84 replies to this topic

[adamts01]

You guys are blowing this entirely out of proportion. All this would do is keep the worst 2 or 3 players out of the most powerful class. And they'd win more because of it. And seriously, the 2 things you need to do to not be the worst player on the team, not go AFK, and manage at least 2 alphas of damage. If that isn't obtainable, then blame PSR, and put that player in a mech that isn't the cornerstone of the team. You really are a sensitive lot.

And I really can't believe you guys are defending PSR.... Seriously?... No matter how we feel about game design, a joke of a ranking and match making system is the greatest nail in the coffin for this simple lobby shooter.

Old MW4 Ranger, on 09 February 2019 - 05:10 AM, said:

assaults only when sussesfull in the Academy

Giving players a free Medium then making them unlock each class wouldn't be a bad idea. But a big part of the problem seems to be when players leave tier 5, and are then thrown in to tier 1 games. It's not their fault, things are just brutal with such a small pool of players.

[ocular tb]

Sounds like a very frustrating thing for new players or those that are trying to skill up new mechs. Even as an experienced player this could be an issue because lets face it, everyone has a bad match at some point.

Fortunately this won't ever be implemented.

[adamts01]

ocular tb, on 09 February 2019 - 08:16 AM, said:

Sounds like a very frustrating thing for new players or those that are trying to skill up new mechs. Even as an experienced player this could be an issue because lets face it, everyone has a bad match at some point.

Fortunately this won't ever be implemented.

These guys really shouldn't be in tier 1 matches, but PSR and the population is what it is. So look at it this way, yeah, those 1 or two players per match might be frustrated they have to hone their skills in a Heavy or Medium, but I see that as worth it to keep these chronically bad assaults from wandering off and dealing sub 100 damage and throwing game after game. Seriously, think of the most frustrating thing for 90% of players, the "potato lottery". You're right that it would never be implemented, but there are people happy and frustrated with any single decision made. This would give a slightly better experience to 90% of players, and hopefully let that 10% win more while they hone their skills.

[Ralatar]

We've been asking for something like the below since 2013-2014 or so:

"..None of the above would matter if we had a performance based MM. It's all in place, we have match score average's for each weight class. With monitoring and tweaking as needed it would allow for like skilled players to be matched up based on their performance in the weight class they are dropping in. Been brought up before after the failed ELO using win/loss as a measure. A number of us have been asking since around 2013-14. Would mean that if you perform at a tier 2 lv in lights but a tier 3 in Assaults then you would use the respective ranking when you drop. Would think that 4 tiers would work and keep the time to match players down and still give a much better experience than we currently have..."

You talk about padding MS's, you will likely NEVER find a performance system that can't be 'gamed' in some fashion, and again, if someone is giving up tonnage, skills and the like for situational systems then points for them if they were able to use them to help the team. You may not feel that those systems show skill but to get true use(and get points out of them)there are tactics needed to be learned and used. As stated above this should "give a much better experience than we currently have..."

[Prototelis]

This is by far the dumbest suggestion I have ever seen.

This absolutely is a big issue, the whole game is about choice. Could you imagine how much crying there would be?


In regard to a performance based match maker; Yeah that could be gamed. But you would only be doing yourself a disservice by doing so. Eventually you'd end up matched against people that aren't going to be rolled over by ********.

[Jon Gotham]

I throw Dim Sum, on 08 February 2019 - 06:02 PM, said:

Don't be a fascist. If I was restricted to lights I'd quit the game. I'm loving my stalker right now and even though I potato it up most of the time, it's still hilarious.

He's not being one, he does have a slight point-alibet he put it acoss horribly. the fact is, the game's population isn't big enough to support skill based mm.
Sad fact is the "I';ll do what I want" brigade have poisned this game to death.

[Ralatar]

No, the sad fact is we've (beta community) told them this would occur YEARS ago if they didn't use a skill/performance based MM. Told them they needed this in place to keep a population and that it needed to be in place BEFORE this went live but as usual, PGI ignored.

[JediPanther]

adamts01, on 08 February 2019 - 05:29 PM, said:

And lights aren't places for noobs either.

I hate to tell people how to play,

Then don't make posts like these with an idea of forcing people to be x good to play a mech class they might want or like playing and if you think lights are for noobs go do a few thousand rounds in a locucst 1v. I don't like to tell stupid people their ideas are stupid but here we are with threads like these.

[ShiverMeRivets]

Ralatar, on 09 February 2019 - 03:55 PM, said:

No, the sad fact is we've (beta community) told them this would occur YEARS ago if they didn't use a skill/performance based MM. Told them they needed this in place to keep a population and that it needed to be in place BEFORE this went live but as usual, PGI ignored.

Developers should not take advice from players. I mean they should pretend they do, ask players for inputs, but then make their own decisions - for better or worse.

With all due respect, players don’t know ****, you don’t know who they are, and they bear no responsibility towards their advice - I will never listen very seriously to someone like that. Definitely not when this affects my business and livelihood.

[MeltedSnowgirl]

Or, maybe don't NASCAR away from your assaults? This is a team game, work as a freeking team? It might not be potatoes in assaults it might very well be potatoes in the faster mechs leaving them behind as they pretend to be the next Dayle Earnheardt

[justcallme A S H]

ShiverMeRivets, on 10 February 2019 - 06:42 AM, said:

Developers should not take advice from players. I mean they should pretend they do, ask players for inputs, but then make their own decisions - for better or worse.

With all due respect, players don’t know ****, you don’t know who they are, and they bear no responsibility towards their advice - I will never listen very seriously to someone like that. Definitely not when this affects my business and livelihood.

lol.. Yeah ignore your customers will you have none left. That's intelligent.


It's called balance, that is the secret to good business.

[dario03]

Not really for this...but I have often wondered if the "bigger should be better" crowd would change their tune if we had something like this. But set up for higher match score average gets you bigger mechs. Especially if we took it far enough to something like almost everybody runs a light or medium and only the top five percent or so can get heavies and assaults.

[Grus]

It doesn't matter what weight class the potatoes are in. Many times in high "teir" matches a game can be won or lost by 1 person either making a beautiful play or getting caught out of position. The issue is the skill curve gets exponentially sharper at +80%, and most of those are in teir 1/2.

The only real way to fix it is what has been said before. Have a tier system that is accurate for the skills of the player.

justcallme A S H, on 10 February 2019 - 07:15 AM, said:

It's called balance, that is the secret to good business.

No the secret is using the system to borderline unethical behavior to make sure that your as far into the black as possible, with out braking any laws... and having a bureaucrat in your pocket doesn't hurt either

[Colonel Presumptuous]

adamts01, on 09 February 2019 - 07:23 AM, said:

You guys are blowing this entirely out of proportion. All this would do is keep the worst 2 or 3 players out of the most powerful class.

Wait I thought we were talking about Assaults? /s

Assualts only work well if the team works well, if the team sucks to high heaven even the best Assualt pilot will come crashing down... and hell i play alot of Assualts and the times ive been left to die horribly in a nascar or to get cored out by a god damn Stealth Flea while in the middle of my team as they fight on oblivious to my calls for a little assistance are legion.

But no go on, stop me playing my favorite class of mech for your benefit. Im sure that will work out just peachy!

Edited by Colonel Presumptuous, 10 February 2019 - 12:33 PM.

[Prototelis]

You don't need a stealth fle to do that. Once everyone is occupied you just need to pick the one mech towards the back who can't or won't turn and be prepared to dip out. If you manage to kill a person you create an advantage, but really if you can turn a few people even for a couple of seconds that creates a pretty big advantage too.

[adamts01]

Colonel Presumptuous, on 10 February 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

Wait I thought we were talking about Assaults? /s

Assualts only work well if the team works well, if the team sucks to high heaven even the best Assualt pilot will come crashing down... and hell i play alot of Assualts and the times ive been left to die horribly in a nascar or to get cored out by a god damn Stealth Flea while in the middle of my team as they fight on oblivious to my calls for a little assistance are legion.

But no go on, stop me playing my favorite class of mech for your benefit. Im sure that will work out just peachy!

If you can't make your assault work with ANY team, you're Assaulting wrong. Either too situational a build, poor situational awareness, or just bad. And really think if this would even apply to you. If assaults are your favorite class, do you seriously finish dead last or next to it on your team? If you do, then 1 player is screwing 11 others. So what's more important, a single player getting curb stomped match after match in his favorite assault, or 11 players not having to deal with a chronic potato wasting the team's most valuable slot?

[ingramli]

I have been potatoes for 4 years, after 3k+ games, and I am still a potato (stuck in T3), the potatoes just couldn't earn any C-Bills with anything lighter than an heavies (sometimes I didnt earn 100k a match even I am in the winning team when I was new), most of them don't torso twist, just standing still facing the foe trying to point the crosshair on it, and of course, no lead shot when using ballistics/missiles, you are essentially ask them to quit trying to prevent them from "wasting" tonnage. I do agree that assaults/lights slot should be given priority to better players, but what potatoes need is teach, not ban.

IMHO what noob need is incentive to learn in a medium or heavies, they tolerate mistake (wrong positioning in an assault and bad movement such as standing still in a light), stay alive longer is the best way to learn (the learning curve of mwo is hard enough, don't make their lives harder), I would rather wish PGI give away a 20% bonus on C-Bills and exp for T5 players who ride on a medium or heavy (and IMHO potato on a light is just as harmful as on an assault, the team is essentially blind when the light go for a sucide run in 3 mins after the match begin).

Edited by ingramli, 10 February 2019 - 08:08 PM.

[Variant1]

adamts01, on 08 February 2019 - 05:29 PM, said:

And lights aren't places for noobs either.

False, lights are a very good class for beginners to start with as it leaves more experienced players with better heavier mechs. Lights are also tend to be less focused unless they are the only thing to shoot at. Also another thing lights teach is importance of sticking with the team due to low armor. And there are some perfect light mechs for beginers such as fire support mechs like uller, adder, cougar, panther, spider and raven.

[Roughneck45]

Variant1, on 10 February 2019 - 06:19 PM, said:

False, lights are a very good class for beginners to start with as it leaves more experienced players with better heavier mechs. Lights are also tend to be less focused unless they are the only thing to shoot at. Also another thing lights teach is importance of sticking with the team due to low armor. And there are some perfect light mechs for beginers such as fire support mechs like uller, adder, cougar, panther, spider and raven.

All of this is wrong, and the OP's idea is bad.

New players should get a medium if they have zero idea what they are doing. I'd say a bushwacker or crab cause the complaints from noobs are usually about exploding quickly.

People pay for mechs with money or time, you can't lock them out from using something they paid for because they had a bad match.

Edited by Roughneck45, 10 February 2019 - 08:06 PM.

[Vellron2005]

adamts01, on 08 February 2019 - 05:29 PM, said:

Don't be too strict about it, but make a player have to score in the top 70% of his last match to pick an assault, and score in the top 80% to pick a light or heavy.

There's nothing worse than a potato in the assault slot, and being at the bottom of the pile in a heavy is also really bad. And lights aren't places for noobs either.

I hate to tell people how to play, but this would help keep potatoes from throwing matches. And lets face it, Quick Play isn't where you go to derp around anymore, it's the only mode we have left. We should focus on making that mode a little better for the sake of what's left of the game.

And really, just getting three full alphas in an assault should get you to at least half way up the scoreboard. So players don't have to "git gud", just not facepalm in the mechs teams need to carry.

Hahahahahaa... good one.. now tell us a joke about Trump

Edited by Vellron2005, 10 February 2019 - 11:48 PM.