used today. It has everything to do with heat.

Context: do you speak it?

Edit: Also durability; with or without that structure nerf, the Night Gyr was coming in due to that alone. The dakka-boat NTG has the same range as the WHM. The pop-tart NTG is performing a different role entirely and isn't comparable.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 14 March 2017 - 09:16 PM.

[TheArisen]

Yeonne Greene, on 14 March 2017 - 07:22 PM, said:

Needs more Sagittaire (Assault) and Lynx (Medium).

Also the Dragon Fire or Falconer for heavies! Nightstar as well. I mean, the Clans got several strong assaults in a row why can't the IS as well?

[5th Fedcom Rat]

TheArisen, on 14 March 2017 - 09:21 PM, said:

Also the Dragon Fire

You do realize...




that mech has a penis, right?

[Clanner Scum]

Pariah Devalis, on 14 March 2017 - 08:39 PM, said:

Can't even opt to have JJ on the Cougar while retaining a significant punch due to no ST hardpoints, without resorting entirely to heavy lasers. Which necessitate closing rage with the enemy. Which is made difficult as you're a 85 kph light mech. ....

If they increased the speed on the cougar then a twin heavy large cougar with jump jets and ECM will be a very potent poptarter.

I'm also interested in it's accel and deaccel rate. If it both are high then it'll be a decent hill humper, but the low slung arms might hurt it so I think poptarting will be the way to go. What's really going to matter is how much heavy large lasers weight. They'll have to be 4 tons for a dual heavy large cougar to be viable so as to fit enough heat sinks to keep it cool enough that i can get off atleast 3 or 4 shots before shutdown.

IDK, they might quirk it. If they do it needs energy heat generation quirks.

Edited by Clanner Scum, 14 March 2017 - 09:46 PM.

[TheArisen]

5th Fedcom Rat, on 14 March 2017 - 09:36 PM, said:

You do realize...




that mech has a penis, right?

Meh I'm sure Alex can make it more appropriate/PG. Regardless, it's one of the absolute best potential additions for the IS.

[Clanner Scum]

5th Fedcom Rat, on 14 March 2017 - 09:36 PM, said:

You do realize...

that mech has a penis, right?

I lol'd so hard.

[Anjian]

5th Fedcom Rat, on 14 March 2017 - 09:36 PM, said:

You do realize...




that mech has a penis, right?

Seems like a hard on for the Mad Cat Mk II.

[I_AM_ZUUL]

Yeonne Greene, on 14 March 2017 - 09:12 PM, said:

Less dense than you, because a lack of range has nothing to do with why Warhammers aren't used today. It has everything to do with heat.

Context: do you speak it?

Edit: Also durability; with or without that structure nerf, the Night Gyr was coming in due to that alone. The dakka-boat NTG has the same range as the WHM. The pop-tart NTG is performing a different role entirely and isn't comparable.

Im throughly confused now... your illogical point is more than I can follow. So your premise about Warhammer being used in MWOWC had nothing to do with the Warhammer? I was pointing out WHY the Warhammer was used in MWOWC which you were holding up as the shining example of how it was a great mech with an awesome engagement window... when in reality it was enjoying insane quirks to put it near the level of Clan mechs but a Clan mech has been released in the past year thats amazing while the Warhammer was $hit on into barely ok. So either the Warhammer is an amazing mech that with a great engagement window which is why it was used in MWOWC like you originally asserted... or it was just quirked to the gills while simultaneously filling a role that the Clan OP Mechs had not filled yet.

so yes... you truly are dense

Edited by I_AM_ZUUL, 15 March 2017 - 12:23 AM.