1380 replies to this topic

[Eurystheus]

Earl Whitehaven, on 29 July 2019 - 03:35 PM, said:

For a lot of people it's not that it has to be on steam but rather they don't want it on epic. Personally it's being lied to countless times that broke the camel's back. I'd have been fine if it had been anything but epic. Honestly if they had not lied I wouldn't be up in arms about it. I auto pass on epic but that is a personal bias and choice and if it had always been epic I would have just moved on. The bait and switch awakened the anger. Hell, for 3 days by Russ's own admission on the last AMA the had the deal signed with epic and sold steam pre orders. That is the standard PGI style move that has me hoping they mess this up enough to knock their company out.

I've seen a lot of people call the Steam to Epic change a bait and switch. Which is part of what led me to be surprised that Steam has such a loyal fan base. If they promised an MW5 that looks like the trailers, then delivered Mario Cart, I'd call that a bait and switch. But for me going from Steam to Epic is more like saying it's going to come in a plastic box, but then delivering it in a cardboard box. I don't care about the box. I care about the game inside the box. Will it be less playable if it is distributed via Epic vs Steam? Will LRMs turn into ATMs if I get it on Epic instead of Steam? Do Steam keys have some kind of collector value that Epic keys don't have?

[Riptor]

Eurystheus, on 29 July 2019 - 04:05 PM, said:

I've seen a lot of people call the Steam to Epic change a bait and switch. Which is part of what led me to be surprised that Steam has such a loyal fan base. If they promised an MW5 that looks like the trailers, then delivered Mario Cart, I'd call that a bait and switch. But for me going from Steam to Epic is more like saying it's going to come in a plastic box, but then delivering it in a cardboard box. I don't care about the box. I care about the game inside the box. Will it be less playable if it is distributed via Epic vs Steam? Will LRMs turn into ATMs if I get it on Epic instead of Steam? Do Steam keys have some kind of collector value that Epic keys don't have?

That just shows how ignorant you are and that you do not mind being taken for granted by corporations and have absolutely no qualms about being lied to.

Read the friggin thread, people have posted more then enough reasons why the Epic game store is pure cancer. But here we are another lazy and uninformed persons not getting why so many despise the epic game store and why they really dont enjoy being lied to their faces by russ bullock.

[Dee Eight]

Eurystheus, on 29 July 2019 - 01:54 PM, said:

The only games I play are Call of Duty MW3 and MWO. Until now, I thought of Steam as just a nuisance I had to put up with in order to play games I like.

You do know PGI has always had their own independent game launcher for MWO and you never have to use steam to play it right ?

[Bwah Ha Ha]

Haven't played for a few weeks now, then they post this, time for a refund!

[Eurystheus]

Dee Eight, on 29 July 2019 - 04:34 PM, said:

You do know PGI has always had their own independent game launcher for MWO and you never have to use steam to play it right ?

No. I didn't know that. I have a MechWarrior Online icon on my desktop I use to launch it. The icon points to the Steam folder in my Start Menu Programs folder and when I look inside that that I see steam://rungameid/342200

How else do I start it?

[Eurystheus]

Riptor, on 29 July 2019 - 04:10 PM, said:

That just shows how ignorant you are and that you do not mind being taken for granted by corporations and have absolutely no qualms about being lied to.

Read the friggin thread, people have posted more then enough reasons why the Epic game store is pure cancer. But here we are another lazy and uninformed persons not getting why so many despise the epic game store and why they really dont enjoy being lied to their faces by russ bullock.

I've read the thread. Sounds like a religious argument to me. I've talked to friends who play games from the Epic store. They just shrug their shoulders when I ask about it.

I don't like being lied to, when it is something I care about. But red plastic box or brown cardboard box, I don't care. If PGI turned around and said, on second thought, we're going to release it on our own game launcher, I wouldn't care. If it turns out the game won't run, or Epic stations a Chinese Tenecent spy in my house, I'll care. If Epic is missing some feature that makes it difficult to play the game, I'll care. But from what I've seen so far ... I don't care.

I don't mind at all if you or anyone else cares. If you really wanted that read plastic box, then ask for a refund.

[Suberoa Zinnerman]

If MW5 has a stand-alone launcher/via the MWO one or comes to steam, I'll buy it.

Not because hate Epic or anything, I just don't want the hassle of yet another login and yet another launcher et al.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Ok we have a problem here. I absolutely do not want the Epic Launcher on my PC and due to their exclusivity deals, which I oppose, I do not want to give them my patronage. So PGI, how do I get my game???

Edit: Oh I see they are offering a full refund. Guess that solves the problem though, personally, I think releasing through ALL distribution channels and giving your customers the CHOICE of where they would like to purchase your product is the right thing to do.

Edited by Angel of Annihilation, 29 July 2019 - 05:10 PM.

[Sideshow031]

Yo, Russ Bullock, step down from the lead, you’ve had one too many.

[Earl Whitehaven]

Eurystheus, on 29 July 2019 - 04:05 PM, said:

I've seen a lot of people call the Steam to Epic change a bait and switch. Which is part of what led me to be surprised that Steam has such a loyal fan base. If they promised an MW5 that looks like the trailers, then delivered Mario Cart, I'd call that a bait and switch. But for me going from Steam to Epic is more like saying it's going to come in a plastic box, but then delivering it in a cardboard box. I don't care about the box. I care about the game inside the box. Will it be less playable if it is distributed via Epic vs Steam? Will LRMs turn into ATMs if I get it on Epic instead of Steam? Do Steam keys have some kind of collector value that Epic keys don't have?

That's the thing ,for me I wont put epic on my pc. I don't trust them at all in addition to my personal aversion to anyone who tries to strong arm me (that is how I see epic's exclusivity deals). If you are ok with it that's all good to me, I only speak for myself. For me it is a bait and switch, steam (GoG or any other launcher other than epic as a matter of fact) I will use, epic I wont. PGI knows people feel that way and hid the fact they were going to epic during pre order sale because that would have ment less sales. For that specifically they can go to hell.

[Paladin IIC]

Dee Eight, on 29 July 2019 - 03:14 PM, said:

Population barely above 600 ? Do you tell that lie to yourself in the mirror over and over to convince yourself its true, before telling others ?

Well, show me player statistics that show otherwise if you're so sure the player base is larger.

Edited by Paladin IIC, 29 July 2019 - 06:53 PM.

[Akillius]

Eurystheus, on 29 July 2019 - 04:05 PM, said:

I've seen a lot of people call the Steam to Epic change a bait and switch. Which is part of what led me to be surprised that Steam has such a loyal fan base. If they promised an MW5 that looks like the trailers, then delivered Mario Cart, I'd call that a bait and switch. But for me going from Steam to Epic is more like saying it's going to come in a plastic box, but then delivering it in a cardboard box. I don't care about the box. I care about the game inside the box. Will it be less playable if it is distributed via Epic vs Steam? Will LRMs turn into ATMs if I get it on Epic instead of Steam? Do Steam keys have some kind of collector value that Epic keys don't have?

First I only played MWO through its launchers, not steam. I don't even use Steam weekly and yet I'll admit its better designed then most for sorting/delivering/selling content, the card/badges and achievements are a great carrot on a stick extra rewards enticement mechanism that's really well thought out, beyond that Steam has no loyalty from me.

Last major multiple (100k or more) accounts hacked:
1. Steam 2016 (afair),
2. Epic Games accounts July 2019 + many times through out this year and last year. (even Sony gets hacked less often.)

As for the anger over PGI announcing major changes to MW5M delivery, well here's some previous announcements:
- "MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries is set for release Late 2018"
- "MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries is set for release in 2019!"
- "MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries will be available on September 10th, 2019!"
- "MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries Coming Exclusively to the Epic Games Store on December 10th"
(That Dec 10th date is as solid as boiling water, which wouldn't be an issue since no one wants Anthem-like releases)
#1. Release date got changed again, which wouldn't be a biggie except........

- "Pre-Order program will provide you with a key to the Steam version of MechWarrior 5"
#2. Many more players already use steam and pre-ordered based on that availability/agreement.

- "Standard pre-orders may become available through Steam and other digital marketplaces"
#3. Other digital marketplaces means Inclusiveness with other platforms, perhaps GoG or where-ever....

#4. And "Epic Games Exclusive" only is a complete 180 back stab to the gaming community at large and their desire to use their preferred game launching platform, a few even pre-ordered MW5M in the hopes it would be on their preferred:
(ie.) GoG, Origin, Paradox Games launcher, Razer Cortex, Game Room, Battle.net, Stadia, Etc.

- "The other Digital Content will also be provided through Steam."
- "to craft awesome mods and build a dedicated modding community"
#5. Steam supports mods & modders. Epic games does not.

- "The Community Edition Pre-order ended April 30th."
#6. For people that hate Steam this change of gaming platform to Epic Games long after the pre-order window is closed is another back stabbing betrayal by PGI to loyal MWO playerbase in their opinion.

Steam has Pioneered/Honed/Perfected the art of selling and delivering games and other content.
Steam has the largest stable gaming community versus other gaming platforms as a result Steam is far more focused on selling, reviews, steam forums/guides, steam external-to-game achievements, steam external-to-game rewards, general content delivery, advertising, wishlists and emailing notices regarding games on it, etc.......
#7. Steam offered PGI the greatest chance at a larger playerbase and bigger payout with a better chance of success if PGI patched problems asap, or rolls-back features after player-exoduses, and communicates upfront and clearly with players.

- "The Community Edition Pre-order ended April 30th."
- Russ admitted PGI decided and signed the paperwork for Epic Games exclusive back in April.
#8. MechWarrior Tactics owners remember all too well what its like to be sold something for months when a company keeps quiet about their plans........
#9. I won't even bring up all the MWO problems that PGI caused which also fit into the above, to a tee!

#10. Based on the above there can be no justifiable reason to not release steam keys exclusively to players who pre-ordered.
Thereby keeping the Steam version exclusive only to the few players who would not abide to Epic Games.
PGI could've included specials to pre-order players to join Epic Games instead, before they used steam key.
Reducing all choice to refund or epic games was an unimaginative, cowardly way out of drama that PGI itself created wholesale, thereby making many of the last fanboys of PGI/MWO question the competence of PGI's management.

---

Personally I've not Yet decided on getting a refund or not for my ultimate pack, but for all the above it just comes across as another donkey-kicking by PGI while they laugh their way to the bank one more time.

Edited by Akillius, 29 July 2019 - 07:07 PM.

[Akillius]

But perhaps I've missed something???

What rewards do I get on Epic Games MW5M for not getting a refund?
(And No the beta and all the other stuff that was already part of the agreement to purchase for Steam do not count.)

Russ / PGI start offering something as rewards for pre-orders who don't get refunds who try Epic Games.

+Offer all refunded players the chance to re-buy their exact same pre-order, or is PGI too short-sighted for even that!?.

Edited by Akillius, 29 July 2019 - 07:09 PM.

[CrustyMech]

On the plus side, they did process my refund quickly and efficiently.

So they got that going for 'em…

[Athom83]

Eurystheus, on 29 July 2019 - 04:05 PM, said:

I've seen a lot of people call the Steam to Epic change a bait and switch. Which is part of what led me to be surprised that Steam has such a loyal fan base. If they promised an MW5 that looks like the trailers, then delivered Mario Cart, I'd call that a bait and switch. But for me going from Steam to Epic is more like saying it's going to come in a plastic box, but then delivering it in a cardboard box. I don't care about the box. I care about the game inside the box. Will it be less playable if it is distributed via Epic vs Steam? Will LRMs turn into ATMs if I get it on Epic instead of Steam? Do Steam keys have some kind of collector value that Epic keys don't have?

You'd be correct... if the Epic store launcher wasn't caught and called out for mining your computer for information and sending it back to China. Plus, again, the Epic store is quite ****** in implementation. This is like paying for the deluxe overnight shipping in a display worthy box and then it arrives two weeks later in a busted up and wet cardboard box.

[LordNothing]

we need more dumpsters on fire.

[Cytekker]

MechWarrior has always been my favorite game. I've been waiting for MW5 for a very long time. The MW5 Atlas attack cinematic was a wonderful but then I heard it wouldn't happen, but maybe an online version would be coming so I gave up on MW. About a year ago I joined MWO and was delighted to see that it had much better graphics and mechanics than I expected.

When the MW5 preorder showed up I bought it immediately, knowing that I was supporting a project in progress. As a project manager I know that 60% of projects go over budget and/or schedule. I expected a delay, and was encouraged by it as a delay is better then releasing a game that's not ready to be released. My primary desire is to GET THE GAME. I want it to magically appear on my machine, but failing that I'll get it from Steam, GoG, Epic, or direct download. If it's Epic then I'll join EGS with extra security.

I want the game, and so far I feel PGI has been doing a damn good job with MWO. A lot of people have been posting their legitimate opinions about the announcement, but for me those problems are speed bumps that I can easily get over. My focus and priority is to get MW5 on my computer, and I'm happy to do what it takes to make it happen. I for one am very happy with my preorder, happy to contribute to the project, and happy for all the MWO goodies that were part of that preorder.

Russ and PGI, thank you for sticking with it, keeping the dream alive and bringing back a great game that's been gone for far too long. I'm looking forward to enjoying all your hard work.

[Lepestok]

Finished a tantrum? Calm down? Now wipe away the tears and run to buy the game.

[Curccu]

Paladin IIC, on 28 July 2019 - 12:23 PM, said:

Dee, no one gives a damn about stats on the Jarl's list in a free to play game with a population barely above 600. Most of the people on the top of that list have over 5k games and way too much free time on their hands, unlike most normal functioning members of society. Most normal people, I guess you'd call us casuals, don't have the free time to sit in front of a PC for 8 hours or more a day and hone our skills like we did in high school.

MWO stats/Jarls numbers are from past 35 months, 30 days a month... 5000 games.
Less than 5 games a day so half an hour playing a day instead of that 8 hours of yours.

Paladin IIC, on 29 July 2019 - 06:46 PM, said:

Well, show me player statistics that show otherwise if you're so sure the player base is larger.

And because you love Jarl's...
https://leaderboard....ats#playerchart

edit: typo

Edited by Curccu, 29 July 2019 - 09:13 PM.

[NocturnalBeast]

Well, I got over my initial emotional reaction and realized that not being on Steam is not that big of a deal to me, even though it would be nice since I have used Steam for years and most of my games and friends are on Steam. It is fun to watch this dumpster fire burn though.