129 replies to this topic

[MovinTarget]

Can't comment on the update post PGI put up but on the change summary for the orion you reference the othe HGNs which would be highlanders.

Not a biggie, but just putting out there...

[Zookeeper Dan]

Thanks for listening and updating the Orion IIC hero with the extra hardpoint. I'm off to make a purchase!

[PhoenixFire55]

Alexander Garden, on 26 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

Tl;dr
We buffed the Jenner and Orion a little bit, the Highlander and Hunchback remain the same.
Though they don't match the eventual Hero Loadouts, we're using new renders for each 'Mech to reign in the excessive Loadout situation seen with the original renders.

Maybe buff your cluelessness and scambaggery a bit too? ... A mech that you advertise still has 3 ballistic hardpoints in each arm yet shows three energy hardpoints on the picture. The next one pictures 3 energy in each torso when it only has one energy in one and one ballistic in another. Additionally it still displays two energy in CT while having none.

Edited by PhoenixFire55, 28 May 2017 - 02:50 AM.

[Ironically Ironclad Irony]

PhoenixFire55, on 28 May 2017 - 02:47 AM, said:

Maybe buff your cluelessness and scambaggery a bit too? ... A mech that you advertise still has 3 ballistic hardpoints in each arm yet shows three energy hardpoints on the picture. The next one pictures 3 energy in each torso when it only has one energy in one and one ballistic in another. Additionally it still displays two energy in CT while having none.

Hey look I found another one that doesn't pay attention to fine print!

[Appogee]

Alexander Garden, on 26 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

Hey everyone,

We've just posted an update regarding the IIC Hero 'Mech Loadouts and the promotional images originally used on the pre-order page. You can check out the details here: https://mwomercs.com...-iic-hero-mechs

Tl;dr
We buffed the Jenner and Orion a little bit, the Highlander and Hunchback remain the same.
Though they don't match the eventual Hero Loadouts, we're using new renders for each 'Mech to reign in the excessive Loadout situation seen with the original renders.

That's two in a row that have been modified post announcement.

I applaud the changes made in response to community concerns.

It might be a good idea if you guys get community input before you launch these things in future, rather than revising them after...?

[MovinTarget]

Appogee, on 28 May 2017 - 07:00 AM, said:

That's two in a row that have been modified post announcement.

I applaud the changes made in response to community concerns.

It might be a good idea if you guys get community input before you launch these things in future, rather than revising them after...?

It might be better to keep it to a poll, not open discussion where thay are able to limit the option to a manageble set of options.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Just use the ACH/MLX/SHC/EXE Heroes as an example and have them weapon stripped.

Yes, I'm aware the EXE has an AMS. No, I don't consider it a weapon.

[PhoenixFire55]

Ironically Ironclad Irony, on 28 May 2017 - 03:34 AM, said:

Hey look I found another one that doesn't pay attention to fine print!

I pay enough attention. I just make emphasis on what deserves it. Now there is a thingy called false advertising, and even tho I think that this particular situation has more to do with simply being clueless and/or lazy, it once again underlines the same thing ... they don't care one bit about anything but farming money off of mechpaks.

[DontStandBehindMe]

Alexander Garden, on 26 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

Hey everyone,

We've just posted an update regarding the IIC Hero 'Mech Loadouts and the promotional images originally used on the pre-order page. You can check out the details here: https://mwomercs.com...-iic-hero-mechs

Tl;dr
We buffed the Jenner and Orion a little bit, the Highlander and Hunchback remain the same.
Though they don't match the eventual Hero Loadouts, we're using new renders for each 'Mech to reign in the excessive Loadout situation seen with the original renders.

So the Orion "hero" is basically an ON1-IIC-B with one less missile hardpoint and a $20 price tag...and that is an improvement? I may be new here but I just can't see how this adds anything positive to the Orion chassis

[Jay Leon Hart]

DontStandBehindMe, on 28 May 2017 - 09:23 AM, said:

So the Orion "hero" is basically an ON1-IIC-B with one less missile hardpoint and a $20 price tag...and that is an improvement? I may be new here but I just can't see how this adds anything positive to the Orion chassis

MASC

[Ironically Ironclad Irony]

PhoenixFire55, on 28 May 2017 - 08:06 AM, said:

I pay enough attention. I just make emphasis on what deserves it. Now there is a thingy called false advertising, and even tho I think that this particular situation has more to do with simply being clueless and/or lazy, it once again underlines the same thing ... they don't care one bit about anything but farming money off of mechpaks.

The thing is, I actually found the graphics funny because they were bonkers redonkulous. Like the commercials where people are able to do impossible things after consuming some snack/candy/beverage/substance and there is print at the bottom that says "seriously people, this sh!t doesn't really happen" Or the car commercials that have vehicles pulling off stupid impossible maneuvers with fine print at the bottom "Don't try this, its totally fake"

I would not only draw those parallels but say they are infinitely more pervasive and potentially dangerous than mech loadouts that are stoopid overloaded (with fine print stating....)

[The6thMessenger]

Alexander Garden, on 26 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

Hey everyone,

We've just posted an update regarding the IIC Hero 'Mech Loadouts and the promotional images originally used on the pre-order page. You can check out the details here: https://mwomercs.com...-iic-hero-mechs

Tl;dr
We buffed the Jenner and Orion a little bit, the Highlander and Hunchback remain the same.
Though they don't match the eventual Hero Loadouts, we're using new renders for each 'Mech to reign in the excessive Loadout situation seen with the original renders.

Deathwish still sucks.

It would have been a fair trade if it was 2 high mounted energy hardpoint. But no, it's just one highmount energy hardpoint for the lost jump-jets, versus other variants able to poptart the same gauss ppc, with the PPC reasonably high.

[Jay Leon Hart]

The6thMessenger, on 28 May 2017 - 02:56 PM, said:

Deathwish still sucks.

It would have been a fair trade if it was 2 high mounted energy hardpoint. But no, it's just one highmount energy hardpoint for the lost jump-jets, versus other variants able to poptart the same gauss ppc, with the PPC reasonably high.

Deathwish is still fine. It's still better than most IS HBKs and they're still solid. JJs are nice, but they don't make or break a 'mech, especially one with such high mounts.

[Rogue Jedi]

it is great that Clans are soon getting 6 ^(JR7-IIC) and 8 ^{(ACH and MLX)} Machine Gun light Mechs, but the lightest IS Mech able to carry more than 4 Machine Guns is the BJ1-A, can we please get a 6 or more B hardpoint IS Light Mech ^{(preferably Spider but anything other than the Locust or Urbie would be good)} to balance this Light Mech superiority of the Clans ^{(especialy in light of the heavy Machine Guns due soon)}.
Also please add one of the Clan 20 ton Mechs in the near future, to give the Clan CW players a way to cripple their dropdecks by taking 2 100 ton Mechs if they wish to do so, with the time jump there are several timeline relevent Clan 20 tonners, both Battlemechs and Omnimechs.

[The6thMessenger]

Jay Leon Hart, on 28 May 2017 - 03:03 PM, said:

Deathwish is still fine. It's still better than most IS HBKs and they're still solid. JJs are nice, but they don't make or break a 'mech, especially one with such high mounts.

So your standard is the IS Hunchback instead of the Clan Hunchback IIC?

I'm not asking for an upgrade, but I'm not paying 15$ dollars for a downgrade.

[Jay Leon Hart]

The6thMessenger, on 29 May 2017 - 08:21 PM, said:

So your standard is the IS Hunchback instead of the Clan Hunchback IIC?

I'm not asking for an upgrade, but I'm not paying 15$ dollars for a downgrade.

My standard is the HBK-IIC and what the DW can do versus what I can do with those, but it being better than the regular HBK? Yeah, that's still a plus point.

For reference, the HBK-IICs I run;
2x Gauss - No JJs
2x UAC10, 2x ERML
2x ERPPC
6x MPL
4x ASRM6, 2x SPL

Builds that look fun/good for the HBK-IIC-DW
Gauss, ERPPC, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x ERPPC
Gauss, LPL, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x LPL
LB20X, ERPPC, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x ERPPC
LB20X, LPL, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x LPL
UAC10, LPL, 2x ERML
UAC10, 2x LPL
UAC10, HLL, 2x HML
UAC10, 2x HLL

[Edit] Consistency [/Edit]

Edited by Jay Leon Hart, 30 May 2017 - 08:52 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 08:48 AM, said:

My standard is the HBK-IIC and what the DW can do versus what I can do with those, but it being better than the regular HBK? Yeah, that's still a plus point.

But considering that it's not an IS HBK, but a Clan HBK-IIC, it's a down grade that costs 15$ so it's a minus.

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 08:48 AM, said:

Builds that look fun/good for the HBK-IIC-DW
Gauss, ERPPC, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x ERPPC
Gauss, LPL, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x LPL
LB20X, ERPPC, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x ERPPC
LB20X, LPL, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x LPL
UAC10, LPL, 2x ERML
UAC10, 2x LPL
UAC10, HLL, 2x HML
UAC10, 2x HLL

Um, yeah there's no CT energy hardpoint on the Deathwish, it only has 1 energy highmount on the side torso, and the remaining 4 are equally divided amongst the arms. Those builds aren't really hard to achieve on the existing variants.

The only difference would be the single energy hardpoint from the CT to the highmounted torso, and the lack of JJ which compromises it.

Case and Point:

Quote

Gauss, ERPPC, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x ERPPC
Gauss, LPL, 2x ERML
Gauss, 2x LPL
LB20X, ERPPC, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x ERPPC
LB20X, LPL, 2x SPL
LB20X, 2x LPL
UAC10, LPL, 2x ERML
UAC10, 2x LPL
UAC10, HLL, 2x HML *replace C-ER*L with C-H*L
UAC10, 2x HLL *replace C-ER*L with C-H*L

On the "large energy weapons" department, there's little change other than changing of placement -- you can only put one PPC or LPL on the CT anyways, just as you can only put one of those in the highmount.

[Jay Leon Hart]

The6thMessenger, on 30 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

But considering that it's not an IS HBK, but a Clan HBK-IIC, it's a down grade that costs 15$ so it's a minus.

Um, yeah there's no CT energy hardpoint on the Deathwish, it only has 1 energy highmount on the side torso, and the remaining 4 are equally divided amongst the arms. Those builds aren't really hard to achieve on the existing variants.

The only difference would be the single energy hardpoint from the CT to the highmounted torso, and the lack of JJ which compromises it.

It's not a downgrade though, so it's not a minus.

Yes, I know the DW lacks a CT hard point, those additional 1-2 Energy weapons are going in the left arm. That difference of moving from CT to LT on the energy? That's a much bigger bonus than the negative of losing JJs, at least how I play these things.

Clearly we disagree on this and we're not likely to reach an accord. I am buying the DW as it is. You are not. You hope they change it. I do not. I would, obviously, welcome the addition of JJs or another LT Energy hard point, but I doubt either are likely because of how much better it would make this HBK-IIC compared to the rest.

The HBK-IIC-A, HBK-IIC and HBK-IIC-B were respectively the 3rd, 4th and 11th most used Clan chassis in Tukayyid 3, with the HBK-IIC-A and HBK-IIC being the 5th and 6th most used chassis between factions.
[Edit] DATA CORRECTION! HBK-IIC-A excluding Scouting is between 3rd and 5th most used for Clan 'mechs in Tukayyid 3, as there are no Scouting only usage stats for the ACH-Prime or HBK-IIC[/Edit]
Clearly the HBK-IIC is a successful and popular chassis, I don't think it needs any more power creep.

Edited by Jay Leon Hart, 31 May 2017 - 09:01 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

It's not a downgrade though, so it's not a minus.

It is a downgrade. Lack of JJ is a massive decrease in mobility, that is not properly equalized by the gained firepower of the highmount. And said firepower is reasonably achieved by the HBK-IIC-C, which is generally regarded as the inferior Variant.

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

Yes, I know the DW lacks a CT hard point, those additional 1-2 Energy weapons are going in the left arm. That difference of moving from CT to LT on the energy? That's a much bigger bonus than the negative of losing JJs, at least how I play these things.

No it's not, the CT energy mounts are reasonably high already.

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

Clearly we disagree on this and we're not likely to reach an accord. I am buying the DW as it is. You are not. You hope they change it. I do not. I would, obviously, welcome the addition of JJs or another LT Energy hard point, but I doubt either are likely because of how much better it would make this HBK-IIC compared to the rest.

Clearly, said statement is just a cop-out. Cause it is demonstrable that DW is certainly a downgrade.

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

The HBK-IIC-A, HBK-IIC and HBK-IIC-B were respectively the 3rd, 4th and 11th most used Clan chassis in Tukayyid 3, with the HBK-IIC-A and HBK-IIC being the 5th and 6th most used chassis between factions. Clearly the HBK-IIC is a successful and popular chassis, I don't think it needs any more power creep.

Oh, so it UP, so we must wanted it to be OP?

No i don't want it to be an upgrade nor a downgrade, just a side-grade. Is that really hard to understand?

[Aramuside]

Jay Leon Hart, on 30 May 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

It's not a downgrade though, so it's not a minus.

Yes, I know the DW lacks a CT hard point, those additional 1-2 Energy weapons are going in the left arm. That difference of moving from CT to LT on the energy? That's a much bigger bonus than the negative of losing JJs, at least how I play these things.

Clearly we disagree on this and we're not likely to reach an accord. I am buying the DW as it is. You are not. You hope they change it. I do not. I would, obviously, welcome the addition of JJs or another LT Energy hard point, but I doubt either are likely because of how much better it would make this HBK-IIC compared to the rest.

The HBK-IIC-A, HBK-IIC and HBK-IIC-B were respectively the 3rd, 4th and 11th most used Clan chassis in Tukayyid 3, with the HBK-IIC-A and HBK-IIC being the 5th and 6th most used chassis between factions. Clearly the HBK-IIC is a successful and popular chassis, I don't think it needs any more power creep.

Not to be rude but are you including the scout matches capped at 50 tons in that? If so its no mystery why there were so many 50 ton Nova and HBK IIC. Not that I trust those figures as apparently there were no Huntsmen and Night Gyr (despite having seen them in huge numbers for the 9 days.