690 replies to this topic

[Brauer]

Brennard Chambrin, on 21 November 2020 - 09:01 AM, said:

Has anyone considered the possibility of "Mech Refits"?

Take an old chassis that you own, with like 2 hardpoints, then give it a more modern refit?

The kits could cost cash or MC or whatever, and on special occasion it could be a reward or a C-Bill sale, but it would essentially allow you to refit a single outdated chassis (which you already own) to be more competitive that the old "bone stock".

Think of it as, I buy a 67 corvette.. new engine, new tranny, new suspension... old chassis, new hotness..

I buy an old Spider... I buy a refit kit.... new engine, new hardpoints.. old chassis, new hotness..

That creates a lot of balance issues and could be seen as P2W. Would be better imo to make those mechs more competitive for everyone. Why force people to pay even in-game currency for it?

[Mighty Spike]

Dregian Bloodwrath, on 19 November 2020 - 10:53 PM, said:

and a must add mech is this one
the hellhound (Conjurer)- the mw4 merceneries model-

yea,like that Design,would also love to see my favorite Mech from MW4,its a mektek mech as far as i know,okay it´s a §$%&# clan mech but i like the Design

Edited by Mighty Spike, 21 November 2020 - 12:32 PM.

[Brennard Chambrin]

Brauer, on 21 November 2020 - 10:05 AM, said:

That creates a lot of balance issues and could be seen as P2W. Would be better imo to make those mechs more competitive for everyone. Why force people to pay even in-game currency for it?

Yeah, it's totally plausible to see that being an issue, but in my mind, it would have to be something like Spider 5V-Refit and have a static refit loadout. I don't think you would be able to do it like clan options are and balance it very well.

As far as P2W, as long as it's balanced, all you are doing is offering new viability to an old chassis, it's not like it would be so OP that everyone would need the old mech refits to be competitive.

[JD Wack]

I would like jump jets on all my 'mechs, thank you. Pretty please, also.

I could see this happening easily, at least with the battlemech type of 'mechs. If a chassis isn't "born" with jump jet capability, a mount for them then could be installed via a rolldown menu in the mechlab, a bit like when selecting artemis system or double heatsinks. It would take a bit of tonnage, say 0,5 ton for lights and mediums and 1 ton for heavys and assaults. Once installed, jump jets can now be added to a class-specific maximum amount,

With Omnimech type of 'mechs, I'm not so sure if that would a proper implementation. But then jumpjets could be fitted to appropriate omnipods with each chassis from the factory. Something woefully lore-wrecking like that?

[Kodan Black]

I keep seeing people want to change hard points and add jump jets and stuff which begs the question why even have mech chassis anymore? Why not just have 4 mechs - 1 per weight class and you can do what you want? The point of any selection is pros/cons and deciding what to pick. If you can then just remove the cons you have only pros. People seem to want more mechs while also asking for all the mechs to basically be the same. I think the long term result would be people bored of the mechs because they have no flavor and all are the same aside from aesthetics.

[Forgeling]

Brennard Chambrin, on 21 November 2020 - 09:01 AM, said:

Has anyone considered the possibility of "Mech Refits"?

Take an old chassis that you own, with like 2 hardpoints, then give it a more modern refit?

The kits could cost cash or MC or whatever, and on special occasion it could be a reward or a C-Bill sale, but it would essentially allow you to refit a single outdated chassis (which you already own) to be more competitive that the old "bone stock".

Think of it as, I buy a 67 corvette.. new engine, new tranny, new suspension... old chassis, new hotness..

I buy an old Spider... I buy a refit kit.... new engine, new hardpoints.. old chassis, new hotness..

I agree with this on the caveat that it will only refit the mech into another existing variant.

[Horseman]

Brennard Chambrin, on 21 November 2020 - 09:01 AM, said:

Has anyone considered the possibility of "Mech Refits"?

Take an old chassis that you own, with like 2 hardpoints, then give it a more modern refit?

The kits could cost cash or MC or whatever, and on special occasion it could be a reward or a C-Bill sale, but it would essentially allow you to refit a single outdated chassis (which you already own) to be more competitive that the old "bone stock".

Think of it as, I buy a 67 corvette.. new engine, new tranny, new suspension... old chassis, new hotness..

I buy an old Spider... I buy a refit kit.... new engine, new hardpoints.. old chassis, new hotness..

Refit kits exist in lore, but MWO already has serious hardpoint inflation. Plus it might make battlemechs and omnimechs too similar to each other.
Don't get me wrong, it's a neat idea - but one that should have been part of initial design and balancing instead of the hardpoint inflation we got instead.

[Big-G]

Brauer, on 21 November 2020 - 06:36 AM, said:

The original design basically dictates horrid hitboxes. I don't see how PGI fixes that without completely tossing out the fafnir's original design, which will upset a lot of people. Try an Annihilator.

That's the thing about Mechs... some are designed well, and some were not. The challenge is to configure them to suit the way you play, and you finding the best way to turn their weaknesses into possible strengths.

[Ormstarr the Splitter]

The6thMessenger, on 16 November 2020 - 04:54 PM, said:

New Community-Driven 'Mech

Spoiler

I would push for the Bull Shark. It's work is mostly done, it's already in HBS Battletech. It's less work for PGI.

I would absolutely love to use the Bull Shark in MWO, but I also admit that I might be a little biased as I'm the guy that designed it, haha!

HBS wanted the "ultimate mech" so I pulled a lot from my experience playing some of the best MWO mechs (Mad Cat MKII was still pretty hot at the time). That's one of the main reasons why it has high mounted weapon slots that are mostly in-line with the cockpit. I even set it up like my MWO mechs by frontloading the armor and storing ammo in it's legs. The designers thought that was weird, but they ended up strapping a big artillery cannon to it's back, so what do they know?

If anyone's interested, you can read more about the thought process behind the design in my dev diary on the Paradox forums.

Of course even though the design and model is done, there would still be a ton of work PGI would have to do to get it ready for MWO. Our Unity pipeline on Battletech was so different than MWO that we basically had to throw out most of the texture information, animation and all of the damage models. I imagine they would have to do the same in a reverse situation.

[VgerRD]

May we please have someway (skill tree, quirks, loadout screen in the mechlab) to change up hardpoints of our 'Mechs? Obviously there would have to be safeguards in place so that people can't put too many hardpoints on a 'Mech and make it OP in some way.

For instance, the AS7-KR. Maybe I could trade 1 energy hardpoint from the arm and add a ballistic hardpoint to the left torso. Or trade the ballistic hardpoint from the right torso and turn it into a missile hardpoint. I know, it's beginning to sound an awfully lot like an omnimech. However, I think this change would increase build diversity and bring up underperforming 'Mechs.

Also, someone mentioned being able to upgrade a normal 'Mech into a Hero or Champion 'Mech with either an XP bonus, C-Bill bonus, or both for MC. Maybe along with the upgrade there could be 2-3 different names you could apply to the newly upgraded 'Mech. I think this is a fantastic idea and my Arctic Wolf-A agrees! Name suggestions for an Arctic Wolf might be: Blizzard, Arctos, Deep Freeze, Grey Wolf, White Wolf, etc.

Edited by VgerRD, 23 November 2020 - 02:00 AM.

[GaelicWolf]

One word .......

QUADS

Edited by GaelicWolf, 22 November 2020 - 11:59 PM.

[M-Lee]

Locust IIC
Firefalcon
Turkina
Guillotine
Thor II
Gunslinger
Phoenix Hawk IIC

[Slambot]

Quirks should be attached to omnipods for underperforming chassis... period. Pls un nerf the Timby... thanks..

Oh as for new mechs... the um Crusader...

Edited by Slambot, 23 November 2020 - 11:12 AM.

[Bowelhacker]

So how hard can it be to just come up with a list of all the mechs not yet in the game at this tech level and let us vote? Again.

[Will9761]

You bring up a good point. As much as I like naming a list of mechs I want to see myself, Gas Guzzler's Mech Pack Poll should have been added in the main topic of this post.

Edited by Will9761, 10 December 2020 - 12:45 PM.

[Will9761]

Given the data from Gas Guzzler's Mech Pack Poll, these are the most popular demanded mechs that people want. From these fan-favorites I can tell that these people want these mechs because they were in the video games or because they want to see the rest of the Unseens again (or both). Nostalgia sells.

Inners Sphere:
Lights
IS BattleMech - Hollander (Mechcommander 1 & 2) (651 votes)
IS OmniMech - Owens (Mechwarrior 3 & 4) (435 votes)

Mediums
IS BattleMech - Chimera (Mechwarrior 4) (376 votes)
IS OmniMech - Men Shen (Mechcommander 2) (398 votes)

Heavies
IS BattleMech - Crusader (635 votes)
IS OmniMech - Avatar (Mechwarrior 3) (400 votes)

Assaults
IS BattleMech - Longbow (Mechwarrior 4 Mercs) (407 votes)
IS OmniMech - Sunder (Mechwarrior 3 & 4) (377 votes)

Clans:
Lights
Clan BattleMech - Locust IIC (Mechwarrior 1: Japanese version) (605 votes)
Clan OmniMech - Fire Moth [Dasher] (Mechwarrior 2) (844 votes) - The real speed of the Fire Moth might have to be lowered for that to happen due to CryEngine.

Mediums
Clan BattleMech - Shadow Hawk IIC (Mechwarrior 1: Japanese version) (590 votes)
Clan OmniMech - Grendel [Mongrel] (234 votes)

Heavies
Clan BattleMech - Grizzly (Mechwarrior 2 GBL, Mercs) (489 votes) - PGI is gonna have to make some new variants for it to be viable.
Clan OmniMech - Crossbow (266 votes)

Assaults
Clan BattleMech - Stone Rhino [Behemoth] (Mechwarrior 2 GBL) (782 votes)
Clan OmniMech - Turkina (Mechcommander 1: Desperate Measures) (345 votes)

Edited by Will9761, 10 December 2020 - 12:47 PM.

[Voice of Kerensky]

Annihilator IIC - onelove

[Voice of Kerensky]

dr3dnought, on 19 November 2020 - 04:07 PM, said:

The most glaring balance issue to me is streaks. Lights usually make up single-digit % of the queue and I believe streaks are at least some of the reason why. There is no other weapon that is a no-aim one-shot against an entire class (at like 450m if c-ssrm), negating the only advantages of said class (namely speed and small size), while being more-or-less useless against every other class. Streaks should be reworked to be less effective against lights and more effective against heavies and assaults. One way of doing this would be to give them LRM-style tracking and spread (with appropriate values) rather than current guaranteed-component-hit behaviour.

I will quote my old message:

To be honest, I don’t understand what caused this storm in a glassful about streak-boats.
I totally disagree that the streak-boat has an overwhelming advantage over light mech.
1) In order not to become an easy prey for a streak-boat, light mech must constantly move, not allowing itself to be taken into lock. Move back and forth, right and left. If you stopped for a long time and during this time you were killed by a streak-mech. It’s only your fault.
2) If you on a light mech do not have enough intelligence for press the "R" button, and look before attacking what weapon have enemy's mech. Well, this is again your problem. Do it, press this button and get information about the enemy. Do this especially if you have a Mad Dog, Trebuchet or Huntsman in front of you. You just need to avoid them, find yourself another target: biger and less agile. And again - don't stay in one place for a long time.
3) Use cover and terrain for quick attacks. If you were smart enough to attack a streak-boat in an open field with no cover on a light mech, well, that's just your mistake.
4) If you play on a slow light mech, stand next to your big comrades. Provoke the streak boat to attack your big comrades, not you. If you are on light mech, which has a speed of less than 120 kph, and decided to arrange a duel against a streak-boat, you have head problems.
5) If you are playing on a light mech with an ECM and you have a friend on a light mech with an ECM, attack the streak-boat. Get closer to it 120 meters, muffle it with your ECMs and tear it apart. The streak-boat can do absolutely nothing to you, its will be very lucky if streak-mech just manages to escape from you. Therefore, you need to go straight to his feet, block him and tear him to pieces.
I’ll tell you a story about what a big advantage a streak-boat has over light mech. Once in FP I played on a streak-Huntsman (8xssrm-4), and my friend on Sun Spider (3xATM-12). On our way, we came across Locust, this Locust stood and did not move. My friend fired three full shots of his ATMs at this Locust from the optimal distance, I fired three full shots from my streaks (96 missiles, 192 damage!). In Locust, not a single component (!) was opened up to the structure. His armor only did change color to orange (!). What was it? Cheat (1000 armor at Locust)? Lagshield?

And added.
Currently, lights (piranha, locust, flea, commando, javelin, and many others) are not afraid of anyone and anything but a streak-missiles. Tell me, do you want to make the lights an absolute and ultimate weapon?

Edited by Voice of Kerensky, 24 November 2020 - 01:00 AM.

[Guile Votoms]

Go back to the community re-balance document but this time actually take a look at it.

[VileKnight]

Daeron Katz, on 16 November 2020 - 01:05 PM, said:

In this thread, lets discuss ideas for updating or adding to our current mechs and how they work in MechWarrior Online, such as:

• New Community-Driven 'Mech (Community input to new 'Mech chassis choice)
  
• New 'Mech Variants
  
• Rescale 'Mechs (for fun and role vs volumetric)
  
• Fix Mech Mobility (Desync)
  
• Update Bolt-Ons (Stay Attached)
  
• Quirks / Set of 8's for Under Performers
  
• Armor Balance for Arm Weapon-Only 'Mechs (Jenner, Jagermech, Rifleman)
  
• Weapon Balance Pass
  
• IS Omnimechs / Engine Discussion

I can only speak for myself and the chatter we have within the Raptors, but allow me to throw some more opinion on the table...

• New mechs:
  
  • The Firemoth seems to be a favorite in the Clan ranks. There are a ton of light players in the Raptors that drool over the idea of getting this mech.
    
  • Personally, I would like to throw my vote behind the calls for the Stoned Rhino. To see that beast on the field would be fantastic! As an assault pilot, this is where dreams are made.
    
  • Edit - There was a poll done (Thank you Will9761) that PGI should look at, if they haven't already..... Stoned Rhino at the top of the vote list.
• New Mech Variants:
  
  • I think this could be good low hanging fruit to go after, but I honestly don't see this as high on the priority list for the long term health of MWO. There might be some outliers, but generally speaking this isn't a need. I would guess it depends on the amount of dev hours that PGI would need to invest to make it happen.
• Rescale
  
  • I can't give you numbers to back up the "YES! PLEASE!", but from a fun aspect, this is a high reward item. I play a good amount of MW5, and I can say without a shadow of a doubt that the rescale mod was a huge gain for immersion in that game. Everyone who has picked it up in my unit loves it, and has echoed that opinion. While you can make a strong argument that rescaling a pvp application of Mechwarrior may need to take a different approach, from a entertainment and immersion point of view, this is a high value "get" for PGI to take on.
• Bolt-Ons:
  
  • I have purchased very few bolt-ons. One, I think they cost far too much MC, and the second reason is the fact they get shot off. For the MC investment that you are asking from your players, we are not getting value here. This needs to be done to make bolt-ons even worth consideration.
    
  • Additionally, I second the opinion that if I buy a bolt-on, it should be able to go onto any mech. I can do that with Warhorns. Why not my bolt-ons? We can stick with the idea that some bolt-ons just don't go onto some of the chassis. That seems reasonable. But if I can buy some bolt-ons to make my Atlas DDC look like a Warboss, I should be able to stick those same bolt-ons onto another mech that can also normally equip those specific bolt-ons. Again, you don't charge me 750mc for a Kodiak Warhorn that can ONLY be put in a Kodiak, right? I don't understand why the additional restriction on bolt-ons.
• Quirks:
  
  • Quirks could use a pass. I do like the fact some mechs have quirks to help push certain builds (+1 HSL is a nice touch for some), and can help contain weapon systems from being abused.
    
  • While I do not have the mathhammer in front of me to defend this opinion, I will say that it does seem like IS mechs do have an obnoxious amount of additional armor from their quirks. This is something that is hotly debated within my unit.
    
    • Not trying to start a flame war with this one, just passing along general sentiment.
  • Set of 8's feel pretty much worthless on Omnimechs, and it is a rare exception to see someone take out a Clan Omni that has the stock 8 pods. I think it would be worth exploring this idea about making it a set of 5-6, or maybe tying the set bonus to the CT, since that can't be swapped out? Warrants further looking into.
• Armor for arm-weapon mechs:
  
  • Yes. This should get a lot of consideration. Jenner and Rifleman 2C (don't own the IS version) are really hard to justify taking when they can be turned into a stick so easily. I was one of the poor saps who picked up the baseline Rifleman 2C pack, and they are collecting a lot of dust because how easily they are rendered weaponless.
• Weapon Balance
  
  • I don't have the link in front of me, but there was a large community effort to give weapon balance feedback to PGI. I discussed this with two of my best comp level players, and they believe that the information there would be a good place to start.
    
  • Outside of that, I want to again push for consideration of a single slug option for clan A/Cs. If not, something seriously needs to be done for our AC20's, because they are in a horrible place right now.
• IS Omni/XL Engine
  
  • I swear this isn't IS hate, but no. Just no to the IS XL changes. Part of the draw into Battletech games is the fact you have two drastically different factions. If you start to make the IS XL more like the Clan XL, then you start down a really slippery path. Sure, it is an advantage for Clan to not die when you have a torso popped. IS have advantages in other areas don't they? Why are my Clan lasers forced to keep so much more time on target? Why are my clan mechs insanely more expensive. Why does IS have more tonnage for their FP drop decks? The more you make the two factions like each other, the more players will start screaming about the differences or advantages that one faction over the other. We would be opening up a huge can of worms with this. Little to zero gain for a huge amount of community drama, and headache for PGI.

Edited by VileKnight, 24 November 2020 - 07:08 AM.