467 replies to this topic

[Sebaztien Hawke]

... I also think the game balance is off.
In those “destroy the orbital cannon” matches, why do the defenders have as many lives as the attackers, when they already have the garrison advantage?

Why aren’t maps bigger so the defenders need to choose how to allocate their forces between A and B, with only fast light mechs having time to potentially move between them to reinforce? A bad or unlucky call thus meaning the attackers sweep through unopposed.

Larger maps could also have staging points to capture which allow reloads or repair... but certainly they are heavily biased in the defender’s favour, which may turn players away.

Maybe it’s time for quick play to have drop decks for Incursion games or something. The possibilities for shaking things up season to season are endless, surely?

[Sjorpha]

Sebaztien Hawke, on 25 February 2018 - 09:00 PM, said:

... I also think the game balance is off.
In those “destroy the orbital cannon” matches, why do the defenders have as many lives as the attackers, when they already have the garrison advantage?

Why aren’t maps bigger so the defenders need to choose how to allocate their forces between A and B, with only fast light mechs having time to potentially move between them to reinforce? A bad or unlucky call thus meaning the attackers sweep through unopposed.

Because the attackers actually have the overall advantage if trying to win the match, they don't need to "win the fight" since they have a non-kill win condition. This means the defenders need an slight advantage in the fighting department, otherwise attacking would be too easy.

[Horseman]

Sebaztien Hawke, on 25 February 2018 - 09:00 PM, said:

In those “destroy the orbital cannon” matches, why do the defenders have as many lives as the attackers, when they already have the garrison advantage?

Because the attackers can win by suicide rush for the generators.

[Xavier]

New players quit because their isn't a game mechanic that helps them understand the game teach them the little nuances about FP (positioning, builds, strategy, when to reinforce, When to regroup, Retreating, Advancing) that organized units have been forced to invent for themselves. Which is why 90% of solo vs organized group play ends up in a group victory regardless of the groups overall talent level.

Units then become villain-ized by solo's for power gaming and meta-gaming when in fact its nothing more than coordination they have ironed out over time. You want to keep new players around. There needs to be a social mechanic that connects them with units who are willing to take the time to instruct new players and educate them in coordinated strategies. Some sort of a unit directory would allow players to search for and find units to connect with and help retain a lot of disgruntled first time FP players.

and to anyone who says that faction play shouldn't have to be group run I argue that FP is the requisite team game mode with deeper strategy considerations than just shoot and die like in QP solo/group. The definition of a faction (a small, organized, dissenting group within a larger one, especially in politics.) clearly calls out groups within groups and the definition of a group (a number of people or things that are located close together or are considered or classed together.) clearly calls out for more than just one person. I think the insinuation that Faction Play should be a group organized activity is clearly stated in the name itself.

[Achle]

Getting close to requitting again. I enjoy the game, but I like to solo queue for FP and lately it seems the wait time has gotten horrible. I queue up and made dinner a couple nights only to find I was still waiting for a match.
Love the game...but seems they need to fix some things

[meteorol]

Yondu the Ravager, on 25 February 2018 - 12:50 AM, said:

But when you want to put yourself up against really good pilots and improve I would say FP is the best place for it.

Yeah... well... no.

When people started fleeing CW a few weeks after its initial release, the top tier players were among the first to drop CW like a hot potatoe. The vast majority of top tier players and units abandoned CW, because rolling over helpless pugs in 9 of 10 matches wasn't the challange they looked for.

The chance of running into really good pilots is considerably lower in FP than it is in QP. MWO has a small amount of really good players, and most of them are a really rare sight in FP.

What FP offers though, is the possiblity to play against T5 permabads with a T1 account. It offers the ability to genrush pugs as a 12 man. Neither of which will help you to improve as a player. Playing against T5 - T3 players and guys in trial mechs teaches bad habits and does not help to improve as a player by any means, and it happens frequently in FP. A lot more than in QP.

Edited by meteorol, 26 February 2018 - 12:50 PM.

[GBxGhostRyder]

meteorol, on 26 February 2018 - 12:47 PM, said:

Yeah... well... no.

When people started fleeing CW a few weeks after its initial release, the top tier players were among the first to drop CW like a hot potatoe. The vast majority of top tier players and units abandoned CW, because rolling over helpless pugs in 9 of 10 matches wasn't the challange they looked for.

The chance of running into really good pilots is considerably lower in FP than it is in QP. MWO has a small amount of really good players, and most of them are a really rare sight in FP.

What FP offers though, is the possiblity to play against T5 permabads with a T1 account. It offers the ability to genrush pugs as a 12 man. Neither of which will help you to improve as a player. Playing against T5 - T3 players and guys in trial mechs teaches bad habits and does not help to improve as a player by any means, and it happens frequently in FP. A lot more than in QP.

I have to agree on this post very rarely anymore will you find f1-f2 vets playing MWO in FP or QP some play comp play but most have left the game and moved on to better games that are more balanced and competitive.

You have only 1 man and his company to blame for MWO'S demise after Closed beta the main reason is lack of communication with his player base and allowing a small group of players to sway his decisions.

Many good players have tried to help him and MWO only to be banned for there efforts. Plus Cris I believe now is the real dev of MWO and makes all the day to day decisions so as far as real new players to MWO there as rare as those old T1 vets your trying to find in MWO good luck.

Edited by GBxGhostRyder, 26 February 2018 - 01:21 PM.

[Xavier]

Sebaztien Hawke, on 25 February 2018 - 09:00 PM, said:

... I also think the game balance is off.
In those “destroy the orbital cannon” matches, why do the defenders have as many lives as the attackers, when they already have the garrison advantage?

Why aren’t maps bigger so the defenders need to choose how to allocate their forces between A and B, with only fast light mechs having time to potentially move between them to reinforce? A bad or unlucky call thus meaning the attackers sweep through unopposed.

Larger maps could also have staging points to capture which allow reloads or repair... but certainly they are heavily biased in the defender’s favour, which may turn players away.

Maybe it’s time for quick play to have drop decks for Incursion games or something. The possibilities for shaking things up season to season are endless, surely?

Clearly you don't remember the initial phases of CW where all generators were really spaced apart and there was no defender advantage at all in fact it felt like a detriment to be a defender. I dont mind a cetralized location but what I do mind is that the entrances to those bases are all so close to each other.

Grim plexus both gates have about 10 feet between them. I think gates should have much more spacing and allow for larger use of the map not one central choke point.

[Yondu Udonta]

meteorol, on 26 February 2018 - 12:47 PM, said:

Yeah... well... no.

When people started fleeing CW a few weeks after its initial release, the top tier players were among the first to drop CW like a hot potatoe. The vast majority of top tier players and units abandoned CW, because rolling over helpless pugs in 9 of 10 matches wasn't the challange they looked for.

The chance of running into really good pilots is considerably lower in FP than it is in QP. MWO has a small amount of really good players, and most of them are a really rare sight in FP.

What FP offers though, is the possiblity to play against T5 permabads with a T1 account. It offers the ability to genrush pugs as a 12 man. Neither of which will help you to improve as a player. Playing against T5 - T3 players and guys in trial mechs teaches bad habits and does not help to improve as a player by any means, and it happens frequently in FP. A lot more than in QP.

I do agree that rolling over helpless pugs gets boring over time. Unfortunately, unless you are referring to group QP, I don't see how going up against good pilots is 'considerably lower in FP than in QP'. There are several units and premades where the average individual skill is better than that of an average T1 player. Occasionally I do go up against EONs/EmPs/228 comp players and whenever I am dropping with a premade, I try to encourage the leader to drop against an opposition premade because one only gets better by playing against stronger players.

Just because the ability is offered does not mean it has to be made used of. Genrushing in general is deplorable. Perhaps if you have dropped with me in FP you would know that I almost never encourage gen rushes. As for bad habits, if one isn't disciplined enough to prevent bad habits from inculcating, then may the good teams come along and roll over that player.

[GBxGhostRyder]

Yondu the Ravager, on 26 February 2018 - 07:41 PM, said:

I do agree that rolling over helpless pugs gets boring over time. Unfortunately, unless you are referring to group QP, I don't see how going up against good pilots is 'considerably lower in FP than in QP'. There are several units and premades where the average individual skill is better than that of an average T1 player. Occasionally I do go up against EONs/EmPs/228 comp players and whenever I am dropping with a premade, I try to encourage the leader to drop against an opposition premade because one only gets better by playing against stronger players.

Just because the ability is offered does not mean it has to be made used of. Genrushing in general is deplorable. Perhaps if you have dropped with me in FP you would know that I almost never encourage gen rushes. As for bad habits, if one isn't disciplined enough to prevent bad habits from inculcating, then may the good teams come along and roll over that player.

That's why 4 years ago PGI should have split the QP and FP buckets organized teams in one bucket to play each other and pugs in the other bucket to play them self's until they became skilled enough to join teams but no some idiot put them all in the same bucket and MWO went to heck over 4 years now it will soon just be a memory like MechWarrior4 became.

And we can wait another 10 years maybe the next MechWarrior BattleTech Dev will have some brains.

[Pain G0D]

GBxGhostRyder, on 26 February 2018 - 10:14 PM, said:

That's why 4 years ago PGI should have split the QP and FP buckets organized teams in one bucket to play each other and pugs in the other bucket to play them self's until they became skilled enough to join teams but no some idiot put them all in the same bucket and MWO went to heck over 4 years now it will soon just be a memory like MechWarrior4 became.

And we can wait another 10 years maybe the next MechWarrior BattleTech Dev will have some brains.

No game is perfect . Few games are as generous or as reasonably priced with in game purchases . DEVs and players are in constant contact through this forum . MWO gives me multiple reasons to want to financially support it and I am pretty sure i am not the only one .

You friend will probably become a memory much sooner than MWO .

[iLLcapitan]

meteorol, on 26 February 2018 - 12:47 PM, said:

The chance of running into really good pilots is considerably lower in FP than it is in QP. MWO has a small amount of really good players, and most of them are a really rare sight in FP.

What FP offers though, is the possiblity to play against T5 permabads with a T1 account. It offers the ability to genrush pugs as a 12 man. Neither of which will help you to improve as a player. Playing against T5 - T3 players and guys in trial mechs teaches bad habits and does not help to improve as a player by any means, and it happens frequently in FP. A lot more than in QP.

BS, big time. The quality of matches in QP is abysmal and you know it. To find decent players there is just as likely as in CW, only with no strategy at all, nascar 24/7 and a lot test (bad) builds. I know you're campaigning against CW in the forums for quite some time and that is probably due to your disappointment with what was promised / delivered. Just get over it and let people enjoy what little is left.

I think many new players who read the forums have to get the impression that CW is the living hell of the game. Bittervets with broken dreams reinforce that feel in every threat, most of them havent played (CW or at all) in ages.

See, we maybe aren't many but we enjoy the mode despite its obvious flaws. Esp looking at the alternatives, group queue with its restrictions and sometimes crazy wait times only for a match to last 2 min. That beeing said, I'd welcome a incentive to include pugs in a group and for bigger groups to find other big groups - I don't know how rly, without building dream castles. The removal of the penalties upon breaking contract should help in that regard.

Why do new players leave? The challenge of CW is appealing to some, others are appaled by it.

[Yondu Udonta]

iLLcapitan, on 27 February 2018 - 01:06 AM, said:

nascar 24/7 and a lot test (bad) builds

So true. I get tilted trying to master my assaults because the damn pugs nascar around about anything they can find. And all those mixed range builds oh god. The standard of players in QP is so bad I could run around in a MLX/PIR getting at least 4 kills critting rear CTs.

[GBxGhostRyder]

Pain G0D, on 27 February 2018 - 01:00 AM, said:

No game is perfect . Few games are as generous or as reasonably priced with in game purchases . DEVs and players are in constant contact through this forum . MWO gives me multiple reasons to want to financially support it and I am pretty sure i am not the only one .

You friend will probably become a memory much sooner than MWO .

Maybe I will become a memory before MWO dies but like 200,000+ other old vets I will not support MWO and it Devs desire to pug hunt in FP thinking it will be serious competition or blow away new players 24/7 in QP exploiting the game mode and watching them uninstall for the last 4 years.

I might come back to play Solaris if its balanced and competitive and not another pug hunt being balancing from the top down.
I have said what I have to say the Devs have made this game horrible by balancing the game from a top down approach by players that only want MWO 1 way there way and no communication with its players except to harass and ban them on this forum and twitter and red edit if they don't like what is being said.

Players quit games for many reasons they don't like the game itself its to hard its to easy ETC but in 5 years I have never seen a company run off so many players just to satisfy the devs and the 5% who truly believe what the devs have don't is right.

This game 4 years ago could not even support its own servers this company without assistance every year would be bankrupt the way they treat there player base.

[Ssamout]

GBxGhostRyder, on 27 February 2018 - 09:44 AM, said:

Maybe I will become a memory before MWO dies but like 200,000+ other old vets I will not support MWO and it Devs desire to pug hunt in FP thinking it will be serious competition or blow away new players 24/7 in QP exploiting the game mode and watching them uninstall for the last 4 years.

I might come back to play Solaris if its balanced and competitive and not another pug hunt being balancing from the top down.
I have said what I have to say the Devs have made this game horrible by balancing the game from a top down approach by players that only want MWO 1 way there way and no communication with its players except to harass and ban them on this forum and twitter and red edit if they don't like what is being said.

Players quit games for many reasons they don't like the game itself its to hard its to easy ETC but in 5 years I have never seen a company run off so many players just to satisfy the devs and the 5% who truly believe what the devs have don't is right.

This game 4 years ago could not even support its own servers this company without assistance every year would be bankrupt the way they treat there player base.

Pfff..

Devs are incapable to pug hunt in FP. They just dont know how to make the mode pleasing to many.

Balanced from top down? Like removing/seriously nerfing weapons that require aiming? Show me a top player that is satisfied by pgi's policy to nerf everything that was fun and working, Nah, they listen to scrubs complaining when someone kills them several times in the same way. LoreWhales complaining that their legacy loadout doesnt work in their favorite mech, like it used to in table top/single player mechwarrior. And ofcourse they listen to some comp player salty from a yet another shift in the meta.

Problem is that you cant please them all. Atleast not, without proper elo/tiering. And that boat sank already.

[Sniper09121986]

Ssamout, on 27 February 2018 - 10:18 AM, said:

Problem is that you cant please them all. Atleast not, without proper elo/tiering. And that boat sank already.

I say it has been sunk intentionally, but it would not be hard to make it sail again. When they tried to split the queues they did it not like it is in QP, but only by unit tags. That hit unit players playing solo (I heard it happens sometimes ) and did squat to stop unitless players from forming a premade, getting on VOIP and getting on with their seal-clubbing. Instead they should separate groups from solo players, exactly like it is successfully done in QP and how the players wanted it done, but for reasons unexplained they have chosen to sabotage the whole thing and set FP into a vicious circle of diminishing population ←→ inability to sustain split queues. And if their latest decision to alienate loyalists is any indication, they will not bother with anything on that front.

[meteorol]

iLLcapitan, on 27 February 2018 - 01:06 AM, said:

BS, big time. The quality of matches in QP is abysmal and you know it. T

Yes, the match quality in QP is abysmal. And i know it. PSR is a joke, every terribad got into t1 by now, and you have a chance to play against terrible players even if the valves aren't open.

QP match quality is abysmal yes. The real shocker is that match quality in FP has been even worse for a long time. by a long shot, btw.

iLLcapitan, on 27 February 2018 - 01:06 AM, said:

I know you're campaigning against CW in the forums for quite some time and that is probably due to your disappointment with what was promised / delivered. Just get over it and let people enjoy what little is left.

Top f*cking kek.

ANYONE who ever believed ANYTHING PGI promised in regards to CW is 100% delusional. PGI's limitations were always very obvious, and it was very, very clear what they would deliver. From the first second on. Anyone right in his mind knew what CW was going to be.

Which is why i'm not dissapointed by it. They delivered exactly what i expected, and i enjoyed it for what it's worth.

I have easily played 400+ hours of CW. I'm loyalty 18 with JF, between 7 and 10 for many other factions. From release of CW to midway of season two - early season 3 you basically wouldn't meet me in QP.

What made me stop playing CW, is, *drum roll*, the utterly terrible match quality in FP that reached a point i couldn't stand anymore. Playing 7 matches in a row with 8-10 players on either team scoring something like between 121 and 850 damage throughout 4 mechs. I grew tired. It's not that i lost much in CW. IIRC, my overall W/L never dropped below 3 back then, way higher than my QP W/L as a matter of fact , and this was while easily solo pugging 3/4 of my matches. It was just that the matches were terrible.

I was never a friend of the lazy chokepoint riddled design of invasion maps and i have always been a loud critic when it comes to invasion map design. I'm disgruntled by the fact that PGI never cared to redo some of the worst invasion maps, while making unnecessary changes to QP maps that were in much less need of it. But i chewed through hundreds of hours on those maps because i enjoyed the possiblities and implications of limited respawns so much.

If the match quality in FP was better, i would be all over it. I'd be 100% done with QP. I still feel the urge to play FP. But i can't get myself to do it anymore. Played like 3 matches, which took me almost 3 hours when accouting for the waiting time, threw up into my mouth a little, left again.

Edited by meteorol, 27 February 2018 - 01:16 PM.

[TWIAFU]

meteorol, on 27 February 2018 - 01:15 PM, said:

If the match quality in FP was better, i would be all over it. I'd be 100% done with QP. I still feel the urge to play FP. But i can't get myself to do it anymore. Played like 3 matches, which took me almost 3 hours when accouting for the waiting time, threw up into my mouth a little, left again.

Solo play in the Group/Unit queue sucks, do not do it.

Gameplay improves dramatically IF you can find 11 friends to play with.

Got 11 friends to play with?

[justcallme A S H]

meteorol, on 26 February 2018 - 12:47 PM, said:

Yeah... well... no.

When people started fleeing CW a few weeks after its initial release, the top tier players were among the first to drop CW like a hot potatoe. The vast majority of top tier players and units abandoned CW, because rolling over helpless pugs in 9 of 10 matches wasn't the challange they looked for.

The chance of running into really good pilots is considerably lower in FP than it is in QP. MWO has a small amount of really good players, and most of them are a really rare sight in FP.

TBH it feels like most games in GQ are the same for me.

Much of a muchness - Too many good players have quit MWO for there to be a noticeable challenge the majority of the time.

[LordNothing]

you come into a game thats been around as long as this one with a small but very dedicated player base that really knows the material. you are then greeted with a broken match maker in qp and the great shark tank that is fp. then you have to wait 10-30 minutes for a match that you are probably going to loose. there is no meaningful training in the game to get you where you need to be to compete. learning what weapons are good and how to build a winning mech is hard and not explained anywhere. and you are stuck running barely viable trial builds until you stack the cbills to even approach your first mech purchase, and with you being new, its going to be a bad choice. then you get to start the slow grind to mastery to fill in the skill tree that you dont understand because you are new. all while this is going on you have to get gud somehow. its amazing more people dont ragequit and uninstall.

if you still need to ask why new players leave, you may very well have the iq of a potato.