197 replies to this topic

[Bombast]

evilauthor, on 11 August 2017 - 07:49 PM, said:

Well that's the idea. These mechs have locked SHS but need DHS to be competitive with mechs that use DHS. So why not a quirk that effectively turns SHS into DHS?

Complete equivalency seems a bit of a stretch. Quirking to performance roughly in the middle of regular SHS and DHS seems reasonable.

[Lucian Nostra]

evilauthor, on 11 August 2017 - 07:49 PM, said:

Well that's the idea. These mechs have locked SHS but need DHS to be competitive with mechs that use DHS. So why not a quirk that effectively turns SHS into DHS?

yeah what could go wrong with single slot DHS right?

[Andi Nagasia]

evilauthor, on 11 August 2017 - 07:49 PM, said:

Well that's the idea. These mechs have locked SHS but need DHS to be competitive with mechs that use DHS. So why not a quirk that effectively turns SHS into DHS?

or they could just unlock them so they can Upgrade to DHS?
MWO already doesnt Follow TT OmniMech Construction Rules, so why should we start following them now?

Arnold The Governator, on 11 August 2017 - 07:58 PM, said:

Uh, because they wouldn't be Omnimechs anymore?

The only way I would be ok with unlocked equipment for omnimechs is if there was a severe punishment if players choose so. Like for example a big disclaimer warning the player if he/she chose to unlock one of of those locked omnimechs for customization, there would be no changeable equipment for that chasis after the player did modifications to that mech. So whatever things that you did to that mech would be permanently locked unless you bought another version of that mech.

Even so, that is a far stretch since all of these newly "customized omnimechs" would throw off the balance even more and obsolete even more mechs. Thus more nerfs to weapon systems, equiptment, and other things that I don't want nerfed by this idea.

well what we have now arnt OmniMechs,

Ether MWO isnt Following TT OmniMech Construction Rules,
at which point PGI can Change those Rules for the Balance of the Game,

or MWO is Following TT OmniMech Construction Rules,
as which Point OmniMechs should be able to Equip Any amount of JJ(based on Speed) and Weapons,
and in so have all the benefits that the TT Omni Construction Rules Bestow upon them,


its ether one or the other, we ether Are Following TT Rules, or we are making our Own,
people need to choose which path they want to follow, because right now we are in limbo,

Edited by Andi Nagasia, 11 August 2017 - 08:47 PM.

[Bombast]

Andi Nagasia, on 11 August 2017 - 08:45 PM, said:

its ether one or the other, we ether Are Following TT Rules, or we are making our Own,
people need to choose which path they want to follow, because right now we are in limbo,

I think it's fairly obvious that we can't use the actual omnimech rules. The removal of hard points for omnimechs effectively makes them the best mechs in the game, no matter what quirks get thrown around.

[Snazzy Dragon]

Gas Guzzler, on 10 August 2017 - 06:46 AM, said:

One of my new favorites is "I think some people will excel at the *insert bad mech here*"

I think some people will excel at the Ambassador

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ambassador

[FupDup]

Snazzy Dragon, on 11 August 2017 - 08:55 PM, said:

I think some people will excel at the Ambassador

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ambassador

You just have to play it right. It's my playstyle.

[Khobai]

doing 0 damage and dying in one hit is your playstyle?

[Lykaon]

Lances107, on 10 August 2017 - 12:11 PM, said:

I do not believe most, but not all, IS pilots would not know what to do with Omni mechs. Very few of them understand omni mechs come with a good deal of restrictions. Namely you can not change the engine them, on some variants you can not change the structure, and on some variants the omni pods are only allowed for said variant. I think most IS pilots would go through the roof when they get a look at these restrictions. Also omni mechs cost a whole lot more because your getting the engine, pods, and mech all in one pack. If they were ever to be released for IS, and then released for via cbills.

Trust that most literate humans playing this game know all about all that stuff.

What you are glossing over is NO clan Omnimech has the following restrictions.

Fixed CASE using a crit slot and half a ton (clan case is FREE) Do you realize that Inner Sphere Pilots almost never equip CASE because it's not worth the weight and space to do so?

Fixed single heatsinks (no clan omnimech in game currently has single heatsinks and I can't even think of one in the lore circa 3060s that does use singles) Single heatsinks cripple designs like the Strider.

XL engine that results in mech destruction when a side torso is lost.Look at the I.S. Avatar and think on how difficult it is to is to hit the side torsos? How about the big blocky Sunder? How about the Templar?

14 crit slot endo steel/ferro armor when a clan mech does have endo/ferro it only uses HALF the space. 14 crit slots is very restrictive (think of how frustrating it is to put large ballistics on a Timberwolf side torso because of the 14 crit slots used by endo/ferro. Now imagine trying it with larger heavier I.S. weapons.

At least a Gargoyle has a sinlge omnipod (C right Arm) That has an entire I.S. mech's worth of hardpoints on it.

I think many exclusively clan pilots would give up on I.S. tech the instant they discovered they can't fit a timberwolf's loadout onto an I.S. mech fifteen tons heavyer and even hope to get close to the speed of the Timberwolf AND they get the suicide box XL engine as an added bonus.

Edited by Lykaon, 12 August 2017 - 01:57 AM.

[Shifty McSwift]

Khobai, on 11 August 2017 - 09:19 PM, said:

doing 0 damage and dying in one hit is your playstyle?

Tordin, on 10 August 2017 - 03:12 PM, said:

And who would smoke inside their battle armor? Thats just a s stoopid

IKR

[Valdarion Silarius]

Snazzy Dragon, on 11 August 2017 - 08:55 PM, said:

I think some people will excel at the Ambassador

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ambassador

Step aside for the Junior.

http://www.sarna.net...nior_(StarDrive)

Spoiler

Had to spoiler it because it's legs are too sexy for the forums.

[Andi Nagasia]

Arnold The Governator, on 12 August 2017 - 08:45 AM, said:

Step aside for the Junior.

http://www.sarna.net...nior_(StarDrive)

Spoiler

Had to spoiler it because it's legs are too sexy for the forums.

My god thats amazing, it looks just like a Mech versuion of the Statue of Aphrodite,

Spoiler

[Fleeb the Mad]

It seems that any IS omnis would have to be propped up on quirks to even be on the same level with IS battlemechs due to their locked equipment often being crippling flaws that can't be mitigated.

That in itself seems to be a big argument against, I'm sorry to say.

[CK16]

Although, proper quirking in place it would be easier to monitor and balance these over current mechs. Take for example the BLR-2C thing was a monster (still is imo) with its buffs it was pretty reliable to run an XL in it and be quite tanky still, XL balanced out. However people that ran them with Standards were even tanker and this stats for both had to be tracked and balanced. Ect, with LFE now in they had to balance it out a bit is my guess for the slight reduction.

What I am saying is PGI does not have to try to please both XL and Standard builds with omnimechs

[Gas Guzzler]

CK16, on 12 August 2017 - 01:12 PM, said:

What I am saying is PGI does not have to try to please both XL and Standard builds with omnimechs

The BLR-2C isn't a monster any more, other BLRs are better.

That said, your statement here applied to these omnis as well as STD-locked Clan omni's like the Kingfisher. Since it can't change engine, you don't have to balance for the different engines that you can put in, you can just balance it based on that one engine that it has. That's why these mechs would get some help, if there geometry proves to be an issue. In the case of the Sunder, I actually think its geometry isn't too bad because its CT juts out a bit and can shield a side torso without having to twist the full 90 degrees.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 12 August 2017 - 05:04 PM.

[Calcite]

why a wolf pin point this


omg its a fetice

Edited by Dave warrior2, 12 August 2017 - 05:18 PM.

[CK16]

Bump

[The Zohan]

CK16, on 02 November 2017 - 05:43 AM, said:

Bump

The answer is still no.

[CK16]

It is going and has to happen...thus pick the good ones now.

[Jay Leon Hart]

I've almost settled on my choices...

Raptor is 100% the Light I want
Men Shen is 90% the Medium I want (the BJ2-O & FS9-O have 5% each)
Black Hawk-KU is 95% the Heavy I want (still 5% on the Avatar)
I'm still 50/50 on the Assault, between the Templar and Sunder

[Paigan]

Why do you even want IS omnis?
All the OmniMechs' advantages (economically, etc.) are hardly relevant in MWO.
Clan Omnis are gimped and restrained wherever possible.
Thus, in MWO (Clan) Battlemechs are MUCH more customizable and versatile than Omnis. You hardly need the customization potential of Omnipods if you have a ton of Battlemech variants with hardpoint inflation. Just pick one of those. Most Omnis don't even have an AMS hardpoint if you heed the pod set to get the quirks that are just there whithout any payoff in Battlemechs
Compare the MAD IIC and the WHK, for example. Since they overnerfed the WHK-C's -13% heat quirk combination to negligible -4% instead of reasonable -8% to -10%, the MAD IIC can do everything the WHK can, but better.

Omnis might look "superior" because of the lore background, but how PGI implemented them, they are actually the restrained low tech crap variant and the old Battlemechs are the shiny high tech powerful variant.

Edited by Paigan, 02 November 2017 - 07:05 AM.