718 replies to this topic

[Darian DelFord]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 07:27 PM, said:

Here lol this is funny tells me to play a light and he never ran an assault either .

Haha whatever.

https://leaderboard....d%0D%0AImperius

Ya know I was looking at Jarl's list earlier to prove a point against you, however I have come to the conclusion that those stats are wrong. The reason being is since this games inception I have almost 2k drops just in my Jenners alone. So you will have to understand me here when I take his list with a bit of salt.

So with that said.... What are you trying to prove? I have never played an assault? Also not true. I have close to 500 in my Founders Atlas. Now I will give you I am no expert on the assault the way I am on lights. However what was your point again?

[Darian DelFord]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 07:42 PM, said:

I wouldn't even say they are super good pilots with them either.

That's just 3

Ummm The first one was due to ammo explosion and being completely ignored.... Ignore a light at your own peril.

The 3rd one literally took 40 seconds to kill a cyclops? You think that is to quick? If you actually watch the videos carefully you will find that most of those mechs were already wide open and ready to be critted. Serously your own video's show the opposite of what your trying to prove if you really want to break them down.

I did not watch the 2nd one, was not going to sit for 2 hours.


I love folks who post video's and do not actually understand what is really going on. All they see is a light mech killing things. They do not understand the other factors that must come into play for that to happen.

Edited by Darian DelFord, 16 March 2018 - 08:38 PM.

[kuma8877]

Samial, on 16 March 2018 - 07:30 PM, said:

No see this is the issue light can kill anything with 12 machine guns its still 12 damage on top of the massive crit chance 12 damage in less than a second racks up.. insanely.. they are no longer using them to take out internals you can take off arms legs and core any mech at the front in seconds..

Honestly how people are not seeing this or are conveniently ignoring the facts is boggling..

Just exactly how easy do you assume it is to maintain that kinda DPS for whole strings of seconds at a time in the PIR without getting blown away? Especially early game? Good luck trying to pull that off. Against decent Assault and slow Heavy pilots, they will kill you... or one of their teammates will.

Edited by kuma8877, 16 March 2018 - 08:12 PM.

[Imperius]

Darian DelFord, on 16 March 2018 - 07:45 PM, said:

Ya know I was looking at Jarl's list earlier to prove a point against you, however I have come to the conclusion that those stats are wrong. The reason being is since this games inception I have almost 2k drops just in my Jenners alone. So you will have to understand me here when I take his list with a bit of salt.

So with that said.... What are you trying to prove? I have never played an assault? Also not true. I have close to 500 in my Founders Atlas. Now I will give you I am no expert on the assault the way I am on lights. However what was your point again?

My point is you tell me to go jump in a light as see how hard it is...
Yet you haven't been in an assault as of recent on the receiving end of 4-6 piranhas a game insta killing stuff.

My personal opinion it's easier to play and light if you respect the fact that you have to use hit and run tactics. Sure sometimes you get that one blast from across the map that kills you. I get it that sucks.

Hear me out. I'll make a point about the difference between an assault pilot and light.

I constantly have to watch and monitor the enemy movement, my teams movement, while trying to not be left behind, and while also trying to not run into or get ran into by the enemy team. I make one mistake in judgement of where I should position and fight and where to fall back (what little I can actually fall back) at. All my stats are in group queue with just 1-2 friends that still will play this game with me.

Light pilot you have speed the ability to pretty much be where you need to be when you want to be.Sure there is thinking involved but a lot more room for error, and I say this because, lets say, you see the whole enemy team around the corner. What do you do? You run back to your team. What do I do. Well i have to accept my fate and try to fight or hope they didn't see me and 52.3kph my slow *** back to my team if I can. (Let me tell you in the level we play at you and I know they saw me and you and I know I have to fight what I can hoping my team is nascaring behind them soon.)

Lights are spur of the moment mechs that will punish you if you challenge the wrong foe the wrong way.

Assaults are the methodical thinkers that have to plan out their path. Make the wrong judgement get picked off.

I'm not calling either of our ability to play in question here and I never have. We both are positive. As an experienced and good assault pilot I can verify some of these claims are out of their hands and that is not good game design. I've adapted to all these constant nerfs and it has effected me very little, but enough that when it does happen, I don't want to touch this game for months.It's just getting old.

These MG's are the issue and need to be adjusted. Im not attacking lights per say. I am however bringing up past issues that have lead us here. A lot of these face humping tactics would not be viable if the stop when running into bigger objects was in the game. Im not asking for knockdowns again. I know and understand their removal due to griefing. But many of these half added systems are adding up.

Edited by Imperius, 16 March 2018 - 08:33 PM.

[Jman5]

YueFei, on 16 March 2018 - 12:59 PM, said:

While I agree that Light vs Assault can be likened to Rogue vs Warrior, and that a single Light should be able to defeat a single Assault... that only covers 1v1 scenarios.

1 Rogue can beat 1 Warrior in a duel. But make it even 2 Rogues vs 2 Warriors, and the odds tip heavily in favor of the Warriors. That's because the Warriors can cover each other's dead zones (completely eliminating dead zone kiting which is only viable in duels), can peel the Rogues off of each other, and the AoE's from the Warriors overlap to hit both Rogues (both AoE attacks and shouts). It only landslides more in favor of Warriors with larger numbers.

In the same way, even if Light > Assault, it won't necessarily hold up in a scenario where it's Lights vs Assaults. The Assaults can form into a combat box and cover each other's backs.

This is why in the team deathmatch format of MWO, Lights are still underperforming, and in fact I would be in favor of more buffs for Lights.

Yeah, like I said, I don't think PGI ever fully got there balance-wise, but I do think it's better than previous titles. My personal opinion, I don't think we ever will see light completely on par with other weight classes because this community would revolt. People would freak out because it would probably require a fundamental change to how the game is played if a Madcat IIC went "OH SH*T!" when a Locust comes around a corner.

I mean we see what happens to these forums every time a decent light mech gets released.

Edited by Jman5, 16 March 2018 - 08:13 PM.

[PocketYoda]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 07:34 PM, said:

Yup ive watched enough youtube vids of this in action and they laugh hysterically at how broken it is. Those same people aren't here defending that though in their defense.

Last match this was the third mech he'd killed

kuma8877, on 16 March 2018 - 08:10 PM, said:

Just exactly how easy do you assume it is to maintain that kinda DPS for whole strings of seconds at a time in the PIR without getting blown away? Especially early game? Good luck trying to pull that off. Against decent Assault and slow Heavy pilots, they will kill you... or one of their teammates will.

Its not hard at all get in fast below a mechs line of fire and its a free kill, they kill so fast the enemy has very little time to react if any time at all, if its cored already with the stupidly fast TTK then its GG instantly, no back required..

Edited by Samial, 16 March 2018 - 08:36 PM.

[Imperius]

Darian DelFord, on 16 March 2018 - 07:57 PM, said:

Ummm The first one was due to ammo explosion and being completely ignored.... Ignore a light at your own peril.

The 3rd one literally took 40 seconds to kill a cyclops? You think that is to quick? If you actually watch the videos carefully you will find that most of those mechs were already wide open and ready to be critted. Serously your own video's show the opposite of what your trying to prove if you really want to break them down.

I did not watch the 2nd one, was not going to sit for 2 hours.

40 seconds is faster than I could kill a cyclops with the build I used that got hit with the nerf hammer.

Those assaults were pretty bad and not position good and engaged with too many targets.

It's the speed that they went poof constantly that is the issue.

I have a pretty good suspicion why my load-out got the nerf and it's way more petty than I would like to think. So I will keep my tinfoil opinion on that to myself.

[kuma8877]

Samial, on 16 March 2018 - 08:15 PM, said:

Last match this was the third mech he'd killed

Are you saying that killing an IS LRM heavy with only 2 ML as back up is somehow hard or shows how OP the PIR is?

[kuma8877]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 07:42 PM, said:

I wouldn't even say they are super good pilots with them either.

That's just 3

These videos highlight bad anti light play. Some people gave up their back and others were already open for critting when the PIR's arrived, and almost noone attempted to deal with the PIR's directly. Cutting thru less than 10 back armor isn't that hard and doesn't really highlight how OP MG's are. Most of what is here could be done in a Locust. Show us some vids that highlight this ability to chew down fresh assaults at will from any angle, rather than give us videos that simply show good pilots taking advantage of bad ones.

[Darian DelFord]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 08:20 PM, said:

40 seconds is faster than I could kill a cyclops with the build I used that got hit with the nerf hammer.

Those assaults were pretty bad and not position good and engaged with too many targets.

It's the speed that they went poof constantly that is the issue.

But you in an assault could last that 40 seconds. I would be dust the moment I got in his cross hairs. Everything being equal. I am sorry. but any light that takes 40 seconds to kill an assault when there are other enemy mechs around him, is extremely lucky!

Once again, the reason they went "poof" is they were already opened up and the light merely capitalized on this. The MOMENT he hit a mech with armor on his "poof" dragged into an agonizing 40 seconds. And any assault mech can take out another assault mech in less than 30 seconds,

[Imperius]

Darian DelFord, on 16 March 2018 - 08:43 PM, said:

But you in an assault could last that 40 seconds. I would be dust the moment I got in his cross hairs. Everything being equal. I am sorry. but any light that takes 40 seconds to kill an assault when there are other enemy mechs around him, is extremely lucky!

Once again, the reason they went "poof" is they were already opened up and the light merely capitalized on this. The MOMENT he hit a mech with armor on his "poof" dragged into an agonizing 40 seconds. And any assault mech can take out another assault mech in less than 30 seconds,

You can last longer too if you're not attempting to face tank lets be real dude.

Still doesn't change the fact that 12MG's needs to be brought back in line.

Jman5, on 16 March 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

Yeah, like I said, I don't think PGI ever fully got there balance-wise, but I do think it's better than previous titles. My personal opinion, I don't think we ever will see light completely on par with other weight classes because this community would revolt. People would freak out because it would probably require a fundamental change to how the game is played if a Madcat IIC went "OH SH*T!" when a Locust comes around a corner.

I mean we see what happens to these forums every time a decent light mech gets released.

When my Mad Cat MK II not IIC can run 156kph I will gladly accept this bs

12MG is the issue the mech is fine.

Edited by Imperius, 16 March 2018 - 08:56 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

Still doesn't change the fact that 12MG's needs to be brought back in line.

Not, strictly speaking, a fact.

[Zergling]

Samial, on 16 March 2018 - 07:30 PM, said:

No see this is the issue light can kill anything with 12 machine guns its still 12 damage on top of the massive crit chance 12 damage in less than a second racks up.. insanely.. they are no longer using them to take out internals you can take off arms legs and core any mech at the front in seconds..

Honestly how people are not seeing this or are conveniently ignoring the facts is boggling..

Because I don't have any real trouble dealing with them.

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 07:34 PM, said:

Yup ive watched enough youtube vids of this in action and they laugh hysterically at how broken it is. Those same people aren't here defending that though in their defense.

Sure, lemme upload a video where I held against three Piranha with my Warhawk, resulting in two dying and a third running with its tail between its legs.

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

Still doesn't change the fact that 12MG's needs to be brought back in line.

You keep saying that word, but I don't think you know what it means.

Edited by Zergling, 16 March 2018 - 09:26 PM.

[kuma8877]

Samial, on 16 March 2018 - 08:15 PM, said:

Last match this was the third mech he'd killed




Its not hard at all get in fast below a mechs line of fire and its a free kill, they kill so fast the enemy has very little time to react if any time at all, if its cored already with the stupidly fast TTK then its GG instantly, no back required..

You're talking about enemies that are already cored (your words).... in that state, most alphas (or an errent grazing) end that player.... from across the map. Still doesn't show MG's or the PIR to be intrinsically OP. And is it the light pilots fault if the assault player didn't properly plan to have arm mounted weapons to defend against such possibilities? No, it's not.

[Trenchbird]

Zergling, on 16 March 2018 - 09:21 PM, said:

Because I don't have any real trouble dealing with them.

Seconded. I can name the amount of times I'd died to Piranhas on one hand, and both were situations that would've already resulted in my death, even if I were fighting something else within reason. One was dueling with a Piranha in a Piranha, and we legged eachother-he just double-legged me first. The second was similar; Got legged by a Piranha in a Piranha and killed. Third time? Legged in a Linebacker, second leg already cherry red internal-Piranha comes up behind and takes out the other leg.

Other times, I see overconfident Piranha pilots rushing competent players and getting steamrolled by a very angry brawler/light hunter, or getting hit by a random backshot when they try facetanking something else, or simply doing nothing of importance.

I get that fighting a 12 MG boat is very much a "Muh DPS" problem. But the people who argue that it's actually a problem-well, in one case they've never fought one themselves, and haven't apparently played for several seasons, so let's just count that out as "Doesn't matter, isn't familiar with it in any way"-fail to take into account the multiple downsides to driving a Piranha, and why anyone with a level, competent head and isn't driving an LRM boat/using a potato as a gaming computer can rather easily take down the fishy boi due to them.

- It weighs 20 tons and has the armoring appropriate to said weight. Which is, to say, a flimsy roll of Military-issue toilet paper wrapped around it like a mummy.
- That high DPS? Yeah. A few things; It's up close, it's basically DoT, and is incredibly bad at shooting at anything with good armor.
- Fight a brawler/gaussboat that can nail said Piranha, means Piranha goes poof. If you expect a LRM boat to demolish anything at any range, you're playing the wrong game; I could pilot a freaking Locust with four machine guns and a Medium-to-Large Pulse Laser and still beat the above noted Archer. And I'm not even a great light pilot.

[Imperius]

Ok by that standard, many people have survived against my ballerina Dire Wolf and Dual Gauss Dual ER-PPC so by your logic those nerfs should be removed.

[Zergling]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 09:54 PM, said:

Ok by that standard, many people have survived against my ballerina Dire Wolf and Dual Gauss Dual ER-PPC so by your logic those nerfs should be removed.

So it's fine to use anecdotal evidence to 'prove' the Piranha is OP, but it isn't fine to use anecdotal evidence to disprove those claims?

Bro, you really need to learn how to argue.

Edited by Zergling, 16 March 2018 - 09:59 PM.

[UnofficialOperator]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 06:36 PM, said:

Sure do it I haven't even played since season 14 I think, so yeah one definitely touched me.

LMAO. 360 games player who hasn't played in 7 months telling us what is or isn't broken ingame.

Its like a cook with no tastebuds eating a ****burger and grading it 3 Michelin stars because texture.

PS: Great I wasted my 1000th post on this

Edited by UnofficialOperator, 16 March 2018 - 10:01 PM.

[Trenchbird]

Imperius, on 16 March 2018 - 09:54 PM, said:

Ok by that standard, many people have survived against my ballerina Dire Wolf and Dual Gauss Dual ER-PPC so by your logic those nerfs should be removed.

I'm so confused by what the hell you mean with this, because it's hard to believe someone could be so daft, so I'm just going to keep saying that your lack of playing experience in the current day makes your opinion irrelevant.

Because it does.

Edited by Catten Hart, 16 March 2018 - 10:04 PM.

[Zergling]

Here we go, recording of my Warhawk running into three Piranha, killing one with a double ER PPC shot to the chest then standing up to fire from the other two without suffering an armor breech:


Note that even without teammate fire support, I still probably would have killed the second Piranha, and still been able to engage the third.

Piranha aren't scary if A: you point front towards enemy and B: you shoot it until it dies

And that's come from someone that plainly sucks at shooting; just look at how I have to use advanced zoom all the time because my eyes suck.

Edited by Zergling, 16 March 2018 - 10:12 PM.