Jump to content

Please, Please Seperate Group And Solo Queue.


281 replies to this topic

#1 Divenity

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Knight Errant
  • 66 posts

Posted 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM

Most PuGs don't enjoy getting stomped by premades, and most premades don't enjoy stomping PuGs.

Time and time again I hear two things

1. "go play quick play"

2. "there isn't enough population to support separated queues."

Thing is, those two statements are contradictory...If all the PuGs went and played quick play, there would be the exact same number of people left playing FP as there would be in the group only queue if queues were separated... So, why not just separate the queues?

Let the PuGs and the groups both contribute to the faction war with reasonably fair fights.

Add a checkbox for solo players to optionally fill in gaps in the group queues if they are willing, for when groups can't field a full 12 people.

I'd wager you'd actually get MORE people participating in FP with separated queues, since the people not doing it because they got sick of getting stomped by premades every other game would have reason to go play it again.

Edited by Divenity, 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM.


#2 MischiefSC

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The 1 Percent
  • The 1 Percent
  • 15,162 posts

Posted 10 January 2018 - 10:32 PM

Put the FW content in QP so people can play it with a matchmaker. You don't get to earn LP and the higher cbill rewards of FW by playing QP, which is all a QP queue for FW would be. The reason it's got the higher payouts is that you are, indeed, playing in a mixed environment. You know, faction vs faction.

Just remove pugging from FW all together and require grouping up.

#3 Johnathan Tanner

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Patron Saint
  • The Patron Saint
  • 429 posts
  • LocationCurrently dodging the pugs war crimes tribunal

Posted 10 January 2018 - 10:48 PM

Sure, I think most units would be delighted to have a split queue. On this condition.

No rewards,No LP, No Mechbays. No extra cbills. No influencing the map.(Not that anybody really cares about that at this point)

Just quickplay with respawns.

Have fun.

#4 FrostyBurn

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 76 posts
  • LocationStockholm

Posted 10 January 2018 - 10:48 PM

The queues were split and it didn't work for the pugs. So they got integrated with unit. That means pugs can play FP and try to get good or skip it. With the population as it is we don't have any other choice. Sorry. If it were a possibility I think almost everyone would prefer split queues.

#5 justcallme A S H

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Ogre
  • The Ogre
  • 4,063 posts
  • LocationMelbourne, AU

Posted 10 January 2018 - 10:52 PM

I've got an even better idea. What it should be is just a "LRM queue"

So all the people that wanna LRM, can LRM each other to their hearts content while crying about no-one holding locks for them. That would fix most of the problems right there as the LRM boats are usually the ones:

- Not bringing optimised loadouts to FP
- Doing sub 1000 damage
- Hiding in the back the entire game
- Rarely following/helping the team
- The "I don't wanna socialise" type of player who is "playing the game their way"

That would leave most of the decent solos left that will work with teams and thus everyone's experience is improved as a whole.

I'm onto something here. I can feel it.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 10 January 2018 - 10:53 PM.


#6 Vxheous

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Big Daddy
  • Big Daddy
  • 2,357 posts

Posted 11 January 2018 - 12:14 AM

View Postjustcallme A S H, on 10 January 2018 - 10:52 PM, said:


I'm onto something here. I can feel it.


That feeling you're getting.....it's probably another 30 day vacation incoming...Posted Image

Edited by Vxheous, 11 January 2018 - 12:14 AM.


#7 Wing 0

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Mercenary Rank 10
  • Mercenary Rank 10
  • 608 posts
  • LocationCalifornia

Posted 11 January 2018 - 12:19 AM

View PostDivenity, on 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

Most PuGs don't enjoy getting stomped by premades, and most premades don't enjoy stomping PuGs.

Time and time again I hear two things

1. "go play quick play"

2. "there isn't enough population to support separated queues."

Thing is, those two statements are contradictory...If all the PuGs went and played quick play, there would be the exact same number of people left playing FP as there would be in the group only queue if queues were separated... So, why not just separate the queues?

Let the PuGs and the groups both contribute to the faction war with reasonably fair fights.

Add a checkbox for solo players to optionally fill in gaps in the group queues if they are willing, for when groups can't field a full 12 people.

I'd wager you'd actually get MORE people participating in FP with separated queues, since the people not doing it because they got sick of getting stomped by premades every other game would have reason to go play it again.


Splitting the queues for Faction Play was already attempted and It failed. It wont be happening again anytime soon.

[REDACTED]

Edited by Ibrandul Mike, 18 January 2018 - 05:02 AM.
Wouldn't suggest doing that... might be a CoC violation


#8 The Basilisk

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Lance Sergeant
  • Lance Sergeant
  • 2,841 posts
  • LocationFrankfurt a.M.

Posted 11 January 2018 - 01:02 AM

Posted Imagejustcallme A S H, on 11 January 2018 - 07:52 AM, said:

I've got an even better idea. What it should be is just a "LRM queue"

So all the people that wanna LRM, can LRM each other to their hearts content while crying about no-one holding locks for them. That would fix most of the problems right there as the LRM boats are usually the ones:

- Not bringing optimised loadouts to FP
- Doing sub 1000 damage
- Hiding in the back the entire game
- Rarely following/helping the team
- The "I don't wanna socialise" type of player who is "playing the game their way"

That would leave most of the decent solos left that will work with teams and thus everyone's experience is improved as a whole.

I'm onto something here. I can feel it.


Hmmm did you mix up the thread you where answering to ?
Nobody said anything about LRMs in this thread...it was about removing PuG stompers from the mayority of people that is playing FactionPlay nowadays.

Posted ImageWing 0, on 11 January 2018 - 09:19 AM, said:


Splitting the queues for Faction Play was already attempted and It failed. It wont be happening again anytime soon.

[REDACTED]

I think the prior attemp to split queues was too early.
From what I see in FP at this point is that the vast majority of people is playing FP as solo pickup player or in very smal Groups.

A possible solution could indeed be the splitting of queues if you seperate large Groups and Lances (Groups of 4,8,12) into one queue and smal groups and PuGs into an other. Uneven groups like 2-3 go into PuG and uneven Groups over 3 are not allowed. BTW that is what the looking for Group tool is for.

Edited by Ibrandul Mike, 18 January 2018 - 05:05 AM.
Quote Cleanup


#9 justcallme A S H

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Ogre
  • The Ogre
  • 4,063 posts
  • LocationMelbourne, AU

Posted 11 January 2018 - 02:39 AM

View PostVxheous, on 11 January 2018 - 12:14 AM, said:


That feeling you're getting.....it's probably another 30 day vacation incoming...Posted Image


I'll have you know I have a firm grip on my wooden desk right now

View PostThe Basilisk, on 11 January 2018 - 01:02 AM, said:


Hmmm did you mix up the thread you where answering to ?
Nobody said anything about LRMs in this thread...it was about removing PuG stompers from the mayority of people that is playing FactionPlay nowadays.


Not at all.

I just came up with a better idea than what the OP suggested (which had been suggested 50 times at least, and will never happen). after hours of in depth thought on the matter

Edited by justcallme A S H, 11 January 2018 - 03:07 AM.


#10 Bohxim

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The God of Death
  • The God of Death
  • 447 posts

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:12 AM

That still wouldn't stop premades from making multiple groups of 3 and sync dropping. In face if it was scouting, the 3 man probably would leave the 4th guy out and do their thing, which means the 4th guy likely wouldn't make match score requirements either (I know cos I've been in that 3 man group multiple times. We usually think we're enough and rush straight ahead)

#11 Lady Alexandra Cousland

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • General
  • General
  • 315 posts
  • LocationNetherlands

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:36 AM

View PostJohnathan Tanner, on 10 January 2018 - 10:48 PM, said:

Sure, I think most units would be delighted to have a split queue. On this condition.

No rewards,No LP, No Mechbays. No extra cbills. No influencing the map.(Not that anybody really cares about that at this point)

Just quickplay with respawns.

Have fun.


Least we could ask for a 30 minute+ wait time that will come if implemented. :P

#12 TWIAFU

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Fire
  • Fire
  • 3,555 posts
  • LocationBell's Brewery, MI

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:45 AM

View PostJohnathan Tanner, on 10 January 2018 - 10:48 PM, said:

Sure, I think most units would be delighted to have a split queue. On this condition.

No rewards,No LP, No Mechbays. No extra cbills. No influencing the map.(Not that anybody really cares about that at this point)

Just quickplay with respawns.

Have fun.


Derpity-derp in QP, leave CW for those that want to try for a little better gaming experience.

#13 Emeraudes

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • The Vicious
  • The Vicious
  • 68 posts

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:47 AM

View PostDivenity, on 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

I'd wager you'd actually get MORE people participating in FP with separated queues, since the people not doing it because they got sick of getting stomped by premades every other game would have reason to go play it again.


I'd actually like to see the statistics to back up this statement. Also, what's stopping people from synch dropping if such a queue was implemented

I'm basically going to repeat the points I've made in every post of this kind from now on until it is legitimately contested.

#14 TWIAFU

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Fire
  • Fire
  • 3,555 posts
  • LocationBell's Brewery, MI

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:48 AM

View PostBohxim, on 11 January 2018 - 03:12 AM, said:

That still wouldn't stop premades from making multiple groups of 3 and sync dropping. In face if it was scouting, the 3 man probably would leave the 4th guy out and do their thing, which means the 4th guy likely wouldn't make match score requirements either (I know cos I've been in that 3 man group multiple times. We usually think we're enough and rush straight ahead)



Pssst, we do not play CW for match score.

That is something event farmers think and worry about.

#15 Juju Shinobi

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Rage
  • Rage
  • 155 posts
  • LocationSingapore

Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:56 AM

View PostDivenity, on 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

Most PuGs don't enjoy getting stomped by premades, and most premades don't enjoy stomping PuGs.

Time and time again I hear two things

1. "go play quick play"

2. "there isn't enough population to support separated queues."

Thing is, those two statements are contradictory...If all the PuGs went and played quick play, there would be the exact same number of people left playing FP as there would be in the group only queue if queues were separated... So, why not just separate the queues?

Let the PuGs and the groups both contribute to the faction war with reasonably fair fights.

Add a checkbox for solo players to optionally fill in gaps in the group queues if they are willing, for when groups can't field a full 12 people.

I'd wager you'd actually get MORE people participating in FP with separated queues, since the people not doing it because they got sick of getting stomped by premades every other game would have reason to go play it again.


Good evening my good and kind sir. Just to jog your memory a tad my dear gentleman, there is a gigantic and very obvious warning that CW is not for solo and new players. It is for groups. Also my dear friend, they have separated the queues before and you'd take an hour or more to find a match. I would highly suggest finding friends to play with or just getting better at the video game.

Thank you for your attention and have a wonderful day =)

Edited by Juju Shinobi, 11 January 2018 - 03:57 AM.


#16 Daidachi

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clamps
  • The Clamps
  • 411 posts
  • LocationSydney

Posted 11 January 2018 - 04:00 AM

<message deleted>

#17 Ssamout

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 337 posts
  • LocationPihalla

Posted 11 January 2018 - 04:11 AM

View PostBohxim, on 11 January 2018 - 03:12 AM, said:

That still wouldn't stop premades from making multiple groups of 3 and sync dropping. In face if it was scouting, the 3 man probably would leave the 4th guy out and do their thing, which means the 4th guy likely wouldn't make match score requirements either (I know cos I've been in that 3 man group multiple times. We usually think we're enough and rush straight ahead)

I've dropped manymany times as a solo in FP and have found no problems following units, leading pushes and out scoring them, without ever hearing any of them speak. You can just, I dont know, follow them on the radar or just by looking at them to see where they are going. If you are left out, problem lies in you own movement and or mech/build.

Only problem when dropping solo is, if the team you are put into wants to do something special (like brawl on a long range map) and you are not prepared for that, but that really does not happen often. And surprise you can actually brawl and push with erll/erppc mechs (even lrms [*gasp*]), they just are not that good as a dedicated brawling builds, but you should do it if every one else is, cos your armor is usually needed.

#18 Tarl Cabot

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Tai-sho
  • Tai-sho
  • 5,330 posts
  • LocationImperial City, Luthien - Draconis Combine

Posted 11 January 2018 - 04:15 AM

Boreal sucks for the passive attackers if the defenders, be it pug or group, have half a brain and get setup on outlying hills. Then said passive attackers spend way too much time attempting to trade at the gates but once a few do push, not all follow and stick to trading at the gate.

Edited by Ibrandul Mike, 16 January 2018 - 05:09 PM.
Quote Cleanup


#19 Stealthrider

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 75 posts

Posted 11 January 2018 - 04:27 AM

Just gonna leave what I proposed in the "Yet Another FP Thread" thread here, because relevant.

Quote

So here's what I propose as at least a temporary "fix."

There's been suggestions of limiting group size to a single lance. Instead of having the game hard-limit the mode as such, I propose that units try to limit themselves to smaller drops. Additionally, that they use the in-game VOIP to drop call and coordinate the pugs and (I'd imagine) smaller/weaker units on the team. The goal is twofold: 1) to attempt to lessen the impact of a large unit drop, both in terms of overall power and of the psychological effect a large drop has on opponents, and 2) to give the other players a taste of what kind of coordination a large/good unit plays with and demonstrate why and how it is effective.

This could be a community-run event of sorts, where this happens for a month or some other period, or a personal mandate by whichever units felt generous enough to do it regularly. Either way, the hope is that by making this kind of effort FP won't appear as daunting as it typically can, that it would encourage players to seek out advice rather than getting clubbed and putting the mode aside, and overall improve the playerbase both new and veteran.


#20 Xannatharr

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 264 posts

Posted 11 January 2018 - 09:51 AM

Sorry, long post coming.


Look, we are all playing the lottery when we queue for a match, even if you queue with a group.

Case in point - last night The Templars were dropping some casual Faction (we run 10-12 mans on Monday/Tuesday night, but the rest of the week it's generally smaller groups) so last night we were between 5-7 guys.

Drop 1, 5 Templars - Conquest on Grim Plexus - For opponents we drew the EVIL & Friends 12-man that was bouncing around late yesterday. For allies we got 4 or 5 Mercstar Guys and a couple folks that looked like they queued solo. It was actually a decent match, we lost by 125 resources but the EVIL premade was up big on kills. LOSS

Drop 2, 7 Templars - Invasion Attack on Vitric Forge - Opponents were EVIL & Friends again. For allies we got a mixed bag of folks, including a few who actively questioned the calls and hung back trying to farm individual damage/score. We got beat handily and only managed to get one of the gens down by running a few mechs into one gate while the main body pushed the other. We then got to sit and watch EVIL spawncamp the couple of guys that had mechs left because they refused to move with the team . LOSS

Drop 3, 6 Templars - Invasion Attack on Hellbore Springs - Opponents were a BCMC & Friends 10-12 man. For allies we drew four 66AH guys, who listened to calls and worked with the team nicely, and two other guys, one of whom always runs to the opposite gate every time and seems to always be perma-dead before wave 3. The other team beat us handily. LOSS

See the pattern here?

Sure, the Clan had Radar Sweep pretty much all night, which certainly made it easier for them but those teams above outplayed us, with better positioning, really good accuracy and the advantage of being on defense helped them a little too. But I am not blaming them for queuing with their unit-mates and friends and kicking our asses. That isn't their fault - we are responsible for our own play and our own choices! We are responsible for learning where we need improvement then working on those things so that we can knock them off their thrones.

Do we want to see EVIL/BCMC/KCOM/228 etc every time we drop? Not really, but we signed up for it and we have to take what we get. (I know some of those guys don't really drop FP anymore)

Queuing in a group, large or small, does not guarantee a "fair" match, except in the sense that each team has 48 mechs. DC's, solo farmers, people who ignore calls, or who criticize the calls but aren't willing to make them are problems that we all have to deal with. That's why people will try to get a full group when they can because they can rule most of that out in advance. That's the design of the mode; sorry if you don't like it.

Please stop trying to change the Faction Play game mode away from what it was always designed to be - a place where players team up and work together to bring complimentary builds then work collectively to win the match.

If you want to queue solo, go for it. I won't even be mad if you come on the forums and complain that you got spanked by a bunch of EVIL or BCMC or KCOM or maybe even T (we want to get good enough to make you complain!). But please don't come on here and ask for the mode to be changed to suit your preference for solo play when that is not what it was designed for in the first place. Faction Play is already on life support and it isn't because people are tired of getting beat, it's because the depth and features that PGI promoted were never fully delivered.

Posted Image



In the name of all that is good and holy in this freeking universe, I humbly ask that you please do not try to ruin what little is left for those who are still managing to squeeze a little fun out of this husk.

Signed,

Everyone that likes playing Faction with their friends





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users