284 replies to this topic

[BearFlag]

Wasn't sure if this directed at me, Mischief, until reading through it. "comp", "mass market". Guess that's me. Unfortunate. Your posts are usually enjoyable - sharp, on point, intelligent, incisive. The one below, however, is a steaming pile. You begin it with a grotesque falsehood that none of PGI, comp or casual would agree with.

"There is no "comp" in FW."

That's followed by some malformed better/worse continuum. Are we now engaged is dissimulative dialectics? Please. This is a game forum.

MischiefSC, on 22 May 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

There is no 'comp' in FW. There's people who play pretty well and actually want to win when they enter the match and there's people who want it to be pug queue with a matchmaker, bring bad builds, play badly and ignore the team.

That's it.

If you had respawn in group queue it would play the same way, with a matchmaker. Exactly the same as FW does right now. Just more ruthless.

If you had respawns in pug queue it would often go the same way, the exact same way, with just 3 or so good players on one side and mediocre people on the other. It would be slaughters, farmed in the dropzone.

People get farmed in the dropzone because they made poor choices. Full stop. That's it. Quit trying to conflate 'not being terrible' with 'comp'. There's a lot of space between those concepts.

Spawn camping happens because the game has respawns. 12 v 1 rolls happen in QP with a matchmaker, no teams and no respawns. If it had respawns, where do those 11 people go? Are they required to go wait at the 50 yard line for the ref? The guys who got smashed, how much time do they get? 30 seconds? 2 minutes? 10? To do whatever magical thing they're supposed to do this time they didn't do last time. Wherever they exit the magic safety hug-box zone is where they're going to get farmed again.

I've seen these complaints a lot of times. I've played thousands of matches in FW, a lot of it pugging, a lot of it grouping with different skill levels of players. What the main complaint is, deep down....

is that nobody wants to play against someone who is trying harder than they are. I won't say 'better' because there's nothing the good teams are doing that everyone else can't.

It's so simple. So stupidly ******* simple.

1. Bring good mechs and make smart choices in the skill tree.

2. Communicate and coordinate with your team.

3. Focus on winning more than you focus on padding your own stats.

That's it. Those 3 things. That's the beginning, the middle and the end of what separates the best teams in FW from everyone else. There's nothing in that, nothing at all, that requires Teamspeak.

So when you talk about making it 'mass market' you're going to need to remove respawns, have a matchmaker and have some way of letting bad players who play badly only play with bad players who play badly.

Which is to say, make it like QP but with respawns. Which will still involve spawn camping.

Lots of stuff there. Some truths and some errors.

1) Respawn camping is 100% design avoidable.
2) Matchmakers work. That's why they're used. PGI's QP matchmaker? Topic in itself.
3) Destroying a game mode intended to be "end game" for 5%, suicidal.

And you missed the point. Is FW an "end game", a universe, a home? Is it a place for the whole community? Or is it a place for organized, 5% 12 man teams? Is it a place for, dare I defy dialectics, comp teams?

The question is root. Foundation. There are other venues for comp. The community needs FW, not as comp sandbox, but as universe. The possibilities....

lol...if PGI could actually program them.

[The Basilisk]

PFC Carsten, on 22 May 2017 - 01:18 AM, said:

That sign/disclaimer even though digitally, is not worth the bits necessary to deliver it. No one reads it, no one refrains from either coming to the forums to express their dissatisfaction of what seemingly makes up half the game or - worse - silently leaves MWO altogether.

I do not argue with that.
FP as it is (tryhard and beginners get butchered land) shouldn't be ingame.

I am not a very good player cause I'm too unstable. I need 4 or so matches to warm up and can then deliver some good matches, 3-5 and thats it. But most of the players out there barely go out of their averange matche with more than 300 dmg, don't care for what meta is and give a damn about decent loadouts.

There should be a secluded zone with restricted access where the enthusiasts can go and where you can not go as singleplayer or group below a certain number (maybe 4) or experience treshold.

Vice versa there should be a Battlevalue system that includes player experience and equipment to determine if a player gets rewarded and how much for a certain kill/ most dmg etc pp

In short: No rewards for sealclubbing. If you want to play the pro go play with the pros.

[TWIAFU]

MischiefSC, on 22 May 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

If you had respawn in group queue it would play the same way, with a matchmaker. Exactly the same as FW does right now. Just more ruthless.

If you had respawns in pug queue it would often go the same way, the exact same way, with just 3 or so good players on one side and mediocre people on the other. It would be slaughters, farmed in the dropzone.

People get farmed in the dropzone because they made poor choices. Full stop. That's it. Quit trying to conflate 'not being terrible' with 'comp'. There's a lot of space between those concepts.

Spawn camping happens because the game has respawns. 12 v 1 rolls happen in QP with a matchmaker, no teams and no respawns. If it had respawns, where do those 11 people go?



Which is to say, make it like QP but with respawns. Which will still involve spawn camping.

MSC, rolls and stomps are OK in QP because it is pugtard vs pugtard without teamwork, coordination. That is acceptable.

It becomes unacceptable when that mentality is placed into a Queue primarily designed for teamwork and coordination. You can roll or get rolled so long as you or the opponent does not use teamwork or coordination in QP.

[Positive Mental Attitude]

The mode is an embarrassment from my standpoint. No direction, failed promises and quickplay garbage maps and modes. No one is trying to get their friends to play it, and the few that are left simply dont play much else anyway. Basically the entire games problems are made more obvious with fw bc of the already small population.

Now we get to watch esports mwo get half assed too, should be fun to watch.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

MischiefSC, on 22 May 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

There is no 'comp' in FW. There's people who play pretty well and actually want to win when they enter the match and there's people who want it to be pug queue with a matchmaker, bring bad builds, play badly and ignore the team.

That's it.

If you had respawn in group queue it would play the same way, with a matchmaker. Exactly the same as FW does right now. Just more ruthless.

If you had respawns in pug queue it would often go the same way, the exact same way, with just 3 or so good players on one side and mediocre people on the other. It would be slaughters, farmed in the dropzone.

People get farmed in the dropzone because they made poor choices. Full stop. That's it. Quit trying to conflate 'not being terrible' with 'comp'. There's a lot of space between those concepts.

Spawn camping happens because the game has respawns. 12 v 1 rolls happen in QP with a matchmaker, no teams and no respawns. If it had respawns, where do those 11 people go? Are they required to go wait at the 50 yard line for the ref? The guys who got smashed, how much time do they get? 30 seconds? 2 minutes? 10? To do whatever magical thing they're supposed to do this time they didn't do last time. Wherever they exit the magic safety hug-box zone is where they're going to get farmed again.

I've seen these complaints a lot of times. I've played thousands of matches in FW, a lot of it pugging, a lot of it grouping with different skill levels of players. What the main complaint is, deep down....

is that nobody wants to play against someone who is trying harder than they are. I won't say 'better' because there's nothing the good teams are doing that everyone else can't.

It's so simple. So stupidly ******* simple.

1. Bring good mechs and make smart choices in the skill tree.

2. Communicate and coordinate with your team.

3. Focus on winning more than you focus on padding your own stats.

That's it. Those 3 things. That's the beginning, the middle and the end of what separates the best teams in FW from everyone else. There's nothing in that, nothing at all, that requires Teamspeak.

So when you talk about making it 'mass market' you're going to need to remove respawns, have a matchmaker and have some way of letting bad players who play badly only play with bad players who play badly.

Which is to say, make it like QP but with respawns. Which will still involve spawn camping.

Great stuff.. If people would actually believe you and listen....but they probably won't . Can't help but think of the movie "A Few Men" with Nicholson's famous lines..

Col. Jessup (MischiefSC): I'll answer the question. You want answers?
Kaffee (unit-less PUGs in FW): I think I'm entitled!
Col. Jessup: You want answers?!
Kaffee: I want the truth!
Col. Jessup: You can't handle the truth!

[naterist]

Once comp que is out, everyone will agree on where the unit playground is, and that it shouldnt be FW.

Face it, the idea that fw is for the few is the reason ques are long. You cant have a tiny population and instaques.

Edited by naterist, 23 May 2017 - 09:36 AM.

[KingCobra]

DarklightCA, on 22 May 2017 - 11:07 PM, said:

First of all FP is designed around units conquering planets in a non-matchmaking environment in which doesn't penalize groups unlike PGI's more solo friendly game mode QP. The fact solo players ignored their welcome message like all the other players who cry on the forums about how units are ruining the game doesn't change that fact.

Second of all grouping up, joining a unit and coordinating with them is not e-sports and never has PGI taken that direction with FP. The only e-sports related thing they have ever created was their World Championships along with supporting the many player created and driven tournaments over the years.

There are SO MANY reasons why people stopped playing Faction Play, the fact it's a poorly designed piece of **** being one for starters but sure blame all the Units and Groups playing in a game mode supported by that action simply because they stomp all over players who ignored the welcome message and reality of that game mode.

Sure you can say FP was designed for units only but its a FAIL it was a FAIL from day 1 back in FP beta1 when they started to let units Slaughter non unit groups.

From Day 1 it should have been a split queue system in FP pugs Vs pugs and units VS units and if you believe that mixing the 2 types of players has not killed FP and MWO in general all of you defending the seal clubbing are out of your minds.

You cant introduce a game mode like FP and not expect players other than units want to play it. Im not downing units except for the fact they went along with not splitting the FP queues along time ago and in there greed and arrogance drove away a lot of MWO players from the game.

Then when they(UNITS) get what they want a UNIT VS UNIT FP and group Queues they cry because they cant seal club pugs to make rewards and C-bills easy its to hard for them to play other units only and get those big payoffs. I've heard it all on TS3 under diff names over 5 years.

If PGI were smart they would think about what is best for both groups not just throw them together and expect a happy outcome.

[sub2000]

another discussion of blinds with deaf.
it is pretty obvious that joining teamspeak server is not enough. it is not going to help group to get builds synergy, trust in drop caller, and most importantly map knowledge (simple things like meeting push on platform or behind it, and not right at the tunnel exit, or moving on the right side of the mountains etc.). It provides just bigger percentage of motivated players willing to cooperate. It is much, but not more than that. You need basic experience and game knowledge to counter experience and game knowledge. Siege maps are way different in structure from the rest.
How many good unites have appeared last year? Any group not branched from existing one, but just fresh, self-grown. A name?
If to completely derail from the original message (funny that nobody pointed obvious fact that OP uses too hot builds).
Some small "statistics" from mine very limited 2 months FW experience. (IS)

map No. V L

Vitric Forge 6 3 3

Emerald Taiga 7 1 5

Boreal Vault 9 1 8

Grim Portico 3 1 2

Hellebore Springs 7 5 2

Sulfurous Rift 6 1 5

Numbers are pretty small, but I find them very peculiar, considering that the percentage of games against premaides (~60%) is spread equally.

Edited by sub2000, 23 May 2017 - 12:06 PM.

[IraqiWalker]

To summarize this thread once and for all:

We have players who:

1- Refuse to group up with others

2- Refuse to use comms

3- Refuse to do something as simple as a basic google search for "good CW builds for X mech"

4- Refuse to understand how the mode works

AND

5- refuse to change their attitude

Complaining about losing in a mode that tells them from the start they need to use these things to stand a chance at winning.


I was there in CW 2 when the FRR managed to turn back the CJF push at Basiliano. We had 3 Players from the same unit. I was soloing (Davion at the time) in there out of boredom, and the rest were people like me, from all over the IS.

First drop, we run into a CJF 12 man. We got roflstomped 48 - 10 (5 of those kills were by the 3 guys from the one FRR unit).

What did we do next? We started spamming the TS3 address in chat. I hopped on the server, some of the others did, a couple dropped out. While we were still in lobby, we got replacements (thank you call to arms). We told them to join us in TS, too.

That second match, we actually held the objective. Third match, we started sharing, and tweaking builds. Turns out 4 of us were first timers in CW. Took about 15 minutes before we got ourselves organized again, and kept on dropping. We held Basiliano for an entire 2 hours after until the battle window ended. By the end of that round, we went from 12 people on TS (with only 4 of us actually using mics), to 60+ in that TS server, all spamming Basiliano, and working together.

Some people had to use trials and we still managed to not only hold the planet, but also win against CJF 12 mans. All it took was the willingness to coordinate with your teammates, instead of going at it alone.

Do you guys think the battle for Wazan became the legend that it is today because of players acting like it was solo queue? Or because people got their act together, and coordinated. Tukayyid is literally the only thing in CW that beat Wazan's numbers,. Let that sink in.

We all deserve a Wazan-esque experience in CW, and PGI won't hand it to us. We have to seek it out.

Edited by IraqiWalker, 23 May 2017 - 03:44 PM.

[DarklightCA]

KingCobra, on 23 May 2017 - 10:49 AM, said:

Sure you can say FP was designed for units only but its a FAIL it was a FAIL from day 1 back in FP beta1 when they started to let units Slaughter non unit groups.

From Day 1 it should have been a split queue system in FP pugs Vs pugs and units VS units and if you believe that mixing the 2 types of players has not killed FP and MWO in general all of you defending the seal clubbing are out of your minds.

You cant introduce a game mode like FP and not expect players other than units want to play it. Im not downing units except for the fact they went along with not splitting the FP queues along time ago and in there greed and arrogance drove away a lot of MWO players from the game.

Then when they(UNITS) get what they want a UNIT VS UNIT FP and group Queues they cry because they cant seal club pugs to make rewards and C-bills easy its to hard for them to play other units only and get those big payoffs. I've heard it all on TS3 under diff names over 5 years.

If PGI were smart they would think about what is best for both groups not just throw them together and expect a happy outcome.

I never said it was designed for units only, PGI allowed everybody from every aspect of the game to play it even new players which is what was stupid. However, the only objective Faction Play has is planetary conquest which can ONLY be completed by units and only actually be successfully completed by grouped units.

Faction Play is an environment that has no matchmaking system, without group limitations, heavily focused on units conquering planets and PGI said as much in their welcome message for it. If seals chose to ignore that and play Faction Play regardless that is THEIR CHOICE. They also chose to do so at a disadvantage by playing it as a solo player in stupid builds and don't bother to coordinate with their fellow solo players, that is also THEIR CHOICE.

My problem with these conversations is that you take solo players, put them into a grouped environment in a heavily team based game and blame the groups and units for stomping them. Like they had any choice who they faced or like they should have killed half their own team prior to fighting them. It's not how the game works.

As for defending seal clubbing, I've already stated on many occasions that I'd rather be fighting 12 man unit groups. The fact I have to way through hordes of solo queue pug players that don't put any effort into winning their games just to try and find that one unit group is what ruined Faction Play for me but I still defend against a split queue because the reality of Faction Play is that it has no population and you can't split a non-existing population in half and still expect to reliable find games.

Also for the record, it's only a select few solo players crying about groups and units. PGI already implemented a solo queue, a poorly designed one much like FP itself but it had the same effect and only that select few wanted it. Straight away majority of the population that was in the "solo queue" created one man units just to get back in the group queue and guess what? Those grouped units enjoyed it because for the shortest of times the quality of the matches actually improved.

[TWIAFU]

KingCobra, on 23 May 2017 - 10:49 AM, said:

If PGI were smart they would think about what is best for both groups not just throw them together and expect a happy outcome.

Agreed.

Adhere to it's primary function, Group/Unit play.

It's not a place for seals who won't talk, listen, group, or read.

If someone is not ready for the deep end of the pool, you don't level the pool depth, you stop them from entering the deep end in the first place.

[MischiefSC]

meteorol, on 22 May 2017 - 10:56 PM, said:

I'm playing group queue every night. The wait time is no where near as long as in CW (really not even close), and that is while CW has a combined queue for solo and group players, (means potentially more players if it wasn't as bad as it is) of which the majority are probably dropping solo. For my last 30 CW drops, i ran into a premade larger of 4 a grand total of 5 times. More importantly, i can get a drop in group queue any time of the day, while i did spent 3 hours in CW queue during offhours without getting a drop.

The group queue, using only group players is nowhere near as deserted as CW with both group and solo players.

If you want to argue that PGIs approach to CW failed horribly, go ahead. But the evidence it failed is there, right infront of everyones eyes. CW started losing players in droves not after months, but weeks of its initial release.

Edit: That aside, i never said anything about shutting down CW. I just said it is bad (which it is) and it will go nowhere, because PGI cares even less for it than the majority of the playerbase.

Furthermore, i compared CW to quickplay as a whole, which are totally different gamemodes, while you changed the premise of the argument by comparing it to group queue, which is not a different gamemode, but a matchmaking queue of said gamemode. Dropping a "bad logic is bad" after changing the premise of an argument is... i'll just stop here.

It's not like there is something to discuss here. CW is done, and it won't change. PGI probably doesn't care. They have the numbers, they have seen they dropped the ball, they very likely have no intentions of picking it up again.

If Group Queue split IS vs Clans the wait would be the same. Conversely if FW was just mixed sides to fill drops and mixed tech it'd drop just as fast as group queue or pug queue. Both group queue and CW are 'niche' in context of the population.

Which was why I compared them. Pug queue doesn't compare with anything, group or FW, because it's just casual, disposable matches with no coordination. It's designed to appeal to the lowest possible denominator. Of course it's got the highest population.

That doesn't mean the FW and group queue populations don't have value or are worth investment. So in e-sports for that matter - worth a huge investment actually as that's where the money is in gaming over the next 5-10 years at least.

The biggest problem PGI has in this games development is that it's not really providing tools to any of these segments. Units and FW with a complex, deep game experience could draw a big population - but PGI didn't do that, they made a slight upgrade to pug queue with some new maps/modes. E-sports would require a lot. Better tools for streaming the games, a lot more support for more leagues (you need 3 or 4 good sized tournaments a year with 1 central one plus a ton of extra tools to support people moving into and skilling up in that environment to fill the pool) and the casual/pug environment needs a ton more maps, modes and balancing done plus a huge revamp of the NPE to draw in more casual players.

MWO has none of that so it's not appealing to any of those demographics when, ironically, it could hit all 3. FW will likely get every bit as much of an investment as group queue and pug queue and e-sports. Which is to say.... nothing, really. Same as it's always gotten.

[MischiefSC]

BearFlag, on 22 May 2017 - 11:21 PM, said:

Wasn't sure if this directed at me, Mischief, until reading through it. "comp", "mass market". Guess that's me. Unfortunate. Your posts are usually enjoyable - sharp, on point, intelligent, incisive. The one below, however, is a steaming pile. You begin it with a grotesque falsehood that none of PGI, comp or casual would agree with.

"There is no "comp" in FW."

That's followed by some malformed better/worse continuum. Are we now engaged is dissimulative dialectics? Please. This is a game forum.



Lots of stuff there. Some truths and some errors.

1) Respawn camping is 100% design avoidable.
2) Matchmakers work. That's why they're used. PGI's QP matchmaker? Topic in itself.
3) Destroying a game mode intended to be "end game" for 5%, suicidal.

And you missed the point. Is FW an "end game", a universe, a home? Is it a place for the whole community? Or is it a place for organized, 5% 12 man teams? Is it a place for, dare I defy dialectics, comp teams?

The question is root. Foundation. There are other venues for comp. The community needs FW, not as comp sandbox, but as universe. The possibilities....

lol...if PGI could actually program them.

1. No. It's absolutely not avoidable. Because whatever location they exit their safe zone at is where they'll get camped and most players will exploit the safe zone, however you design it, to avoid fighting when they know they will lose.

2. Matchmakers work with a deep enough population pool and with the length of matches in this game (15-30 minutes) they need a huge, huge pool to work even moderately well. Even if we had TrueSkill running here it would have a minimal impact on the matches that get filled.

3. It's not just for 12mans. It's for players who want to play in a group in a 12 v 12 environment. I drop in a full 12man maybe 5% of my drops - the other 95% I still drop, just in smaller or mixed groups. However I play to my team and I play to win so I still have a good win/loss. The only reason FW doesn't appeal to more people is that there's no point to it; no depth, no purpose and the wait time is longer because it's splitting clan and IS. That's a huge hurdle to filling matches as it puts the population in a binary with no possible release valve.

If you think FW is a 'comp sandbox' then you're so far from reality I'm not even sure where to start. Maybe here. That's the page for MRBC. That's comp. See those names? Teams? Why don't you watch the videos of the matches. That's comp play. That's not FW. They are utterly unrelated.

It doesn't take a comp team to dominate in FW. It takes a few people who are not absolutely blitherlingly incompetent to put in a modicum of effort. That's it. It just takes teamwork. That's all. Just teamwork. Bring good mechs, play as a team, try to make good decisions. What's humiliating to the whole human race is that people consider those basic, simple, minimal expenditures of effort are considered 'comp' by the FW pug/casual population. It's like saying being able to wash yourself, get dressed and ride your bike on the weekends is exactly like being a pro fitness model. No. No, not even close.

The effort involved in not being stomped in FW is so minimal it's crazy. Sure, there's a handful of teams that work a lot harder than most and as such win a lot more. Still however there's nothing they do others can not. No magic trick, just coordination and focus and effort.

Bring good mechs with a good skill tree.

Play to your team.

Make an effort, which includes following the calls and focusing fire and finding a team to integrate with.

That's it. That's all.

It's so simple. Which is where the lack of empathy comes from. People want to put in less effort, the least possible effort, and still get the same rewards.

[KingCobra]

TWIAFU, on 23 May 2017 - 04:30 PM, said:

Agreed.

Adhere to it's primary function, Group/Unit play.

It's not a place for seals who won't talk, listen, group, or read.

If someone is not ready for the deep end of the pool, you don't level the pool depth, you stop them from entering the deep end in the first place.

Gesus someone finally gets what Im talking about grats.From Day 1 of FP units should have only played units like in the group queues in FP and all the pugs should have had there own queues as mercs so they could play IS or clan and call it good no more crying from ether side about anything and PGI could have not wasted 4 years of failed FP crap mixing PUGS and units in the same battles.

PGI could have had 4 years to develop better things for solo and fp players like better game modes maps ETC.

[justcallme A S H]

He was actually calling you out, in a very satirical way, but I think you kinda missed that.

sub2000, on 23 May 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

How many good unites have appeared last year? Any group not branched from existing one, but just fresh, self-grown. A name?

54MR? BCMC?

I'm sure there are others if I put my mind to it and actually looked at the leadeboard to work it out.

[Kirito Kerenksy]

I'll be frank: as much as I would like to be pitted up against other players of equal skill to me, that's simply not going to happen in MWO because there's too small of a population, matches take a long time, and there's a player division in that clan and inner sphere pugs can't mix teams to fill numbers.

I'd rather get my genitals punched in concave every 2 to 3 matches by an organized team than have to wait hours on end for players with my skill level to match up against. And I'm not even that high tier, imagine how long it would take for great teams to find eachother!

Also, OP, its not the mechs, its whatever side people who are just better than you decided to lump together in. The whole faction rewards thing doesn't work if there are fewer skilled players than garbage pugs like me. Garbage players like myself will just bloat up a faction and then mercs will flock to whatever faction pays the best causing either the clans or the IS to be OP for a week or 2.

Edited by Story Time, 24 May 2017 - 01:35 AM.

[TWIAFU]

The Basilisk, on 23 May 2017 - 12:04 AM, said:

. If you want to play the pro go play with the pros.

Then the inverse must be true as well.

If you cannot play with the pros, then do not play in the 'pro queue'.

[TWIAFU]

KingCobra, on 23 May 2017 - 06:55 PM, said:

Gesus someone finally gets what Im talking about grats.From Day 1 of FP units should have only played units like in the group queues in FP and all the pugs should have had there own queues as mercs so they could play IS or clan and call it good no more crying from ether side about anything and PGI could have not wasted 4 years of failed FP crap mixing PUGS and units in the same battles.

PGI could have had 4 years to develop better things for solo and fp players like better game modes maps ETC.

They have their own queue, QP and Group, well QP, since they cannot be bothered to use LFg and Group.

In CW, today, 12mans face 12mans FIRST. If no other 12man, it is a 'group', no groups, seals.

You want QP with respawn where pugtards can beat up pugtards like they do in QP, becuase that is the norm and acceptable. They do not need to work as a team.

Fine, put the pugtards vs pugtards in CW. Yea! Now they can club each other and the complaints end right there, right? They cannot earn anything from CW, other then XP or cbills. No LP, no planets. So, that means all there are there for is to farm the other team as much as they can, just like they do in QP.

You can now sit back, just like in QP, in your Clan mech and poke at range while your farming or getting farmed. Swap side to whomever grants a bonus. Do nothing in CW that grants anything behind the intent of CW.

In your QP with respawn nirvanna, it is not fair or right for you to be able to take a fully mastered mech into CW and use it to farm pugs that take trials. You must be seperated from the pug nubs so you cannot farm them or you cannot take mastered mechs.

Experienced players should not be able to play/farm lesser, right?

[iLLcapitan]

KingCobra, on 23 May 2017 - 10:49 AM, said:

Sure you can say FP was designed for units only but its a FAIL it was a FAIL from day 1 back in FP beta1 when they started to let units Slaughter non unit groups.

From Day 1 it should have been a split queue system in FP pugs Vs pugs and units VS units and if you believe that mixing the 2 types of players has not killed FP and MWO in general all of you defending the seal clubbing are out of your minds.

You cant introduce a game mode like FP and not expect players other than units want to play it. Im not downing units except for the fact they went along with not splitting the FP queues along time ago and in there greed and arrogance drove away a lot of MWO players from the game.

Then when they(UNITS) get what they want a UNIT VS UNIT FP and group Queues they cry because they cant seal club pugs to make rewards and C-bills easy its to hard for them to play other units only and get those big payoffs. I've heard it all on TS3 under diff names over 5 years.

If PGI were smart they would think about what is best for both groups not just throw them together and expect a happy outcome.

Your hatred for people who enjoy playing together literally blinds you.
The short time of the queue split was the best time to be had in CW, with lone starrs banished to their own playground. Nobody misses this split more than the units. Btw it was rolled back because the lone starrs cried about wait times.

What you also fail to perceive is that many (most) people started playing alone CW. Same for me and I got stomped countless times, but different to you and other forum cybabies, the challenge appealed to me and I strove to get better.

'I've heard it all' ... While I still have to find a single unit enjoying pugstomping day after day after day...
Big payoffs.. Thats just ridiculous looking at the state of the game with most people sitting on hundreds of millions of cbills.

Your whole post reeks of a burnt wannabe.
Some things never change.

[justcallme A S H]

Well said.