132 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

As far as I am concerned it can keep it armor, just give the Kodiak back its mobility to compensate.

In all seriousness though, the amount of damage an Annihilator can tank is ridiculous and if you really want to get right down to it, the only downside it has at all is that it is slow. Nothing Clan can compete against it right now. The KDK never had good hit boxes but it did have good agility and fast torso twisting which is what made it hard to compete against. Without that it is so-so at best. The Direwolf has crazy amounts of firepower but it is no faster than the Annihilator and only has 60 degrees of torso yaw verses the Annihilators 90 degree plus it has absolutely horrid hit boxes comparably and no Armor or Structure quirks to help it out.

So overall, I personally am expecting a significant nerf in the near future, probably reducing those armor quirks down to less than half of what they are currently at.

[Y E O N N E]

Viktor Drake, on 30 July 2017 - 11:34 AM, said:

As far as I am concerned it can keep it armor, just give the Kodiak back its mobility to compensate.

In all seriousness though, the amount of damage an Annihilator can tank is ridiculous and if you really want to get right down to it, the only downside it has at all is that it is slow. Nothing Clan can compete against it right now.

Not in DPS, no. The ANH will out-tank the DWF and win that fight. However, it is a trivial matter to poke an ANH to death, even with a DWF, because it is slow and has half of its firepower in really awful mounts.

[C E Dwyer]

If your stupid enough to stand in front of an Annihilator trading then yes it's OP.

If however you are an intelligent player that plays to the strengths of your own mech and to the weaknesses of the one your fighting it's pretty bloody awful.

It's slow it twists badly it's fodder for any half good light player, because waiting for a 50 kph assault is beyond the ability of most pugs.

So play to win claims are just having me laugh very loudly

[Angel of Annihilation]

r4plez, on 30 July 2017 - 03:44 AM, said:

First Annihilator was DOA now its P2W - f#cking MWO forums

Well who would have thought they were going to give such massive armor quirks. Remove those quirks and it would have been DOA. There are alot of mechs like this to be honest. The Linebacker would have been total crap if they hadn't give it such massive mobility quirks. So yeah DOA unquirked, tough mech quirked to hell, no surprises there.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Yeonne Greene, on 30 July 2017 - 11:37 AM, said:

Not in DPS, no. The ANH will out-tank the DWF and win that fight. However, it is a trivial matter to poke an ANH to death, even with a DWF, because it is slow and has half of its firepower in really awful mounts.

Do you really thing the Direwolf has all that good of hardpoints? I know I don't. What the ANH can do that the Direwolf can't is actually torso twist effectively. Even without the the massive quriks, the shape of the ANH torso would allow it to twist and cover 10x better than a Direwolf which can't effectively twist and shield anything.

As far as poking the ANH to death sure, I have seen 5-6 mechs poking the ANH constantly and watched it tank all that for like a minute straight. Any other mech would be down in 10 seconds flat.

[Y E O N N E]

Viktor Drake, on 30 July 2017 - 11:44 AM, said:

Do you really thing the Direwolf has all that good of hardpoints? I know I don't. What the ANH can do that the Direwolf can't is actually torso twist effectively. Even without the the massive quriks, the shape of the ANH torso would allow it to twist and cover 10x better than a Direwolf which can't effectively twist and shield anything.

They are better than the ANH. With the DWF, the weapons aren't much lower than the cockpit, some are in-line with it, and if you can see it you can typically shoot it. With the ANH, the weapons are a long ways below the cockpit, which increases the amount of time it takes to actually get all of them exposed. It can corner much better than ridge, but no better than a DWF can.

Without the quirks, the ANH would be dead with only 50% of its firepower exposed almost every time.

The DWF actually can spread damage decently, just not from a flanking attack. And neither can the ANH. Or the MAD-IIC. Or the MAD. Or the STK. It's just a characteristic inherent to a deep torso shape. That said, I'm not saying the DWF doesn't need some help, just that you are exaggerating the effectiveness of the ANH.

Quote

As far as poking the ANH to death sure, I have seen 5-6 mechs poking the ANH constantly and watched it tank all that for like a minute straight. Any other mech would be down in 10 seconds flat.

Those were lazy pokes. I've seen the same thing, and it was always when there were no other targets and killing it quickly was not exactly a high priority task. But I've also seen the same thing from an Atlas.

[Shadowomega1]

Requiemking, on 30 July 2017 - 12:06 AM, said:

Well, actually, if I'm remembering correctly, the SupaHunchDakkaBear's reign of terror was a result of potato play and a bug with Clan UAC 10 Ghost Heat(ie, it had none).

The only bug with ghost heat on the UACs didn't apply just to the 10 it applied to all. Now this bug gave ghost heat on the second burst if the weapon didn't jam. As for the ghost heat is was set low because up to that point mounting 4 UAC10's could only be done on the slow moving Direwolf with low weapon mounts, as well as most UACs having low ghost heat multipliers. With the release of the KDK those UACs could now all be mounted in the toros, set high, and on a Battlemech without locked criticals and a high engine cap. On its release and seeing so many of those builds tear through assault mechs in seconds something had to be changed, however I think they went the wrong route on the change. I would have place a negative jam chance quirk on UACs for the KDK-3 that would have made double bursting with all four UACs firing far more risky and left the mech badly exposed to return fire.

The good thing to come out of it though was the confirmation of the UAC ghost heat on double bursting on two UAC 10s and 1 UAC 20 was fixed not actually sure if the UAC 2 and 5 was fixed as not sure if any mech can actually get enough to hit ghost heat.

Edited by Shadowomega1, 30 July 2017 - 12:19 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Yeonne Greene, on 30 July 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

Those were lazy pokes. I've seen the same thing, and it was always when there were no other targets and killing it quickly was not exactly a high priority task. But I've also seen the same thing from an Atlas.

I agree but the Atlas doesn't have the crazy level of firepower a ANH does. My personal experience with the Atlas is it is a good tank and a above average short range brawler but while it is getting into range it usually it is taking a ton of damage. From what I have seen in the ANH they are usually using AC/10s or UAC/5s or some such giving them double the range of most Atlas builds. Basically they don't have to cover the same distance under fire that the Atlas does in order to fight back and in fact can even stand back and function as a second line Fire Support mech. Also since they don't have to cover that distance, their slow speed isn't as much of a liability. The blunt truth is that currently it is the premiere IS Assault Mech and one could argue that it might very well be the overall premiere assault mech in the game right now. Unfortunately that means that about the time it comes on sale for C-bills, it will get a nerf and that is sad.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 30 July 2017 - 12:08 PM.

[LT. HARDCASE]

Massive powercreep that's locked behind real money, even if temporarily, is technically pay to have an advantage.

Wait until the Nightstar comes super strong out of the box, and people realize it's not out for cbills for 288 days.

Edited by LT. HARDCASE, 30 July 2017 - 12:10 PM.

[roboPrancer]

Go for the legs, and try to flank them....

[Y E O N N E]

Viktor Drake, on 30 July 2017 - 12:06 PM, said:

I agree but the Atlas doesn't have the crazy level of firepower a ANH does. My personal experience with the Atlas is it is a good tank and a above average short range brawler but while it is getting into range it usually it is taking a ton of damage. From what I have seen in the ANH they are usually using AC/10s or UAC/5s or some such giving them double the range of most Atlas builds. Basically they don't have to cover the same distance under fire that the Atlas does in order to fight back and in fact can even stand back and function as a second line Fire Support mech. Also since they don't have to cover that distance, their slow speed isn't as much of a liability. The blunt truth is that currently it is the premiere IS Assault Mech and one could argue that it might very well be the overall premiere assault mech in the game right now. Unfortunately that means that about the time it comes on sale for C-bills, it will get a nerf and that is sad.

The premier IS Assaults are still the Battlemaster and the Mauler, because they can move around the map better and that is a force multiplier. The Annihilator is good if you can get the enemy to come to you, but that's also its weakness. The solution to the ANH is the same as the solution to any power-position 'Mech: pop-tarting. And thanks to the HPPC and improvements on both ERPPC and cERPPC velocity, we have more competent pop-tarts in the game than we've ever had before.

[Honeybadgers]

my quad LB10 Trolldiak can outplay any annihilator I've come up against. Because I can twist and he can't. Even 1v1, while his numbers are better than mine on paper, when it comes down to it, nuts to butts I can get more damage where I need it than he can.

I'd take the spooky scary atlas and its invincible twisting over the annihilator. While the anny can spit out damage and take a beating when it's not being concertedly focused, it's got insanely weak hitboxes that make it REALLY need that HP it has. Maybe if you're in an incredibly well coordinated team, the Annihilator is the new dire whale for the IS, but they kinda needed one. I'm really quite happy with the new IS mechs, as a clanner. My only problem with IS is their insane new tech that leaves me face down in the dirt.

The new tech is nonsense, the new mechs are not. I quite like the annihilator. And you can have it in a few months. "pay to win" implies only mechs that can ONLY ever be bought with MC.

Edited by Honeybadgers, 30 July 2017 - 12:32 PM.

[Escef]

Teer Kerensky, on 30 July 2017 - 07:46 AM, said:

Everytime I see Annihilator in QP I feel a little bit bad for the player. To have paid real money for a mech that so often gets taken out so easily.

I can't understand how, on average, playing that thing is a good experience.

It's a nostalgia mech for those of us that loved Mechwarrior 3. You could pick one up relatively early and it just tanked damage and dealt out s***tons in return. In a franchise this old, everyone has a couple nostalgia mechs.

[Escef]

Viktor Drake, on 30 July 2017 - 11:34 AM, said:

Nothing Clan can compete against it right now.

Except Arctic Cheetahs, Vipers, and Ice Ferrets. Fast movers have always been the bane of slow assaults.

[Ryllen Kriel]

This thread is ridiculous OP. Go buy an Annihilator if you feel they are so powerful. They really aren't. I don't own any but I have friends who do and they have distinct disadvantages. I have killed quite a few in Quick Play matches, they aren't as deadly as the Kodiaks when those mechs launched last Summer.

[Humpday]

How can something be P2W when it gets released for cbills?

[The Unstoppable Puggernaut]

Play an Annihilator on Crimson straight. I don't own one but I saw one get shot to crap only because it's giraffe neck sticks out and it can't even shoot back. To counter this, I am going to take a wild wild guess, that's why it gets the extra armour. I am pretty sure I won't even buy this for c-bills when it comes out.

Anyways all the new mechs are pay to win, they'll get "balanced" soon. The Madcat II is definitely too agile, so that'll get the wooden plank treatment soon. This is all very normal, nothing to see here.

[Humpday]

Honeybadgers, on 30 July 2017 - 12:29 PM, said:

my quad LB10 Trolldiak can outplay any annihilator I've come up against. Because I can twist and he can't. Even 1v1, while his numbers are better than mine on paper, when it comes down to it, nuts to butts I can get more damage where I need it than he can.

I'd take the spooky scary atlas and its invincible twisting over the annihilator. While the anny can spit out damage and take a beating when it's not being concertedly focused, it's got insanely weak hitboxes that make it REALLY need that HP it has. Maybe if you're in an incredibly well coordinated team, the Annihilator is the new dire whale for the IS, but they kinda needed one. I'm really quite happy with the new IS mechs, as a clanner. My only problem with IS is their insane new tech that leaves me face down in the dirt.

The new tech is nonsense, the new mechs are not. I quite like the annihilator. And you can have it in a few months. "pay to win" implies only mechs that can ONLY ever be bought with MC.

Wut? It doesn't have to twist at all. I'll take you on 1v1 bud. I won't even twist, I'll just stare you down and shot your crotch or big head, while you waste time trying to twist.

Edited by Humpday, 30 July 2017 - 12:50 PM.

[iliketurtles87]

how can a mech that runs 50 kph be OP?

KDK 3 is still better and doesnt even need quirks.

[C E Dwyer]

Khobai, on 30 July 2017 - 06:33 AM, said:

DWF needs structure quirks

DWF needs its ECM variant too

thanks

Just put a go faster dekkel on it for the illusion of speed