366 replies to this topic

[MrMadguy]

Also this. Leaderboard allows us to prove, that PSR is broken. Without it all our statements would be "anecdotal", cuz there always will be "Only PGI has all stats" argument. And with leaderboard everything is obvious. <40% (45% now, but it's due to Christmas events - S20 stats are terrible again) rating means Tier 4. And I'm Tier 2. Conclusion?

Edited by MrMadguy, 10 February 2018 - 08:44 AM.

[Jarl Dane]

Y u so mean my list

Edited by Mech The Dane, 10 February 2018 - 09:02 AM.

[Trenchbird]

Edited by Catten Hart, 10 February 2018 - 09:03 AM.

[Samedi Wretch]

Lighthouse, I'm sorry people on the internet are little sh!ts. You're right that stats are a weak indicator of one's understanding of the game. Further more, if anything your stats show that you're an above average to good player.

However, I appreciate the leaderboards. They can be helpful when recruiting people and knowing who you actually want to drop with and be competitive. It's not the leaderboard fault people suck. The appropriate response to this kind of behavior is a collective disavowal and condemnation.

Edited by samadhiVOID, 10 February 2018 - 09:35 AM.

[Exilyth]

Some (maybe many) of the physically disabled people (and, maybe, players with hand/wrist injuries) playing MW:O probably struggle to get consistently good scores due to problems with controls - being able to mentally grasp what they have to do to get the damage in but being physically unable to make their mech do exactly what they want it to do in the short timespan required.

I would value the opinions such people have on balance higher than the opinions of people who need to resort to comparing stats just to make a point.

[Mystere]

Catten Hart, on 10 February 2018 - 09:02 AM, said:

Nope.

[Scurro]

Creator of The Jarl's List here,
I mainly created The Jarl's List because I work in IT and wanted to learn more about php and sql. SQL is very common in network services like WSUS and uniFLOW and I actually learned immensely from this project.

Secondly, I wanted to make a leaderboard as almost every competitive multiplayer game has one and PGI leaderboards were only monthly. I figured that a leaderboard would be a great opportunity to learn.

I have had a few people thanked me for the leaderboard because it gives them a goal to work towards while still playing.

[Armorine]

i like the leaderboards. makes it easy to track my performance. also shows me that my troll builds ive been running lately arent really working....but they are so much fun.

[PocketYoda]

Scurro, on 10 February 2018 - 10:48 AM, said:

Creator of The Jarl's List here,
I mainly created The Jarl's List because I work in IT and wanted to learn more about php and sql. SQL is very common in network services like WSUS and uniFLOW and I actually learned immensely from this project.

Secondly, I wanted to make a leaderboard as almost every competitive multiplayer game has one and PGI leaderboards were only monthly. I figured that a leaderboard would be a great opportunity to learn.

I have had a few people thanked me for the leaderboard because it gives them a goal to work towards while still playing.

Its not your fault, people will literally take anything and abuse it..

[ANOM O MECH]

sycocys, on 10 February 2018 - 07:55 AM, said:

If they got rid of the public stat data the game's population accounting would drop by by probably 25-30% because there'd be no more reason for people to mask their performance under the cover of anonymous alts.

That is hilarious.

Alts are not a problem in this game.

I have a bunch of them.

No one with a lick of sense is going to look at the 10 games I played in season 19 in this account as actually meaning anything.

So if there is a couple or few people (I mean there is really only one guy famous for picking on lower tiers, by creating new accounts) that might be actively trolling lower tiers, but none of them are widely considered good.

Stats are a tool. Yes they can be misused but they have value, not in as much for bragging but to track and understand progress.

If anything, I think all players mech and weapon stats should be published as well.

More information is always better.

[nehebkau]

The Lighthouse, on 09 February 2018 - 12:52 PM, said:

These three guys have different stats. Different playtime, different skills, and pretty much everything is different.
Well.... except they are all me.

I looked at the stats before I looked at this ^--- line and my thought before I read was that all 3 pilots were 'dead average' so I guess it is somewhat accurate being that I ranked all three pilots as about the same and since all 3 pilots are you -- that was an accurate assessment?

Edited by nehebkau, 10 February 2018 - 05:48 PM.

[Xetelian]

No one is arguing that you shouldn't have your stats, so everyone saying "the stats helped me" are missing the point. This is as far as I can tell, is about everyone having access to your stats. I personally think that a leader board is a bad idea. I frequently see people bring up another person's K/Dr or AMS as proof the person is wrong instead of giving a well argued response to the topic.

As much as we shouldn't balance from the bottom up we also can't balance from the top down. Tier 5 has an entirely different experience than tier 1. One tier may have no problem avoiding LRMs and claim it is a bad weapon system for various reasons while another may watch their teams get slaughtered. Telling someone their ideas are invalid because of their leader board stats is lazy and shameful.


So when someone in a position that is worse than yours says something that is not agreeable, explain why instead of posting their stats.

[ANOM O MECH]

Xetelian, on 10 February 2018 - 06:04 PM, said:

No one is arguing that you shouldn't have your stats, so everyone saying "the stats helped me" are missing the point. This is as far as I can tell, is about everyone having access to your stats. I personally think that a leader board is a bad idea. I frequently see people bring up another person's K/Dr or AMS as proof the person is wrong instead of giving a well argued response to the topic.

As much as we shouldn't balance from the bottom up we also can't balance from the top down. Tier 5 has an entirely different experience than tier 1. One tier may have no problem avoiding LRMs and claim it is a bad weapon system for various reasons while another may watch their teams get slaughtered. Telling someone their ideas are invalid because of their leader board stats is lazy and shameful.


So when someone in a position that is worse than yours says something that is not agreeable, explain why instead of posting their stats.

There is a big difference between shaming and bringing up that someone may not have a good grasp of the game.

Also you absolutely balance from the top down or you end up with Uno for those who find crazy 8's too hard.

Bottom up balancing would make the game uninteresting to people with skill, and it is the skill that makes the game. No one is going to tune in to see tier five championshit games...

The only other option would be to have a sliding balance for every tier...which I don't think PGI could even do, let alone do it well.

[Zergling]

Kaeb Odellas, on 09 February 2018 - 10:58 PM, said:

I see far more "your stats are bad" ad-hominem attacks than anything like what you're describing.

Stat-shaming are stat-bragging are completely irrelevant to a discussion on balance or gameplay mechanics. It's possible to be bad at the game while understanding what parts of it are broken. Conversely you can be good at the game and have no understanding of how to fix it. If you can't formulate an argument without resorting to either, you have no place in the debate.

I see far more totally wrong opinions being posted by bad players than I see stat shaming attacks though.

And almost always the people posting those wrong opinions use anecdotal evidence or their own experience as a basis for their opinions, and refuse to admit they are wrong even when refuted with actual factual evidence based arguments.

At that point, can you really blame people for bring up stats?

[Kroete]

denAirwalkerrr, on 10 February 2018 - 04:35 AM, said:

No I have argument that I’m best player and dropcaller of 4th place team of WC2017 and have 1st and 2nd places in many 1v1 tournament helded over past year. Keep your feeling with you.

Does it pay your bills?
Helps in getting with the ladys?

Or is it just something virtual thats not recognized and doesnt matter, outside of the mwo bubble?

Edited by Kroete, 10 February 2018 - 08:51 PM.

[Vxheous]

Kroete, on 10 February 2018 - 08:49 PM, said:

Does it pay your bills?
Helps in getting with the ladys?

Or is it just something virtual thats not recognized and doesnt matter, outside of the mwo bubble?

WC2017 earnings helped pay for my Christmas this year, if that counts.

[Bombast]

Kroete, on 10 February 2018 - 08:49 PM, said:

Does it pay your bills?
Helps in getting with the ladys?

Or is it just something virtual thats not recognized and doesnt matter, outside of the mwo bubble?

Ah, yes. Disregard balance suggestions made by people who play the game well and understand it, acquire opinions from people who can get their eggplant wet.

[Koniving]

Bombast, on 09 February 2018 - 01:07 PM, said:

One dude posted your stats. One. Get over it.

Its a common phenomena. Mine get used to contradict me quite a bit.
Help a new player. "You shouldn't be helping new players your stats are terribad."
Suggest a balance change. "You suck. Herp-derp look at your stats."
Tell someone about a workaround to a bug. "You don't have any right to tell people about workarounds because stats."

Still not sure how stats qualify me or disqualify me from giving a hardware workaround, but it's happened.
And I'm pretty open about the fact that I tank my stats.

And my stats do not reflect my skill as one might see here, my point and click skills are pretty good when I actually try, even through thick fog without identifying markers.

[Deathlike]

Kaeb Odellas, on 10 February 2018 - 01:33 AM, said:

How do you define average? His main account's overall stats are better than 83% of all other ranked players. That seems well above average to me.

I'd say that less than 20% of the players (active or otherwise) are actually "good" at the game though (probably closer to 10-15% at best). I'm sure there's a greater percentage that are "competent". However, it is often seen that some suggestions are totally "off the wall" closer to being outright bad or dumb, due to total misunderstandings of how things actually work (like people saying LRMs are bad, while walking in the wide open, absorbing every shot, due to sheer ignorance).

It's mostly intelligence on display or lack thereof by certain participants on the creation or response to a more serious discussion.

[cougurt]

really getting sick of the whole "w-well, i play bad on purpose!" nonsense. even if that actually is the case, that doesn't make you any better than someone who's just genuinely bad. if you really didn't care about your stats then you wouldn't be here attempting to justify your poor performance. all i'm seeing are weak excuses.